The End Of Car Ownership

They would have to start making and selling about 16 million vehicles a year considering approximately 115 million vehicles are currently used daily by 150 million people driving to and from work in the USA. Add in all the new immigrants and vehicle usage goes up even more.

It's a ludricrous idea. There are only about 2 million EV cars currently in use in the USA. And coincidently:

Proterra biggest EV bus maker in the US files for bankruptcy protection

The company has failed to turn a profit on the 1,300 EV buses it has sold across North America. It plans to continue operations after a restructuring. 8 August 2023

Proterra, the largest U.S. electric-bus maker, filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection late Monday.

It’s a shocking turn for the nearly two-decade-old U.S. company, which has sought to compete against giant Chinese rival BYD and to partner with traditional bus-makers in the emerging North American and European electric bus markets.

www.canarymedia.com...

Proterra, the Burlingame, California, company that makes electric buses as well as large trucks, vans and components for other manufacturers, has filed for bankruptcy.

The wheels on the bus go ‘round and ‘round but it’s not a smooth ride when the powerplant is a battery. Proterra, the Burlingame, California, company that makes electric buses as well as large trucks, vans and components for other manufacturers, has filed for bankruptcy. Just as Barack Obama hyped and funded solar panel maker Solyndra before it failed, President Joe Biden promoted the company in 2021, declaring that it was “getting us in the game.” He also forgave its $10 million COVD-aid loan.

Unlike Solyndra, which lasted only six years, Proterra is not a new company. It’s been around for almost two decades. It’s considered “an early pioneer in the commercial electric vehicle industry.” Just two years ago, it was expanding. The company took in federal EV funding, COVID aid, had hundreds of millions in cash, and was producing “very meaningful revenue.”

Yet it has been dragged down by the EV anchor, failing “to turn a profit on its core electric bus manufacturing operations, as well as the drivetrain, battery and EV charger businesses it launched over the past five years,” Canary Media reports.

In fact, it loses money on every electric bus it sells. That segment of its business has been pulling down Proterra’s other operations due to in part the capital intensity required to build electric vehicles.

That’s not an isolated occurrence. Ford loses more than $66,000 for each EV it sells. Other EV makers are finding that consumers aren’t interested in their automobiles. Korean luxury brand Genesis only a few weeks ago had nearly a year’s worth of unsold EV inventory on hand. ​
***SNIP***
Maybe the truths about EVs are finally running them down. They’re no more eco-friendly than internal-combustion vehicles, and might be less so. They don’t have tailpipes, but, with some exceptions, their batteries are charged from power generated by plants that burn natural gas and coal, and emit the same greenhouse gases that a hi-test guzzling Big Detroit V8 does. The carbon footprint of EV production is larger than the carbon footprint left behind by the manufacture of conventional cars. The mining needed for the components in their batteries is a dirty business.

www.pacificresearch.org...

Will Heavy EVs Destroy America's Roads?

Even if streets aren't buckling under the weight of battery-electric pickup trucks, these extra-heavy vehicles do have an effect on a road's lifespan. The latest full-size battery-electric pickups and SUVs boast substantial driving ranges—in the neighborhood of 300 miles—but there's a price to pay for harnessing so many electrons. These larger-than-life trucks feature equally enormous batteries that drive their curb weights up to levels not often seen outside commercial-spec vehicles.

Some 2022 models of the Ford Lightning and Rivian R1T battery-electric trucks tip the scales at between 6,500 and 6,700 pounds. The GMC Hummer EV truck checks in at an astonishing 9,063 pounds. These monster machines weigh between two and three times the mass of a standard compact car (the GMC's 2,923-pound battery weighs more than a 2022 Toyota GR86). With the Hummer surpassing even the heftiest of 3/4-ton heavy-duty pickups on the scale, what does that mean for American roads designed to support a much lighter fleet of passenger vehicles?

Heavier vehicles = also more wear and tear on tires:

Some EV drivers are finding that their tires wear out more rapidly than they had with traditional internal combustion-driven vehicles—in some cases, 20 percent faster.

The problem has multiple causes. Many EVs are heavier than regular cars of a similar size, which puts more load on the tires. When combined with the almost instant torque provided by electric motors, that can lead to leaving rubber on the road—even when a driver isn’t attempting to burn rubber.
www.sciencefriday.com...#:~:text=Many%20EVs%20are%20heavier%20than,t%20attempting%20to%20burn%20rubber.

Doesn't look good for EV's. Finally the truth IS coming out about how bad they are. Not enough charging stations. Long charging times. Damage to environment harvesting EV battery materials. Excess wear and tear to roads, excess wear and tear to tires, excess wear and tear to our wallets....all the way around.

Is the government going to own all the vehicles then?

a reply to: StoutBroux

They would have to start making and selling about 16 million vehicles a year considering approximately 115 million vehicles are currently used daily by 150 million people driving to and from work in the USA.

They wouldn't. In the future as visualised by environmentalists and the Davos set, most people would either work from home or travel to their jobs using public transport. Shopping would be done mostly online (as it is already except among the Wal-Mart demographic).

On the rare occasions when you needed private, door-to-door transport, you'd summon one of those driverless taxicabs Klaus was talking about. One cab can replace severate private cars -- which spend most of the day sitting idle in a parking lot or a garage.

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There is a country where this future has already been happening for decades: Singapore. It works beautifully; I love cars and love driving, but I lived there for years without one and never felt the loss.

Of course, Singapore is a small, well-organised country with a strong government and a cooperative, well-educated populace. Not much like the USA. Which is why I agree that this highly desirable future won't come to pass in America (or anywhere else except, maybe, China): not for the reasons you've pointed out (those are all problems of technological adaptation, which technology itself will resolve) but for the reasons I pointed out earlier: animal inertia, lack of adaptability, stupidity and greed. The Four Horsemen of the Malthusian Apocalypse.

a reply to: Byrd

Who do you think runs the computers, builds houses, runs the plants that manufacture electronics, runs the power plants that provide electricity, repairs roadways, repairs electronics, repairs cars, installs dishwashers etc, etc? It's not the uber-elites.

We hold them hostage.

A nice thought, Byrd, but historically speaking, peasants’ and slaves’ revolts − which is what you’re talking about − rarely succeed; in modern times, scarcely any at all. It takes an educated bourgeoisie to launch and manage a successful revolution, and you won’t find many bourgeoises participating in the one being mooted here.

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a reply to: StoutBroux

By the way, I have no idea why you think 16 million electric vehicles a year is a target unachievable by American automobile manufacturers, which produce that number of vehicles in an average year. Shortage of some essential element for making batteries, perhaps? Educate us.

I doubt people will be happy when they own nothing. They will probably be forced to work and get nothing out of it. In fact, who will own everything? Oh the rich!

a reply to: darkbake

I doubt people will be happy when they own nothing.

I wonder why you doubt that. Jesus, Buddha, Plato and the founder of Jainism, Mahavira, all taught that attachment to material possessions creates amxiety and unhappiness. Many other moral teachers and philosophers have taught the same.

If you know better than they, please teach me.

Cars are money pits and depreciate in value over time. Give me better options.

a reply to: Astyanax

They would have to increase public transportation to accommodate maybe approximately 25 million? people, because I sure don't see all 150m riding to work instead of driving. The stats I gave in the above post from current sources states 150 million drive to and from work on a daily basis. The US has probably 7 million new immigrants in the last few years. Let's say if half of them get jobs and drive to work, that's another 3.5 million vehicles on the road. Most jobs that can be done at home are already in place and the rest need their workers on site. The public transportation can't possibly (as it stands now) compensate increasing ridership of millions and millions of people.

Now my opinion certainly isn't a forever and ever thing. But it takes many, many years to accommodate the changes some of these 15 minute city fans are wanting. And most likely it would also take a major catastrophe to even get people on 'that' train. Which by the way I believe Covid19 was set up to be a catalyst for but it didn't work. In fact I don't see anything remotely like some of these people want happening for 20-30 years or more. But sure, it could happen eventually. There are ways to force compliance like raising gas prices so high people can't afford to drive or making availability an issue which may be easier to deal with in the large cities. In rural areas and towns without public transportation and those forced compliance techniques, I guess that one could force those outside of city limits into the cities.

But then, there's the housing issues which also won't get resolved overnight. You're talking about a major overhaul of society and quality of life as we know it. And sources to get food and basic need products. And a LOT more schools. As Biden once told Obama, this is a BFD!

a reply to: StoutBroux

They would have to increase public transportation to accommodate maybe approximately 25 million? people, because I sure don't see all 150m riding to work instead of driving.

In the USA there would certainly have to be an increase, hgand a general improvement, too, in public transportation. Not in other industrialized nations; American public transport is both inadequate and primitive for the country it is. But I am sure the country can cope.

Which by the way I believe Covid19 was set up to be a catalyst for but it didn't work.

If you believe a cabal of scheming elites secretly rule the world by means such as this, why are you still supporting capitalism and free enterprise? Isn't that how the elites of today became elites?

(I ask out of curiosity only; I too believe in capitalism and free enterprise, but I don't believe in cabals of scheming elites, so there's no logical contradiction there.)

originally posted by: Astyanax
a reply to: StoutBroux

They would have to increase public transportation to accommodate maybe approximately 25 million? people, because I sure don't see all 150m riding to work instead of driving.

In the USA there would certainly have to be an increase, hgand a general improvement, too, in public transportation. Not in other industrialized nations; American public transport is both inadequate and primitive for the country it is. But I am sure the country can cope.

Which by the way I believe Covid19 was set up to be a catalyst for but it didn't work.

If you believe a cabal of scheming elites secretly rule the world by means such as this, why are you still supporting capitalism and free enterprise? Isn't that how the elites of today became elites?

(I ask out of curiosity only; I too believe in capitalism and free enterprise, but I don't believe in cabals of scheming elites, so there's no logical contradiction there.)

I agree, for the advanced modernization of the US, there are many areas of infrastructure and transportation that need to be improved. But the funny thing is, billions and billions have been given to fix our country for these areas in the last 12 years yet somehow, there is little improvement.

No, I don't believe that 'Covid19' was specifically chosen for THE catalyst to ensure the desired outcome, but I do believe the government and other entities are pushing for thing(s) to happen to help their agendas along. There are too many fingers in the pie to ignore.

I have seen them tease this back in 2010s where hot tub time machine 2. They go to a future were everyone uses a uber app to get a electric car to drive them somewhere. car tries to kill one of the people. www.youtube.com...

If you do the math uber has to get really cheap in order for there dreams to happen. People go to work everyday. In most cases just 5 to 10 trips is the whole car payment.

Does anyone have the full context?

originally posted by: IndieA
Who would own the self-driving cars?

People like my wife would love to own a self driving car. She has a driver's license, but is on a low vision program, thus her ability to drive is severely hampered. The area we live in is highly dependent on car travel. She would love to be able to get in a car and travel independently without having to wait for my son, her mother, or I to take her somewhere. Uber and Lyft is not the same.

a reply to: billxam

Within the confines of its 15 minute city. Duh.

originally posted by: Astyanax
a reply to: darkbake

I doubt people will be happy when they own nothing.

I wonder why you doubt that. Jesus, Buddha, Plato and the founder of Jainism, Mahavira, all taught that attachment to material possessions creates amxiety and unhappiness. Many other moral teachers and philosophers have taught the same.

If you know better than they, please teach me.

Hmmm..
I have read the Bible many times and I have never read where Jesus taught "that attachment to material possessions creates amxiety and unhappiness".

The lesson is: Don't put anything above your relationship with God.
Money can do that.
Drugs can do that.
Social Media can do that.
Etc.
We can put anything before our relationship with God.
"It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than a rich man to enter into the kingdom of heaven".
Why?
Because of the distractions it brings and the lengths people are willing to go to in order to obtain it and hold on to it.
This can go for anything that we value more than our relationship with God.