euthanasia for psychological distress

reply to post by UnifiedSerenity


I suffer from a specific mental illness. I see and hear things. I have voices in my head. My anguish has driven me to attempt suicide four times. Now if that isn't baring my soul, I don't know what is.

I know whereof I speak.

reply to post by FlyersFan


When I was 20, I tried to kill myself. Almost did it too, but my parents found me in time and got me to the hospital.
Long story short, I am freaking glad that I am sitting here 5 years later, alive. In 5 years my life has become great.
If you had asked me back then, why I would kill myself. I would have a load of great arguements for why I should die. I would be very persuading and could tell some stories that would make you feel like killing me would be a huge favour.

I am glad my attempted suicide failed, I am glad that I am alive today. Thats is a big change in 5 years. A very big change.

That is why I am in a huge dilemma on this whole subject. It is every man and womans right to die if they choose. It is their life. But 5 years is all it took for for me and now I can look forward to maybe 60 years of good living, maybe more.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Yes, I know what assisted suicide means, but it's generally understood to be an option specifically for those physically incapable of doing it for themselves.

If you can do it yourself, why involve others?

You will never convince the PTB that doctors should casually dispatch perfectly healthy specimens who are just depressed.

Nor will you find any sane doctor willing to carry it out.

reply to post by CJCrawley

I am VERY happy for you. Really.


Lemme' tell you about my friend, Steve. We were friends starting in High School until he died 25 years later. He had clinical depression. No meds helped. No shrinks helped. He tried. He suffered. He 'pulled himself up by the bootstraps' and really tried. But the weight was too great and he committed suicide (by car in the garage). He tried and tried and tried. Nothing helped. He couldn't live with it. Just the fact that he made it as long as he did is amazing to me. I feel that he had every right to end his torment. And I stand by that.

CJCrawley
If you can do it yourself, why involve others?

There is a big difference in strangulation death by hanging yourself and painless death by lethal injection administered by a trained professional. Doctors want to end the pain of their patients. For many, death is the only way to end the pain. If a doctor wishes to help patients end their lives, they should be allowed to. IMHO.

People will stand behind capital punishment and the use of lethal injection, an eminently humane death for a murderer, sometimes multiple, but they will not allow that same humane death for someone who is suffering from deep mental illness or terminal illness.

It boggles the mind.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Exit bag/suicide bag all the way. Painless, easy and quick. Like breathing, but not really.

I have to agree with the above poster about how, if you are capable of doing it yourself, there is no reason to involve someone else.
I will also have to agree that assisted suicide should be for the people, not able to kill themselves in a painless and easy way.

On the joke side though, I had to share this I remember from way back when on 4chan.

I think the best method I ever heard went something like this: you'll need a chair, some cheese wire, and a tube of super glue. Now, stand on the chair and tie a slip knot out of the cheese wire. Attach the cheese wire to anything high up that can support your weight. Take the glue and squeeze it all over your hands; stick hands to either side of your face. Jump.

It'll look like you pulled your own effin head off with your bare hands.

reply to post by FlyersFan

For many, death is the only way to end the pain.

Yes. They're called cancer patients. Fortunately, there comes a point where the dosage of the drug necessary to block the pain is simultaneously a lethal one. So all's good.

I don't accept that "death is the only way to end the pain" for any psychological problem. I'm a nurse, by the way.

If a doctor wishes to help patients end their lives, they should be allowed to.

Sorry, that birdie never gonna fly.

Interesting POV, nonetheless.

FlyersFan
Any adult in the world should be allowed to engage in physician assisted suicide for any reason they wish. It's their life. They are the ones who know best if they can live it or not. We have no business judging someone else's level of 'psychological or physical distress'. What is a huge burden for some, isn't for others. We can't judge.

I say ... Physician assisted suicide for any adult for any reason they deem it necessary.

AMEN !!!!



- SN

Restricted
People will stand behind capital punishment and the use of lethal injection, an eminently humane death for a murderer, sometimes multiple, but they will not allow that same humane death for someone who is suffering from deep mental illness or terminal illness.

It boggles the mind.

Hey, lookey here!!! We actually agree on something!!!


WooHoo!!!


- SN

FlyersFan
reply to post by CJCrawley

 

I am VERY happy for you. Really.


Lemme' tell you about my friend, Steve. We were friends starting in High School until he died 25 years later. He had clinical depression. No meds helped. No shrinks helped. He tried. He suffered. He 'pulled himself up by the bootstraps' and really tried. But the weight was too great and he committed suicide (by car in the garage). He tried and tried and tried. Nothing helped. He couldn't live with it. Just the fact that he made it as long as he did is amazing to me. I feel that he had every right to end his torment. And I stand by that.

Again, AMEN!!!!

Until the day arrives that the medical and psychiatric community actually creates a manner with which to "change" a persons mood from depressed to one where they can actually enjoy the small and large things in life, we should ABSOLUTELY have the right to decide what is too much to deal with on a personal basis. It is *your* life.

Now, personally, I believe that you have to take into consideration how your actions will impact others. It's only fair. But, at the end of day, if you're suffering, you're suffering.

I hope that if there is a heaven, Kavorkian will be in a special place there.


- SN

CJCrawley
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

For many, death is the only way to end the pain.

Yes. They're called cancer patients. Fortunately, there comes a point where the dosage of the drug necessary to block the pain is simultaneously a lethal one. So all's good.

I don't accept that "death is the only way to end the pain" for any psychological problem. I'm a nurse, by the way.

If a doctor wishes to help patients end their lives, they should be allowed to.

Sorry, that birdie never gonna fly.

Interesting POV, nonetheless.

So, you feel that you are fully qualified to tell an individual suffering psychological pain that they should try harder? Day after day?

You do realize that you are setting yourself up as Judge and Jury there, right? You're actually sentencing someone to a LIFE of pain.

I personally do not care what experience you have, or what profession you are in. Just doesn't matter. Until you can *actually* feel the pain that person is going through, you have absolutely no right or business involving yourself or your opinions in what they do with their life.

I'm really on a personal crusade these days to not make personal attacks, and I feel like I'm straddling a thin line here. But wow. I just cannot believe someone could actually think, so, or act on opinions like this.



- SN

FlyersFan
Any adult in the world should be allowed to engage in physician assisted suicide for any reason they wish. It's their life. They are the ones who know best if they can live it or not. We have no business judging someone else's level of 'psychological or physical distress'. What is a huge burden for some, isn't for others. We can't judge.

I say ... Physician assisted suicide for any adult for any reason they deem it necessary.

Sorry, don't agree. And this would go from personal atonamy to panels in some places at least, and room for a lot of corruption and even murders within families, and undue influences. Don't agree with this at all.

needlenight
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

When I was 20, I tried to kill myself. Almost did it too, but my parents found me in time and got me to the hospital.
Long story short, I am freaking glad that I am sitting here 5 years later, alive. In 5 years my life has become great.
If you had asked me back then, why I would kill myself. I would have a load of great arguements for why I should die. I would be very persuading and could tell some stories that would make you feel like killing me would be a huge favour.

I am glad my attempted suicide failed, I am glad that I am alive today. Thats is a big change in 5 years. A very big change.

That is why I am in a huge dilemma on this whole subject. It is every man and womans right to die if they choose. It is their life. But 5 years is all it took for for me and now I can look forward to maybe 60 years of good living, maybe more.

I've got to say, I agree with your stance and appreciate not only that you made the statement you did so eloquently as you did, but that it might not have been very easy to divulge so openly and publicly.

I am glad you found a way to make things better for yourself. I truly am. And I realize the paradox you have discovered must be perfectly perplexing.

Personally though, I feel that if a person is in that much pain, they should be allowed to do what they see fit. I realize this pretty much goes along with what you said, and I'm not trying to be combative, I'm just asserting my position on this.

Is it safe to say you were a minor when this happened and your parents found you? I wonder if a person with such a limited experience at living truly has the "toolkit" necessary to handle such a situation. If I were in your parents situation, and one of my children (I have two daughters) took their life, I'd lament the fact that I either didn't realize the extent of the situation or that there wasn't much at all that I could have done effectively (other than providing access to psychiatry, medications, therapy, etc. until such a time that they were able to develop that "toolkit" on their own). Naturally, if there were *any* sign that I was aware of, I'd do everything I could. I have a relative who is a psychologist, and I'd immediately start there.

I do feel though, far far moreso with adults than with minors (again, the "toolkit" issue), that there are simply situations where it is far too much to ask of a person to go another day. Either psychologically speaking of pain, or physical pain.



- SN


PS - Oddly enough, in my HS I was in the drama club. I acted in our production of "Ordinary People". I played the part of the Psychologist.

Restricted
reply to post by UnifiedSerenity

 

I suffer from a specific mental illness. I see and hear things. I have voices in my head. My anguish has driven me to attempt suicide four times. Now if that isn't baring my soul, I don't know what is.

I know whereof I speak.

That took cajones, my friend. Thank you for coming out and saying that. Whereas I "merely" deal with depression and anxiety on a daily basis (and have for my entire life), I can see how difficult aspects of life might be for you.

With any luck, you might have touched someone going through precisely what you are going through. That is the ultimate good dead, in my opinion.



- SN

Painterz
The problem with this is the very symptom of what makes depression depression is it makes people feel as if everything is doomed and hopeless and nothing about how they feel will ever change.

Which is of course why the depressed mind starts to consider such extreme positions as self-termination as the only viable solution to the problem of feeling so awful forever.

This is the illness talking though. Tackle the depression, and the concept of self-termination as the only solution recedes.

So no, I would like to see screening that specifically prevents people with depression from being allowed to kill themselves with the assistance of a physician. Instead I'd like to see them get counselling, therapy, and medication, so that they can get back to a place where life is worth living again.

I respect your opinion, and see the logic you are positing.

However, I could not disagree more.

That is little better, IMHO, than when it was an offense punishable by death to be suicidal in the UK.

"The Suicide Act 1961 (9 & 10 Eliz 2 c 60) is an Act of the Parliament of the United Kingdom. It decriminalised the act of suicide so that those who failed in the attempt would no longer be prosecuted.

The text of sections 1 and 2 of this Act was enacted verbatim for Northern Ireland by sections 12 and 13 of the Criminal Justice Act (Northern Ireland) 1966.

The Act does not apply to Scotland as suicide was not an offence against Scots Law. Assisting a suicide in Scotland has long in some circumstances constituted murder or culpable homicide and see similar offences in England and Wales and in Northern Ireland."


My position is based on the idea that there is no way that any one person can fairly judge the pain another is going through, and what their actual thresholds for dealing with pain are. That being said, I cannot see how anyone acting in a humane fashion could outlaw, or otherwise prevent someone (ie, legally) from ending their life. Realistically, sure, you may catch them in the act and get them to emergency treatment. But, in the end, if it's what they truly desire, it's going to happen.





-SN

chiefsmom
Ok, so reading the mothers reaction to his death, I would think it is pretty darn obvious that there is some type of mental disorder that runs it that family.

I am a firm believer in the right to choose, for the individual themselves and only themselves. Be it mental or physical ailment, if you are a grown adult, it should be your choice.
I've felt this way ever since Dr. K made it such a public issue.

Truth be told, a specific side of my family tree could have both saved and made a fortune if they had simply opened an insane assylum.

Family reunions can often digress into "who's on what" discussions.






- SN

SadistNocturne

chiefsmom
Ok, so reading the mothers reaction to his death, I would think it is pretty darn obvious that there is some type of mental disorder that runs it that family.

I am a firm believer in the right to choose, for the individual themselves and only themselves. Be it mental or physical ailment, if you are a grown adult, it should be your choice.
I've felt this way ever since Dr. K made it such a public issue.

Truth be told, a specific side of my family tree could have both saved and made a fortune if they had simply opened an insane assylum.

Family reunions can often digress into "who's on what" discussions.

It's my only desire that I can somehow pass on my knowledge to my children to better help them deal with any issues that they may face as they age. Unfortunately, when I was a kid, this kind of thing simply wasn't "discussed". Sadly, many don't today.



- SN





- SN

UnifiedSerenity
This is not a simple situation. Then there is the government deciding ... you see it's a slippery slope. We don't start off with government death chambers, but how do you think we end up there? Too many people want a simple solution and death is never simple.

Suicide is a very permanent solution to a temporary problem.

I mean no disrespect, but that is strictly your opinion.

A day to you might be a lifetime to another.

A stubbed toe to you, could actually feel like hell to someone else. Am I oversimplifying, yes, but I believe it makes my point.




- SN

I've always thought that people should have the ability to 'leave' if they so wish. There's no reason to wait years upon grueling years until one's body finally fails on its own.
Leave life to the living. As for allowing it for people under 18... what a bad idea. Minors are under complete influence of their parents. They could be coerced into assisted suicide by a parent who hates them, despite wanting to stay alive.