Obama Care Will be the Catalyst That Will Force a Change for a Better Healthcare Plan for America.

I doubt you could reform the health service without a serious amount of money, to create a proper 'public' hospital system you need to establish the required infrastructure such as public hospitals/ambulance services/doctors surgeries paid for out of the tax income and since its paid out of the public purse the wages will be set and doctors etc who are used to just writing telephone numbers for annual pay will find its not as profitable as it used to be.

reply to post by Maxatoria


We have a private health care system in the U.S. that is costing consumers and businesses a fortune, and still leaving millions of Americans without health insurance. Don't you think it's the responsibility of any government to provide their people access to healthcare? We're the only industrialized nation that doesn't provide health care to all its citizens. There is something definitely wrong with that picture.

We pay an enormous amount of taxes in the U.S. to fund a huge military and war machine, support numerous military bases around the world and provide billions of foreign aid. I would think a tax to preserve human life would out weigh anything we spend for the main purpose of killing and destroying another countries infrastructures.

Like I mentioned in my post, I would think a national sales tax to support a health care plan would cost much less and bring down costs rather than continuing on the same failed private health care plans we have in the U.S.

It's an enormous undertaking, and I personally believe a private insurance plan doesn't have all the answers. Maybe a combination of both could be a possibility, but I don't see how businesses and people who currently don't have coverage can afford the rising costs under our current private insurance plans. I'm not saying I have all the answers, but it seems everyone needs to pay into the system in the form of taxes to bring down costs and to make sure millions have health care coverage.

I have to firmly disagree.

It is another chink in the armor of freedom.

One more(and maybe the last) link to the unbreakable chain of destruction.

We need job creation to prosper and keep 350 million Americans out of the dark ages.

Not job killers.

reply to post by liejunkie01


I can understand your perspective, but the current private system is only putting money in the pockets of insurance and pharmaceutical companies. There's no jobs being made except filling the pockets of greedy executives of these two corporate entities.

It's private industry who has sold American jobs overseas for the simple fact that poverty labor brings in higher profits. So I would question if a compete private system will actually reduce costs and make health care more affordable and available to all. Private businesses main focus is to make money, providing healthcare is no different.

What is freedom if citizens don't have their health and no access to healthcare. It's a basic human right.

reply to post by ChuckNasty


I'm not saying that Obama Care is the answer. I'm just saying the dissatisfaction with the plan will cause a rumbling throughout the country. Pressure from American citizens will force a better plan to answer the concerns of the majority.

Damn...where do you live? I can often get in the same day, the most I've waited is 2 or 3 days. I'm in a Chicago 'burb so it's not a low population area. I don't know if that makes a difference or not.

reply to post by BobM88


I live in a city with a population of a little more than 100,000. If you're lucky, the only way you can get in quickly is if there's a cancellation, and that doesn't happen too often. Hospitals in our city have set up places called Urgi-Care if you need to see a doctor the same day. (When you arrive, you can expect to wait a couple of hours before you're seen by a doctor.

If you want to see your family physician, that's a different story altogether.

Asking for afforsable healthcare in the US is like asking the
sun to please set in the east....

reply to post by MALBOSIA


You're probably right on with that assessment. However, I still think it's wrong to deny health care to any individual based upon whether they can afford it. Talk about human rights, the U.S. is in no position to judge when it comes to not providing healthcare for its citizens.

obamacare is forcing some people to buy insurance which they won`t be able to afford to use,the only one who benefits from that is the insurance companies.

reply to post by Tardacus


It keeps on going back to the insurance companies. The pharmaceutical companies are also benefiting too. If the government doesn't regulate costs, health insurance alone will bankrupt America.

Capitalism and healtcare do not belong together. A capitalistic healthcare will never work well... It is simply wrong.

Economy is based on supply & demand, healthcare has an inelastic demand. You can not set a price on human life. Whether the price is 10 dollars or 10,000 dollars - if not paying it would result in death, a person will find a way to come up with the money, whatever the price, even if crime is necessary to get the finances.

The new system has its flaws, although it is a step towards better. At the end, as many countries have already proven, universal healthcare works the best - no middle men to drive up the costs and everybody who needs medical help, gets it.

Healthcare should not be privilege, but a right.

reply to post by Cabin


I totally agree. Thank you for your perspective.

WeRpeons

Capitalism and healtcare do not belong together. A capitalistic healthcare will never work well... It is simply wrong.

Economy is based on supply & demand, healthcare has an inelastic demand. You can not set a price on human life. Whether the price is 10 dollars or 10,000 dollars - if not paying it would result in death, a person will find a way to come up with the money, whatever the price, even if crime is necessary to get the finances.

The new system has its flaws, although it is a step towards better. At the end, as many countries have already proven, universal healthcare works the best - no middle men to drive up the costs and everybody who needs medical help, gets it.

Healthcare should not be privilege, but a right.

reply to post by Cabin

 

I totally agree. Thank you for your perspective.

Um, no. Nothing that costs money is a right, it just isn't.

Are you proposing we make doctors slaves? Health device and drug companies produce at no cost at gunpoint?

You might as well say shelter is a right so everyone is entitled to a house. Food is a right so it should be given to everyone. Sorry personal responsibility is essential to have a functional society. If everything is just given to everyone, they will do nothing, and there will be no one to give anything to them because they will be to busy laying around taking handouts.

Look healthcare as we know it did not exist until the last 150 years, before that people just dropped dead when it was their time. Would it be nice if the country was doing so well we could afford healthcare for all citizens without going broke - sure. Is that reality, No at the current healthcare costs it is not.

Until the litiginous nature of healthcare is addressed and the high costs associated are looked at;

Any attempt at legislating/controlling/mandating healthcare will fail.

Obamacare is a Three step plan.

Step 1, Make everyone enroll in Insurance. (Private, Medicaid, Medicare).

Step 2, Most of the Insurance Plans are not cost effective. (as only government through Medicare/Medicaid can argue the price). So we'll create a Government Option. This Insurance plan will also be known by the the person who started the whole thing...OBAMACARE.

Step 3, As the majority of the population have enrolled in the Government Option (Obamacare) it seems pointless not to establish SINGLE PAYER. Obviously this new UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE system will be known throughout the land as Obamacare.

Ten years later the citizens of the U.S.A. will be wondering why it took so long to get the Healthcare system they needed.

And no Teabagger, Paul, Cruz, Bachmann. O'reily, Hannity or Koch will say what a wonderful time it was when a child's Leukemia led to their entire families Bankruptcy.

One day America will get the Healthcare it needs, not the one it deserves.

beezzer
Until the litiginous nature of healthcare is addressed and the high costs associated are looked at;
Any attempt at legislating/controlling/mandating healthcare will fail.

Excellent idea!

Why should we have any cause of redress for the amputation of the wrong leg?

BritofTexas

beezzer
Until the litiginous nature of healthcare is addressed and the high costs associated are looked at;
Any attempt at legislating/controlling/mandating healthcare will fail.

Excellent idea!

Why should we have any cause of redress for the amputation of the wrong leg?

Straw man argument. Address deliberate errors. But the high costs of malpractice insurance are just ridiculous!

But lets keep pandering to lawyers, as you want to.

WeRpeons
reply to post by ChuckNasty

 

I'm not saying that Obama Care is the answer. I'm just saying the dissatisfaction with the plan will cause a rumbling throughout the country. Pressure from American citizens will force a better plan to answer the concerns of the majority.

Sorry if I came off wrong. I truly hope what you posted becomes a reality.

After looking into how the states handle ACA, I am fearful that this will stay around for a very long time.

The companies are 'funding' for absolute control. Once they get a, what is it called when a foreign army takes over an installation...foothold? Once they get a foothold, they'll be able to 'donate' money to keep them in control.

Crooks are like that bird of a feather saying.

After looking at the aca estimator, the majority of the people will be happy with the ACA.

The total out-of-pocket expenses is way less than any other coverage.. And if you only have a part time job or 3, your coverage would likely be better and cheaper than any employer offered coverage.

Link to ACA estimator.

proximo
Um, no. Nothing that costs money is a right, it just isn't.

Are you proposing we make doctors slaves? Health device and drug companies produce at no cost at gunpoint?

You might as well say shelter is a right so everyone is entitled to a house. Food is a right so it should be given to everyone. Sorry personal responsibility is essential to have a functional society. If everything is just given to everyone, they will do nothing, and there will be no one to give anything to them because they will be to busy laying around taking handouts.

Look healthcare as we know it did not exist until the last 150 years, before that people just dropped dead when it was their time. Would it be nice if the country was doing so well we could afford healthcare for all citizens without going broke - sure. Is that reality, No at the current healthcare costs it is not.

edit on 5-10-2013 by proximo because: (no reason given)

Most basic needs should cost the money they are worth, not the additional cost added to every middle companies profit...

Non-profit company does not mean company producing loss... Doctors still get paid and drug companies get paid, yet the difference is in the amount added to their net profit from tax payer´s money.

Doctor´s should get paid well, although to be honest US doctor´s get paid way too much considering the living costs in US. Although that´s another story, just as your second paragraph with which I am not commenting on in this post.

The problem in US system lies in the middlemen. Of course doctors & other people needed for providing healthcare and the hospital administration are needed just as companies providing drugs and equipment are needed, although the middlemen, who add 0-benefit to the actual healthcare - insurance companies- are where the problem lies. Does an insurance salesmen gives you better healthcare, yet as part of your healthcare you are paying his salary...

Personal responsibility - of course it is very important in functional society - although how can we prove whether health problems come from personal decisions or from uncontrollable reasons - genetics. Does somebody have to pay more their entire life because they inherited worse genetics from there family? There are way too many conditions, where it is impossible to determine whether the disease came from personal decisions or from mother, father, 2nd great grandfather... Impossible to say which exactly caused that particular disease.

How much are the costs of your healthcare quality should not come down to lottery in the long run (except drug costs). The doctors visits, scans, whatever else should be covered by the government with the same with the same tax amount that everybody else pays. Why should you be punished for uncontrollable reasons?

Personally I would also fully support eliminating drug companies, as the current system does not work well when it comes to customers, as profits are always more necessary. The intellectual property/patent system is setting the needs of the company in front of customers. I would personally prefer a global system, where every country is required to put certain % of their budget into research, which would not be patented and will be shared between different research teams from every country in order to create maximum efficiency and speed in creating the best cures for diseases at non-profit prices.

beezzer

BritofTexas

beezzer
Until the litiginous nature of healthcare is addressed and the high costs associated are looked at;
Any attempt at legislating/controlling/mandating healthcare will fail.

Excellent idea!
Why should we have any cause of redress for the amputation of the wrong leg?

Straw man argument. Address deliberate errors. But the high costs of malpractice insurance are just ridiculous!
But lets keep pandering to lawyers, as you want to.

There are no spuriuos law suits to speak of.

Ambulance chasers don't tend to get paid unless they win.

And let's not forget that Judges refuse to hear pointless cases.

Medical lawsuits are declining.

Medical professionals are being fleeced by the Insurance companies too.

Any of your 401k in Blue Cross Blue Shield?

liejunkie01
I have to firmly disagree.

It is another chink in the armor of freedom.

One more(and maybe the last) link to the unbreakable chain of destruction.

We need job creation to prosper and keep 350 million Americans out of the dark ages.

Not job killers.

edit on 5-10-2013 by liejunkie01 because: (no reason given)

Problem is that most of those Americans who don't have jobs, wouldn't take the jobs.
They already have free money.

reply to post by BritofTexas


You may no be far from the truth, But not in the way your enumerated, this is the way is going to go.

First, health insurance will become too expensive to buy under the mandate aka taxes, employers will lay out or lower the hours of the employees to avoid having to offer medical insurance, people will rather pay the fines.

Second, the amount of people that will be in the Medicaid expansion will be too much for the system to work.

Third, subsidies will put a dent on the budget, and without new enrollees for the insurance business they will start going out of business.

This will force the government into a one payer system.

How about that.

The Obama administration lied to the public about been able to keep their existing insurance and we know how that is going.

At the end the Obama administration will get its wishes of one payer system that was the original bill anyway before the house and senate created two new bills that later merged to favor the insurance businesses.

I like my version better.

reply to post by marg6043


How you are wrong, part I:

First- Employer funded plans still result in a subsidy if they charge more than that 9.5% limit. It'll 'balance' the costs no matter what.

Second - It will be up to a state to include more into the states medicaid.

Third - the way you stated that one is a typo I'm sure. Subsidies are payments to people to lessen their costs. The being forced to pay for insurance will be a strain on a budget. The rest of your Third statement is...silly.

The rest..
States are allowing a one provider system...only people who isn't effected by the 'one' are those with employer provided plans.

The plan is set up for people to keep their current plan....but it forces people to take their employer plan or get royally F'd.

In the end - certain insurance corps will make mega bank...who will then 'donate' to their public 'helper' with promises of future employment to those who helped..

Your version is a Neverland version. **Nerd rage **

reply to post by ChuckNasty


No, subsides are to go directly to the insurance companies, on that you are wrong, people are not getting a penny or checks, some may get credits.

And by the way the subsidies are still tax payers dollars no money that is made of thin air, the Obama administration gives the impression that giving away money on subsidies, expansion of Medicaid up to 90% for states that will expand is free for all, is still tax payer dollars and still will cause the mammoth Obamacare program to get costlier and that will fall on the tax payers regardless.

I still like my version best.

BobM88

WeRpeons
How often can anyone in the U.S see a doctor the next day or the next week for that matter? A majority of the time it takes 2 months to schedule an appointment to see a doctor or we're told to go to the hospital emergency room where you'll spend hours just to see a doctor!

Damn...where do you live? I can often get in the same day, the most I've waited is 2 or 3 days. I'm in a Chicago 'burb so it's not a low population area. I don't know if that makes a difference or not.

I live in a town that's somewhat suburban, somewhat rural. Decent sized city about a town over. Hospital in my small town, with many additional outpatient care centers.

Sometimes I can get an appointment with my primary within a couple/few weeks. Setting up an appointment can sometimes take a month or two, though, if they are booked and don't get any cancellations. Seeing a specialist is the ridiculous one. Those can sometimes take six months or more, from a referral. No joke.