Secret Connections: LDS Church and the American Intelligence Community

reply to post by luxordelphi


Yes, it was brought to my attention, by adjensen, that that particular site is a satirical site....kind of like the onion. I ran across it during my research, seen the front page and added it to the source list for people to look at.

None of the information in the OP was sourced from that site, I just wanted to share and thanks for bringing that up.

reply to post by CavTrooper0430

Yes the church collects vast amounts of data on family trees, and as someone also pointed out earlier, it is not for any nefarious reason other than to perform ordinances for relatives who have passed.

WAIT. What???!!!!

I have accessed those records over several years; I built a family geneaology from the information I gleaned.

I even transcribed census microfilms into digital data as a volunteer.

I never saw any indication of it being some kind of "trap" to 'posthumously baptize' dead people.

Nice post, but I find your claims quite suspect.
~w

sheepslayer247
...You are confusing my attempt to share information and stir-up conversation with intolerant ignorance in which we round up these people and send em to the FEMA camps. Just because I bring this info to people's attention, does not mean that I subscribe to extremist ideologies where it is the goal to suppress one's right to religious freedom.

I've also assumed that we're not talking about Church members as a whole but, rather, some penetration and collaboration from without with some of those within. I buy it from that perspective.

I also cherish the experiences I've had with church members. My ex and I had many missionaries over for dinner and discussion and truly enjoyed it. We donated some bricks for one the local church's new building project. When we moved for me to accept a scholarship I had just badly broken a leg and guess who helped me move? More than helped, because I was on crutches at the time.

So I haven't had the feeling that sheepslayer was downing the membership at all. And I'm certainly not either. Do I think there's a faction within that has distinct ties to the intelligence community? It's not really up for much debate is it?

RedFunfzhen
Also, for those that do not know, the Mormons claim that the Native Americans are a lost tribe of Israel. One branch of the 'lost tribe', the Lamanites, killed the members of the other branch, the Nephites. That, plus their rejection of the 'ol JC, caused God to curse them with dark skin and a degraded existence.

That's a hell of racist principal Mormons won't tell you about their religion - if you aren't pasty white, it's 'cause you pissed God off and he wants to punish you by making you 'not white' and a less pleasant existence.

I found out about this first hand from my so called "ex" mormon d-in-law. She may have given up going to church but her twisted views are very much in line with mormon teachings.

I'm native american, I just smile at her low class remarks and her "jokes" about me "needing feathers" to complete my look.

She has one lily white daughter but my DNA lives on in the second, jet black hair and her skin is already as dark as mine. I hope this doesn't set the child up for ridicule from mormon family members. They'll probably have to exorcise the demon. I can only go by what I've experienced and it's been pretty bad.

wildtimes
reply to post by CavTrooper0430

 

Yes the church collects vast amounts of data on family trees, and as someone also pointed out earlier, it is not for any nefarious reason other than to perform ordinances for relatives who have passed.

WAIT. What???!!!!

I have accessed those records over several years; I built a family geneaology from the information I gleaned.

I even transcribed census microfilms into digital data as a volunteer.

I never saw any indication of it being some kind of "trap" to 'posthumously baptize' dead people.

Nice post, but I find your claims quite suspect.
~w

They don't have a 'trap'; just a belief that they CAN posthumously have people baptized in the Mormon church, and they are taught that they are 'saving' souls.

The Mormon fills out the proper paper work, and then must have it 'registered' in Utah to be 'valid'.

I saw the paperwork my mother had registered on us 'non-Mormon' family members - including my deceased, strict Methodist grandparents.

There are many, many layers to the Mormon onion, just as there are in Scientology.

reply to post by Morningglory


That's odd. I thought Mormons considered native Americans to be descendants of one of the lost tribes of Israel.

Great that this is being given a wider audience, but this has been known for decades.

Keep up the good work of exposing these activities to new generations.

Howdy! Just got home from Church....MORMON church and thought I would weigh in on a few of the comments ideas being batted around here.

For SheepSlayer: My opinion on your thread topic is that there is not a secret connection between the LDS church and the CIA/NSA etc. In fact, the LDS missionary program was in place long before modern spy agencies came into being. The belief in and perceived need in a missionary program is strong in the LDS faith. This tenet alone accounts for the size and organization of the modern program.

What I will gladly concede to is that the LDS church produces a very unique young person(as you have noted). In addition to the attributes you mention, the LDS church teaches a sense of patriotism and civil duty to the membership.
If there was ever a perfect profile to work in the CIA/FBI/NSA, it would be a young LDS person: Strong moral character and discipline and in many cases a spotless history. These kids often have a sense of duty and loyalty to the US deeper than most, because it is tied to their strongest religious convictions.

As for the contractors and corporate entities indirectly tying the LDS and government, I think that's more coincidence than anything. The lineage of some business owners isn't related in a conspiratorial way either. Those families have held prominence in the political and religious arenas of Utah for well over 100 years. because of this, the families have grown in wealth and power. These pedigrees brings with them a seat at the political table as well as the skills to survive in that world.
___________________________________________________________________________
A couple of posts reference the LDS church's position on the history of native Americans. Spending a ton of time explaining the nuances various ideas wouldn't be productive in this kind of forum. Let me just say that the image you have is very far from the way things are in the LDS doctrine.

As with any group or organization, it is important to identify and separate the doctrinal beliefs from the cultural ones. Sadly, the core Utah region was culturally isolated from the rest of the country for many years. Really, the integration of the area only happened in conjunction with technology advancements of the 90's forward.
Due to this, many wrong-minded social norms were applied to the way this region practiced the religion. These incorrect beliefs weren't taught by the church as doctrine, but were locally accepted as the default norm.

As a side note, in the Book of Mormon, the two factions cycled between righteousness and wickedness. In the end, the 'lily white folk' were so corrupt and evil that the righteous 'dark skinned people' had to wipe them out completely. So from an LDS perspective, Native Americans are the descendants of the more righteous and worthy people.

reply to post by wildtimes

I never saw any indication of it being some kind of "trap" to 'posthumously baptize' dead people.

You didn't look very hard, then, WT

Here's their own testimony to it: Why do Mormons do family history or genealogy work?

reply to post by adjensen


Wowza! I guess it just never occurred to me that it was anything but a 'benevolent public service' thing.

Thanks, d!

reply to post by constantwonder


Wish you wouldn't have edited your post, because I think that in some small way, you are right.

Eventually, we all die, the Earth will be taken out by the sun when it becomes a red giant and the observations we make today dont really matter. But I like to live for today, learn from our past and make the future the best it can be.

Op, want to thank you for this,During the last election, I found that Mormons and Romney & Co., had connections such as you are sharing.

I've heard and read that Utah is the most corrupt state in the Union. With that would be no wonder why the NSA chose to build as they have done there.

I have heard on ATS that my neighboring state to UT is also far worse than I had imagined. No one got back to me on my reply about Utah, there seems to be only bits and pieces on the net as to these levels of corruption. I may make a detailed thread on areas of corruption for those interested but I am sure that is by far few.

So, once again thanks for the thread.

It isn't just the intelligence community that like return missionaries. There are a lot of employers that would love to hire some hardworking, disciplined, honest, organized young men and women.

Also, their moral code and health code reduce the risk of drug, alcohol and sexual distractions while on and off the job.

These are great kids and I'd highly recommend them to any type of employment.

reply to post by sheepslayer247

I thought it was odd too, wasn't sure how to take it.

I know very little about mormon history. From what my d-in-law told me there's issues concerning dark skin, a curse or something. I questioned her because of mormon commercials I'd seen using afro-american actors.

She didn't go into detail but from what I gathered it's either something from the past the church wants to dispel or it's more of an individual/congregational thing. I'm not saying it's in the book of mormon she didn't say.

I can't speak for the whole religion but it's what I experienced.

CAPT PROTON
You forgot to add the one odd ball task that mormons do, and that is collect family trees on everyone in a giant database of their own, just in case someone decides to convert to mormonism, they can convert the entire family tree. During the Olympics in Salt Lake City the FBI remarked about how clever their organization system was for all the people they had acquired in their database.

Yes, info. on dead people. Go to one of the LDS database sites and run a search for a living person, you will not find anything.

And on the observation about the original founder of Jacobson Construction having a son that married a lady who was a grand-daughter of a prophet. I don't think that is out of the ordinary. LDS have lots of kids, most likely he had other children that had no such ties, you hand picked one such tie to make a link to attempt to make a point. LDS also want to marry other LDS, as far as Utahns are concerned, many people know at least someone who is somehow related to past or present leaders in the Church. it is also not that unlikely that if they go far enough back in their genealogy that someone in their family line might have been a leader of some type.

reply to post by bigrex

you hand picked one such tie to make a link to attempt to make a point.

I did not "hand pick" this connection in an attempt to make a point. I researched the companies involved and the connection presented itself. But you do make a valid point. I'm sure, considering the size of many LDS families, it would be easy to tie many of them together.

sheepslayer247
reply to post by SubTruth

 

It's funny that you mention the word "community", because the Mormons experimented in it's early stages with what is considered "communist" governance/living.

Do a search on Orderville, Ut.

In many neighborhoods in Utah it is a collective with the church sitting in the middle. Growing up in Utah was a great experience that I would love to give my children.



How many really buy the whole story is up for debate but I can tell you the people I knew did not believe........BUT. The church and the community that it allows to happen really is zion. The block I grew up on had over 100 kids and we all hung out together if you happened to be over at a neighbors house around lunch time you were feed just like the other kids.



Everyone wonders why these people seem so happy........It's because they watch out for each other. Utah is about the safest place in the world to raise a family. And boy do I miss the Wasatch. I grew up in a city called sandy that sits right below Snowbird and Alta.

reply to post by SubTruth


The Term "zion" has many different meanings and interpretations. Can you define it as you believe it to mean?

reply to post by SubTruth


This thread would be funny if it didn't so blatantly indicate the level of research ability and critical thinking skills possessed by even the members of our society we consider "intelligent".

First off as someone who was raised Mormon and also spent a good portion of my teenage years and early 20's hanging around places like Alpine Utah...

While I'm not a practicing mormon I have nothing but respect and love for the church and the people who believe in it.

First off... if you knew very much about Mormon History and world history in general you'd understand the number of mormons in federal service especially in the covert and law enforcement arms has very little to do with exerting influence and very MUCH to do with getting advanced warning when the people in power start looking for scapegoats.... One thing the Mormons are ACUTELY aware of is the fact that the US government and governments worldwide in times of crisis tend to find a group of well educated and monied but not well liked subgroup and blame everything on them. Because of this there's several official unofficial policies the mormon church and most of it's members take very seriously.

1. The church itself NEVER takes a position on politics. Notice Mitt was NOT ONCE endorsed by the mormon church as a whole!

2. Keep your friends close and your enemies closer: .... gee maybe that's why there's an NSA facility in their backyard.

3. Speak softly and carry a BIG MOTHA ****ing stick!: Look into why minivans are known as mormon assault vehicles sometime in utah.... also just as an aside ... people in Utah county when I lived there in the late 90's early 2000's genuinely believed that Home invasion robberies were some sort of crazy myth and or nowhere near as common as they were made out to be on national news. NOTE: If you do come to Utah county and decide unwisely to do a home invasion.... make sure the first guy through the door is someone you don't like because he's not long for this world (neither are you unless you come in platoon strength but hey.... such is life).

Also as to the general mormon bashing and talk of blood atonement etc.... I hear all catholics self flagellate and it MUST be true because I saw it on the Da Vinci code and Mel Gibson hates jews!!!

Come on guys.... grow up and quit demonizing stuff you don't understand.

As far as the quotes about mormons being fanatics blah blah blah.... per capita they are some of the most GIVING people in the US by a WIDE WIDE margin.... You know why you don't know that? Because unlike the other trashhat fools the Mormons believe charity is about HELPING people not being RECOGNIZED! (But hey I'm not a practicing mormon so I can shine a light on these for the most part ultra giving people) Not only that but if you look into what percentage of moneys actually gets used for helping people versus "administrative costs, salaries, and overhead" and you'll want to kick your pastor in the junk!

So to recap.... the entire reason the mormons do what they do and have as many people involved in intelligence and law enforcement is because of ignorant A holes that write threads like this and try to drum up hate against something they don't understand.