Ufology is pointless, just give it up already

originally posted by: sheepslayer247
a reply to: BlueMule

I think skepticism is rooted in the most basic of concepts.....if there is no evidence, no reason to believe. If there is evidence, no reason to believe...it's fact.

Evidence is only as good as the way you are brought up to look at it. If you are conditioned to look at it lopsided, then you will be at best only half right.

Skeptics are half right, and true believers are half wrong. Or vice versa.

Read mutants & mystics by KRIPAL.

This thread misses the obvious point though.

Something weird happens and then get's investigated. That's Ufology.

Lights in the sky--what are they? Woman says she was abducted by aliens--investigate her claims. Signs of a coverup--investigate it. Anomaly on Mars--looks artificial--investigate it. That is Ufology, basically.

Saying to give it up is like saying every time something weird happens or someone has an interesting story to tell you ignore it. Bad idea. Life is more interesting when you take a good hard look at all the weird unexplained things going on in our world.

I think we're in a phase of nothing EXCITING happening. There are bits and pieces on the fringes, but nothing that will set the world alight.
The constant hoax pictures and videos don't help the subject either, but as long as people are still taking videos and taking photos of the sky, the subject won't die completely.
I personally love coming on here and seeing a new picture of a UFO, it might be real, it might be fake, the fun is deconstructing it to its core and seeing what comes out.

I just think we are missing that moment, that piece of evidence that we've all been searching for. I'm always hopeful it's just around the corner.

a reply to: BlueMule

Evidence is only as good as the way you are brought up to look at it.

Huh? Maybe you could say that critical thinking skills depend on your upbringing, but evidence is something that's pretty cut and dry. Either it confirms a theory/hypothesis/existence or it does not.

And I believe you may be confusing skeptics with debunkers. We skeptics are open to all the possibilities but do not lean one way or the other unless there is reason to do so.

So I think a rational, honest person would be able to look at ufology and say that there is no evidence, as of yet, that confirms any one claim or story.

a reply to: sheepslayer247

A single bit of evidence can support multiple theories, depending on the hidden philosophical premises you start with. And that depends on your indoctrination. You just don't realize the extent of your indoctrination until you look at evidence through fresh eyes. The way for people who rely on science to do that is start over with the humanities.

Of course not everyone is up to the task. Ignorance is bliss, and at this point you are ignorant of how much you don't know, because you won't shut up long enough to read the damn book I keep mentioning. Your half truths are easier for you, like old leather.

Maybe you need to slay your inner sheep.

originally posted by: sheepslayer247


And I believe you may be confusing skeptics with debunkers. We skeptics are open to all the possibilities but do not lean one way or the other unless there is reason to do so.

Still I respect any researcher more than any skeptic. Skeptics are mostly content to let others do the real footwork and then trot out an opinion that has no more validity than the person who made the effort to go outside and look around and TRY and gather evidence. imo....skeptics are cowards taking the easy way out.

Personally, I'd much rather be the guy in the truck with my camera, looking skyward, than at a monitor trying to find fault with others. It's much more fun and you meet the most interesting and sometimes beautiful people.

a reply to: sheepslayer247

Please tell me how you feel about the known alterations of soil after some of the more famous UFO incidents. What caused this?

If you cant give me an answer then I would expect an apology.

You say there is no evidence. There is evidence. Just nothing good enough for you.

a reply to: BlueMule

So I have not been able to read the book you suggested....and somehow you are holding it against me? I've been able to read some reviews and overviews of the book and there is one consensus I have found. It is a very well written book. Otherwise, it's a book correlating comic books, personal experiences and the esoteric.

Or in other words, it's a well-written piece of new-age "could-be's" and "what-if's". Of course, I'm ignorant, so what do I know?

But what's really important here is that even though I am open-minded and willing to have a polite conversation on this topic, you try to imply my opinion is invalid because I am indoctrinated and haven't read some book.

You know, maybe you should read some of Michio Kaku's books and realize that the supernatural/paranormal and science/physics are possibly much more closely related than we think.

This new-age nonsense people are falling into these days is what is ruining ufology. It's no longer about finding the truth...it's about belief.

a reply to: olaru12

At first I was not going to respond because, well, your post really didnt add anything to the conversation except to be insulting.

It's pretty obvious that some people have no clue what skepticism is and how open many of us are to the wide world of possibilities. Very sad indeed.

originally posted by: andr3w68
a reply to: sheepslayer247

Please tell me how you feel about the known alterations of soil after some of the more famous UFO incidents. What caused this?

If you cant give me an answer then I would expect an apology.

You say there is no evidence. There is evidence. Just nothing good enough for you.

Easy answer. I don't know.

There is evidence that someone or something had an affect on the soil. From what I have seen, that is true.

But was it aliens or UFO's? How does a change in chemical composition equal aliens/ufos?

Wouldn't that be a leap in logic?

a reply to: uninfluenced

Your frustration and annoyance with the topic is exactly how TPTB want you to react. They enjoy that people believe it's pointless and that it's relatively impossible to "prove" anything, because now, any evidence that comes out on credible stories are just automatically discredited as fabricated lies, photoshopping, etc....

a reply to: uninfluenced

I hear you. The nuts and bolts UFO types of the past decades have come and gone. Nowadays, I would think that the evidence that there is something in our skies is more from a testimonial point of view of eye witnesses accounts in opposition to pictures and videos evidence - that are mostly infesting youtube for hits and clicks, thus fakes and hoaxes.

But there is still something up there that we (the public at least) know nothing or very little about. Just on ATS alone, you will find plenty of testimony from very credible members that have seen silent slow flying unidentified objects - triangles or otherwise - to support that there is something up there.

Extraterrestrial or secret military crafts ? Don't know but they're seen by regular folks.

Boring? Far from it. Look into those. If it doesn't take you away from boredom, at least it'll keep your mind occupied.

JMO.

originally posted by: sheepslayer247


It's pretty obvious that some people have no clue what skepticism is and how open many of us are to the wide world of possibilities. Very sad indeed.

I think I know what skepticism is....



What is truly sad is that there are those satisfied to condemn with out investigation. It's just an opinion and you know what they say about opinions....

So who am I to believe you or this guy.....

“Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance.” – Albert Einstein

UFology is not pointless and worthy of investigation in the field and I'm as big a skeptic as you are and I don't jump on the alien ufo bandwagon at the flash of a light in the sky or adhere to any new age BS.

But I have experienced events that I'm sure you would be skeptical of and try and explain away....but you weren't there !!

a reply to: olaru12

I have only given my opinion on the state of ufology and my dislike of it's general direction. I did not say it was pointless, but did say that we are lacking in real evidence.

So I have not condemned anyone or anything.

originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: sheepslayer247
POST REMOVED BY STAFF

Care to add anything relevant to the conversation? Ad Hom attacks do not bother me and I will not be swayed in to petty, useless conversation because you can't properly defend your stance.

You could always go back to the drawing board. Slay your indoctrinated inner sheep and read that book.

I think I have a pretty good grasp on things, thank you. Considering that I take a reasonable look at things before I commit to a certain belief would indicate that I am not a sheep...in fact I am sheepslayer.

POST REMOVED BY STAFF

Either way I'm done with you until you've read it. I've got little patience for skeptics these days

That says more about you than it does us evil skeptics. Perhaps if you were a bit more open to diverse opinions, your conversations with skeptics would be more productive.

a reply to: uninfluenced

Hi uninfluenced!
Your thread title, "Ufologoy is pointless, just give it up already" is merely your opinion.
That's fine, we are all free to "Rant" our opinions here.

But don't try to tell ME what to give up and what to keep, okay?

Personally, I think stamp collecting is pointless....or spoon collecting....or dolls. I'm not a collector, but I don't have a problem with other people enjoying their hobbies.

Ufology is one of mine. I love the theories. I enjoy pondering, "What if?"
I don't have definite beliefs, so to speak...but I believe that anything is possible.
I will read anything I can about certain events/sightings, like Roswell. It intrigues me.

So, while this is YOUR thread...and YOUR opinion...the rest of us are still entitled to keep wasting our time (lol) as we see fit. I'm just not sure why you are upset enough to rant? If I think something is 'pointless'....I usually just leave it alone.

jacygirl

originally posted by: jacygirl


Ufology is one of mine. I love the theories. I enjoy pondering, "What if?"
I don't have definite beliefs, so to speak...but I believe that anything is possible.
I will read anything I can about certain events/sightings, like Roswell. It intrigues me.



jacygirl

But be forewarned....

If you relate any of your personal high strangeness experiences on ATS; there are those who will try and shred your experience, insult your intelligence, and use all manner of real or imagined "scientific" evidence, or claimed authority, to discredit you and your sighting or event.

They are clever and articulate but pay them no mind because they weren't there and for some odd reason their opinions are borne of irrational fear, disguised as knowledge.

Some skeptics feel threatened by anything outside their personal comfort zone; that's the reason for their skepticism.

a reply to: olaru12

Some skeptics feel threatened by anything outside their personal comfort zone; that's the reason for their skepticism.

I disagree, Olaru. I think you might mean denier or naysayer. A skeptic keeps an open mind on different possibilities, as Sheepslayer mentioned. I agree with him. A denier or a naysayer on the other hand is at one end of the spectrum where it says "nope, impossible, not ET" - the other end of the same spectrum being the blind believer who says "yep, absolutely, ET" - on just about any sighting possible.

Being a skeptic is evaluating what it could be, without jumping on the "no, impossible, yes, absolutely" bandwagon, yet keeping an open mind on alternatives.

There are a lot of skeptics on ATS. I would define them as members trying to find what the real truth is.

And to be frankly honest, I find that healthy.

originally posted by: SonoftheSun


There are a lot of skeptics on ATS. I would define them as members trying to find what the real truth is.

And to be frankly honest, I find that healthy.

ok.......semantics....but I see what you mean. Still it's a fine line between being a skeptic and a naysayer or denier.
When the skeptic stoops to personal attacks and calling those they have an issue with "stupid", new age believers, uninformed, deluded, or anyother derogatory comment, is when they end being "skeptical" and morph into trolls. Of course it works both ways too!! An all to frequent occurrence on the boards lately.