Dr. Jacques Vallee ~ The Control System

originally posted by: olaru12
In my shamanic travels, I got a distinct impression that God actually does play dice with the cosmos. And at times the dice are loaded.

Most mystics think that everything is 100% pre-ordained and that
all free-will is a hoax.

If one had the ability to see everything "above the level of all interactions"
it could certainly appear that way.

(hind sight is 20 /20)

But even if true, if we live that way, it often takes all the zest out of life,
as we enjoy the illusion that we are separate actors that actually do things.

Kev

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

If one had the ability to see everything "above the level of all interactions" it could certainly appear that way.

The concrete bridge example you mentioned several days ago does suggest a predictable structure (from a blue hat perspective). Trump warned us about the dreamer situation in the SOTU address (which probably synched some of us).
Amazing to watch IRL though .

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear

originally posted by: FingerMan
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Yeah. I jumped a few hurdles there to think he may be religious.
But still, he is hypothesizing gods at play. Other possibilities are too abstract for a short post.

If I could ever have a conversation with him directly, my first question would be if he believed in god. Only because it makes sense to me based on his comments.

I have only watched a few hours of him on YouTube interviews. I could change my mind with further study.

"god" is a very ill-formed and primitive concept that adds no value to anything,
whether "god" exists or not.

To Kellyprettybear and ColdWisdom, the above statement seemed to me a mud pit. There was no need for that comment. If you disagree with my OP, fine. But to say the concept of God is primitive is insulting to many, hence my appropriate reply.

a reply to: FingerMan

You can't really begrudge anyone an opinion, nor expect to fight and win that battle on an online forum.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Many mystics do believe in pre-destination. But its based on people not knowing or seeing that their actions are preordained based on the internal unseen or non perceptive dynamics that rule their actions.

a reply to: Willtell

Or it could be that the past, present, and future are all happening simultaneously so while it appears they are preordained, they aren't necessarily. Actually I don't think that's so much an "in stead" but rather an "in addition to" to your statement.

There are certainly some interesting experiments that show that some biological processes are happening before the brain even receives the data in order to act. In other words precognitive in a way. Ill try and find the info if there is interest, but won't be a quick thing. I think it was in Beyond Biocentrism by Robert Lanza that I read about it.

originally posted by: Willtell
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Many mystics do believe in pre-destination. But its based on people not knowing or seeing that their actions are preordained based on the internal unseen or non perceptive dynamics that rule their actions.

I don't disagree. I believe I said much the same thing, in another way.

Kev

a reply to: FingerMan

"God" was a very early concept.

Most early concepts are primitive, compared to what they
have evolved into thousands of years later.

Some folks keep an old concept of "god", thinking that there is merit
in that.. that's it's "good" because it's "old" or "my friends think that
way" or whatever the reason is.

I myself often get accused of being a theist.. by atheists anyway.
I often get accused of being an agnostic.. which I don't mind really..
as agnostic simply means that there is not enough available information
to make an informed choice. Which is certainly true.

I don't hate "god".
I'm not a "liberal".

I'm not really anything.. and there is a clue..

But that is a topic for another day.

even' friend.

Kev

originally posted by: MCL1150
reply to post by The GUT

 

I'm very familiar with Vallee's Control system, been using it in my life for may years!

Can you elaborate please?

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
Most mystics think that everything is 100% pre-ordained and that
all free-will is a hoax.
If one had the ability to see everything "above the level of all interactions"
it could certainly appear that way.
(hind sight is 20 /20)
But even if true, if we live that way, it often takes all the zest out of life,
as we enjoy the illusion that we are separate actors that actually do things.

The one time I happened to be in an expanded state of mind regarding this topic, which only lasted a couple of minutes, I understood that both are utterly true. We cannot wrap our brains around this in the logical-linear world alas.

RC

a reply to: The GUT

The feed back loop he was talking about.

Its a big part of UFO lore to me. The ability to control their tech. To command.

To summon. To command. Sounds like jinn to me!!

What if you could summon UFOs, would you?

a reply to: tadaman

I have. They like attention. Like using an Ouija board, I do not recommend it.

a reply to: tadaman

Hell no. And I mean hell literally, T.

The occultists with real experience will tell you they're not UFOs in our modern sense.

Although I do think some--maybe even all--of them are connected to the stars.

I'm not even sure I could explain that theory. Something like, say, The Watchers--those of the control system--are embodied in those stars and "disembody" when they come here.

I can't recall his name at the moment, but one of the great British ufologists of yesteryear wrote an interesting piece about the Jinn being the beings behind the phenomena.

I think it was Gordon creighton TheGut,Jinn-fairies-demons & angels


fun fact jinn are smokeless fires

Looks like every mythology in the world holds a piece of the puzzle,everyone is puzzled but none get together to put the pieces together

originally posted by: IMSAM
I think it was Gordon creighton TheGut,Jinn-fairies-demons & angels

link

IMSAM, You're not wrong about that - Gordon was a top chap.

I'm glad this thread on Vallee was brought back. I wonder does anyone know who financed Vallee’s research?


On the most part, a good guy even though a little arrogant to me and very wrong on some issues.

a reply to: Willtell

I thought Vallee was self-financing, self-motivated etc, hence why he was supposedly held in such high-esteem because even if he was wrong he was at least wrong for the right reasons. That's always been the impression that I got, reading the boards, that he was really just confirming his own bias and that he was wealthy enough to be able to do so.

That said, I see he's published by Simon and Schuster so I guess he doesn't have to stump up his own printing costs.



Where would UFOlogy have been without the mass media to ensure all these books got the attention they needed to sell them? Seems to me that the real impetus has always been via the Wall Street organ-grinders not the monkeys in Washington or at the Pentagon.

Valleee had it right in a Joseph Campbell sense, but he had it all wrong at the same time. Valley rightly believed the phenomena was real. Vallee was also reasonably correct using a “control system” analogy. Where he got it all wrong is that UFOs are NOT the mysterious control system... like fairies and Bigfoot, Jesus and ghosts, UFOs are what happens when the CONTROL SYSTEM BREAKS DOWN. The control system is human consciousness as it interacts with strange physics (through biological perception) to create our experience of physical reality. Our human system of biological perception isn’t solid enough to define reality, nor are the instruments we use to measure aspects of our perception (physical reality). In fact, the grouping of organs culminating in human physical consciousness is quite fragile, delicately perched, and extremely limited. As such, circumstances of the greater unperceived (and usually unperceivable) reality surrounding our physical organism (multidimensionality from OUR perspective) tend to INTRUDE into the cozy domain of our awareness. Such intrusions, or breaks in the control system of humanity’s perceived physical reality will be perceived and processed by the personality according to relevant achaetypal memes.

Intrusions that break down the control system of our biological ability to perceive and create our own physical reality through sensory organs and self consciousness are the norm, not the exception, and thus are a part of human history that ties us to other dimensions, other “intelligences”, and the spiritual mythos of our own collective unconscious. Hope that helps unwind the confusion of this a bit...although years after this thread posted...lol

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

See here's the thing and it's huge, God is relative to the individual only. Everybody's idea of God is different for example if you don't believe in God then that's your idea of God, for me God is the reason for the all and is unknowable at our stage of development... That's my idea, your only right in your own mind when speaking of the unknowable.

a reply to: Cology

This is a really disruptive and interesting angle change in the Control System theory.
I can see a bit of Jungian concept (from my scarce understanding of it) - You meant 'archetypal' right?

Could you please give us some hint on how you engage into this hypothesis? What intellectual material did you feed on?

cheers