For those interested in Free Energy, does Otis T. Carr's Free Energy Principle comply with Physics?

Any vehicle accelerated to an axis rotation relative to its attractive inertial mass, immediately becomes activated by free-space-energy and acts as an independent force...

-Otis T. Carr's Free Energy Principle, from around the late 1940's

i know Otis T. Carr has been mentioned here on ATS quite a few times, but i've never really found a straight answer from, let's say, a Physics major, about this particular statement...

does it hold water?

could his entire explanation for free energy activation be possible if one were to follow his work?

...to elaborate, from the 1957 article, "Carr's Principles of Free Energy Space Flight Accorded Highest Scientific Verification":

An excellent example of this principle applied in practice is the fact that the two satellites now orbiting the earth, have achieved space-energy activation by an equivalent inertial velocity, and were it not for their susceptibility to internal or inherent physical deterioration, they would theoretically and factually be kept orbiting by natural space forces until the end of time in our solar system. These statements in evaluation of natural physical phenomena as first discerned and made public by Mr Carr, have been physically tested in laboratory experiment by an impartial scientific laboratory and confirmed as follows:

"We have shown that a charged body, accelerated to an axis rotation relative to this attractive inertial mass, indicates polarity in a given direction. The dip-needle points, say, up toward the top of the body. But mount this while rotating body, with its spindle, on another platform and rotate this platform on a spindle, then if the counter-rotation is greater than the inertial forward rotation of the body, a dip-needle on the second platform will point down while the first dip-needle points up, indicating complete relativity of polarity. When the exact counter-rotation matches the forward rotation the body loses its polarity entirely and immediately becomes activated by free-energy (tensor stresses in space) and acts as an independent force..."

...

"Your discovery therefore is distinctly a possibility, and its creative genius lies in its inventor's ability to provide it with a process for generating its own power as a result of its self-rotation."

Translated into familiar terms, this scientific explanation means that the above-described assembly of counter-rotating charged masses becomes weightless and will escape the immediately attractive gravitational forces...

...

Some tests were independently made by qualified engineers at one of America's leading plants and it was estimated that a small model, only 4 inches in diameter, produced energy equivalent to 1,000 tons. This was in 1952, and Mr Carr was unable to interest anyone in his efforts at that time. Things have changed, and the Government has now put its blessing on space flight development.

At the present time the rocket enthusiasts are commanding topmost attention. But there will be changes in thinking, and new directions of endeavor very soon. Our experiments with circular-foil design, as relates to gravity, electromagnetism, and electromotive force, have led us to the certain conclusion that it is possible to use the inverse-proportion laws of Newton as successfully as the third law of motion applies to accelerated rockets.

...from an article entitled "Gravity Machine" from 1958:

He said the same "free energy" which causes the earth to rotate on its axis and orbit around the sun will turn a machine he described as two cones joined at their circular bases.

When the rotation of such a machine reaches a certain velocity relative to the earth's orbital velocity, Carr said, it will take off.

Carr said the core of his space ship would be a huge battery which would spin at the velocity of the external craft and which would be recharged, he said, by its motion. Carr declared such a battery, built to any size, could be designed to power the largest electric generating plant, operate an automobile, heat a house or power any conceivable machine or device.

i could quote his research all day, but it's already been done on this site... apparently, O.T.C. didn't succeed when he was supposed to publicly demonstrate a working model, so many could say that it never worked at all, period.

i disagree - i think his story is legit, but i need those that are more educated in physics and whatnot to explain if his principle is plausible! on the page i got this information from he's got a jaw-dropping interview, which has most of the specifics of how free energy becomes activated, and how his machine works specifically, and anyone who's remotely interested in free energy at all would do well to read it NOW!!

behold!
www.rexresearch.com...

...that page also includes images of his "Amusement Device" (flying saucer), and has diagrams and descriptions of most, if not all, of the parts!

finally, here's a teaser from his interview:

The equation is brought about by the shape of our Utron electrical accumulator; this is the name given to our central power system. In our operation of working models and in checking out experiments, we had to find the formula that fit the reason for the action and reaction we were getting. So in exploring nature and studying the great inspirational work of the Dr. Einstein on relativity, we came upon this formula of linear correlation. And when we study linear correlation in geometric form we have to have a starting point and this is the point. And from there it explains through the cross and through the circle. And the only mathematical way we can express it is in the symbolism of zero X or 0X, and this formula brings us to that. We claim that this is the true unified field theory in physical practice.

In a further study of Dr Einstein's great inspirational work --- and we corresponded with him and we had the great good fortune of being advised by him at one time --- we learned that all measurements of time and space had to be considered in relationship to the observer and therefore there never was a fixed quantity of any number. Now in physical form, this is something else again...

On this craft, insofar as the individuals are concerned, we can travel in the same manner as a pressurized airliner. We don't have the problem of a heat shield... because the electromagnetic system sets up a protective shield in our craft which enables us to overcome this [thermal] barrier without any discomfort to the occupants of the craft. And we can very slowly rise, and once we are outside the atmosphere we can accelerate to tremendous velocities up to the speed of light itself.

moreover, if you're interested in researching one of the lucky passengers that flew in this craft, you can always check out Ralph Ring's story... that page even has audio interviews from Otis T. Carr that go even more in depth into this fascinating subject of "Free Energy"!!

again, i've heard many responses from those who've only skimmed the surface of Otis T. Carr's story here in other threads, but now i'm looking to finalize this issue with the complete and absolute truth, because i've got a very strong feeling that O.T.C. was on to something, especially when you realize that he was one of Nikola Tesla's disciples!!

is this all bogus, or could these theories that seem so plausible actually be true??


peace, everyone, and let FREE ENERGY shine in the spotlight forever!!!


[edit on 26-5-2009 by adrenochrome]

also...

Carr's engine had only two moving parts – like two spinning tops on top of one another, each spinning in a different direction. Carr stated that "when counter-rotation matches forward rotation, a body loses its polarity... and creates a kind of independent force. This causes the counter-rotating mass to escape the full effect of gravitational influence."

Similar results, pertaining to the apparent antigravitic properties of rotating objects, have been shown by a variety of researchers – most notably, the eminent British engineer Professor Eric Laithwaite, who demonstrated an apparent loss of weight in a sealed system containing an arrangement of spinning gyroscopes and called upon the scientific community to research the phenomenon. Intriguingly, the "Jell-o" description [see below] of the altered state of solid metal, attained under specific and unusual conditions, has also been reported by the researcher John Hutchison, and is part of the lore of The Philadelphia Experiment.

www.projectcamelot.org...

the "'Jell-O' description", from Ralph Ring's interview:

So than I got back and they had set up the meeting with Carr and then we got down into the laboratory down in Hesperia, down in Apple Valley. And we started setting up shop. We had a little machine shop set up and we had, you know, all kinds of stuff to do things with, but we had a couple of models that they brought with them that were semi-operational. So the first experiment that I saw that just knocked my socks off was... We set it up on one of the work benches and attached - not electricity, but sound waves, if you will. Or maybe it was, I think... I'm not sure. Anyway, this was a small model, about, was it two feet in diameter? Two or three feet in diameter. And they said, "Well, take a look at this." So they fired it up. Hardly any noise, just a hum, a vibratory hum. And it was made out of aluminum. I touched the surface of it and it felt good, but I could feel the vibration. And so they kept increasing the energy and then there was this feeling... Jeez, it felt like somebody opened a door and a cool breeze was coming through. It felt really good. And at that time I went to touch it again and it was like jello, it was getting soft, getting really, really soft, like I could put my fingers through it. Better than jello, because it didn't stick or anything. I put my hand in and pulled it out.

...

And after the experiment, Carr... The way he briefed us on things was just, we'd sit down and have a cup of coffee, you know? It was just... He'd come out with this wonderful stuff about the laws of nature and how that is our whole essence and if we ignore it, we're in trouble. He's got to understand these laws and how they work for anything. If you want a comfortable life, a good life, a happy life, and especially if you want to get anywhere in technology, you can't use brute force. And I told him about Advanced Kinetics and everything and he kind of laughed. He told me a lot. He worked with Tesla. He had known him for a while and worked with him. And I guess by now you already know about the story of Tesla going to J. P. Morgan.

...

But it's going to get worse because they've already challenged nature. Man, way back there, had challenged nature. And what goes around comes around. Natural law. It will come back on us.

www.projectcamelot.org...


...any takers?



[edit on 26-5-2009 by adrenochrome]

reply to post by adrenochrome


Carr is an interesting man, I thought you might be interested in reading an interview with him. From the way he speaks, he had a craft that could go into space and return safely.

keelynet.com...

keelynet.com...



[edit on 26-5-2009 by RussianScientists]

Carr was an incredible person, from what I've read, truly inspirational and innovative, everything the prodigé of Nikola Tesla should be.

Can his free energy device work? Don't know, I believe it could, I mean, if anyone but Tesla could do it, it would be Carr, let's face it.

As for asking people on here? Thats a wrong move IMO, half will swear blind it works, the other half will swear blind that it's fanciful crap (Pseudoscience) that should never be believed.

I personally think that even if it doesn't work, or isn't plausible under our current understanding of physics, our current understanding of physics changes every day, let's just hope it's allowed to change for the better.

Also, isn't this the same principle of the vortex engine? 2 'cones' rotating in opposite ways facing each other, one is charged to create polarity and the rotating magnetic fields are what causes the 'phenomena'?

Viktor Schauberger was looking into Vortex engines, only he was using water as the medium, not air.

EMM

reply to post by RussianScientists


yeah, i'm trying to get everyone to read any and all of his interviews!!

i believe that once people hear what he's got to say, and begin to research it on their own time, then they'll discover that there's a VERY good possibility that this would all work as he says...

i mean, i'm no dummy, but also i'm no astrophysicist either, so i'm trying to get those with a revered background in this general field to lend their opinions on whether or not Carr's/Tesla's Free Energy theory will work!

reply to post by adrenochrome


Adrenochome I think that a great source of knowledge is located on Project Camelot.

www.projectcamelot.org...

Ralph Ring is a great source to listen to and to read if one wants to know more about Otis Car and his Flying Saucers that actually work.

Ralph Ring is the key to getting everything moving in the right direction because his brain contains most or all of what is needed in order to get the ball rolling in the right direction.

You are moving in the right direction yourself Adrenochrome, and I like your Avatar, it brings back memories of typewriters and what I always wanted to do to them.

I don't see any scientific explanation of the effect. All I see is someone saying 'it works folks! trust me!'...

Why should we believe it? there isn't even the tiniest thread of evidence in this.

reply to post by masterp


You didn't do your homework Masterp, both Adrenochrome and myself have given the links to Project Camelot and other sources. Ralph Ring in Project Camelot explains a lot of things.

Furthermore what is your scientific background Masterp. Adrenochrome is looking for someone with a scientific background to look into the situation, not some fool that states "he" can't personally see any scientific explanation to the effect; especially when there is plenty of scientific evidence to the effect. The problem is that there are people out there that would rather see a person dead, than to let everyone fly around freely without any borders and no way of giving you a ticket or taxing you, or charging you for fuel.

reply to post by RussianScientists


well i've known about "Project Camelot" for years now, and have researched Otis T. Carr and Ralph Ring for quite some time..

i just finally got around to making a thread about them because i'd like to see if there is anyone here that can provide some valuable information with their scientific background - perhaps of particle physics or quantum mechanics??

basically, everything they say just makes sense - i don't know how else to put it...



[edit on 26-5-2009 by adrenochrome]

reply to post by adrenochrome


You are very correct in your thinking Adrenochrome. We think similarly in this situation. I'm sure that everything is correct, but I personally don't have time to delve into this matter, or I would, because I would enjoy such a scientific endevour. This is a great scientific endevour for some scientist that wants to make a name for themself.

The scientist that wants to make great discoveries and possibly risk his life later on after he has rediscovered the great discoveries should contact Ralph Ring and pry into his brain and rediscover all that is about to be lost to this world. Ralph Ring is the key to getting everything started in bringing this great discovery of Nikola Tesla and Otis Carr back to life. I just wish I had the time, or I would drive out to California and be asking Ralph Ring everything possible and video and audio tape as much as possible so it isn't forgotten.

I really don't understand whats with people and their obsession with attributing complicated effects with simplistic and ultimately unrealistic (even impossible) causes.

Get it through you heads free energy does not exist, just because we don't know where the energy comes from that does not mean its free. Its like people constantly relating UFO's with little green men in flying disks.

I don't mind people experimenting with odd ways of generating energy but why does it always have to be called free energy.

reply to post by Louther


Louther in this particular case, and many other cases that use magnetics, it is called free energy because once you start it up and it goes on its own without you having to reach into your pocket twice a week to pay for gas, or once a month for your electric bill then it is essentially free.

Another instance of free energy are magnets of all kinds. If you are using a magnet to hold a reminder note of some kind on your refrigerator it is doing work, but it is not costing you anything for that magnet doing work now or 100 years from now; now is it Louther? That's called free energy.

If you could drive your car from now till eternity like the Tesla/Carr flying disks using magnets and without having to fill it up again, you would call it free energy.

Free energy exists if you aren't paying continually for the energy, wake up Louther, or are you a sheeple already?

Originally posted by RussianScientists
reply to post by masterp

 

You didn't do your homework Masterp, both Adrenochrome and myself have given the links to Project Camelot and other sources. Ralph Ring in Project Camelot explains a lot of things.

Furthermore what is your scientific background Masterp. Adrenochrome is looking for someone with a scientific background to look into the situation, not some fool that states "he" can't personally see any scientific explanation to the effect; especially when there is plenty of scientific evidence to the effect. The problem is that there are people out there that would rather see a person dead, than to let everyone fly around freely without any borders and no way of giving you a ticket or taxing you, or charging you for fuel.

I read all the material in the links you posted, but I did not understand a thing. And I know Physics (I am not a Physicist though). There was simply nothing connected with known Physics.

reply to post by masterp


Master P

I don't know what kind of physics you learned when you grew up, but basic physics are basic physics and you should learn about electricity and magnets because that is what Nikola Tesla and Otis Carr were all about.

Electricity and magnetism were both thought of as phenomenon that was something to produce parlor tricks a hundred years ago (UFO's and Free Energy are thought of as Phenomenons). Today they are big business, and if anybody seriously looks into this stuff they are going to go into big business also.

Keep up the good work Master P. Read about Victor Schauberger he discovered the same thing. He was extremely smart and most of his technology is lost; like his logging plume, his UFOs. Most of his knowledge was learned by watching swirling water, trout, wirlpools and different temperature gradients. He invented jet propulsion and many other things, not bad for a Forester.



[edit on 27-5-2009 by RussianScientists]

I make no claim to be a physicist, but I believe I understand the subject pretty well; it was my subject at university. Check out some of my posts on threads in this forum and judge my understanding for yourself.

As far as I'm concerned, the extracts from Carr's writings quoted in the OP are so much gibberish. They have no connection to real physics.

reply to post by Astyanax


I understand where you are coming from. One does have to know elementary physics "themselve" other than just rewriting what others have written; that is what I get when I read your posts rewritten from other sources.

IF Otis Carr and Nikola Tesla wrote nothing but jibberish as you state, and you can't understand it, that is no problem of ours. Apparently the patent offices in many different countries could read and understand what they were talking about with their terminology in physics, that is why so many patents were granted to both of them.

Brush up on your physics and you can work at a patent office also, that is how Albert Einstien worked his way up to where he became a great scientist; by working at the patent office in the physics department. Nikola Tesla is still probably the greatest scientist/inventor of all history.

Go back to school and finish up that last 3.5 years to get your physics degree it could be well worth it.

[edit on 28-5-2009 by RussianScientists]

reply to post by RussianScientists

Do you mean that in another 3.5 years I'd get to the place where they teach you how to repeal the law of conservation of mass-energy?

Or is that just a speciality of 'Russian scientists'?

Gibberish, my friend, is gibberish in any language.

Edit to add:

IF Otis Carr and Nikola Tesla wrote nothing but jibberish as you state

I never stated anything of the kind. Is this eager misinterpretation an example of the scientific approach as you understand it?

Just asking.

[edit on 28/5/09 by Astyanax]

reply to post by Astyanax


i'm just curious - how long have you been studying Physics??

also, you may want to start researching waveforms, Acoustics, and especially Cymatics...





as far as i've heard, this is possibly the phenomena that keeps planets in orbit in our Electric Universe...

[edit on 28-5-2009 by adrenochrome]

Originally posted by adrenochrome
also, you may want to start researching waveforms.

Actually, acoustics was my special subject. Plus, I'm a musician.

Resonance phenomena don't violate any conservation laws.

I have expressed my views on electric-universe 'theory' in other threads.

Hunter S. Thompson wrote some good books.

reply to post by adrenochrome


Adrenochrome, John Keely was big into waves and sound, his discoveries are lost also, and he was on to a similar discovery.

Keely supposedly had a platform on which sat a piano, upon playing the keys on the piano, the piano lifted. When Keely played certain notes the platform moves in one direction or another. Speed was supposedly estimated at 500 mph by the cavalry. They noted that as Keely passed them his hair and clothing was not effected by the speed.

Keely's cannon which was supplied power by a wire recieving vibrations from a tuning fork, became more and more powerful as it was firing 1 inch balls.

Keely's disintegrator that was similar in size and design to Tesla earthquake machine (the size of a pocket watch) disintegrated rock into powder.

Keely made many great discoveries.