85 richest people as wealthy as half of the world's population

How come I don't know any of those 1% that hold all the wealth. Gee, I always seem to hang out with people who think they have money but really don't.

beezzer
reply to post by blupblup

 

So you are of the opinion that everyone's work ethic, everyone's drive to succeed, everyone's goals should be the same?

(use small words, according to you, I'm an idiot)

No... and they're not the same, but YOU are saying that the rich have more drive and ambition.

They DO NOT.

They just have more opportunity and connections.


The nurse struggling to make ends meet, working 14 hour shifts has an amazing work ethic, but may lose their house because they can't afford the rent, bills and everything else going up while their pay is frozen.

The child on the rubbish dump, who lives on the rubbish dump, digging for scraps of metal and food, I suppose if they just dug a little harder, they too could own and run a multi-national corporation?

The guy working in the computer factory, with no health and safety laws, making more per hour than anyone and working longer hours for less pay than anyone in the US or UK, he just needs to knuckle down and have more ambition?

The woman in the sweat shop in Bangladesh, working 18 hours a day, trying to feed her kids and provide shelter and a life for them, while making sure we have nice, branded clothing.... she just doesn't have the ambition to be CEO of Adidas huh?


It has NOTHING to do with drive and ambition.... NOTHING.


It's to do with circumstance, opportunity and class.

And you're worse than an idiot or a moron.... you're ignorant, you refuse to accept the reasons behind poverty and instead make it about the poor and somehow how they are at fault for their own poverty because they don't have ambition or work hard or whatever.

Utterly ridiculous and couldn't be further from reality.

reply to post by NavyDoc


A shell game?

Just words - and the rhetoric remains the same. Dress it up however you want

If you want to play teams - I'm out

Read through this thread Navy - from the start. Notice anything?

It was inevitable really that it would go like this - these threads always do. You want to force people into a position of having to defend this from a left or right position - but this subject is bigger than that

Don't trivialize it with election-year talking points and the usual one-upmanship nonsense

Spiramirabilis
reply to post by NavyDoc

 

A shell game?

Just words - and the rhetoric remains the same. Dress it up however you want

If you want to play teams - I'm out

Read through this thread Navy - from the start. Notice anything?

It was inevitable really that it would go like this - these threads always do. You want to force people into a position of having to defend this from a left or right position - but this subject is bigger than that

Don't trivialize it with election-year talking points and the usual one-upmanship nonsense

Nonsense. It has nothing to do with election year talking points, but the simple fact that economic freedom, not redistribution of wealth lifts people up from poverty.

You've fallen from the class warfare rhetoric that TPTB want you to so, instead of demanding more freedom so people can rise up, you demand less freedom and more laws and taxes and government to make things "fair."

reply to post by NavyDoc

You've fallen from the class warfare rhetoric that TPTB want you to so, instead of demanding more freedom so people can rise up, you demand less freedom and more laws and taxes and government to make things "fair."

You have a lot of nerve telling me what I've fallen for - you haven't heard a single word I've said

blupblup

beezzer
reply to post by blupblup

 

So you are of the opinion that everyone's work ethic, everyone's drive to succeed, everyone's goals should be the same?

(use small words, according to you, I'm an idiot)

No... and they're not the same, but YOU are saying that the rich have more drive and ambition.

They DO NOT.

They just have more opportunity and connections.


The nurse struggling to make ends meet, working 14 hour shifts has an amazing work ethic, but may lose their house because they can't afford the rent, bills and everything else going up while their pay is frozen.

The child on the rubbish dump, who lives on the rubbish dump, digging for scraps of metal and food, I suppose if they just dug a little harder, they too could own and run a multi-national corporation?

The guy working in the computer factory, with no health and safety laws, making more per hour than anyone and working longer hours for less pay than anyone in the US or UK, he just needs to knuckle down and have more ambition?

The woman in the sweat shop in Bangladesh, working 18 hours a day, trying to feed her kids and provide shelter and a life for them, while making sure we have nice, branded clothing.... she just doesn't have the ambition to be CEO of Adidas huh?


It has NOTHING to do with drive and ambition.... NOTHING.


It's to do with circumstance, opportunity and class.

And you're worse than an idiot or a moron.... you're ignorant, you refuse to accept the reasons behind poverty and instead make it about the poor and somehow how they are at fault for their own poverty because they don't have ambition or work hard or whatever.

Utterly ridiculous and couldn't be further from reality.

So you throw straw men at me and claim that drive and ambition are pointless.

Circumstance, opportunity and class are the only identifiers that create wealth disparity for you?

So, according to you, we should have equal opportunity, equal circumstances, and equal class to remove wealth disparity?

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his need"?

beezzer

So you throw straw men at me and claim that drive and ambition are pointless.

Nope, just showing that in the real world, they mean diddly-squat

Circumstance, opportunity and class are the only identifiers that create wealth disparity for you?

Nope... you can add Education, greed, corruption, illegal practices and many other things.
But to the average person living in extreme poverty & famine & squalor... these things are the biggest stumbling block.

But the 3 you listed are the main... because all others fall under that.

The opportunity for education
The circumstances to better yourself.
The right social standing to be afforded any kind of voice, protection or help.

blupblup

beezzer

So you throw straw men at me and claim that drive and ambition are pointless.

Nope, just showing that in the real world, they mean diddly-squat

Circumstance, opportunity and class are the only identifiers that create wealth disparity for you?

Nope... you can add Education, greed, corruption, illegal practices and many other things.
But to the average person living in extreme poverty & famine & squalor... these things are the biggest stumbling block.

But the 3 you listed are the main... because all others fall under that.

The opportunity for education
The circumstances to better yourself.
The right social standing to be afforded any kind of voice, protection or help.

But you have to WANT to better yourself. If you don't have the drive or ambition to do so, then the opportunities are wasted.

There is ample opportunity to educate yourself, even within the failing public school system.

But people have neither the drive, the ambition, the work ethic to do so.

Because it is so much easier to blame the rich folks. (shakes an angry fist at rich folks)

They got more than me!

It's not fair!

beezzer

But you have to WANT to better yourself. If you don't have the drive or ambition to do so, then the opportunities are wasted.

There is ample opportunity to educate yourself, even within the failing public school system.

But people have neither the drive, the ambition, the work ethic to do so.

Because it is so much easier to blame the rich folks. (shakes an angry fist at rich folks)

They got more than me!

It's not fair!

You literally are clueless aren't you?

WTF has the public school system got to do with sweatshops and rubbish dump kids?

You're thinking this is about poor US & UK citizens wanting a slice of the rich folks pie, it's not, as you've been told time and time again.

You're being purposely obtuse and ignorant.

There are millions of people starving around the world...literally starving and dying.
People drinking diseased water.
Children dying of preventable diseases.

And then there are 85 people who have sooooo much money that they could never spend it if they tried.
There are companies who exploit these poor people and abuse them and these companies don't pay their fair share and these rich 85 don't pay their taxes.

You cannot defend or make excuses for these things.


I know you;re trying to, but you're failing.
I don't actually know if you are stupid, but it certainly seems that way.... or you just don't care?

*shrugs*

reply to post by blupblup


That's the difference between you and me.

If we both found ourselves in the same economic problem, you'd immediately look outward, to find someone to blame, in order to bring about change.

I, on the other hand, would look at a mirror, and see what I could have done, or can still do, to make a change.

And we have kids living without food daily right here in good olé USA. Go Capitalism!!

beezzer
reply to post by blupblup

 

That's the difference between you and me.

If we both found ourselves in the same economic problem, you'd immediately look outward, to find someone to blame, in order to bring about change.

I, on the other hand, would look at a mirror, and see what I could have done, or can still do, to make a change.

It's not about me or you, as I've said.

What is the kid on the rubbish dump going to do? He goes home, looks in the mirror... oh but wait, his home IS the rubbish dump, he has no parents, no education.

This is not about you looking out or in or up your own ass, it's about poor, destitute people... who can't just magic stuff out of thin air.

You have a very warped view of the world, and an extremely pathetic, unappealing high opinion of yourself.

You're great, you're better and more smart, and more resourceful and resilient than all the poor people in the world.

Well done

People will never see eye to eye if they can't keep a layered perspective.

Regardless of socioeconomic status, laze and drive are apparent.

I can find any combination regarding starting status, and current status, relating to any number of factors.

It's as much a lie to say that becoming rich has to do merely with ambition, or drive, as it is to say it has to do solely with connections, and opportunities.

The equation can't be so easily conjured up and still remain applicable to reality.

It's irrelevant where each member is within the system in place, as the corruption is systemic, coming from all sides of SES.

We shouldn't spend our time in futility, fighting each other, we should attempt to objectively assess where we are, what we want our future to be, and how we are to go about bringing this change.

The end insight should be to realize the human condition leads way for this cycle to reach where it currently is. There is no need to blame any one side in particular, as every side in general has played there part through the generations to bring us where we are today.

blupblup

beezzer
reply to post by blupblup

 

That's the difference between you and me.

If we both found ourselves in the same economic problem, you'd immediately look outward, to find someone to blame, in order to bring about change.

I, on the other hand, would look at a mirror, and see what I could have done, or can still do, to make a change.

It's not about me or you, as I've said.

What is the kid on the rubbish dump going to do? He goes home, looks in the mirror... oh but wait, his home IS the rubbish dump, he has no parents, no education.

This is not about you looking out or in or up your own ass, it's about poor, destitute people... who can't just magic stuff out of thin air.

You have a very warped view of the world, and an extremely pathetic, unappealing high opinion of yourself.

You're great, you're better and more smart, and more resourceful and resilient than all the poor people in the world.

Well done

And the arrogance portrayed by the progressives who are angry and bitter towards those who have succeeded is well evidenced in this thread.

You live in a world where money can make things better.

I live in a world where people make things better.

reply to post by beezzer

If we both found ourselves in the same economic problem, you'd immediately look outward, to find someone to blame, in order to bring about change.

Presumptuous much?

Of course - you'd handle it the right way because you're better than that?

We all get to be king in our hypothetical kingdoms

In the meantime - there are people in a day to day struggle just trying to survive. They're there because of a situation that they can't change by simply looking at themselves in the mirror and telling themselves they've failed - and need to try harder

Fascinating how much ego plays into all this - how our need to feel better about ourselves decides the fate of others

I don't see the real difference between the caste system in other parts of the world and this need to rationalize the reasons for poverty here in the land of the free and the home of the brave

Sometimes our own bootstraps are just not enough beezzer - no matter how shiny or how strong

blupblup
There are millions of people starving around the world...literally starving and dying.
People drinking diseased water.
Children dying of preventable diseases.

The number of persons in abject poverty has been dropping.

Interestingly enough, the same mechanism that created the "85" is what is causing it to drop.

So what, they are extremely successful or inherited it.

Big whoop, play enough games of cards and you are going to get some constant winners, thats probability folks! o/

Spiramirabilis
reply to post by beezzer

 

If we both found ourselves in the same economic problem, you'd immediately look outward, to find someone to blame, in order to bring about change.

Presumptuous much?

Of course - you'd handle it the right way because you're better than that?

We all get to be king in our hypothetical kingdoms

In the meantime - there are people in a day to day struggle just trying to survive. They're there because of a situation that they can't change by simply looking at themselves in the mirror and telling themselves they've failed - and need to try harder

Fascinating how much ego plays into all this - how our need to feel better about ourselves decides the fate of others

I don't see the real difference between the caste system in other parts of the world and this need to rationalize the reasons for poverty here in the land of the free and the home of the brave

Sometimes our own bootstraps are just not enough beezzer - no matter how shiny or how strong

So give them money.

Justify taking money from someone else and give them money.

because, after all, it's just money that'll make things better, right?

Moneymoneymoney

Give 'em money!

reply to post by beezzer


As long as the rich has all the advantages,yeah give them money. I want them to take from the rich and give to the poor. Then I want all the policies and laws and benefits the wealthy get from government to end.

Spiramirabilis
reply to post by NavyDoc

 

You've fallen from the class warfare rhetoric that TPTB want you to so, instead of demanding more freedom so people can rise up, you demand less freedom and more laws and taxes and government to make things "fair."

You have a lot of nerve telling me what I've fallen for - you haven't heard a single word I've said

LOL. Its very obvious given what you support what you've fallen for.

It's obvious, given use of the "progressive" leftist catchphrase "war on the poor" that you've bought in.