For God so loveth the world...

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Satan goes:
Luke 4:6f All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them [...] If thou therefore wilt worship me, all shall be thine.

And Jesus shakes his head going all:
Matthew 5:5 Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

Then John pops in on God's behalf and just:
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

I mean what are these gods thinking of? When Satan failed to sell the world to the Jebus, God took the means in his own hands and dumped the world to the highest bidders and deepest kneeler, before explaining how simple it really was. We'll believe anything obviously. There is some wisdom here, I know it, but it's just so hard to figure him out some times.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Are you worthy of eternal life? If so, how can you be so sure?

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Are you worthy of eternal life? If so, how can you be so sure?

Your poorly disguised bias kinda shows you already know the answer, so shoot. Does anyone deserve eternal life? And seeing all the bollocks you always come hurling in with, I'm amazed there are even people who entertain that thought. I know a few people whom I would have loved to give eternal life just to have them shat at at noon everyday in aeternitas.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

"For God so loveth the world,
that he hath given his only begotten Son,
that whosoever believeth in him,
should not perish, but have everlasting life." - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

This quote gets to the heart of why I don't even think Christianity makes sense . . .

Followers claim that Christianity is not a polytheistic belief system . . . they insist it is an extension of the Jewish tradition and monotheistic. However, in order to perpetuate this belief, one has to assume that Jesus (the son) is actually just a physical manifestation of Yahweh (the father). Then of course you also have the holy spirit, but some denominations down play this tenet. So, Jesus is Yahweh and Yahweh is Jesus . . . one god in two forms.

If we look at that concept against the quote from above, it appears Yahweh sent himself to suffer/die for our sins (apparently due to the "original sin"). After sending himself, to die for his creation, he then returned himself to be reunited with himself. However, Yahweh decided what was sin and what to "condemn" man for. So, he decided man was flawed, condemned from birth, due to a rule he made up and decided to punish us for. To rectify this faux pas, he had to send himself to suffer and die, and subsequently demand we believe in the son manifestation in order to be forgiven for rules and a punishment he decided to enforce?

Why didn't god just forgive everyone? . . . say you made a mistake and he is wiping original sin away. Why the theatrics? If god is the son, why send anyone to die or suffer? What kind of sadomasochistic behavior is that and what exactly was god trying to prove?

More over . . . how are those actions a sacrifice? If Jesus is god, then god knew how it would all play out. God, being immortal and not physical, knew he wouldn't really "suffer" or "die" because he would simply return to the spirit realm. What is it that was sacrificed? God back to himself . . . to return to heaven . . . for rules he made up and chose to stop punishing people for? Why not just stop punishing people for it?

I fail to see a sacrifice when someone acts in a way that is wrong against others (punishment for "original sin"), then decides to stop acting that way, so they create a brutal and violent act of theater in order to once again demand obedience or you fail to be "forgiven". Forgiven for that original someone's petty and abhorrent behavior . . .

Wouldn't it make more sense if the suffering and dying was due to Yahweh asking forgiveness of humans? . . . After all, the "sins" we are guilty of are of his doing to begin with.

a reply to: solomons path

And forgot to add:

According to Christian mythology . . . doesn't everyone have "eternal life". Doesn't that quote from Jesus discount the notion of a "hell" or "purgatory". If those options were real . . . why would Jesus talk about someone perishing.

The good, supposedly, go to heaven to be reunited with the father/son.
The bad or unbeliever, supposedly, goes to hell.
The lost, according to some sects, goes to purgatory.

All three options imply "everlasting life" . . . the choice becomes everlasting life in heaven or outside of it. And of course, if Jesus is Yahweh, that was his doing to begin with . . . so, . . . how is Jesus' "deal" not seen as just bullying tactics in order to gain obedience?

All this sounds like the petty behaviors of a manipulative sociopath, not the actions of a "loving" all powerful god.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Are you worthy of eternal life? If so, how can you be so sure?

That's not even the most important question.

Seems like GOD wants heaven to be full of unquestioning faithful submissive believers and gives plenty of fuel for failing to those that want to take his place. If it is true that he exist then it may be true that life and control has been tried every way imaginable and all ways have failed or succeeded except the one we are in now. Much of what you are finding in your search can be explained by us living in a reflection and no man being worthy of trust to get the job done so he just fills the important roles himself. Maybe he is his own worst enemy. If all else fails repent and submit.

a reply to: deadeyedick

If all else fails, roll over and beg like the dog you are to him.

a reply to: AfterInfinity No need for your renforcement of degradation. It was a jk and you seem to be not jking. either way i would to be proud to. I have no shame.

a reply to: deadeyedick

I think he meant the figurative you, not you personally.

originally posted by: AfterInfinity

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Are you worthy of eternal life? If so, how can you be so sure?

That's not even the most important question.

Then what is? Please, enlighten all of us.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest

originally posted by: AfterInfinity

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Are you worthy of eternal life? If so, how can you be so sure?

That's not even the most important question.

Then what is? Please, enlighten all of us.

What do you do when your will to exist runs out before your immortality does? And if you think it's impossible to run out of things to live for, then you have no idea what you're talking about. It's easy to discuss skydiving with both feet planted firmly on the ground.

originally posted by: Utnapisjtim

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Are you worthy of eternal life? If so, how can you be so sure?

Your poorly disguised bias kinda shows you already know the answer, so shoot. Does anyone deserve eternal life? And seeing all the bollocks you always come hurling in with, I'm amazed there are even people who entertain that thought. I know a few people whom I would have loved to give eternal life just to have them shat at at noon everyday in aeternitas.

Ok, so lets assume, for the sake of argument, that you could atain Eternal Life by good works. What about all the sins you have committed? How many sins have you commited so far? How much good work do you need to cancel those sins out? Where do you draw the line?

Salvation by works is arbitrary and dependent on the eye of the beholder. This is why John 3 teaches faith in the Son. Then you are free to do good works.

First clean the inside of the cup, then you can polish the outside.

originally posted by: deadeyedick
a reply to: AfterInfinity No need for your renforcement of degradation. It was a jk and you seem to be not jking. either way i would to be proud to. I have no shame.

Oh, I wasn't joking. If all else fails, roll over and beg like a dog. That's all he seems to want from us humans.

a reply to: AfterInfinity

To live is Christ, to die is gain.

What do you live for? To pay your debt in sin?

16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.

19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil.

20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that their deeds will be exposed.

21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what they have done has been done in the sight of God.

The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: AfterInfinity

To live is Christ, to die is gain.

What do you live for? To pay your debt in sin?

That's just the crappiest remark I've seen in a while. My own included.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: AfterInfinity

To live is Christ, to die is gain.

What do you live for? To pay your debt in sin?

See, that's the kind of unthinking answer I expected. You speak just like someone who has never had an opportunity to live forever, like a child who has never been behind the wheel of an actual car and yet insists they know how to drive like a champion.

I live to be happy, and it just so happens that making others happy, seeing them happy, also makes me happy. But I do not live for the express purpose of fulfilling someone else's agenda. I will gladly and purposefully screw their agenda to the hilt, wreck their operation, just to teach them a lesson about control.

Have you ever seen Simon Pegg's At The World's End? That movie demonstrates precisely what I'm talking about. "Face it! We're the human race, and we don't like being told what to do!"

originally posted by: Utnapisjtim

Are you sure? And Christians don't see how this whole Church-Christian-Jesus-Cult is exactly what the Apocalypse describes about the Satan charade-- the Beast-- and it's followers, which makes up most of the world. Jesus warns about the European kingdoms and the Church in Revelation and the false teachings and diabolic religion attributed to him that has enslaved billions of people in false bliss. So to the Christians out there, it is allowed to think, not just read and memorise.

Amen brother! (or sister but most likely you are male.) I have been preaching the same thing, but I have been shunned and chastised for it. (I mean, to real-life people.) America, Europe, and Israel are by far some of the most wicked Lands on this planet (as would be viewed by the Biblical God). Yet, the fools who serve this wickedness think they are serving righteousness.

And billsions are enslaved. YES! Billions ARE enslaved! It is my goal to free them all (but, by myself, I cannot do anything). I am glad to see that not everyone in this world is so hopeless.

a reply to: AfterInfinity

You just stated that your agenda is to fulfill another person's agenda to be happy.

I live to please my Lord. To live is Christ.