Why we SHOULD demand military action on Syria

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin

Why we SHOULD demand military action on Syria, page 1

No we shouldn't demand anything

We should not "demand" that we send our sons to die

We Should not "demand that we get dragged into another war

We should not "Demand" that we continue to police the world at the expense of the national sovereignty of other stats

Really I have to ask

Why "us" its not "our" problem

its tragic and horrible whats going on but why must "we" do something, why not the Arab League for example why does it always have to be NATO states.

edit on 31-8-2013 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)

I agree to a certain extent....


The bottom line....

There's more evidence to prove that they're lying and it was not Assad that dropped the CW!!!

There is Video of the REBELS cutting people open and eating thier hearts and liver!!!!

There is video of REBELS SAWING OFF THE HEADS OF PRIEST AND A BISHOP!

Isnt our corrupt Government supporting these Rebels???

The real reason for regime change has nothing to do w/ kids being gassed!!

False Flag !! And you got no flags so far... Thank-god at least here... Majority rules.. People aren't stupid!!! And by here I mean ATS!!!

reply to post by mikegrouchy


Oh I have considered it.

Centuries the ME has been screwed up, after decades of western interventionism if s no better off.

The definition is insanity is keep doing the same thing over, and over again and expecting a different result,.

The result has always been the same.

The ME is as screwed up as it ever was, and it will always be that way.

That endless cycle has been repeated for 2000 years.

Time to get the hell out of dodge, and let Allah sort it out.

Originally posted by Starwise
. [color=gold] Who is to say that our government isn't responsible for the chemical attack? I do not trust anything they say. Yes I feel bad for the people but we are not the GREAT PARENT of the world. We need to stop acting like it. Who cares what history books would say about us if we do not act. If we are to act it should be with the approval of everyone including other nations!!!

Good!

I hope they are.

We should get in there,
get the evidence proving just that
and then start handing out indictments.


How would that _not_ be a win for us?!



/is everybody taking crazy pills!?


Mike

reply to post by mikegrouchy


You failed to answer:

Are you willing to go to the recruitment office and sign up right now and go to the front and do it yourself if you feel so strongly. If not, you are hypocritical.

Originally posted by grandmakdw
History will look back and see:
the spark that started WWIII
and how stupid Americans could be.

edit on 31-8-2013 by grandmakdw because: grammar

Only a poor historian.


Or are you suggesting that in 100 years,
everyone will have forgotten about September the eleventh,
being a precursor to all these things?


No,
if we fail to _demand_ action,
as a people,
history will judge us very harshly.


Mike

Originally posted by tracehd1

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin

Why we SHOULD demand military action on Syria, page 1

No we shouldn't demand anything

We should not "demand" that we send our sons to die

We Should not "demand that we get dragged into another war

We should not "Demand" that we continue to police the world at the expense of the national sovereignty of other stats

Really I have to ask

Why "us" its not "our" problem

its tragic and horrible whats going on but why must "we" do something, why not the Arab League for example why does it always have to be NATO states.

edit on 31-8-2013 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)

I agree to a certain extent....


The bottom line....

There's more evidence to prove that they're lying and it was not Assad that dropped the CW!!!

There is Video of the REBELS cutting people open and eating thier hearts and liver!!!!

There is video of REBELS SAWING OFF THE HEADS OF PRIEST AND A BISHOP!

Isnt our corrupt Government supporting these Rebels???

The real reason for regime change has nothing to do w/ kids being gassed!!

False Flag !! And you got no flags so far... Thank-god at least here... Majority rules.. People aren't stupid!!! And by here I mean ATS!!!

edit on 31-8-2013 by tracehd1 because: No Flag No Star !

Good.

If it was a false flag,
all the more reason to take control of the situation
and bring real evidence to light.

Indictments will follow.


Mike

mikegrouchy

Originally posted by crazyewok
If you want to go over and meddle even more in middle easten affarirs than maybe you should go enlist and do the dirty work yourlself cause I dam well certainly wont!

I did.
I know exactly what I'm saying.

ATS really above top secret: I was there (first shots on Iran)

I am not some kind of armchair warrior.

Mike

If you already did then you above many should know better. And not all of us are armchair warriors.

War is bad enough, war against almost all reason is worse. Note I said "almost." Chem attacks are horrific but that's why we have a UN Security counsel. If you don't approve of a couple of the permanent members that's your problem not everyone elses.

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by mikegrouchy

 

Oh I have considered it.

Centuries the ME has been screwed up, after decades of western interventionism if s no better off.

The definition is insanity is keep doing the same thing over, and over again and expecting a different result,.

The result has always been the same.

The ME is as screwed up as it ever was, and it will always be that way.

That endless cycle has been repeated for 2000 years.

Time to get the hell out of dodge, and let Allah sort it out.

edit on 31-8-2013 by neo96 because: (no reason given)

We are not doing it for the Middle East,
we are demanding it be done for us,
because in this over sensationalized
desensitized media controlled world
we are living in, the use of chemical weapons
is something in a class all by itself.

We should want to reclaim some sense of perspective.

But thank you none the less.

At least I got my say.


Mike

Originally posted by grandmakdw
reply to post by mikegrouchy

 

You failed to answer:

Are you willing to go to the recruitment office and sign up right now and go to the front and do it yourself if you feel so strongly. If not, you are hypocritical.

You haven't read the whole thread,
if this is still a question in your mind.


Mike

reply to post by mikegrouchy


They will see the US sticking it's nose into yet another country's civil war, which no matter what our intentions going in, will result in WWIII
The people in the middle east are intent on killing, torturing, and doing any number of heinous things to each other and it is their problem, not ours.
We do not need to end up killing tens of thousands to millions for the loss of a few thousand.
No good will come out of this, you can't get good from bad.

Originally posted by Bassago

mikegrouchy

Originally posted by crazyewok
If you want to go over and meddle even more in middle easten affarirs than maybe you should go enlist and do the dirty work yourlself cause I dam well certainly wont!

I did.
I know exactly what I'm saying.

ATS really above top secret: I was there (first shots on Iran)

I am not some kind of armchair warrior.

Mike

If you already did then you above many should know better. And not all of us are armchair warriors.

War is bad enough, war against almost all reason is worse. Note I said "almost." Chem attacks are horrific but that's why we have a UN Security counsel. If you don't approve of a couple of the permanent members that's your problem not everyone elses.

Exactly.

Who do we trust running things for our future?

The UN Security counsel,
or ourselves.



This IS OUR MOMENT PEOPLE!

Seize it.

Seize it with both hands!


Mike

Originally posted by grandmakdw
reply to post by mikegrouchy

 

They will see the US sticking it's nose into yet another country's civil war, which no matter what our intentions going in, will result in WWIII
The people in the middle east are intent on killing, torturing, and doing any number of heinous things to each other and it is their problem, not ours.
We do not need to end up killing tens of thousands to millions for the loss of a few thousand.
No good will come out of this, you can't get good from bad.

A Little bit of separation please,
so we can have some daylight in here.


It ceased to be _just_ a Civil War,
when chemical weapons were used.


Taking a stand on Chemical Weapons,
is not the beginning of some sliding slope,
it is the first thing in generations that is actually
worth fighting, and taking a strong stance against.


Mike

Does no one else
get the feeling that we are being played,
and that some powerful interest(s) wants us
to drop the ball on this, so later we can be ignored.


Mike

Originally posted by mikegrouchy

Originally posted by Britguy
reply to post by mikegrouchy

 

If you are that keen, why not go join the rebels and lend a hand?

2nd line same as the first as the question may need repeating if this thread progresses!

In a country,
and on a forum,
where everyone seems to be 100% unified against the POTUS,
I would say that I have joined the Rebel,
and am wondering if anyone else
will wise up and wake up before it's too late.

Mike

Aren't the rebels infiltrated with Al Queda? Aren't those the same people that were blamed for 9/11?

So what story is wrong? Which one do you believe? Can't believe or hold true to both.

American hypocrisy at its finest. (not just you)

reply to post by mikegrouchy


Mike, you do realize that if we stick our nose in someone else's sh__ that they will feel justified to attack us, and it can end up being much more ugly than it was in Syria, here on our own soil.
Are you ok with that?

mikegrouchy

Who do we trust running things for our future?

The UN Security counsel,
or ourselves.



This IS OUR MOMENT PEOPLE!

Seize it.

Seize it with both hands!

Mike

We have to disagree. According to you we should give up on the UN completely and withdraw from it? Or is this just about the parts you don't like? Don't get me wrong, just asking cause it seems the US government likes the UN until it disagrees with us. Then we'll "seize" opportunity and do as we please. Right? That's what you seem to be saying.

Originally posted by mikegrouchy

Originally posted by tracehd1

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin

Why we SHOULD demand military action on Syria, page 1

No we shouldn't demand anything

We should not "demand" that we send our sons to die

We Should not "demand that we get dragged into another war

We should not "Demand" that we continue to police the world at the expense of the national sovereignty of other stats

Really I have to ask

Why "us" its not "our" problem

its tragic and horrible whats going on but why must "we" do something, why not the Arab League for example why does it always have to be NATO states.

edit on 31-8-2013 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)

I agree to a certain extent....


The bottom line....

There's more evidence to prove that they're lying and it was not Assad that dropped the CW!!!

There is Video of the REBELS cutting people open and eating thier hearts and liver!!!!

There is video of REBELS SAWING OFF THE HEADS OF PRIEST AND A BISHOP!

Isnt our corrupt Government supporting these Rebels???

The real reason for regime change has nothing to do w/ kids being gassed!!

False Flag !! And you got no flags so far... Thank-god at least here... Majority rules.. People aren't stupid!!! And by here I mean ATS!!!

edit on 31-8-2013 by tracehd1 because: No Flag No Star !

Good.

If it was a false flag,
all the more reason to take control of the situation
and bring real evidence to light.

Indictments will follow.

Mike

Take control of the situation how? No boots on the ground remember? Or are you advocating that as well.

The argument to be made is not some abstract (is intervention in principle good or bad) its an argument for the specifics of this case. The case needs to be made that:

- Assad used chemical weapons
- Striking the regime, and therefore strengthening the various rebel factions will be action that saves more lives on balance than it takes.

Neither of these cases have been made in a convincing way. Hence failure to get the UK public on side. Rational people (myself included) can be convinced. It needs proof of guilt and a plan for the future that doesn't include Al Qaeda overrunning Syria.

Originally posted by superman2012

Originally posted by mikegrouchy

Originally posted by Britguy
reply to post by mikegrouchy

 

If you are that keen, why not go join the rebels and lend a hand?

2nd line same as the first as the question may need repeating if this thread progresses!

In a country,
and on a forum,
where everyone seems to be 100% unified against the POTUS,
I would say that I have joined the Rebel,
and am wondering if anyone else
will wise up and wake up before it's too late.

Mike

Aren't the rebels infiltrated with Al Queda? Aren't those the same people that were blamed for 9/11?

So what story is wrong? Which one do you believe? Can't believe or hold true to both.

American hypocrisy at its finest. (not just you)

Up until noon this day,
everything you say was true,
and I would have joined you in arguing against military action.


But this is different.

Chemical weapons and their use,
will receive their own treatment in the long view of history,
and just because we have been the resistance up till now
does not mean that this is not the moment when we should
rise up as a people and _demand_ action.


Mike

Originally posted by grandmakdw
reply to post by mikegrouchy

 

Mike, you do realize that if we stick our nose in someone else's sh__ that they will feel justified to attack us, and it can end up being much more ugly than it was in Syria, here on our own soil.
Are you ok with that?

I've heard that.

I've heard others as well.

The President of Iran said that Syria is a Zionist trap.

Russia has said that any action will start ww3.




Why is the entire world,
and even all the members of ATS
unified for the first time ever?

Why is that.

On the one issue that is clear and actually matters.

Are you sure that we are not being played by our feelings,
and confused by all the back and forth,
all the chasing from one crisis to the next.



If those chemicals were a false flag,
I WANT TO KNOW FOR SURE,
we should take action,
we should demand action,
we should take control,
and we should produce real evidence.




But to cower now....


Mike

reply to post by mikegrouchy

I am the most anti-war,
least war mongering person here.

But you are calling for war, right?

History won't look back at the spin like you say. It will only see a nation that time and again toppled nation after nation in a typical Empirical grab of power and wealth. Just like every other on the ash heap of history.

They will also forget (the spin) too and be on their own road to destruction. We'll all be dead so it will be easy for the same type greedy bastards to control their minds into thinking it is for the good of mankind, the children or decency, whatever.

"Deutschland ubbe alles!" "Germany above everything!"