Beijing-bound MAS plane carrying 239 people missing as of 20 mins ago.

Zaphod58
reply to post by Bilk22

 

There are six countries laying claim to the Spratly Islands, all of which have ships in the area. There are patrol vessels off the coasts of Vietnam, and over near Brunei, there are ships such as the Pinckney doing training in the area. There is also the chance of someone picking up the plane and scrambling interceptors to identify it.

Yes, Primary won't tell them that it's the Malaysian 777, but don't you think they're smart enough to trace the course it appeared on, and figure out that "Oh my god, that plane came from the area that the Malaysian flight is missing from!", and then look at a flight schedule, and see that no other flights would be taking that flight path? Or are they not smart enough to even start to put it together.

I'd be willing to bet there's hundreds of unidentified blobs on radar in that part of the world every day over that body of water that only military can track or determine what they are. But you're not on board with the idea that all the players are keeping the info of it being in China so it won't matter. You want to believe that everything is reported. Tell me why the airline didn't report it missing for 6 hours? Not just a couple of hours. 6 hours. I know. Don't waste your time. It's because of their pride and wanting to be in control. Or something like that. Right?

Tell me why the airline didn't report it missing for 6 hours?

Reported missing 1 hour and 30 minutes after the time it was scheduled to land. Even with loss of contact it still could arrive.

edit:

Public statement

reply to post by Bilk22


So they are flying "hundreds" of military flights a day in the area? Doubtful. Not to mention that a lot of military flights are under civilian control while flying, so they would have codes appearing. And how many of those come EXACTLY from the area that a commercial flight went missing?

I have no intention of believing everything the media says. I believe my own experience and past history. Not reporting it had nothing to do with then wanting "to be in control". The flight was an hour in, when it lost contact, it's a seven hour flight. It was entirely possible that they missed a radio switch, or they had a short problem with their transponder, or any number of things that have happened in the past, that later turned out to be nothing at all. You don't report a plane missing unless you KNOW it went down, or it fails to land at the destination, when it was supposed to.

If they reported every flight missing that lost contact, then there would be thousands of SAR missions launched every year, and the ones that really were missing would be missed.

reply to post by generik


It is a captains duty to offer assitance if called upon in a search and rescue scenario regardless. All traffic in the area will have been asked to keep an eye out. Unfortunately it seems the area is an AIS black spot as no vessels are showing up. This is probably due to piracy risk or political reasons. Millitary vessels rarely enable there AIS. Most vessels involved will be millitary as there is scant regard for life in the area and highly unlikely there will be ocean going search and rescue vessels available.

reply to post by da pickles


One of the articles I linked to earlier in this thread said that most of the vessels in that area are small fishing vessels, that aren't equipped with AIS systems. Which is making it harder for the SAR guys, because they have to investigate every small, slow moving target that shows up, which means they have to check every fishing boat in the area.

reply to post by Bilk22


Bilk 22

What are you suggesting...?

I've only just responded but you're map intrigues me....

PDUK

reply to post by tothetenthpower


Kind of a coincidence considering how two of the members on the plane had ran stolen passports.???

Zaphod58
reply to post by Bilk22

 

So they are flying "hundreds" of military flights a day in the area? Doubtful. Not to mention that a lot of military flights are under civilian control while flying, so they would have codes appearing. And how many of those come EXACTLY from the area that a commercial flight went missing?

I have no intention of believing everything the media says. I believe my own experience and past history. Not reporting it had nothing to do with then wanting "to be in control". The flight was an hour in, when it lost contact, it's a seven hour flight. It was entirely possible that they missed a radio switch, or they had a short problem with their transponder, or any number of things that have happened in the past, that later turned out to be nothing at all. You don't report a plane missing unless you KNOW it went down, or it fails to land at the destination, when it was supposed to.

If they reported every flight missing that lost contact, then there would be thousands of SAR missions launched every year, and the ones that really were missing would be missed.

The lost radio contact too, not just the transponder. I guess the next course of action would have been to see where it would would \next be expected to be picked up by radar and if that didn't occur, then you could suspect something happened. Would that be six hours later?

reply to post by Bilk22


I get alerts from FlightRadar24 on my phone that show emergency, and lost communications codes from planes. On average I get 4-5 a day from planes that lost communications. Usually it's just a simple matter of the pilot missing the frequency change directive from the tower. Sometimes it's an electrical problem, usually that they end up fixing within a few minutes. So yes, they're going to wait until the plane was supposed to land before they raise an alert.

The plane was leaving Malaysia, so how would they know if they came up on comms later on or not? They couldn't hear them anymore once they left their airspace. Once they are handed off from one Center to another, the first Center no longer follows them, and doesn't know if they switched or not unless someone calls them about it.

Malaysia doesn't know if they switched comms or not, and Vietnam doesn't know if they turned around or not, since they didn't have them on radar.

PurpleDog UK
reply to post by Bilk22

 

Bilk 22

What are you suggesting...?

I've only just responded but you're map intrigues me....

PDUK

Well it's way back in the thread and actually a few times But ok it was reported very early on the plane landed safely in China and had been escorted by Chinese military craft. Then those reports started to 404 and or be retracted. Additionally, the known information of stolen passports being used to board the plane coupled with Freescale semiconductor personnel on board had me thinking this was some kind of plot to kidnap those people or something along those line. However additional information seems to have come forward where threats of terrorism were issued to another airline,but involving China.

So I am suggesting that the initial reports are true. That the Chinese escorted the flight to an alternate airport in China and have the plane grounded. Whether or not there's a standoff of something else? Who knows? That's the gist of it anyway

Bilk22

Zaphod58
reply to post by Bilk22

 

There are six countries laying claim to the Spratly Islands, all of which have ships in the area. There are patrol vessels off the coasts of Vietnam, and over near Brunei, there are ships such as the Pinckney doing training in the area. There is also the chance of someone picking up the plane and scrambling interceptors to identify it.

Yes, Primary won't tell them that it's the Malaysian 777, but don't you think they're smart enough to trace the course it appeared on, and figure out that "Oh my god, that plane came from the area that the Malaysian flight is missing from!", and then look at a flight schedule, and see that no other flights would be taking that flight path? Or are they not smart enough to even start to put it together.

I'd be willing to bet there's hundreds of unidentified blobs on radar in that part of the world every day over that body of water that only military can track or determine what they are. But you're not on board with the idea that all the players are keeping the info of it being in China so it won't matter. You want to believe that everything is reported. Tell me why the airline didn't report it missing for 6 hours? Not just a couple of hours. 6 hours. I know. Don't waste your time. It's because of their pride and wanting to be in control. Or something like that. Right?

Having worked in the Far East then I have to agree with Bilk 22 in his/her assumption of "not reporting" because of Pride.... C
I found the Far Eastern races very dependant upon 'instruction' and very honourable in terms of tradition .......plane missing for 1 hour - whatever. 6 hours then.......hmmm m. Where is it.?
PDUK

My mind is still stuck to the fact that when someone called the phone of one of the passengers it rang twice before it was disconnected. Had the plane exploded or drowned, would the phone still be ringing?

(yes, this has probably already been discussed somewhere but I wont scroll around for hours to find it, mind you)

reply to post by Zaphod58


Sorry but missed the article. 80 square miles is bloody tiny ! Unless they had knowledge that it definatly went down in the area, even still the last task I carried out ended up with a debris trail 7 miles from the suspected POI within 4 hours.

PurpleDog UK
plane missing for 1 hour - whatever. 6 hours then.......hmmm m. Where is it.?

That's exactly what it is everywhere. Plane flies off radar, after losing transponder and comms - electrical problem the crew may be able to fix, interesting problem.

Plane doesn't land where it's supposed to, and is an hour overdue- Oh crap.

That's going to happen with just about every airline, unless they have witnesses to an explosion/crash, follow the plane down on radar, to impact, etc. Without tangible evidence something happened to them, you don't report it missing for something that may be fixable in flight.

Bilk22

PurpleDog UK
reply to post by Bilk22

 

Bilk 22

What are you suggesting...?

I've only just responded but you're map intrigues me....

PDUK

Well it's way back in the thread and actually a few times

But ok it was reported very early on the plane landed safely in China and had been escorted by Chinese military craft. Then those reports started to 404 and or be retracted. Additionally, the known information of stolen passports being used to board the plane coupled with Freescale semiconductor personnel on board had me thinking this was some kind of plot to kidnap those people or something along those line. However additional information seems to have come forward where threats of terrorism were issued to another airline,but involving China.

So I am suggesting that the initial reports are true. That the Chinese escorted the flight to an alternate airport in China and have the plane grounded. Whether or not there's a standoff of something else? Who knows? That's the gist of it anyway

65 pages ....... Forgive me....:-P

Based on your suggestion ...".. Then this is a HUGE conspiracy ........ Possibly

Regards

PDUK

reply to post by da pickles


I was surprised as hell to hear that it was that small. I would have thought it would have been at least 150 from the start, and expanding as nothing was found.

reply to post by Skyfloating


From what someone said somewhere in here, when they've gone international roaming, their phone has rung when called, even when it was turned off. Definitely interesting though.

reply to post by Skyfloating


In my experiences, when a cell phone is turned off, battery is dead or not functioning, it can ring a couple times on the callers end or it can go straight to voicemail...etc.

As a test, turn off your cell and call it from a land line. It may ring...it may go to VM. You never know.

Zaphod58

PurpleDog UK
plane missing for 1 hour - whatever. 6 hours then.......hmmm m. Where is it.?

That's exactly what it is everywhere. Plane flies off radar, after losing transponder and comms - electrical problem the crew may be able to fix, interesting problem.

Plane doesn't land where it's supposed to, and is an hour overdue- Oh crap.

That's going to happen with just about every airline, unless they have witnesses to an explosion/crash, follow the plane down on radar, to impact, etc. Without tangible evidence something happened to them, you don't report it missing for something that may be fixable in flight.

Zaphod....... Hmmm. You are an authority on all matters "aviation". IMHO....

Are you suggesting that the airline know more than they are letting on...?

Probability is that it " broke apart" in flight...... I mean a pressurised tin can in the air is not normal or natural......

PDUK

sheepslayer247


In my experiences, when a cell phone is turned off, battery is dead or not functioning, it can ring a couple times on the callers end or it can go straight to voicemail...etc.

As a test, turn off your cell and call it from a land line. It may ring...it may go to VM. You never know.

I see. So that unsticks my mind from this issue. Thanks.