Fundies. Put A Lid On it!

a reply to: Klassified

This kind of behavior makes me so mad!

There is the bandwagon that talks crap about the "PC" people who say Happy Holidays rather than Merry Christmas. My in laws were talking about those very PC people last night, lol. I always say Happy Holidays because I don't assume the person in front of me is Christian, they could be Pagan, Jewish or Atheist or hold another spiritual or religious belief. I don't assume everyone is Christian, or that because I celebrate Christmas that everyone else does and should too. Unless I know for sure the person standing in front of me is Christian, I will always say Happy Holidays.

My in-laws are what would be considered hard core Christians. There is a prayer before every meal, no matter where we are. The only music played on the radio is the Christian station or Christian music. The only programing allowed on TV is rated PG or Christian based programing. Jesus comes up in almost every conversation. Honestly, it was uncomfortable for me at first but that's who they are and I accept that and adapt while I am with them out of respect for my husband, his family and particularly my mother in law.

During Christmas one of my husbands cousins was brought in to the conversation. His cousin is transgender, he was born male but associates himself as a female. He is currently a senior in high school and wears makeup, dresses and high heels and gets harassed at school really bad but still stands by who he is and continues to wear whatever he wants. All of the sudden it turned in to a bashing session and I listened as everyone said horrible things like, eww that's gross, he's sick, he better never come around me because I'm not gay, I'll punch him in the face, and he's not turning me gay, he's going to hell, that child is going to burn. After listening to horrible things being said, including threats of violence, about someone who wasn't even there, I gave my opinion. If the cousin isn't harming anyone in the room by wearing a dress, what does it matter. If the cousin is gay, what does it matter as he's not harming anyone else by loving someone. That everyone should be able to express themselves, be happy, love and be whoever they want, as long as it's not hurting anyone else. They all agreed he was going to burn, I went outside and had a cigarette.

I grew up with a Catholic mother and and Episcopalian father. Their families didn't want them to get married because the other wasn't in the same denomination...but they're both Christians! Since they had a lot of conflict with the family in the early days of their marriage, my parents decided that they didn't want their kids to experience that and would not let us go to church. My mom said when I turn 18 I can decide for myself but until then I am not to go to church. My in laws know about this and were rallying against me to my husband when he told them he was going to ask me to marry him, they were very much against our marriage and probably still are. This last year I have made every effort to try and mend the fences. Had I stood up and said what I really wanted to say, all the work I have put in to trying to build a relationship with my in laws would have gone down the drain.

What I really wanted to say is aren't Christians supposed to be loving and accepting of others? Where in the bible does it say to tell people they are going to hell because of their beliefs? Where in the bible does it say to use violence against someone who doesn't dress like you?

I have a major problem with organized religion and the fact that some churches are preaching that this type of behavior is acceptable and getting tax breaks for preaching hate.

a reply to: Grimpachi
My thanks to you and CellDamage. I was going to go through all of that, and second guessed myself. Maybe it will be useful for those who didn't know about it til now. Like the above poster.

a reply to: Klassified

No one who considers themselves Christian, should lambast people for having an alternative faith. It is not the job of any mortal person to chastise others for their religious beliefs, but from the perspective of a Christian, I find myself more horrified by examples of persons who profess to hold beliefs similar to my own, who decide that their faith makes them arbiters of right and wrong on the mortal plain.

Simply put, no one who is Christian, and has the slightest understanding of what that actually MEANS would go about making such awful prognostications, or victimising people and trying to oppress them.

It is very possible that the individual who vilified your friend in this awful manner, is merely one of the many people who lay claim to faith in Christ, who follow the Church, and not Christ. Contrary to doctrine handed down by the Church (be it Anglican or Catholic in origin) following Christ is NOT automatically following the Church. Very often Christs message is subverted by the very institutions which were founded to spread his message, and this woman of whom you speak seems to be one of those who has allowed the cancerous rot at the heart of organised Christianity, to seep into her being, and effect her actions, attitude, and deeds.

I must say, from my own perspective that seasonal greetings that I speak out loud, or deliver to the web, are aimed at everyone, from Christians to Atheists, and persons who subscribe to every belief system in between. Some people have forgotten that Christ's primary message was love. I have not, and I would hope that you, and your friend, understand that there are Christians out there who do not take such a vile and negative position, where members of other faiths are concerned.

I hope that you, and the friend who was the victim of such outrageous abuse, have a happy new year despite this negativity, and that your future interactions with the followers of Christ are not coloured by such ignorance as the one which is the subject of this thread has been.

May you be blessed, by whomever suits you best.

a reply to: Klassified

Hey no problem. ATS certainly inspires me to look up/research things. I have learned more in the past few years by checking perceived truths than any other time in my life. I don't always post but I am constantly checking things to see if they are correct.

a reply to: Jennyfrenzy

What I really wanted to say is aren't Christians supposed to be loving and accepting of others? Where in the bible does it say to tell people they are going to hell because of their beliefs?

One of several verses from the bible that addresses your question...
Mark 16 - Jesus is speaking...

15And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. 16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.

And another in John 8 - Again, Jesus is speaking...

24 Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.

As to crossdressing and transgender, as well as gays...
There are several verses between the old and new testament that condemn homosexuality. Leviticus 18 - Leviticus 20 - Romans 1, to name a few.

Where in the bible does it say to use violence against someone who doesn't dress like you?

Cross-dressing specifically, is only mentioned in one verse that I can think of at the moment...
Deuteronomy 22:5

5 “A woman shall not wear anything that pertains to a man, nor shall a man put on a woman’s garment, for all who do so are an abomination to the Lord your God.

I thought this was a thread about "fundies." Underwear for two.

a reply to: skunkape23

There IS a post covering that on page 1 somewhere I think!

Could be worth a look, if thats your bag!

a reply to: Klassified

So your friend posted a controversial piece on FB and got condemned for it. OK. So why do you come on here complaining about the replies to her piece? Didn't all of the responders have the right to give their feelings about what your friend posted? What's your point? Maybe it was to show us that you evidently come from another planet and enjoy calling some of us from this place "extians?"

Any way, I hope you have a better 2015.

I don't trust Christians. They preach a religion of love but practice a religion of condemnation, intolerance and censorship of those with different Ideas.

They know that their spiritual arrogance drives people away; but they don't care. I know it's a broad brush but that's my experience being raised a Baptist.

The Texas Baptists' I grew up with would secretly like to bring back the Inquisition and it's tortures, all in the name of Jesus.

a reply to: Aliensun

The issue of Xtians was also covered on page one, and I feel absolutely no dishonour when I read the word spelled that way. It has the same meaning.

It might have helped to read the thread, so that you could have avoided making such an empty point.

I believe that people who profess faith in Jesus should hold themselves to better account than the person who made all these objectionable comments toward Klassified's friend. We have no mandate to intimidate, to ridicule, or to chastise others for their faith. We may have the freedom to speak, and I thank God that we do. But we ought to be better able to control ourselves, and prevent ourselves from bringing disgrace upon the faith itself by way of what amounts to religious xenophobia.

Again, Jesus primary message was love, and compared with that, all that he said was secondary in its importance. We MUST love our fellow man, even when we believe them to be wrong. To love someone, you have to be able to respect them, and indeed respect their free will, which, I should not have to remind you, is God given according to our lore.

It shows no respect, and no love, to make a persons life just that little bit more harrowing, in the name of Jesus of all people. It is hypocrisy at its highest possible height to do so.

a reply to: Aliensun

So your friend posted a controversial piece on FB and got condemned for it.

Can you please explain why wishes of a happy solstice to everyone would be controversial? I just don't understand that logic.

a reply to: Klassified

When a religion, or any belief system is exclusive, humans can get persnickety. When that a large part of that belief system's modus operandi includes proselytism people will seize upon the opportunity to show contempt, disdain or otherwise demean individuals that do not share this belief.

This is yet another one of my pillars for leaving christianity. If humans are indeed "all god's children" then they should all be treated with the respect deserved of "god's children." None of us is better or worse. Fundamentalists sometimes get so wrapped up in their systems and dogma that they forget major aspects of the teachings of what they proselytize.

Personally I find it silly and sad at the same time.

originally posted by: Klassified


The self-righteousness, and the elitism displayed by these "loving xtian" people rivals anything I see from politicians and royalty. Some of these so-called xtians could and would put an extremist muslim to shame. I've met Satanists who were more caring and considerate of other people than these modern day inquisitors.
/RANT

That's because it's a totalitarian political movement fronting as religion. You're wise to recognize how dangerous it is. Stand up to it now or live under it.

Isnt this thread kinda hypocritical, dont the people complaining see all they are doing is acting the same way as the fundies.
That you are indeed as fundie as those you accuse

You accuse of intolerance and use intolerance as a reply

originally posted by: borntowatch
Isnt this thread kinda hypocritical, dont the people complaining see all they are doing is acting the same way as the fundies.
That you are indeed as fundie as those you accuse

You accuse of intolerance and use intolerance as a reply

There is a difference between hypocrisy, and speaking out against a hypocritical wrong. Though admittedly, there can be a fine line betwixt the two at times. We(unbelievers) have not claimed the moral high ground. They have. If they're going to claim it. They should be living it as best they can.

Do you use the terms Xlam, Xadan, Xhist, or anything similarly derogatory for Islam, Ramadan, or Buddhist?

no one does, using X for christ come from christ being spelled in greek, which starts with X.

i think fundies put the fun in xtianity.

originally posted by: Klassified
We(unbelievers) have not claimed the moral high ground. They have. If they're going to claim it. They should be living it as best they can.

Not only do you claim the moral high ground you claim the intellectual high ground.
Yes there are to many religious fundies but oh so many atheist fundies as well and they are hypocrites too.

So yeah, I agree, claim it live it

originally posted by: borntowatch

originally posted by: Klassified
We(unbelievers) have not claimed the moral high ground. They have. If they're going to claim it. They should be living it as best they can.

Not only do you claim the moral high ground you claim the intellectual high ground.
Yes there are to many religious fundies but oh so many atheist fundies as well and they are hypocrites too.

So yeah, I agree, claim it live it

Could you enlighten me as to what an "atheist fundie" is, and how they are hypocritical? Thanks.

I thought you were talking about members who had contributed to the ATS fighting fund.

Oh well, Happy New Year!!

originally posted by: Aliensun
a reply to: Klassified

So your friend posted a controversial piece on FB and got condemned for it. OK. So why do you come on here complaining about the replies to her piece? Didn't all of the responders have the right to give their feelings about what your friend posted? What's your point? Maybe it was to show us that you evidently come from another planet and enjoy calling some of us from this place "extians?"

Any way, I hope you have a better 2015.

I'll have to second Grimpachi's response to this. Why is wishing people a happy solstice "controversial".

The fact you find it controversial is a bit controversial. It speaks volumes about the problem and why she (and many like her) are marginalized for her faith.

When people wish me a "merry Christmas", I'm not the least bit offended nor do I feel the need to tell them their sheep god cult is built upon the corpses of millions of innocents. I don't feel I need to tell them that their holiday commemorates a myth that represents the near extinction of both sides of my lineage. I don't find it controversial at all when a Christian wishes me a merry anything because it's something positive and I know they are being nice.

If you find a person wishing you a happy solstice, Blessed Yule, or a happy anything and you find it controversial... you have the problem. Not them. You.

I hope you had a merry christmahannakwanzakah and a blessed Yule. I really mean that.