Putin puts troops on alert... What does the US have to gain?

It was actually Russia that proposed a plan for Russia, the EU and the US to provide aid and assist Ukraine in getting over it's economic woes. However, the EU and US wouldn't play ball and we are seeing the result. What the US and EU want is Ukraine under the thumb of the IMF and more NATO (US) bases on Russia's doorstep.
This could all have been avoided, but I guess bloodshed and mayhem are just NOT good for business where the IMF and globalist bankers are concerned.
I predict only economic pain and enslavement by the bankers for the people of Ukraine, and certainly NOT freedom, democracy and happiness under their EU and US approved new masters. After all, if those were the goals, then they'd have been storming the shores of many a country previously, rather than propping up dictators, puppet royalty and other despots oppressing their subjects!

As for Crimea, they have always been very much pro Russian anyway, but rather than allow them a separatist state, or to become a Russian dependency, the West will work (as they have done in Kiev) to destabilize things there too, then blame the nasty Russians when they intervene. As for all those Western leaders condemning the Ukraine government, one has to wonder just how would THEY react to foreign funded and organized armed revolt to oust them? I am sure they wouldn't just roll over and leave!

reply to post by boymonkey74


It's a tad late for that if you ask me! The previous governments goons shot the hell out of protestors, and some of their mob got taken out as well, so there is already blood on the ground in this situation. The thing now, is for the people of Ukraine to ensure that those are the final deaths to come of this shoddy affair.

reply to post by Rodinus


Yeah now in the Crimea pro Russian armed dudes have set up shop in their government building saying If protesters can form a new government so can they.

reply to post by boymonkey74


Yep, definately not good and I find it difficult to imagine how further blood cannot be spilt, saw this earlier on :

Ukraine warns Russia after gunmen seize Crimea parliament

Armed men seized the parliament in Ukraine's Crimea region on Thursday and raised the Russian flag, alarming Kiev's new rulers, who urged Moscow not move troops out of its navy base on the peninsula.

Crimea, the only Ukrainian region with an ethnic Russian majority, is the last big bastion of opposition to the new leadership in Kiev since President Viktor Yanukovich was ousted at the weekend and provides a base for Russia's Black Sea fleet.

"I am appealing to the military leadership of the Russian Black Sea fleet," said Oleksander Turchinov, Ukraine's acting president.

Linky winky : www.reuters.com...

The Ukranian people are in for a tough time...

Kindest respects

Rod

Britguy
As for all those Western leaders condemning the Ukraine government, one has to wonder just how would THEY react to foreign funded and organized armed revolt to oust them? I am sure they wouldn't just roll over and leave!

How would the USA react??? The government would have but one choice over 300 million of us decided it was time to go.. LOL look AT what happen when a smaLL hand full was pissed off in LA over the rodney king verdict!!!!!
Thats why they only push so far, they know we are armed AND dangerous !!! real G #..

On a political slant, I find the historical associations of Kiev / the Ukraine, interesting, and perhaps relevant to the recent uprising there and political turmoil (most political turmoil is instigated by an interested party).

Kiev was the first Rus capital and became the spiritual centre of Rus.

Consider the strategic military positioning and commercial enterprise via the 'water road', the Volga, Black Sea and the Golden Gate, (the surviving gate of three, the Polish and Jewish gates being since destroyed) being a symbolic (and perhaps literal) 'Gateway to Russia'.

www.britannica.com...

THE FIRST RUS CAPITAL
The Varangians (Vikings) seized Kiev in the mid-9th century, and, as in Novgorod to the north, a Slavo-Varangian ruling elite developed. Kiev, with its good defensive site on the high river bluffs and as the centre of a rich agricultural area and a group of early Slavic towns, began to gain importance. About 882 Oleg (Oleh), the ruler of Novgorod, captured Kiev and made it his capital, the centre of the first East Slavic state, Kievan Rus. The town flourished, chiefly through trade along the Dnieper going south to the Byzantine Empire and north over portages to the rivers flowing to the Baltic Sea—the so-called “road from the Varangians to the Greeks,” or “water road.” Trade also went to the Caspian Sea and Central Asia.

In 988 the introduction of Christianity to Kiev enhanced its significance as the spiritual centre of Rus. By the 12th century, according to the chronicles, the city’s wealth and religious importance was attested to by its more than 400 churches. The cathedral of St. Sophia, parts of the Kiev-Pechersk Lavra (Monastery of the Caves), and the ruins of the Golden Gate remain today as witnesses to Kiev at the height of its splendour. The town was famed for its art, the mosaics and frescoes of its churches, its craftsmanship in silver, and the quality of many of its manufactures. One of Europe’s major cities, Kiev established diplomatic relations with the Byzantine Empire, England, France, Sweden, and other countries. Travelers wrote of its population as numbering tens of thousands.

www.globalresearch.ca... 70479

Concerning Syria and Iran, it has been repeatedly stated many times that the road to Tehran goes through Damascus and that the US and its allies have targeted Syria as a means of going after Iran. In regards to Ukraine and Russia, a very similar axiom is also applicable. The road to Moscow goes through Kiev. The takeover of Ukraine is part and parcel of a geo-strategic campaign against the Russians, as is the regime change campaign against Damascus to a lesser degree.

Regime change in Ukraine is part of a covert and overt war against the Russian Federation. The installment of a puppet government in Ukraine will remove one of the most important partners that Moscow has. If Ukraine joins the EU and NATO, it will be a direct threat to the western borders of Russia and the security of one of the most important Russian naval bases, which is the home of the Russian Black Sea Fleet and located at Sevastopol in the Crimean Peninsula.

www.theguardian.com...

Either way, the seizure dramatically escalates tensions on the already volatile Crimean peninsula. Ukraine's acting president, Oleksandr Turchynov, who has been in the job since the removal of Viktor Yanukovych last week, explicitly warned Russia not to intervene in the crisis by moving troops. The Kremlin's Black Sea fleet is based near Simferopol in the port of Sevastopol.

Turchynov said: "I am appealing to the military leadership of the Russian Black Sea fleet. Any military movements, the more so if they are with weapons, beyond the boundaries of this territory [the base] will be seen by us as military aggression." Ukraine's foreign ministry also summoned Russia's acting envoy in Kiev for immediate consultations.

The EU's economic ''it's all good old democracy'' 'stance'

Sustaining Ukraine's breakthrough: EU expertise and markets are essential
The EBRD should get involved like it did in central Europe, while endemic corruption and weak rule of law must be addressed

reply to post by Rodinus


The trickiest thing, is that the former president of the nation has surfaced in Russia, still claiming to be the legitimate leader of his nation. I do not believe that it is right for him to claim as much, since he has failed in every particular to create acceptable circumstances for his people, but his presence in Russia makes things even more complicated than they needed to be.

reply to post by Shaiker


In addition to old rusted crap, the training of Russian men handling the machines is way way low grade.

Other than nukes, Russian military has little to talk of.

Diplomatic strong gaming is another option. They can create lots of trouble in other parts of the world. West should understand that.

reply to post by victor7


And oil, perhaps the greatest international currency these days, politically.

Denying oil supply and access to their oil supplies to international bullying organisations is probably a big deal to those that want it.

en.wikipedia.org...:Major_russian_gas_pipelines_to_europe.png

english.farsnews.com...

www.zerohedge.com...

Russia has to play this very carefuly. They can not afford to lose Ukraine. They have literaly fought for hundreds of years and put down Ukraines attempts to free itself from Russian domination with force on many occasions. Now that is not really an option. With the US and Europe united against it a military conflict is a no win scenerio. Russia for the first time would be facing not only a more advnaced foe but, a foe that out numbers it. To make matters worse the West does not even have to directly confront a Russian military action in Ukraine it could simply declare a global embargo and end Russian trade with the world. Russia has few to any friends in the world and many many enemies along its borders that would love to see Russia weakened even more. We will not even go into the unfortunate state of the Russian military. So Russia has to show it is strong by putting on a show and then coming to the table in an agreement with the West. Perhaps one that allows Russia some influence and trade in the Russian eastern parts of the country as a way to claim victory and save face. Much as they did in Syria Russia will sell out its friends interests so long as it meets their own. So Putin starts some military exercises and is waitiing for a chance to make the right the deal. He also has to hope the West has some influence with Ukraines government who could throw makes things bad if they were more aggresive than the west would like. Russia only has about a million duty members in it military, the EU has 1.5 million. And that does not count the US or non EU NATO members like the US, Turkey and Canada which is another 2 million active duty members. The US Navy and Airforce alone dawarf their Russian counter parts without the rest of Europe. Russia has to play this right and very carefuly, which is why the normally talkative Putin is very quiet right now.

MrSpad
it could simply declare a global embargo and end Russian trade with the world.

how can US do it, like it put embargo on Iranian oil.........can you elaborate.
In Russian case many nations would not tow the US line.
On the otherhand Russia, can shut the gas to EU and bring its industries and households into economic recession.

Russia only has about a million duty members in it military, the EU has 1.5 million.

Russia has 1 million active and upto 2 million in reserves. Russia has upto 20 million men who were trained as conscripts at some point in their life. But in modern warfare, men with Ak-47s mean a little. Although Airwars alone cannot win the theatre also.

Would repeat nukes are Russia's best bet. Putin needs to gamble if West calls the bluff.

However, throwing nukes out of the picture for a bit.

Russia can still count on China, India, 3/4ths of Middle East, Vietnam, North Korea and these can come up with substantial numbers and keep countries like Japan, S. Korea, Australia, Turkey, Israel, atleast in check if not over run them.

Pakistan and Egypt will turncoats for sure.

Turkey has deep enmity with Russia so initially it would not but under danger of being overwhelmed by Iran, Iraq, Syria and soon approaching Chinese PlA, the Turks will throw their women to face off while run in other direction.

reply to post by victor7


Its 2014, the last time Russia was getting whacked in Afghanistan, the Russian mothers were just about storming the Kremlin. All the western personnel coming back from the various conflicts are psychologically damaged. The mentality of a trooper having to put a bayonet in the guts of some other poor dude, then dream about it for the rest of his life, just isn't there any more. Its my guess civilised countries just haven't got the bottle anymore, the personnel in the services I would suggest are to intelligent and refined. If they hire the likes of the Taliban who don't mind cutting the throat of a goat and cooking it up, they might have the type of people that can get down and dirty. If you get down and dirty, which you have to do to win on the ground, then you are just as likely to end up on trial for human rights abuses. The gun culture in the West has long gone, you cant even get an airgun without permits etc. anymore, lets face it a career choice for a girl as a grunt looks sexy as long as no real war breaks out. But on the front line captured by Islamic extremist, name rank and number would be laughed at.

reply to post by anonentity


so what are you trying to say here.............

Russia's involvement in Iranian oil and trade is also a concern to the EU and US, as well as the surrounding areas (including Ukraine) being perhaps essential to these trade links, and the connections to Iraq and Afghanistan, which the West perhaps would oppose.

english.farsnews.com...

“We hope an increase in the volume of economic exchanges between the two countries and in reciprocal visits by the two sides' traders and we also hope that strengthening the Joint Chambers will be put on agenda,” Head of Iran’s Chamber of Commerce Gholam-Hossein Shafeyee said in Tehran on Saturday.

He also stressed the necessity for cooperation with Russia in privatization of Iranian companies and development of trilateral and multilateral relations with Russia due to Moscow’s good ties with the regional states.

“There is a possibility for joint cooperation in Iraq's and Afghanistan's markets as well as providing technical, engineering and construction services (to third party countries),” Shafeyee said.

Iran and Russia have consolidated their ties and cooperation due to their proximity and identical views on regional and international developments.

Analysts believe that Russian oil companies’ activities in Iran and Moscow’s opportunity to buy Iranian crude have raised the US and other countries’ serious concern.

Not only Russian companies but also their rivals from other countries, among them western, have demonstrated activity on the Iranian track.

European companies are making increasing demands for cooperation with Iran after Tehran and the world powers struck a deal in November which removes sanctions against the country.

Many European countries, including France, Germany and the Netherlands, are planning to enhance their economic relations with Iran, a business powerhouse in the Middle East region, as sanctions imposed against Tehran are partially suspended, AP reported last month.

"Optimism is predominating that there has finally been something of a relaxation in political relations and therefore in business possibilities," Head of Trade Relations at the Association of German Chambers of Commerce Volker Treier said.

On January 20, Iran and the six powers started the implementation of the historic nuclear deal which the two sides struck in the Swiss city of Geneva on November 24, 2013.

After endorsing the agreement with the world powers, Iranian Foreign Minister Mohammad Javad Zarif underlined that the six world powers have recognized Iran’s enrichment program.

As part of the deal, in exchange for Iran’s confidence-building bid to limit certain aspects of its nuclear activities, the six world powers agreed to lift some of the existing sanctions against Tehran.

www.bbc.com...

Ukraine's interior minister has accused Russian naval forces of occupying Sevastopol airport in the autonomous region of Crimea.
The other main Crimean airport, Simferopol, has also been occupied by armed men. The men are thought to be pro-Russia militia.

Mr Yanukovych is now in Russia and is preparing to hold a news conference on Friday in the city of Rostov-on-Don, near the Ukrainian border.

Looks like its Russian forces or militia backed by Russia ... this is increasingly going out of control

news.bbcimg.co.uk...

Well..that looks like Russian Army to me...

reply to post by victor7


I'm saying that you need a certain type of person, and that type of person simply doesn't exit modern education systems, into armed forces . Not in the west or in Russia. The system requires a human being to act like a killing machine for a certain period, then just turn it off, the people who could do this are picked up by the educational psychologist, and are in treatment long before they would ever join up. Most people today would not kill a bunny if they were starving, and we expect them to kill humans. You might have a few but not the numbers required for hard core invasion, that can take the horrendous carnage required.
I've known two people personally that have been involved with a bit of hard fighting, one was in korea on a machine gun, he said he didn't know how many people he killed, as they just charged and he fired, most were Chinese and unarmed. It was okay until he was about fifty that was when the nightmares started. The other was a Sniper during the second world war ,the same thing happened he was haunted and disturbed by the people he killed. He said it was okay when he was young but when he got older he couldn't get the images out of his mind.

MrSpad
Russia has to play this very carefuly. They can not afford to lose Ukraine.

Funny, they could have supported the new government and appealed for Ukrainian-Russian unity and support rights of all Ukrainian citizens, East and West, and sent some aid packages. They'd have made a friend.

But no.

Putin's wang is bigger than his brains on this matter. It's more important to Putin that Ukraine is unfriendly with the West and a subordinate actor of Russian policy than it is is friendly with Russia.


You can take a man out of the KGB but you can't take the KGB out of the man

reply to post by crazyewok


That's making the colossal assumption that Obama has the 'nads to actually make an overt military move. I'll believe that when I see it. The EU will make military moves before the US in this one.

reply to post by ketsuko




If you have a developing civil war on your border, I'd think you had the right to put troops on alert. I bet if it was Mexico you would see a build up of American troops. Since a lot of Russian gas goes through the Ukraine to keep Europe from freezing, its essential that the pipes are not damaged. If they were damaged and the winters were as bad as they have been, it wouldn't just be the Ukraine in a state of Civil unrest.

reply to post by anonentity


So, again, the EU will move on this before Obama does. Obama doesn't move on things that won't be popular with his base, and this won't. If the US gets involved in this at all, it will only because of inescapable NATO obligations and it wouldn't surprise me to see Obama trying to find ways out of those unless the idea of military intervention in the Ukraine suddenly becomes rabidly popular in the US.