Why do you think your "God" does not make it's existence obvious or communicate in an obvious man

we have free will now. If he showed up then it would remove our free will. So he has let us do whatever we want in this life. And if we serve him it's by choice not by force.

reply to post by spartacus699


Would it be safe to assume that all of the old testament figures which did have a chat with god that they in some way had free will removed? Since the scriptures state that this did happen I'm wondering if in those cases if you somehow think those individuals no longer had it as your statement implies.

bitsforbytes
reply to post by AfterInfinity

 

God doesn't pull triggers humans do. God never showed humans how to make guns or how to kill. Humans did that on their own.
Humans are accountable for their own actions.

Which is why they 'invented' a God Aspect to place all the blame upon.

spartacus699

Xeven
Why do you think your "God" does not make it's existence obvious or communicate in an obvious manner?
Now I know some of you are going to say oh he does make his existence known and he does communicate and well I am not talking about some vague bible writings written thousands of year ago. I am talking about just plain ole hello there type talking.

Why does your god not reveal himself? Testing your faith? Why would he do that if he created you he knows the lengths of your faith.

So now that this is clear what gives? Why is god so secretive? Why is our only salvation written on some scrolls created by uneducated men 1000's of years ago?

Would be easy for everyone to believe if God would just say hello.

God could save everyone with a simple hello.

edit on 2-1-2014 by Xeven because: (no reason given)

we have free will now. If he showed up then it would remove our free will. So he has let us do whatever we want in this life. And if we serve him it's by choice not by force. And that's how he'll know who to take into heaven. Those that served him out of there free will. The rest go to hell.

edit on 3-1-2014 by spartacus699 because: (no reason given)

The ones who have not learned will just be separated from the ones who have and continue their journey. Suffering depends on the level between the ideal the consciousness has and the environment the consciousness exist in. Some can handle dog eat dog, non empathetic world and some can't and will suffer.

Just because many humans will like the judgement to hellfire do not mean we as souls should let us fall to that level of judgement. It is better to say let those who have advanced far enough rise to where they belong, even if they have done wrong and later fixed what they broke. Even a person like Hitler when it has fixed what he has done wrong and will behave with his evolved consciousness deserve to go home.

We might not like what a soul is like today. But we can love what it will evolve to and become in time.

AfterInfinity
reply to post by crazyewok

 

God gave us perfect life and we told him to stick it in Eden and go our own way.

So he basicaly said fine go.

Oh, is that what you call perfect? I don't admire your standards. Not to mention that the whole "fruit of forbidden knowledge" thing could only have happened if God allowed it. Are you reading me? IT WAS A SET UP. God put that tree in the one place they could reach it, let in the one animal who was guaranteed to trick Eve, and just happened to not be around while Satan was talking to her. For being omniscient and omnipotent, he royally screwed up. I mean, BADLY. And that's why he got rid of them, because it was HIS fault, not theirs. Or maybe because he wanted to hide the fact that it was all intentional. He wanted them to eat the fruit. He just had to make it look like he hadn't had a hand in it.

But whatever. Again, your standards in perfection are a little screwy.

edit on 3-1-2014 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)

You mean the tree of knowledge of good and evil? I always think of that as an allegory of the illusion of duality, where we create an ego, that we use to judge others with. Like I am right and you are wrong thinking just because I am me. Since I am a citizen of this country, this country got to be the best. Since I am of certain religion, my religion has to be the true words of god and no other book can be as true as my source.

Can you give me the specific text in the bible you are referring to?

I kinda like the theory that Annunaki genetically evolved humans from apes to mine gold.

reply to post by LittleByLittle


You guys just have a knack for coming up with inspiring origin stories, don't you? Maybe I find more comfort in evolution than I do in creationism, because I'd be loathe to imagine any higher power by the character description I'm forced to confront after reading or hearing stories like that.

AfterInfinity
I find more comfort in evolution than I do in creationism

Guess what I beleive in evoloution too

Shock horror.


Im a chritian and I dont beleive in young earth creationism

Infact I get major pissed off that you have to be a atheist to beleive in evolution.

1) God does not interfere with the simulation
2) The idea of this universe is to discover whether God exists. Once the answer is known, the simulation ends(you can see this reference in a video game. Note that I arrived at this conclusion before playing that game. Actually, the Japanese seem to know quite a lot about these UFOs stuff, wonder if after Hiroshima and Nagasaki, they reincarnated there?)

I think a better question is why the aliens refuse to show. I've experienced and seen too many things to doubt their existence. Maybe they fear #2?

Just my opinion but possibly because its not simple.
We could live for 10,000 years more as a society and still be grasping the meaning of life, the good and the bad.

They thought of Gods as giant people, then as a shepherd, now we think of it as unknown forces holding things together but balanced on the side of good. new definitions will be created that we understand and pass on.

In 10.000 the thought of god will be an amazing communalization of society's history.

Our understanding of God defines us.

I like to think it also humbles...

The signs people hope from God will not come as in my opinion the definition of that God was only good for its time, God is not a person who will move mountains but more the spark, the bricks and mortar or existence. Whatever that turns out to be.

People might feel it wasteful to consider or argue for a God that is obviously not as our understanding but in my opinion God is everything regarding our existence and to not consider or argue our understanding would be to ignore the brilliance in it.

reply to post by Xeven

Xeven
Why do you think your "God" does not make it's existence obvious or communicate in an obvious manner?

Been there done that got the t-shirt.

and

They wouldn't listen, but some did..


We've just got to get back to the Lord and somehow sympathize with his reason and logic, or begin to understand him in so doing "befriend" him again.

I know that I've fallen away, myself and must get back to Jesus, even the foot of his cross if need be, again.. (eyeroll)

And there he is the smile put back on my face in my own good-humor restored, there he is again, in me and through me to you with love.

He's BACK!

Never by expectation though so he blindsides our ignorance in a joke that would only have made us cry inconsolably, otherwise, if we did not know that the Spirit Lives always and forever and that God is truly He who was, who is, and who is to come.

He's never an "it" though in self awareness, just like us. And that's what we share in common. A desire to seek one another out, again, but he is Jesus Christ the Lord (say's NAM in the willingness to cry). None other. And who, after all, and when everything is said and done, who else, could have the audacity to be also right there ready to wipe the tears away from our eyes with a smile, even joyful laughter at our own prior absurdity. That's Jesus. His very presence takes a stand for US in the name of and for the sake of what is right, true, just, and above all loving and as I've pointed out even humorous.

In answer to your query, because you lack sufficient imagination to seek him out in in so doing find that which you seek in your innermost heart of hearts, it's a desire that only God could have placed there, for himself.

He's a riot. You just don't know him. He's not an "it". How can "it" communicate it's genuine love for us, and desire for us to also come to know him who's the very best part of us anyway to begin with and surely more, much more.

There either is or there is no God, but I pity the man, or woman, who doesn't have the guts to imagine one who's capable of loving us more than we know...

We sell both ourselves and God short by not believing in him, and in not believing in God, where is the possibility for any sort of real and authentic communication in the knowledge of true understanding, which by it's very nature must be humorous.

It's in not getting God's joke, not trying to relate, to see it from his own perspective, and God knows he knows we know he knows us, in the very person of Jesus himself, who never died and can never die because the Spirit only flows where it wishes and God is quite able to come to those he loves and he loves us all already - we were just to scared and too wimpy to summon up the courage to really love God and to also love ourselves and our neighbor as self, as we are love to the degree that we are able to receive it.

So it requires a leap of faith, and then tell me that "it" is not communicating something from God..

God is always alive, always communicating something, and in more ways than one.

Man is included however for a reason and a purpose, to help God lay the foundation of heaven on earth.

He's ready.

He's "communicated" his desire for us, including the desire that we might know something of him, at least enough to never forget that we really and truly are children of a beloved God who surely love us, and himself, to no end.

AfterInfinity
reply to post by LittleByLittle

 

You guys just have a knack for coming up with inspiring origin stories, don't you? Maybe I find more comfort in evolution than I do in creationism, because I'd be loathe to imagine any higher power by the character description I'm forced to confront after reading or hearing stories like that.

At least evolution has a tract record (you will never see the failures) Oh the dinasours were a biggy and the flying bird or the swimming fishy that never came to be sentient beings (speaking the kings english). Creationism suggests there was Demi-God aspect (in control of our genetics) that manipulated the apeform into a human thought energyform (originally to mine this planets resourses as slaves). Why not 400,000 years ago? Maybe it was the other way around. -400,000 years and the human became the ape?

Why does "God" not say hello? Not likely from a personified projected supreme being. I just finished reading "Messages from Michael", where it was indicated that the closest thing to a true understanding of God in our dimension is the concept of the Tao, the all. Unfortunately, the Tao does not come out and say hello. It is. Just as it is. Right now. That's the hello.

LittleByLittle

spartacus699

Xeven
Why do you think your "God" does not make it's existence obvious or communicate in an obvious manner?
Now I know some of you are going to say oh he does make his existence known and he does communicate and well I am not talking about some vague bible writings written thousands of year ago. I am talking about just plain ole hello there type talking.

Why does your god not reveal himself? Testing your faith? Why would he do that if he created you he knows the lengths of your faith.

So now that this is clear what gives? Why is god so secretive? Why is our only salvation written on some scrolls created by uneducated men 1000's of years ago?

Would be easy for everyone to believe if God would just say hello.

God could save everyone with a simple hello.

edit on 2-1-2014 by Xeven because: (no reason given)

we have free will now. If he showed up then it would remove our free will. So he has let us do whatever we want in this life. And if we serve him it's by choice not by force. And that's how he'll know who to take into heaven. Those that served him out of there free will. The rest go to hell.

edit on 3-1-2014 by spartacus699 because: (no reason given)

The ones who have not learned will just be separated from the ones who have and continue their journey. Suffering depends on the level between the ideal the consciousness has and the environment the consciousness exist in. Some can handle dog eat dog, non empathetic world and some can't and will suffer.

Just because many humans will like the judgement to hellfire do not mean we as souls should let us fall to that level of judgement. It is better to say let those who have advanced far enough rise to where they belong, even if they have done wrong and later fixed what they broke. Even a person like Hitler when it has fixed what he has done wrong and will behave with his evolved consciousness deserve to go home.

We might not like what a soul is like today. But we can love what it will evolve to and become in time.

I would not choose random opinions on how I think the universe works, it's never a good idea.

MrLucky
Why does "God" not say hello? Not likely from a personified projected supreme being. I just finished reading "Messages from Michael", where it was indicated that the closest thing to a true understanding of God in our dimension is the concept of the Tao, the all. Unfortunately, the Tao does not come out and say hello. It is. Just as it is. Right now. That's the hello.

I've had messages direct from God. I know for a fact he's real. Just because you don't talk to him doesn't mean anything. Give me 1 good reason why he would talk to you? Someone who won't even get on his knees and pray? And yet you think you should get some kind of communication from God? It's ridiculous, you have to humble yourself in a major way before you can expect to get any communications from him. And the other thing is he doesn't have to prove himself to you. You prove yourself to him. You worship him. If he decides to send you a communication thats on his terms and time frame. What have you done that he should take notice of you? Nothing. so that's why he doesn't talk to you. Start praying and open up some dialog, and see what happens.

My goodness, I seriously wish that Christians understood their identity in Christ. It would make responding to the OP that much easier.

We ARE the body of Christ, here today in the earth, and the manifestation of God Incarnate to the planet. He does speak to the world each and every day, and He does it through you and I. Whenever someone cares, gives, loves, heals, forgives, comforts, or performs any of the other attributes that we grant God possesses, He is speaking through us and to the world. It isn't what we do, but what He does through us.

Look to your local person who goes above and beyond, without recompense, and claims to be a Christian, and you will hear the voice of God.

reply to post by Thejaybird


Good post. Very good. It reminded me of this

Eugen Rosenstock-Huessey, a Christian philosopher (a Jewish convert) and contemporary of Buber's, described the emergence of the messianic sensibility, "Unlike other tribal or imperial people the Jews broke with the narrative that life and death, peace and war were inevitable cycles. Instead of merely longing for a lost golden age, they staked their entire existence on a future reign of righteousness and peace" (Cristuado 247). The historian of religion Mircea Eliade has noted that human beings from the beginning of history have been haunted by the mythical remembrance of a pre-historical happiness, a golden age -- thus we harbor an abiding nostalgia for paradise. Judaism was the first religion to convert this nostalgia into the belief that this mythical paradise will be realized in history as the Kingdom of God on earth. History is the realm of redemption.
According to messianic thinkers, both Jewish and Christian, our state of conflict with the world, our mortality and suffering is not a permanent human condition but is a result of our historical estrangement from God. The Kingdom of God, the reunion of God and humanity, is the remedy: "For the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea" (Isaiah 11:9). Buber emphasized that this was not a matter of gradual progress but something "sudden and immense" (Lowy 52). In Isaiah God says, "I create new heavens and a new earth." The long awaited age of peace and happiness is called the "day without evening" in Eastern Christianity, thus connoting a state of immortality. Even in the Indian Vedas we find evidence of the messianic longing in the symbol of a new beginning also connoting immortality, "the eternal dawn." The messianic age is universally described as the union of heaven and earth.
More than any other religious Jewish thinker, Buber placed the active participation of human beings -- as God's partners -- at the heart of messianism. "God has no wish for any other means of perfecting his creation than by our help. He will not reveal his Kingdom until we have laid its foundations" (Farber 90). In the early 1920s Buber stated, "We are living in an unsaved world, and we are waiting for redemption in which we have been called upon to participate in a most unfathomable way"

realitysandwich.com...

That said, i do think that God in totality is self aware, and while innerrent is also transcendant.

i've heard his whisper on a couple of occasions, so you're right, but there's also a strange and very mysterious self aware otherness of God transcendent, and i'm glad for that, because without it, there's no real relationship and no real partnership with God.

It's a very mysterious paradox of sorts, imho.

In other words that God can do for us what we cannot do for ourselves.

reply to post by Thejaybird


Equating Christ with Logos (word, reason), as defined in the christian theology, states Christ as a kind of a universal principle that is everywhere, in everything. This can be easily mistaken by christians, that feel a special familiarity with other christians, making them somehow better fit together, so they call their group or their specific denomination, church or even the whole christendom as the body of Christ. This is obviously a contradiction to a universal principle.
Unfortunately this misunderstanding leads to separation, instead of unity. A universal principle cannot lead to separation but only to unity. If Christ is Logos, he is everywhere, if a christian cannot see him in a muslim, a jew, a tree, a cat or a stone, then his consciousness is not in connection with Logos, he is not christian but only calling himself so.
Unfortunately theological acrobatics was always able to unite some people and separate them from others and Jesus's statements in the bible, created by the catholic/orthodox church, support this until our days.

reply to post by Xeven


Define "God" then you will know the answer :-)

The word "God" is an oxymoron and a meme.

reply to post by ArgentumAquila


ArgentumAquila, if you have the experience of spiritual guidance in your life,
how would you differentiate whether it is from
- Jesus Christ,
- Jewish God,
- Your soul,
- Higher Self
- Ishvara,
- Angel,
- Saint,
- Tempters
- Karma manager
- Tulpa (thought form)

Whom do you think you pray to?
Do you know it for sure?

Christian theology has a solution, saying everything good comes from god.
If helpers are working on you, than only because god allowed it and you were ready for it.
Bad influences come from the devil or demons, because god allowed it and you needed to be tested or punished.
But its easy to see that god does not to be blamed,
the equation works without mentioning him and depends in reality on you!

As I see it, the main reason why whomever it is that ACTUALLY exists in the intelligently unseen (IU) doesn't reveal themselves and/or himself, herself or itself, is because of the glaring lack of honesty and humility that goes with the delusional and otherwise false religious or religion-based or religion-like EXPECTATIONS of FAR too many people on this rock. (Religion should not be confused with spirituality). It's BECAUSE mere BELIEFS, overall or definitely politically dominantly so, take precedence over objective reality, proved facts. In a sufficiently civilized and intelligent society, that's known as mass psychosis, as far as I can tell. It's because there's not enough DESIRE for greater knowledge, experience, MEANING than is allowed by the ghastly-corrupt existing (secrecy-BASED) political world. It almost certainly is a "Prime Directive" or quarantine-type situation.

It would take at least a long dissertation and probably a book (or more) to properly explain the above, but there's no room for it here, and it works for me anyway; I'm secure, no worries. One needs to remain calm, centered, focused, loving and compassionate-forgiving, and to rise above the sewer.

reply to post by bitsforbytes


Why is FAITH required. Is belief and undeniable evidence or knowledge not enough. Why do people reach to FAITH. FAITH basically means you believe in something that cannot be proven. Why would a Loving God let us go to hell when some simple evidence could ensure all men know of his existence. Something as simple as hello.