Rendlesham Forest…, A Christmas Story from 1980 - Can We ‘Let it Be’?

originally posted by: mirageman
Conde said: “I was almost certainly the Woodbridge patrol or the LE flight chief the night of Halt’s expedition. All I remember was the laughing about the people seeing UFO’s. It was not treated seriously at all. It was a non-event when it happened, and the stories of the believers are the ones that have morphed over time.

I don't really give a lot of credence to Kevin Conde's story there. Even Ian Ridpath says in the source you've quoted.

You're referring to his alleged explanation of the lights?

I didn't say anything about that, and pretty much ignored that part of his story since there's no real evidence of the date when he might have pulled such a stunt. However I don't think uncertainty about the date of his alleged antics is reason to dismiss his comments that the personnel on the base didn't take the UFO reports seriously. Those are two different issues IMO.

originally posted by: mirageman

originally posted by: Baablacksheep
It appears John Burroughs
Is ill again....

m.facebook.com...

a reply to: data5091

This is not good news at all. As I have said a number of times. No matter how sarcastic and snarky this thread seems at times we certainly do not wish ill of anyone involved in the case. So, if you are looking in John, then I'm sure we all wish you a speedy and full recovery.

Get well soon mate.

Yes. When you cut it back to it's bare bones, there is a guy out there who has been at death's door before now and who is still out there looking for answers. Get better soon John.
As he has said before, he still does not know whatever it was they encountered, unlike some out there who seem to have already made their minds up as to what is was?

The VA paid him out due to the injuries that he sustained while on duty at the bases did they not?
Confirmation that 'something' occurred to cause his injuries from medical records that are still classified due to the National security issues with it's content?

a reply to: Arbitrageur

My thought was that Conde believed he had been the source of the UFO reports and "...... almost certainly the Woodbridge patrol or the LE flight chief the night of Halt’s expedition". When in fact his information and recollections of when and where he was seem sketchy at best. So I don't place a lot of emphasis on his testimony.

But it's probably best to see everything in context. So those who want to check out a stance on the incident being nothing more than a bunch of US airman goofing around during the Christmas break see Brookesmith on Rendlesham and Conde and Buran and make your own minds up.

a reply to: AdamE

your line of thinking on this, is pretty much exactly mine as well here.

originally posted by: Baablacksheep
It appears John Burroughs
Is ill again....

m.facebook.com...

Sorry to read that. I hope John gets well soon!

originally posted by: Arbitrageur
a reply to: Guest101
I didn't say nobody ever called it a UFO, but let's look at your own comments about the lack of credibility of witnesses reporting an object:

originally posted by: Guest101
Well, morphing lights that travel through the air have been proven to exist. They have been filmed by scientists, by their automatic observation station at Hessdalen (see first movie clip below).

But the Big Question is, was there a solid craft?
The landing traces and Halt’s memo seem to suggest this, but the only witnesses who reported a solid craft were Penniston, Warren, and Bustinza (in his phone interview with Fawcett).

Penniston and Warren have been exposed earlier in this thread, and Bustinza told three different stories, his last one did not involve a solid craft at all. So the evidence for anything solid grows thin… or do you have information on this that we missed, Jenny?

So you yourself said the evidence for anything solid grows thin, which is not far from the truth which is that there was never any substantial evidence of such IMO.

True. I'm just wondering what caused the discrepancy between the 'original witness statements' that are in the public domain, and the detailed description of a triangular metallic object in the Halt memo.

I can't imagine Halt making up a triangular metallic object out of the blue. So either the UFO story was a cover-up from the start but it was badly coordinated (maybe even intentionally), or there was a craft and not everything on record is in the public domain.

Of course people make fun of UFO reports, that's no surprise. But even these people can have memory issues:

Chris Armold, 1997:

"I'm certain the decision to call the local constabulary was one that was made late in the morning and with hesitation. You see no one was particularly eager to call the local police and ask silly questions about UFO's. However one also must cover all the bases so we made the decisions to call and ask if they had any reports of aircraft accidents or similar phenomenon. I'm quite certain the word UFO wasn't a part of the conversation."

Yet the official police logs state:

"We have a sighting of some unusual lights in the sky, have sent some unarmed troops to investigate, we are terming it as a UFO at present"
INFORMER: A.1.C Armold, Law Enforcement Desk Bentwaters

So the word UFO was part of the conversation. It was the term used for the unusual lights in the sky.
And the question 'if they had any reports of aircraft accidents or similar phenomenon' is not on record. So it seems that Armolds statements are completely inconsistent with what really happened.

Was this UFO-call to the police part of a cover-up? Or was it an honest representation of the events that night?

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: data5091

Hello data. I was just posting about the same piece. However the story about the capsule is basically a load of crap.

Nick Pope totally misses the point.

It really is this simple.

The capsule could not have been in the forest on Christmas Day, then removed before the police arrived at the landing site on Boxing Day only to be back there again two nights later. The night when Halt went out because the "UFO was back".

Just some thoughts......
The triangular markings remind me of a sampling technique.

'Spectroscopy is the study of the interaction between matter and electromagnetic radiation. Historically, spectroscopy originated through the study of visible light dispersed according to its wavelength, by a prism.'

'An important present-day application of THz gyrotrons is in the
field of Dynamic Nuclear Polarization / Nuclear Magnetic
Resonance spectroscopy, providing enhanced NMR signals at
high magnetic fields. THz gyrotrons have the potential for
providing narrow bandwidth, high power coherent radiation at
frequencies well above 1.0 THz for important scientific and
industrial applications.'

'Nuclear magnetic resonance spectroscopy, most commonly known as NMR spectroscopy, is a research technique that exploits the magnetic properties of certain atomic nuclei. This type of spectroscopy determines the physical and chemical properties of atoms or the molecules in which they are contained.'

'An important potential application
of pulsed gyrotrons is in the remote detection of concealed
radioactive materials'

Was there a craft involved in checking the area for traces of radioactivity in the biological surroundings?

If the apparent craft was say affected by something say a free electron laser?

'A free electron laser is a relatively exotic type of laser where the optical amplification is achieved in an undulator, fed with high energy (relativistic) electrons from an electron accelerator. Such devices have been demonstrated with emission wavelengths reaching from the terahertz region via the far- and near-infrared, the visible and ultraviolet range to the X-ray region.'

'Gyrotrons can produce hundreds of kilowatts in short pulse
operation (microseconds time scale) at THz frequencies, or
watts to kilowatts in cw operation. Fig. 1 gives an approximate
representation of gyrotron power vs. frequency; it is updated
from ref. [2]. The inherent frequency bandwidth of a cw
gyrotron is in the kilohertz range, resulting in a frequency
spectrum suitable for spectroscopy. The gyrotron frequency
can be tuned in steps or even continuously as the magnetic
field is swept. Such THz gyrotrons are useful for spectroscopy
and industrial applications.'

If the craft was designed as an NMR type device, maybe a hit from a free electron laser can amplify the THz region?

Maybe this 'extra energy boost' left traces in the ground due to electromagnetic conductivity?

a reply to: AdamE

The triangular markings remind me of a sampling technique.

Were you thinking of anything specific that would leave markings like this?

'An important potential application of pulsed gyrotrons is in the remote detection of concealed radioactive materials' Was there a craft involved in checking the area for traces of radioactivity in the biological surroundings?

Now who would be behind such a craft and why would it be searching a forest near to a base containing nuclear weapons?

If the craft was designed as an NMR type device, maybe a hit from a free electron laser can amplify the THz region? Maybe this 'extra energy boost' left traces in the ground due to electromagnetic conductivity?

I know this is all random thoughts. But who would be using a free electron laser in a dense forest?

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: AdamE

The triangular markings remind me of a sampling technique.

Were you thinking of anything specific that would leave markings like this?

I was thinking of the 3 markings at equal distance from one another.
I heard them described at one point by a witness (my memory does not always serve me well) as looking like a hole had been dug with just bare earth below.
Nothing you would expect from landing legs if there was foliage on the ground. Would not this also be compressed into the hole?
Unless the legs were designed in a way that may also carry out tests like some of the Mars probes from the base of their feet?
The extra energy may have produce holes like that of a small electric bolt?

'An important potential application of pulsed gyrotrons is in the remote detection of concealed radioactive materials' Was there a craft involved in checking the area for traces of radioactivity in the biological surroundings?

Now who would be behind such a craft and why would it be searching a forest near to a base containing nuclear weapons?

Someone or something interested in testing of possible radioactive contamination in the area?
Or monitoring the effects of the Microwave Woodpecker signal on biological surroundings?


If the craft was designed as an NMR type device, maybe a hit from a free electron laser can amplify the THz region? Maybe this 'extra energy boost' left traces in the ground due to electromagnetic conductivity?

I know this is all random thoughts. But who would be using a free electron laser in a dense forest?


I was thinking of a possible hit from above? Maybe a Satellite?

originally posted by: AdamE

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: AdamE

The triangular markings remind me of a sampling technique.

Were you thinking of anything specific that would leave markings like this?

'An important potential application of pulsed gyrotrons is in the remote detection of concealed radioactive materials' Was there a craft involved in checking the area for traces of radioactivity in the biological surroundings?

Now who would be behind such a craft and why would it be searching a forest near to a base containing nuclear weapons?

If the craft was designed as an NMR type device, maybe a hit from a free electron laser can amplify the THz region? Maybe this 'extra energy boost' left traces in the ground due to electromagnetic conductivity?

I know this is all random thoughts. But who would be using a free electron laser in a dense forest?

I was thinking of the 3 markings at equal distance from one another.
I heard them described at one point by a witness (my memory does not always serve me well) as looking like a hole had been dug with just bare earth below.
Nothing you would expect from landing legs if there was foliage on the ground. Would not this also be compressed into the hole?
Unless the legs were designed in a way that may also carry out tests like some of the Mars probes from the base of their feet?

The extra energy may have produce holes like that of a small electric bolt?

I was thinking of a possible hit from above? Maybe a Satellite?

What about the familiar 6 inch high inscription ?
youtu.be...

a reply to: 808Funk

What about it?

a reply to: AdamE

I was thinking of the 3 markings at equal distance from one another.
I heard them described at one point by a witness (my memory does not always serve me well) as looking like a hole had been dug with just bare earth below.
Nothing you would expect from landing legs if there was foliage on the ground. Would not this also be compressed into the hole?
Unless the legs were designed in a way that may also carry out tests like some of the Mars probes from the base of their feet?

A number of documentaries have said the 'holes in the ground' looked like a huge military issue coffee can had been pressed into the soil. However the actual pictures from the following morning don't seem to back that assertion up to me.

The extra energy may have produce holes like that of a small electric bolt?

I was thinking of a possible hit from above? Maybe a Satellite?

If anything like that happened at all it could be a plethora of things.



NASA created 'coloured clouds' recently : Link

And they were talking of using lasers for beaming solar power down to earth a few years ago : Link

But back in 1980 and on Christmas Day? Could we really do any of that? It would take some exotic technology that's for sure.

originally posted by: 808Funk
What about the familiar 6 inch high inscription ?
youtu.be...

That TV show was a pack of lies.
Nick Pope is certainly not trying to debunk the case, instead he's blowing the insignificant radiation readings out of proportion to make the case seem like more than it is, but even he in his role at the ministry of defense had access to all the radar records and he checked them and confirmed nothing was tracked on radar during the period in question. So the show you linked to is lies, fantasy and mythology, especially the part about the radar confirmation.

Nick Pope - Nothing on Radar

Penniston and his supervisor both confirmed he never got closer than 50 meters to the craft (until later embellishments and fabrications surfaced), so there's no way he read such a tiny inscription from over 50 meters away, again that's a complete fabrication, as is Penniston's later notebook he came up with to show what the inscriptions looked like, and other hokum like the "binary code".

originally posted by: AdamE
I was thinking of the 3 markings at equal distance from one another.

If the 3 markings were of an equal distance from each other, why would the police memo not say that, but instead calls it an "indeterminate pattern?"

originally posted by: mirageman
As regards contact with the police. There is evidence to confirm they were contacted at 4:11am on the 26th December and also again at 10:30am when an officer actually filed a report that was basically saying "nothing to see here" except for the lighthouse.

a reply to: Arbitrageur

So with all of the above, now what?

Many know there is a lot of fantasy here,
but it all still continues?

I saw this on "Earthfiles".

John Burroughs is been connected to it ?

Others might pick something out of all this perhaps?

Tune In PHENOMENON Radio LIVE tonight 5pm PST/8pm EST with host Linda Moulton Howe and guest former Marine Corporal and Army Sergeant Michael Gerloff who — like John Burroughs — had his mind and memory manipulated while serving in the U. S. military.

a reply to: Arbitrageur

What you have said is not in dispute. However Nick Pope does not feature in that clip linked.

So just to keep everything clear.

The YouTube link is to an ITV production "Strange But True". In general it's one of the better shows on RFI.

However it gives a misleading representation that there was something picked up on radar just prior to the incident starting. The radar operator Mal Scurrah has confirmed that it did happen but he is talking about radar returns and an intercept attempt in the autumn of 1980. It was not part of the events around Christmas at Rendlesham and he made that clear not long after the programme aired in the United Kingdom.

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: AdamE

I was thinking of the 3 markings at equal distance from one another.
I heard them described at one point by a witness (my memory does not always serve me well) as looking like a hole had been dug with just bare earth below.
Nothing you would expect from landing legs if there was foliage on the ground. Would not this also be compressed into the hole?
Unless the legs were designed in a way that may also carry out tests like some of the Mars probes from the base of their feet?

A number of documentaries have said the 'holes in the ground' looked like a huge military issue coffee can had been pressed into the soil. However the actual pictures from the following morning don't seem to back that assertion up to me.

The extra energy may have produce holes like that of a small electric bolt?

I was thinking of a possible hit from above? Maybe a Satellite?

If anything like that happened at all it could be a plethora of things.

NASA created 'coloured clouds' recently : Link

And they were talking of using lasers for beaming solar power down to earth a few years ago : Link

But back in 1980 and on Christmas Day? Could we really do any of that? It would take some exotic technology that's for sure.

It seems that something may have been going on in reference to Airborne Lasers by the USSR and U.S.A.?
Kirtland is mentioned too.

www.cia.gov...


Also, this is from a newspaper article?

www.cia.gov...

When talking tech during the Cold War, we must also consider what the Soviets had apparently since the 50's and 60's,
was any of this tech being used by the Soviets to try and countermeasure anything the West were doing on any of the nights?

Were some of the balls of orange fire like objects connected to any of the events over those nights?

'Again, the leathality of the jammer/transmitter is vastly expanded by such adaptation. Indeed, jammer/transmitters using scalar interferometer techniques are capable of attacking most military targets, such as tanks, aircraft, vehicles, installations, fuel dumps, ammunition dumps, inflammable supplies, personnel, etc.'


The Bohm-Aharonov Effect, Scalar Interferometry and Soviet Weaponization.
T.E.Bearden
April 24th 1984

www.cia.gov...