My Trip To Disneyland (August 2013)

reply to post by AfterInfinity


I do not have a problem admitting where I am wrong A.I., but all I have seen is misrepresentation of my standpoints to form conclusions that I am wrong.

I'm sorry you feel this way, but I try and keep an open mind. Never insinuated Walt had anything to do with this, but why the references clearly after he is dead? Sure, could be a good laugh, or coincidence as some would put it. Me personally I don't believe this way.

However, I did ask you to point out where I accused the 'Brothers' of lying or being too ignorant, so that I may issue an admission of fault. A constructive argument would be supplying the evidence. At least I am ready to admit my faults when they are proven to me. Some people here won't even go that far.

reply to post by VeritasAequitas

Never insinuated Walt had anything to do with this, but why the references clearly after he is dead? Sure, could be a good laugh, or coincidence as some would put it. Me personally I don't believe this way.

Not enough. Need something more. All you have is speculation.

A constructive argument would be supplying the evidence. At least I am ready to admit my faults when they are proven to me. Some people here won't even go that far.

You're the one suggesting a conspiracy, or suggesting a particularly well-known individual was complicit in a currently active conspiracy. It's on you to make your case and convince us. Members are just pointing out exactly how serious the flaws in your case really are. They're doing you a favor, actually. This is one of the few places where you can both stick your neck out and protect your reputation at the same time. Call it a private peer review session.

reply to post by VeritasAequitas


I prefer Jolly over "cute". Cute people weigh less than 150.

When you have a body by Bud, you get comfortable with "'Jolly".

Is it of your own free will and accord that you enter this amusement park?

It is.

Brother Goofy Warden, please escort our brother three times through the turnstile.

My husband is gonna poop a solid gold eggroll when he finds out I'm revealing actual lines from the Disneyland ritual.

Originally posted by RadarOReilly
Is it of your own free will and accord that you enter this amusement park?

It is.

Brother Goofy Warden, please escort our brother three times through the turnstile.

My husband is gonna poop a solid gold eggroll when he finds out I'm revealing actual lines from the Disneyland ritual.

It's actually brother goofy "deacon" that escorts him. The wardens are lazy and don't do much "movin' around.

Originally posted by wrabbit2000
Op, don't take this the wrong way....but I really can't help feel this thread says more about your approach to what you see and how you interpret it than what the 'Imagineers' at Disney Corp intended to amuse children with in Toontown.

I'll try keep my personal views about Disney to myself (or in another thread). I more made this due to all the info available saying there is no Disneyland/Freemason connection.

Here is an esoteric employee piece, a name badge for the Disneyland Masonic Club. Back in the late 1950s, there were many clubs and organizations for the employees of Disneyland. They were all organized by the Disneyland Recreation Club. The DRC published the employee magazine The Disneylander and featured many of these clubs. The clubs included bowling, basketball and softball teams, shooting club, skiing club, knitting club and the Masonic club. There was also organized trips that an employee could take.

Originally posted by VeritasAequitas
By teaching a man what it takes to become a better person, you also teach him the opposite or inverse, how to be a worse person, by applying the inverse aspects of the lessons that Freemasonry teaches.

Masonry lessons basically boil down to do good until all. If you feel that this is some sort of reverse applicable knowledge then you are sorely mistaken as nothing Masonry teaches cannot be learned anywhere else. So I will ask you again, what does Masonry teach you that allows you to control other people?

...DeMolay is modeled after Freemasonry

So are the other groups but being a Rainbow Girl, just like being a DeMolay, does not make you a Mason.

Saying that DeMolay doesn't have or incorporate masonic ideals, essentially being a step below, is like saying that the children in Hitler Youth didn't exude the same qualities that the National Socialistic Party did...

Equating a conscripted goverment youth group with a voluntary orginization is intellectual dishonesty at its best. Membership in the Hitler Youth either led or would have led, war permitting, to eventual membership in the Nationalist Socialist Party. Membership in DeMolay, as evidence by Clinton and Disney, does not automatically lead to membership in Masonry. It is obvious that both of them opted not to join for personal reasons.

And never did I infer that they were as literally close as you represented my standpoint to be. It is an analogy, I thought you as an initiated could understand and appreciate such a useful tool. Or are you purposefully being obtuse?

See above for a remedy to your obtuseness.

You should probably explore other methods for constructive and civilized debate, like maybe not using ad hominems...Just a suggestion...

Then stop being a smart guy and purposefully misrepresenting facts. And also quite comical coming from someone who needs to use vulgarity to prove a point and is slef-admittedly 'enlightened'. Maybe it came from your brown....oops, I mean third eye.

See, I can do point-for-point replies as well...What a joy it must be, huh?

Works for me. I could care less what you do.

Originally posted by r666evolution

Originally posted by wrabbit2000
Op, don't take this the wrong way....but I really can't help feel this thread says more about your approach to what you see and how you interpret it than what the 'Imagineers' at Disney Corp intended to amuse children with in Toontown.

I'll try keep my personal views about Disney to myself (or in another thread). I more made this due to all the info available saying there is no Disneyland/Freemason connection.

Here is an esoteric employee piece, a name badge for the Disneyland Masonic Club. Back in the late 1950s, there were many clubs and organizations for the employees of Disneyland. They were all organized by the Disneyland Recreation Club. The DRC published the employee magazine The Disneylander and featured many of these clubs. The clubs included bowling, basketball and softball teams, shooting club, skiing club, knitting club and the Masonic club. There was also organized trips that an employee could take.

Oh my god, that's the best name ever. Flemon A.! Mah ninja!

And OP, I wouldn't worry about the masonic connections with DineyLand (and you have to say DineyLand like Mike Tyson); I'd worry much more about the connection with that so-called "knitting club" you mention. Flemon A.! Mah knitter!

Originally posted by VeritasAequitas
Uh, right here...

as this is where the play on words comes from.

Those words DO NOT appear in the Original Post but nice try attempting to rewrite history.

The evidence of influence itself comes from the very same 'play on words' that you outlined, otherwise what is the point of said 'play'?

And it was in relation to the Moose and Elks, not the Masons. Or was that not crystal clear to all three of your eyes?

Are you really doing this on purpose? I get the impression that you willfully and purposefully present your remarks/replies...

Says the guy who attributes remarks made after the Original Post to the Original Post.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


Augustus, I knew I'd see you here.
dishing out common sense to folks without any. saludos

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


Because I think I'm going to bust a gasket here explaining once again how you've misrepresented my statements. I'm going to agree to disagree with you and bow out of this thread.

You don't seem to understand that I could care less about this pseudohistory of Freemasonry worshiping devils... I don't see things that way, but you can not be so positive that everybody who joins Freemasonry doesn't have their own demons; not everyone can be such angelic beings, ya know.

Hope that you have a better day though, and I presume I shall see you around, preferably at another time when my viewpoints aren't so deliberately misrepresented.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

Those words DO NOT appear in the Original Post but nice try attempting to rewrite history.

This is really what I mean though...

You are rebutting me with inferences that I never made, and then acting like I'm the one that should feel stupid. I know that your comment wasn't in the OP. However these play on words suggest a masonic influence IN the play on words. Not masonic influence through the play on words...

Whatever A.M. I'm done for now....Continued strawman argument after strawman argument, and the truly disconcerting part is you don't even deny it...

In case you don't know what it is, which I very much doubt & is why I suspect an obtuse nature of your post, here is the definition of a strawman argument.

A straw man or straw person, also known in the UK as an Aunt Sally,[1][2] is a type of argument and is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position.[3] To "attack a straw man" is to create the illusion of having refuted a proposition by replacing it with a superficially similar yet unequivalent proposition (the "straw man"), and to refute it, without ever having actually refuted the original position.

Originally posted by r666evolution
I more made this due to all the info available saying there is no Disneyland/Freemason connection.

A group of Disney employess forming their own lodge does not make the Disney Corporation or Disneyland Masonic, no more than them forming a softball league make it a sports orginization.

Originally posted by VeritasAequitas
You don't seem to understand that I could care less about this pseudohistory of Freemasonry worshiping devils... I don't see things that way, but you can not be so positive that everybody who joins Freemasonry doesn't have their own demons; not everyone can be such angelic beings, ya know.

Newsflash, people having their own demons is not the premise of this thread.

Originally posted by VeritasAequitas
However these play on words suggest a masonic influence IN the play on words.

Since when is word play a Masonic characteristic? You try to come across like you know something about Masonry but it becomes obvious, once you start typing, that you know very, very little.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

Where did you get this knowledge, by the way? Did you go to Freemason Academy?

My assertions about the philosophy or point of Freemasonry was not my own commentary but a direct quote, hence the ex-text, from a masonic lodge website.

Once again here it is. Allow me to underline the pertinent aspects.

The quotation by John Ruskin at the beginning of this chapter summarizes the lesson that Freemasonry would like to give to the world. It is often said that the purpose of Freemasonry is "to take a good man and help him to become a better man." It does so by offering a man who becomes a Mason opportunities to improve himself. If you are to profit from Freemasonry to the fullest extent, you must work at applying the lessons in your daily life. The lessons of Freemasonry are timeless, but we learn from them by doing . Nothing worthwhile has ever been achieved without effort.

Source

Once again, by teaching a man how to become better, you also teach him how to become worse, by inverse application of the teachings. Here is one example or analogy, which is to prove useful.

A man can become a locksmith, and earn a living honestly opening doors and locked cars for people who are in trouble or need.

However, by teaching him this simple ability, you additionally teach him the negative aspects as well.. Instead of using his skills to open locks honestly for people, he could very well use the skills to break into cars, or homes, and steal possessions that do not belong to him.

Masons conduct their meetings using a ritualised format. There is no single Masonic ritual, and each jurisdiction is free to set (or not set) its own ritual. However, there are similarities that exist among jurisdictions. For example, all Masonic ritual makes use of the architectural symbolism of the tools of the medieval operative stonemason. Freemasons, as speculative masons (meaning philosophical building rather than actual building), use this symbolism to teach moral and ethical lessons of the principles of "Brotherly Love, Relief, and Truth;" or as related in France, "Liberty, Equality, Fraternity."

By taking this and applying the inverse you will see what I mean. You can teach a man how to be good, but through the inverse of that, you can teach him to be evil as well. Not to say it's intentional but those with ingenious minds will undoubtedly make the connection as some do.

Good/+ Bad/-

Brotherly Love (unity) - Selfishness, Self-centered, and Divided.
Relief (charity) - Again, stems into being self-absorbed & selfish, instead of being charitable you say screw 'em.
Truth (wisdom) - Spreading ignorance, hatred, fear, and misunderstanding; all of which completely antithetical to Truth.

Everything has it's poles, and your lessons are no different. I'm not saying this is the way, the lessons are meant to be understood; by application of it's inverse. I'm just saying that it has room for abuse via this application of inverse methodology.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

Since when is word play a Masonic characteristic?

I NEVER SAID IT WAS!!! Jesus Christ...How many times can you misrepresent what I said?

Benevolent & Protective Order of the Mouse

Knights of the Loyal Inkwell

Neither of these word plays, possibly have anything in common with the Masonic Order and Knights Templar?

Like "The Fraternal Order of Free and Accepted Masons" or "Knights of the Temple of Solomon"?

I never said nor inferred that by them doing a word play like this, that it was a teaching emulated in Freemasonry, so just stop.

You try to come across like you know something about Masonry but it becomes obvious, once you start typing, that you know very, very little.

And you would be surprised how much I actually know about real Freemasonry, learned from reading the works and quotes of people who were actually Freemasons. Your assertion that I know nothing about it because I'm not initiated and that I hold different viewpoints is erroneous...Like Brother J.D. Buck, ever heard of him? You mean to tell me there is only one meaning to any particular symbol? Get outta here with that garbage...

When you teach by symbols and by allegory, you are talking to each man as an individual, because he interprets the symbols and the allegory according to his own experiences. That is the strength of the method, and it provides ample opportunity for men to share their interpretations with each other thereby broadening the perspectives of everyone. We call our form of Freemasonry "Speculative", because we are encouraged to ponder the meanings of the lessons taught in terms of our own experiences.

The world is a symbol as well as being full of them, and forgive me if I don't adopt your interpretation on every little one. That's the benefit and point of being separately distinct and unique human beings, with different viewpoints.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

A group of Disney employess forming their own lodge does not make the Disney Corporation or Disneyland Masonic,

As a whole, you are correct. However, how many employees of Disney, let alone Disneyland do you suspect of being Freemasons, which would warrant the forming of such a lodge?

Why even form a lodge in association with Disneyland period? Is your local lodge not enough?

Dude seriously, why can you not get this?

reply to post by VeritasAequitas


With regards to the Disney Masonic club,
I happen to belong to the Scottish Rite. Our valley is about an hour and a half from us. We don't go to the Valley much unless there is a reunion. But we took it upon ourselves to form a club made up of Scottish Rite members who meet about 5 times a year. Locally. It's called the Cape Fear Area Scottish Rite Club. The Cape Fear is a river near here. I assure you it's not masonic in any way shape or form. It's just a river.

Now I am not nor have I ever been a member of the Disney Masonic club, but before I wagered the whole paycheck on the assumption that Disney is a secret haven for wayward masons, I might reflect on my previous point.

Or..... all the Higher up masons that rule the world just cannot get enough of that hot ass Minnie mouse. (see masonic sex ritual)

Originally posted by VeritasAequitas
Once again, by teaching a man how to become better, you also teach him how to become worse, by inverse application of the teachings. Here is one example or analogy, which is to prove useful.

A man can become a locksmith, and earn a living honestly opening doors and locked cars for people who are in trouble or need.

However, by teaching him this simple ability, you additionally teach him the negative aspects as well.. Instead of using his skills to open locks honestly for people, he could very well use the skills to break into cars, or homes, and steal possessions that do not belong to him.

Your Mom taught you not to pick your nose. But you did the opposite. You just thought nobody was looking. Your analogy is baseless. Only a sociopath would think in everything inverse. It's how they justify their actions.