Khufu Cartouche in GP Dated - Centuries Old

dragonridr
reply to post by tsingtao

 

I see you never been a farmer do you know how popular the farmers almanac is? Its only job tell farmers in each area when to plant and harvest.This is why knowing when the floods ends and when the ground was ready is kinda important or they starve . See december 15th was the 2nd month of peret this is when they could plant crops. After the nile flood has sufficiently disappeared. and there growing season started. Now technically yeah they could wait risk planting to late to get maximum yield at harvest but that means some people may go hungry. This was just there way of maximizing the amount of food they could produce and also a good time for a celebration. You know sort of like thanksgiving this whole holiday is just when farmers had to have their crops done by.

edit on 12/9/13 by dragonridr because: (no reason given)

besides, you pile up mil of tons of stone just to remind me when to do stuff.

lol!! i'll come to the lecture.

serious?

send me a tweet or an e-mail.

reply to post by dragonridr


Hello Dragonridr,

D: As the fact your willing to accept multiple configurations the odds become much lower.

SC: How exactly do odds become smaller when the configurations are multiple? The permutations of the Giza three (their relative sizes, placement, rotation etc) are endless. That is what makes it so remarkable that the very pattern which the pyramids represent—Orion’ Belt—is the very pattern required to produce these three relative dimensions of the Gizamids via the geo-stellar fingerprint technique.

D: When i said you had to invert orion in order to match it to the pyramids you dismissed this by saying its perspective and we dont know how the egyptians looked at it.

SC: The POINT is that there is a perfectly plausible alternative cosmographic way of looking at the Belt stars that do not make them upside-down as you claim. As I explained to you, Dr Ed Krupp who first made this upside-down claim, adopted modern cosmographic conventions in order to make his claim. How does Dr Krupp know that the AEs used the same cosmographic conventions as modern astronomy? He clearly doesn’t know this because he failed to understand that the AEs actually would place south to the top of any map.

D: If we swapped Mankhaurs pyramid with the great pyramid your claim would still be the same. So just the fact you want to see this connection lowers the odds greatly.

SC: The Gizamids as they stand correspond better to the AEs world view and not to modern cosmography. If they had swapped the positions of G1 and G3 (to correspond with modern cosmography) as you suggest, then you would argue that they contradicted the AE worldview.

D: As we already seen even you conceded the angle is wrong and doesnt match orion either so again built in error correction in your theory.

SC: No. The three bases I produce are produced using a high-res image of Orion’s Belt from the Palomar Observatory. When we then compare the result of these three bases with the actual bases of the three main Gizamids (not their layout), we find that their relative proportions agree. When the builders then began to implement the design they had to move G2 slightly off-plan. The reason for this slight compromise to the design is explained here. In short, the design came first (using the Belt stars). This set the relative proportions of the three main Gizamids. The construction came next and they found that they had to compromise the layout very slightly but clearly it is still good enough to recognise it as Orion’s Belt as it remains very similar; so similar, in fact, that the Gizamids were known throughout history as the ‘Three Kings’ (a reference to Orion’s Belt). And, as I have pointed out to you numerous times now, the correspondence is corroborated with the two sets of so-called ‘Queens Pyramid’ presenting to us the two unique moments in the precessional cycle of Orion’s Belt, their maximum and minimum culminations. You attempt to nitpick at one particular aspect of the correspondence but when you look at all the correspondences, the evidence of the connection is simply overwhelming. If you disagree then that’s fine—we will simply have to agree to disagree.

D: Since you seem to agree if Menkaurs pyramid was relatively the same size we would have a straight diagonal line through the center of each pyramid ...

SC: No, we wouldn’t. The diagonals of G1 and G2 are not in a straight line.

D:...what makes your theory any more valid then Menkar not being able to make it full size.

SC: Try and deal with the evidence AS IT IS, not how you would like it to be. The simple fact is, the Geo-Stellar Fingerprint explains the extant evidence AS IT IS.

D: And a satellite pyramid blocking it its smaller so how would that work?

SC: Smaller or not, why take the risk? Why not have a perfectly clear and unobstructed pathway to the southern sky? If you are now suggesting it was okay to have the pathway to the skies partially blocked, why not place G3 in front of G2? There was plenty of space. And G3 is much smaller than G2 so wouldn’t have impacted Khafre’s access to the southern skies, would it? So you argue on the one hand for unobstructed pathways to the north and south skies but when it’s pointed out to you that G3 is partially blocked you insist the three queens are too small to have been a hindrance. If it was so important then simply do not place the Queens on to the south or north. Clearly it wasn’t so important and so, once more, another argument of conventional Egyptology mantra contradicts itself. Hardly convincing. Over and above which, the whole orthodox idea is pure guesswork and nothing more.

D: As far being incomplete you claim it was restoration work however it was far from restoration work the pyramid itself was never completed.

SC: You have no proof of that. And THERE IS clear evidence from a number of these early, giant pyramids of staged building and restoration works.

D: So you claim they restored the other pyramids and just didnt do anything on Menkaures this defies logic and reason.

SC: Menakure’s (G3) was clearly restored too, most likely ca.2450 BCE. There is evidence on the outside and inside of this pyramid that supports that contention.

D: Now for your challenge this is set up on a false premise and a useless endeavor.

SC: And yet the very pattern that can give us these relative proportions of the Gizamids is set out for us in the layout of the pyramids themselves. The chances of that occurring by random chance are astronomical in the extreme. And then when we add that we are also presented with the two unique culminations of that same star asterism (via the two sets of ‘Queens’) then the odds of such an occurrence are mind-bogglingly high leaving us to conclude that this scheme was fully intended and serves a particular function.

D: The pyramids in Giza were not randomly thrown down on the Giza plateau were they?

SC: Well they are certainly aligned to the cardinal directions and follow the ‘Lehner-Goedicke Line’ but other than that, conventional Egyptology asserts that there was no grand, unifying, trans-generational plan, there was no geometric relationship between the structures. That is patent nonsense as the images below clearly demonstrate:





Note the clear geometric relationship between G1 and G3 i.e. the inter-quarter lines above. And guess what happens to these inter-quarter lines when we theoretically re-locate G2 precisely to its corresponding stellar position of Al NIlam?



As you can see above, when G2 centre is positioned precisely on the corresponding Al Nilam centre the inter-quarter lines pass perfectly through the inter-quarter points of G2. It fits like a glove between G1 & G3. Cool huh?

Continued...........

Continued from previous....

SC: And it is worth mentioning here that such an outcome is highly unlikely to occur by mere chance as the diagrams below demonstrate:

D: As i said even you cant deny if menkars pyramid was the same size as the other 2 the pyramids would be spaced equally apart each with there own view of the 4 cardnal directions.

SC: Menkaure's pyramid isn't the same size as the others--and I present a theory as to why that is the case. And, as stated previously, if it were so important for the king’s to have clear, unobstructed views of the cardinal directions (i.e. the norhern and southern skies), why put the so-called Queens Pyramids in the way? It makes no snese. You contradict your own argument.

D: So the real issue is why Mekaurs pyramid was smaller isnt it?

SC: Two issues actually. Why it’s much smaller and much more ‘offset’. The use of Orion’s Belt as the underlying design ‘template’ from which to create the relative base dimension of each structure explains this perfectly. As does the two sets of queens presenting the two culminations of the very same group of stars, thereby offering corroboration.

D: See i dont know if your aware of this but menkaurs pyramid was completed in stages ...

SC: Hmm – if you go back through this thread I think you will find that this is precisely what I have been trying to tell you. These ‘stages’ present evidence of repair/reconstruction from different times.

D: As i said you have a theory its not evidence until you find proof.

SC: In terms of the geo-stellar fingerprint, the proof is self-evident. It is statistically highly improbable for such an outcome to occur without human intervention. And, again, it is statistically highly improbable that the Sphinx would bisect the Lehner-Goedicke Line (the precession timeline) at precisely its midpoint. Everything needed to create a working precession clock is available to us at Giza and its all in the right place. As for the wider ‘Recovery Vault Theory’ we have the massive quantities of seed and distribution vessels found in, under and all around S1 as well as the secondary evidence of vast storage of seed in G1. We have the earth and stones discovered in the Neb-ankh of G2 as part of a chthonic ritual. We have ancient texts warning of a great deluge and stating that this is why the firs pyramids were built. And there is an ostrich eggshell depicting the Giza pyramids some 2,000 years BEFORE Egyptology claims they were built. In short, I HAVE evidence to support my theories which is a good deal more than what Egyptology has ever presented to support that these first pyramids were conceived as tombs. Where’s the evidence for that ‘theory’?

D: As humans we can make connections that arent there its what we do are brains are programmed to see them. Sometimes it sees things that arent there.

SC: Your pareidolia argument again. (Going round in circles now). These “connections” you refer to cannot easily be ‘observed’, they have to be calculated, projected and understood using maths and astronomy. You do not look at a map of Giza and instantly observe a clock, do you?

D: As i said you can tell people about your theory you can display the correlations but you cant pass it off as fact until you have archeological evidence your claim is right.

SC: Hmm – I guess that’s why I call it the ‘Recovery Vault Theory’ (RVT). And it is why, incidentally, I refer to the conventional view as the ‘Pyramid Tomb Theory’ (PTT). You might like to do the same.

D: So i guess your going to have to find the quarry they used to build these in 10500 BC

SC: What are you talking about? And this 10,500 BCE? The age I propose in my forthcoming book is 16,940 BCE—and yes, there is some evidence to support it.

D: ...since obviously the ones we found arent that old. And your going to have to find workers to build them since the ones we date at Khufus time in the workers village obviously according to you couldnt have done this.

SC: The ‘workers village’ of the 4th dynasty restorers. What does that prove? Keep digging. After all, how many layers of Troy were there?

D: When you prove these two things your theory can move from wild conjecture to proof positive.

SC: Well, of course. That’s how science works. And conventional Egyptology ought to start practicing what you are preaching. Until then, the RVT presents better evidence to support its contention than the PTT.

D: Until then your dismissing other facts to meet your theory Such as all those workers that tell us in their tombs what they did working on Khufus pyramid.

SC: I don’t dismiss anything of the sort. Why wouldn’t there be workers repairing/restoring the pyramids?

Regards,

SC

reply to post by Scott Creighton


As you once again demonstrated they are not an exact match to orions belt. Thank you for that at least your being honest. However your reason why is well funny you do realize that Giza wasnt flat before they started building the pyramids. The egyptians were very smart they built bases under the pyramids knowing they would need to support a lot of weight. That means in some places they removed stone and in some they added stone. Unlike us they didnt have concrete to this took alot of stone workers. Khafres pyramid would be in alignment if it was important to them. They moved a mountain of stone but couldnt move the pyramid what 200 ft? Really come on maybe the orion thing wasnt that important because maybe thats not the alignment they used. Now i know you have a book to sell and lots of work went in to it and youll argue the landscape prevented it even though the entire giza valley was transformed. Them moved huge blocks from one area to another built temples and pyramids and created basses for them. Then built causeways to connect them but could for some strange reason stay accurate to the plan you claim they had?

Although if we said i dont know maybe the pyramids were ligned up to point to the solar temple that was on the nile might make more sense. Being you know that was there god and the pharaohs (kings) thought they would be with him in the afterlife. And when you draw a line from the sw corners of the pyramids it point at the solar temple just like in Saqqara and Dashur. And as i said geometry on a map the human mind will make connections. Look heres someone that believes they modeled in on the solar system! Hes very precise in his measurements just as you .



So you see when i say there are multiple ways to look at things and you declaring your theory to be right means nothing. You need archeological evidence not a map to prove your right. Other then that so far we have 3 diffrent reason the pyramids are were they are all equally as valid and im sure i can find more. So you have nothing the alignments you think are irrefutable so does every other theory out there.

reply to post by Scott Creighton


Tell you what if you like i know someone at AUC she might be willing to look at your work if i can get her to remember me in college almost became an egyptologist but met the wife had kids and you know life changes. Her specialty is mummies but who knows she may look at it. And Maybe even get Kent weeks to have a look. Now i wont do this if you dont want to because of your upcoming book however if you do i can make an email off the pages you put here.Or send me what you would like and see what they say the worst they could say is i dont have the time.

PS if you choose not to i do understand and it wont be brought up again i would just be interested in what counter points she might have if any.

reply to post by dragonridr


Can I push you in the right direction?

That image you posted? You forgot to link it and the sites/articles associated to it.

A good debater will cite his/her sources.

Just a friendly reminder. Not to mention other things you have claimed/stated.

You would make a good debater. Just that you need to cite your claims/sources/whatever.

Deaf Alien
reply to post by dragonridr

 

Can I push you in the right direction?

That image you posted? You forgot to link it and the sites/articles associated to it.

A good debater will cite his/her sources.

Just a friendly reminder. Not to mention other things you have claimed/stated.

You would make a good debater. Just that you need to cite your claims/sources/whatever.

It was just to show there are other theories of the alignment by no way shape or form do i want to promote his crackpot theory. Merely pointing out showing how things line up in Giza is not proof. Theres several crazy theories on the alignment of Giza however thats human nature. The other part of it is i know mr crighton indeed has studied Egypt and when i bring up certain things i know he knows. He is very knowledgeable on egypt as far as i can tell.And i dont entirely disagree there very well may be a correlation to the layout and orions belt. However his idea of dating the pyramids by a calendar the egyptians left in the layout. Well thats pushing it to say the least main reason i commented actually. So as far as when i mention the pyramidion like the one found on the red pyramid. I know he knows and is aware of the inscription etc if someone else is curious just ask ill look it up on the net.

reply to post by dragonridr


Just wondering about where you got that image from. And the articles/sources that you got it from or can link to.

However his idea of dating the pyramids by a calendar the egyptians left in the layout.

reply to post by dragonridr


I don't understand this? Please explain?

The pyramids line up perfectly as he has shown you over and over again.

I don't claim to understand it but I have followed his work and Graham Hancock and other's work. I read and I follow the evidence, logic. possibilities, and understanding.

From what I read in your posts... you keep saying that Scott believes in AAT or some far fetched theories. Why? What does it have to do with it?

dragonridr

Deaf Alien
reply to post by dragonridr

 

D: ... by no way shape or form do i want to promote his crackpot theory...

SC: Okay. I think we can end this discussion now. I wish you well in your future searching.

Best wishes,

SC

Deaf Alien

However his idea of dating the pyramids by a calendar the egyptians left in the layout.

reply to post by dragonridr

 

I don't understand this? Please explain?

The pyramids line up perfectly as he has shown you over and over again.

I don't claim to understand it but I have followed his work and Graham Hancock and other's work. I read and I follow the evidence, logic. possibilities, and understanding.

From what I read in your posts... you keep saying that Scott believes in AAT or some far fetched theories. Why? What does it have to do with it?

Im talking about the calendar he is using to date the pyramid. Thats what i dont agree with the rest is plausible.

Scott Creighton

dragonridr

Deaf Alien
reply to post by dragonridr

 

D: ... by no way shape or form do i want to promote his crackpot theory...

SC: Okay. I think we can end this discussion now. I wish you well in your future searching.

Best wishes,

SC

edit on 12/12/2013 by Scott Creighton because: (no reason given)

Reread that wasnt in reference to you i was talking about the theory that Giza is a model of the solar system. Im willing to go on record and say no possibility of that one since i have serious doubts the egyptians understood orbital velocities. As for you merely disagree Your theory is possible at least i wont deny that but im thinking not probable. However if its to much for you cool were done. I know you have something to lose and well thats not cool good nite all.

wrong thread

dragonridr

Scott Creighton

dragonridr

Deaf Alien
reply to post by dragonridr

 

D: ... by no way shape or form do i want to promote his crackpot theory...

SC: Okay. I think we can end this discussion now. I wish you well in your future searching.

Best wishes,

SC

edit on 12/12/2013 by Scott Creighton because: (no reason given)

Reread that wasnt in reference to you i was talking about the theory that Giza is a model of the solar system. Im willing to go on record and say no possibility of that one since i have serious doubts the egyptians understood orbital velocities. As for you merely disagree Your theory is possible at least i wont deny that but im thinking not probable. However if its to much for you cool were done. I know you have something to lose and well thats not cool good nite all.

edit on 12/12/13 by dragonridr because: (no reason given)

SC: Well it wasn't entirely clear to whom your comment was addressed so, accept my apologies.

Yes, there are many theories out there. And they exist only because the case for the pyramids as tombs (with particular regard to the early, giant pyramids) has not been proven. There are simply too many contradictions to that theory for many to accept it and so many look for other answers--which is not an unreasonable thing to do. Certainly all theories can't be right and all of them, including the RVT AND the Pyramid Tomb Theory (PTT), can be wrong. There is no one from the time to say who is right and who is wrong. Clearly you accept the PTT. That's your choice and no one denies you that. Just do not expect the rest of us to accept your view when there is little evidence to support it and much that contradicts it. And no, I haven't ever said the RVT is right or is fact--only that it is better evidenced than the PTT and explains many of the contradicitons (see above) in that theory.

Now, I am off to work on my next book--you know, those things that Egyptologists such as Lehner, Hawass, Spence, Dodson et al write and sell to earn their living.

Regards,

SC

dragonridr

.. i was talking about the theory that Giza is a model of the solar system. Im willing to go on record and say no possibility of that one since i have serious doubts the egyptians understood orbital velocities.

Please go back to page "four" of this thread and have a close look at what I posted.
I agree with you - the AE probably didn't understand orbital velocities -
but SOMEONE definately did!

This is what makes it so hard to believe the AE we know of,
built these amazing structures thereby lending credence to
an Atlantean 'type' civilization.
Are you familiar with Carl Munck's "The CODE"..?


@SC -

All apologies, missed a pic back on pg. 4 (didn't load)
Should appear as this...



Good luck with the new book!

HumAnnunaki

dragonridr

.. i was talking about the theory that Giza is a model of the solar system. Im willing to go on record and say no possibility of that one since i have serious doubts the egyptians understood orbital velocities.

Please go back to page "four" of this thread and have a close look at what I posted.
I agree with you - the AE probably didn't understand orbital velocities -
but SOMEONE definately did!

This is what makes it so hard to believe the AE we know of,
built these amazing structures thereby lending credence to
an Atlantean 'type' civilization.
Are you familiar with Carl Munck's "The CODE"..?

@SC -

All apologies, missed a pic back on pg. 4 (didn't load)
Should appear as this...

Good luck with the new book!

SC: Many thanks. Here's one you might like:



3-1-4 Satellites

Regards,

SC

reply to post by Scott Creighton


Thanks Scott -

No need to reply to this (just a thought I have pondered awhile)

This has to your with your polar tilt CROSS-OVER theory..
(visiting your forum looking for updates last night, I was reminded)

Carl Munck has the polar tilt at 19 degrees.

In your theory, you have it at 6.5 degrees crossing over.
Could the air-shafts crossing over constitute multiplying by a factor of two:

I say this because 6.5 x 2 = THIRTEEN.

Thirteen jumps at me everywhere at Giza so curiously I wonder
if 13 is the polar tilt or a halfway mark in the 26,000 precession period.

Giza is definitely a book of questions!

This is somewhat of a tangent to the thread but I can’t help notice some glaring facts pertaining to the large pyramids of Khufu and Khafre. It came to me after reading this comment from you Scott.

SC: In 1818, Giovanni Belzoni became the first person in modern times to enter G2, the pyramid attributed by conventional Egyptology to Khafre. When Belzoni entered the so-called 'burial chamber' he found a stone container set into the floor which he presumed to be a sarcophagus. When he prised the lid from the container, Belzoni was disappointed to find that the container was filled only with earth, stones and fragments of bull bones. Belzoni concluded that some 'joker' in antiquity had removed the king's body and had went to the not inconsiderable trouble of then dragging bags of earth and stones to fill the stone container and then re-seal it.

The mention of bull bones made me look up some information on sacred bull worship. It appears that bull worship in ancient Egypt was directed to the sacred bull god Apis. The hieroglyphics for Apis seems to match the construction style for the main entrance to Khufu’s pyramid.



Hieroglyphs of Apis.




You can clearly see the double gabled roof symbol is a match for Khufu’s pyramid and Apis. It is also believed that there is a double gabled roof within the Queen and King’s chambers.

We only know about the stress-relieving chambers because in 1837 Howard Vyse had small tunnels dug and blasted, but we don't know about what lies on top of the gable. If you compare the configuration of the King's chamber with the way the entrance to the pyramid was built you notice, that two layers of stone blocks were used there to form a double gabled roof. For this reason some archeologists conjecture, that there might be another layer of limestone slabs lying on top forming a double gabled roof.

www.cheops-pyramide.ch...

I was wondering if these two great pyramids were meant to house a live or dead bull. An animal can’t read so maybe that’s why there are no writings within these pyramids.

reply to post by lostinspace


Hello Lostinspace.

Great observation. I see here connections between the creator god Ptah, the bull and the Ka. Thanks again for your contribution.

Regards,

SC

Scott Creighton

Now, I am off to work on my next book--you know, those things that Egyptologists such as Lehner, Hawass, Spence, Dodson et al write and sell to earn their living.

Archaeology for the eager, intelligent, non-specialized public?

It appears there's a competition going on, open to everyone.