I understand its a scary subject but>

Originally posted by the_0bserver85
My hell ; immortal and being imprisoned in a casket drop in ocean, and suffer in agony from torture for eternity.
My heaven ; living forever with my grandma and grandpa down to my son and daughter.

Me and oceans don’t get along for some reason, I got clostaphobic just thinking about what you said, that freaking scary ,I’m scared just thinking about it, like really, my biggest fear of death is drowning.urrgg.'mental visual'

reply to post by Vicky32

where to begin? Many of those beliefs you are claiming are Christian ones, are simply American ones!

Actually those "things" I quoted are contained in the bibles which are claimed (obviously not by me) to be the word of a god or "inspired" by a god. The god in question being the charter described in the said bibles that goes by various names including yawhe and jesus.

George W Bush is thankfully irrelevant, but outside the USA, it's easy to see that he isn't a Christian..

Geoge W Bush is certainly not irrelevant, ask any Iraqi or Afghan parent that had their 5 or 1 year old blown to bits or poisoned by depleted uranium . How chrsitians sort out who and who is not a "real" member of their club is not my concern.

lady much wiser than I once said to me "never trust anyone that hides behind a fish" how remarkably astute she was.

Have you never heard of Christian pacifism? It's a much older and stronger idea than the Christian militarism that as far as I can see, Americans believe...

Pacifists ? Was it not the jesus character that said "I have not come to bring peace but a sword --"?
This is ATS for goodness sake almost every flavoured xtian has proselytized (almost always to their own detriment) here , frankly they all sing from the same hymn sheet my dear.

Also, many of the things you quote are from the Old Testament. The New Testament is called that for a reason. These things such as the bit about slavery, are as irrelevant as GW Bush

!

Ah, the old , "Old Testament is nothing to do with us" trick eh ? the old testament is integral to the claims of Christianity, for starters yawhe and jesus are allegedly one and the same being we could go on from here for quite a bit but to be brief if christians reject the OT then simply don't use it

Do you by any chance happen to be a chrsitian Vicky ? If so let me ask you a question -

If your god told you to kill me would you -

A) Do it without a second thought ?

B) Make some absurd claim like your god wouldn't ask you to or you don't think it would.

C) refuse to accept the voice in your head is real and seek medical attention.

D) Look in the bibles or ask your pastor what to do ?


For your amusement Vicky , whos' book ? -

Originally posted by Immortalgemini527


My Heaven imaginative thought would be, me and one woman of virginity, who cleans cooks and just stays in a woman’s place like a woman supose to…period !

Interesting. So your heaven is also that woman's hell.

My personal view of heaven is the state of being separate from even the most minute semblance of love/empathy (ie. God) surrounded by others who also have a complete and absolute lack of love/empathy. This IMHO happens when a person is unable to see past their own addictions/flaws/obsessions/vanities and have no love, compassion or empathy to restrain their desire for these things and thus are unable to see God/Perfect Love. I am not certain because i haven't reached a state where i could know absolutes about these things but i suspect that once a person CHOOSES perfect Godly Love they move toward God and away from the "Hell" state.

My idea of heaven is complete and perfect freedom to move, learn, explore while embraced by perfect Love, peace and joy in communion with all that has lived.

Originally posted by Lannock

Originally posted by Vicky32
reply to post by Lannock

 

You should fix your quotes. Your response is directed at The Djin, who responded to 'fallow the light' who responded to me.

I am sorry about that, I did make a bit of a pig's ear of it! My excuse is I am new, signed up tonight, and my eye sight is not that crash hot... I'll do better next time!
Vicky

Originally posted by The Djin
reply to post by Vicky32

 

where to begin? Many of those beliefs you are claiming are Christian ones, are simply American ones!

Actually those "things" I quoted are contained in the bibles which are claimed (obviously not by me) to be the word of a god or "inspired" by a god. The god in question being the charter described in the said bibles that goes by various names including yawhe and jesus.

And you distort them.

George W Bush is thankfully irrelevant, but outside the USA, it's easy to see that he isn't a Christian..

I meant that he isn't in power any more, so denigrate the next war-mongering Pretzeldent!

Have you never heard of Christian pacifism? It's a much older and stronger idea than the Christian militarism that as far as I can see, Americans believe...

Originally posted by The DjinPacifists ? Was it not the jesus character that said "I have not come to bring peace but a sword --"?

I take it that you have never heard of it then! You misinterpret what Jesus said. He meant that people would fight because of him, not that he wanted that. This 'discussion' is an example!

Also, many of the things you quote are from the Old Testament. The New Testament is called that for a reason. These things such as the bit about slavery, are as irrelevant as GW Bush

!

Ah, the old , "Old Testament is nothing to do with us" trick eh ? the old testament is integral to the claims of Christianity, for starters yawhe and jesus are allegedly one and the same being we could go on from here for quite a bit but to be brief if christians reject the OT then simply don't use it

Do you by any chance happen to be a chrsitian Vicky ? If so let me ask you a question -

If your god told you to kill me would you -

A) Do it without a second thought ?

B) Make some absurd claim like your god wouldn't ask you to or you don't think it would.

C) refuse to accept the voice in your head is real and seek medical attention.

D) Look in the bibles or ask your pastor what to do ?


For your amusement Vicky , whos' book ? -


I am a Christian. I wouldn';t kill you because God wouldn't ask me to to do so, whatever you think! You are a spiteful little man and I have already wasted too much time on you.

reply to post by Immortalgemini527


Nah... life on earth is where the real hell is man.. anything else imo is just a threat.. one that cant be backed up..

reply to post by Immortalgemini527


There is no hell, the pope apologized for that ( "Hell is not a punishment imposed externally by God, but the condition resulting from attitudes and actions which people have done in this life. More than a physical place, Hell is the state of those who freely and definitively separate themselves from God," the Pope said at a weekly audience.) And why does it really matter where you end up, it's inevitable. Be more concerned with now because you'll never get another chance.

reply to post by The Djin





Actually those "things" I quoted are contained in the bibles which are claimed (obviously not by me) to be the word of a god or "inspired" by a god. The god in question being the charter described in the said bibles that goes by various names including yawhe and jesus.

And you distort them.

Then please feel free to point us to the authority on the contextual manner in which the bibles are supposed to be read . The actual authors of the bibles by any chance ? As we know these books have been rehashed over and over and the authors are unknown so where do we seek authority you Pastor by any chance ? Your parents ? A man on TV ? Some other man who claims to have some sort of commnication relationshiup with your god that you don't? A voice in your head?

Is it not just another typical response from an xtian in the cherry pick and make it up as you go along club ?

George W Bush is thankfully irrelevant, but outside the USA, it's easy to see that he isn't a Christian..

I meant that he isn't in power any more, so denigrate the next war-mongering Pretzeldent!

You mean the next warmonger in that is a member of the christian club of course ?

Have you never heard of Christian pacifism? It's a much older and stronger idea than the Christian militarism that as far as I can see, Americans believe...

Pacifists ? Was it not the jesus character that said "I have not come to bring peace but a sword --"?

You misinterpret what Jesus said. He meant that people would fight because of him, not that he wanted that.

And how exactly do you know this ? Again where do you get the authority on context ? The passage is quite clear -

Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division: 52 For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. 53 The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter,

Yes indeed, pretty unambiguous this character in a book is quite clearly saying he has not come to bring peace the opposite of which is war, which he backs by giving the instruction to buy arms -

22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

Now we all know that one doesn't acquire a sword to spread butter on an unleavened loaf so it's fair to say that the passages mean exactly what they say.

But, of course that just won't do will it ? So they must mean something else but what exactly and who should one ask, the anonymous author your pastor the cookie monster ?

Also, many of the things you quote are from the Old Testament. The New Testament is called that for a reason. These things such as the bit about slavery, are as irrelevant as GW Bush

It was your god jesus/yahweh that said -

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: ----------.

Nope it appears ywaheh didn't change his mind about things when he changed his name to jesus then.

I am a Christian. I wouldn';t kill you because God wouldn't ask me to to do so,
[/quote

And how exactly do you know this and state it as fact ? Do you have some special secret hotline with the bible go that others don't so as to make this assertion ? Please feel free to enlighten us

You are a spiteful little man and I have already wasted too much time on you.

Then forgive me.

I must say you've done a piss poor job of defending your delusion so far, you've nothing new to add just the usual cherry picking make it up as you go along bible bashing.

And this nonsense is taught to children ? No wonder the pews are emptying by the second, some serious growing up is need to be done.

Hell will be w.e you imagine it to be. So will heaven.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/41a2ea17b80f.jpg[/atsimg]
Hell is here.

I think he says it well.

I experienced hell 7/20/07. Its hard not to violate the T&Cs without going into details, but it was under the influence of something. It all lasted about 5 minutes, and I couldn't believe my eyes when I checked the time, it seemed like I was under for an eternity. Within the confines of my thoughts, I was completely flat...there was no feeling of freedom, but there was a feeling of needing to move. My family and friends, as I knew them, were being eroded from my mind. The relationships that I had formed up until that date, had become pointless. I soon discovered that my entire life was a joke, and the entire universe wanted to explicitly let it be known to me.

I saw my environment exposed for what it was, a cheap, thoughtless, paint by numbers scheme. It was like discovering the wizard behind the curtain. I tried writing about this experience many times, and yet I still cannot convey what I saw. Hell to me is a level of awareness. If this is what possibly awaits me, I want no part of it.

reply to post by The Djin


as i stated in a previous post that I DID NOT SAY CATHOLIC/CHRISTIAN VIEWS. I SAID TO KEEP AN OPEN MIND ABOUT WHAT WE CAN NOT TOUCH SMELL SEE AND HEAR! my views are not that of christian/catholic.

reply to post by Vicky32


oh and i did not quote any thing from the old testament. and this is a heaven/hell thread and i was using scripture to show an idea of what some believe. i love how when some one is not an atheist, the atheists automatically think that person is a catholic/christian. you should fully read and understand a post before you assume and make a mistake.

apologies to vicky32. this post was meant for The Djin. sorry for the confusion. and im not sure if the old testament comment was made for me or you, so if it wasn't to me i apologize to Djin. if it was then i dont.

reply to post by The Endtime Warrior


i have experienced something very similar. and i think i know what substance you are talking about. if im correct about which one than it is legal were i am and you can buy it at the mall in martinsburg WV

reply to post by fallow the light


well I did buy it in a head shop. It became illegal in IL as of 2008 I believe. only found in one place in the entire world, naturally. Mexico.

We all experience both extremes, calling them heaven and hell. The Source does not waste Its creations, as seen in the laws of simple physics. All matter is energy, be it in a stable or unstable form. Hell is within us all, just as Heaven is. Its a state of mind, not a reward or punishment, and we ourselves are the keyholders to our release from such restrictions. Now, on a lower note, I've always been fond of the bumper sticker that says " I may be going to hell, but at least you won't be there".

reply to post by The Endtime Warrior


i believe that it was created by the mayans from different sages (dont quote me on that one). its very hard to grow. its a plant that is usually cloned because seeds are very hard to come by. but yeah i thought i was going to see heaven and i most def saw hell. well when i started coming to it felt like i was being pulled out of hell and saved and it was a very good feeling when i became coherent.

after growing up in a christian church, ive come to the conclusion that real hell would be to spend eternity with a buck of christians singing church songs, living as a vegan, keeping a fake smile to impress the hypocrites. basically everything ive come to hate under the thumb of a god who kills and demands total obedience.

that my friends is my hell.

but maybe theres something wrong with me because i never felt "his love", a bunch of crap imo. not my fault, i guess i spent 18 years trying, and nothing. all to waste.

anyways my heaven is where i am god

"Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the company." -Mark Twain

Love the Hellraiser clips. In my opinion, even to this day, Hellraiser scares the crap out of me more than the modern day horror movies. And if theres a hell, I could safely say it's probably just like that.

As for the idea of heaven, I always thought it would be like the movie What Dreams May Come. We create our own.