A Question About Crop Circles

I remember first reading about them about 20 or so years ago, and for awhile they had me fascinated, as did tales of UFOs and Big Foot, and the Bermuda Triangle, etc.

Now here is a question I have about Crop Circles, and their supposed alien/paranormal origins, that has been in my mind and have never seen dealt with by believers.

Here is a link to google images search for crop circles, it is easier than pasteing a whole bunch in this thread:

Crop Circles


So if these circles made in farm crops are from extra-terrestrial sources, that should be able to fly, or paranormal sources, etc. Why is there not a SINGLE crop circle that has designs that are NOT connected. You know what I mean? Like a circle within a circle, but NO lines connecting them. That would at least prove that something not walking on the ground did them. But the more I have looked over the years, I have never found a single instance of this. Whenever I hear of or see a new crop circle, the first thing I look for is if the patterns are all connected so that it would be possible for a terrestrial source to have created them. As soon as I find out this is the case I dismiss the crop circle out of hand as another hoax.

Are there any examples out there anyone can show me, or can anyone who believes in crop circles as being proof of intelligent life that is not human explain this for me? Thanks.

This is one hell of a hoax:

lucypringle.co.uk...

Yawn

reply to post by JayinAR


Thanks for the yawn, I think...if it was condescending in nature, then no thanks, that is not what I'm looking for, but you didn't really address the question in the OP. Can you do that?

As far as that design as being proof to super-human or paranormal forces, etc. I have a brother that is an artist and can design things far more grand than that. So that design is not proof of a paranormal or extraterrestrial intelligence.


If a fish can do this:



I'm pretty sure a human can do what you showed me. Besides they're all connected terrestrially, so you did not give me the pic I asked for.

reply to post by iSomeone


Aww you beat me to it.

Yes yes, it's a land based puffer fish!

reply to post by JayinAR


lol Lucy Pringle and her myriad of crop circle merchandise :

books, post cards, posters, DVD's, calendars, jigsaw puzzles, mugs , magic cubes , necklaces, lectures if there was ever a main offender for perpetuating the myth of alien/new earth energy mad crop circles so they could cash in from gullible people its her without a shadow of a doubt.

reply to post by iSomeone

I know a few people like to think that crop circles are made by aliens etc but the fact that they only pop up when the weather is good enough for us fragile humans to be out messing around in fields should at least raise you suspicions that these are just hoaxers having a laugh at your expense. The way each design is only done in fields that have track lines going through them which makes it easy for teams of people to get in an out without leaving any tracks should speak volumes. The fact it only ever happens under the cover of night were people can sneak in and out unseen usually very close to a road should also be a clue to the obvious hoax. Hell even the fact that they are only ever made in crops that a human would find easy to flatten with a board tied to a couple of ropes should give the game away. You never see these designs flattening large tough thorny bushes or groups of trees or crossing motorways. how about a crop circle in a housing district that spans hundreds of peoples back gardens?

We are all looking for evidence of aliens but you wont find it stomped out in a field in the south west of the UK. Either way i always like looking at few pretty designs.

I didn't say that was alien.
I said it was a hell of a hoax.
Please, please someone reduplicate that design in a field.
I will wait.

Originally posted by JayinAR
I didn't say that was alien.
I said it was a hell of a hoax.
Please, please someone reduplicate that design in a field.
I will wait.

Oh, ok. Well, I can't. I can't even draw better than stick figures. Of course I can't duplicate Itzak Perlmen playing Carmen's Fantasy on a violin either, that doesn't make him any more human than me.

ETA (for the delight of your ears)

reply to post by iSomeone


Your thread presents a false dichotomy.
Hence the yawn.

"If you think this may be something, ANYTHING more than human hoaxers, you obviously fall in the alien camp".
And given the poster PhoenixOD's usual condescending remarks on this subject it all gets rather tiresome.

We get it already, you guys think its all human! Cool!
I don't - period.

Originally posted by JayinAR
reply to post by iSomeone

 

Your thread presents a false dichotomy.
Hence the yawn.

"If you think this may be something, ANYTHING more than human hoaxers, you obviously fall in the alien camp".
And given the poster PhoenixOD's usual condescending remarks on this subject it all gets rather tiresome.

We get it already, you guys think its all human! Cool!
I don't - period.

Actually I added paranormal to the list at the top, realizing that there are those who believe in demonic and not extraterrestrial involvement. So I did not intend, nor imply what you are stating. You seem to be intelligent, but I find it hard you were able to reason that if you believe crop circles are paranormal/extraterrestrial in nature you must be only in the "alien camp." I guess if the glove fits, wear it, and as you are of that sort you felt the attack in that direction.

But I wasn't even making an attack. I was trying to get someone to give me a crop circle that couldn't have been made by terrestrial means. I never stated my beliefs on the matter, except that I would call hoax on any and all crop circles that are connected terrestrially, because they at that point are NOT PROOF of anything other than an intelligent person/persons making patterns in the farm vegetation.

reply to post by iSomeone


A lot may be due to more common weather phenomena for starters. Obviously not the one that I linked, but I am just giving one example of a possible explanation that does not fit the dichotomy presented here.

There are examples of people actually being witness to multiple circles forming due to some sort of wind vortex.

The bigger question is, of course, why do so many appear in the UK?
They happen elsewhere, but in drastically lower numbers. WHY ARE THEY MADE? Is just as important as how, in my opinion. And that answer very well may be a paranormal one.

JMHO

Originally posted by JayinAR
reply to post by iSomeone

 

A lot may be due to more common weather phenomena for starters. Obviously not the one that I linked, but I am just giving one example of a possible explanation that does not fit the dichotomy presented here.

There are examples of people actually being witness to multiple circles forming due to some sort of wind vortex.

The bigger question is, of course, why do so many appear in the UK?
They happen elsewhere, but in drastically lower numbers. WHY ARE THEY MADE? Is just as important as how, in my opinion. And that answer very well may be a paranormal one.

JMHO

The weather phenomena is hard to sallow because of the complexity of the patterns. You would think that eventually someone would film such phenomena if it was real. Eye-witness account is sketchy, why haven't they caught any of it on film. Not to say that wind vertices are not causing the patterns, or certain ones, just, where is the proof?

It seems to me that there is no evidence to base belief in these being anything other than clever human designs. Not to say that they perhaps do not attract paranormal involvement. There is basis to believe that it does because of the high number of those involved in the occult that have had these experiences.

I believe the same is true with the lights at Stonehenge as well. Many occult followers have been witnesses to lights in the sky around that area when they approach it for certain occultist practices.

Now I know demonic influences can cause lights appear in the sky to appear as stars even because of the Biblical account of the "star" that appeared to the magi in Persia, practicers of the occult, that lead them to Herod Agrippa in Jerusalem. That Satanic sign was set up to try and get the king of Jerusalem to kill the baby Jesus. After which Jehovah God had to warn Joseph to flee before the Messiah was put to death as a child.

So there is Biblical proof of Satanic involvement with occultists to trick them for certain reasons, with light phenomena in the sky. He has* great powers, many of which we will never fully understand or comprehend. (It is funny how so-called Christians celebrate this Satanic star during Christmas).

I have yet to come across proof or evidence though that these crop circles are anything but human concoctions.

reply to post by iSomeone


So you're ready to accept witness testimony in the bible, but not in this matter?
Cool.

As I said, weather is a good explanation for some. Not all.
What would you have, people filming empty fields at all times in hopes of catching the elusive tornado?

At any rate, as I said, this is just my opinion. I am fine disagreeing. It just gets a tad silly when folks keep hammering the same points home all the time.

Why so many in the UK?
History has shown that folks tend to behave similarly despite cultural differences. Why aren't there more American crop artists then?? We have MUCH MUCH more farmland and a FAR GREATER population.
Still yet, they are found almost EXCLUSIVELY in the UK. It makes no sense.
There is your paranormal element.
The thing about the paranormal is we can never prove it. If we could it would be called NORMAL.

reply to post by JayinAR


Well, there have been people who have come forward (as one example why I doubt all eye-witness testimony in crop circles) and confessed to making these crop circles. So already we know that there ARE hoaxes. How many is the question. I asked sincere questions in the OP hoping for more than just, well you don't believe, so what, move along.

If someone were to question me WHY I trust the Bible, and if they were sincere and looking for real answers, then I would happily explain why. Because I have built up a trust on it around study, investigation, and proving that it is more than a mere book made by humans. That is, I have concrete evidence that has proven to me that it is reliable. Now there are many who are merely skeptics and merely want to disbelieve anything and everything, and do not ask questions to learn, rather to degrade, defame, and hate on others. I have that happen to me all the time. But when I ask questions it's because I'm trying to come to reason with something.

As far as the exclusivity in the UK, I have had a couple of ideas about that. But they are only that, ideas. Perhaps it's because the majority of the people who hoax these live in that area. Perhaps it has to do with occult groups in that area as well. It was not a coincidence that I mentioned Stonehenge when using an example of paranormal activity and the involvement of those that dabble in the occult.

There are some things we can be certain of, there are others that are not certain. Those concerning the question in the OP are not certain. And until they are made so to me, I will assume it is because there is no clear answer.

reply to post by iSomeone


These things have been found in that same area for decades, if not centuries.
I've seen the estimate of 85% found are found there, and that seems accurate.

Again, despite cultural differences, people tend to behave in similar fashion. One example would be pyramid building.
Here we are thousands of years later and we are even linked through a www and people are STILL only doing this in the UK. This goes against the grain of human behavior as we know it. Now am I saying that these are not being done by humans? No. What I am saying is that even if one were to jump off at the human hoax point, one is still faced with the question of WHY?

There may in fact be a paranormal element at play here.
I personally do not believe they are all human made though, and occult practices are hardly confined to the UK.

Originally posted by JayinAR
reply to post by iSomeone

 

These things have been found in that same area for decades, if not centuries.
I've seen the estimate of 85% found are found there, and that seems accurate.

Again, despite cultural differences, people tend to behave in similar fashion. One example would be pyramid building.
Here we are thousands of years later and we are even linked through a www and people are STILL only doing this in the UK. This goes against the grain of human behavior as we know it. Now am I saying that these are not being done by humans? No. What I am saying is that even if one were to jump off at the human hoax point, one is still faced with the question of WHY?

There may in fact be a paranormal element at play here.
I personally do not believe they are all human made though, and occult practices are hardly confined to the UK.

That was a very thought-provoking answer. And, of course, there are people all over the world, since the beginning of human history where the occult has been practiced. But there is a reason that England is known for occultism more than other places.

As for the pyramids. It is no mere coincidence that cultures all over the world built them in their occultist religious worship to their false demon gods. All religion stems from Babylon because it was there that the tower of Babel was constructed at the behest of Nimrod. It was the confusion of man's one universal language at that time that had them do what God told them to all along, which was to spread out among all the earth and populate it. They did spread out after the languages were confused, but brought with them the same false religious and occult teachings founded in Babylon, the mother of all false religion. But this is a digression to an examination to a topic left for another thread.

I respect your ideas that perhaps not all crop circles are of human origin. I just want proof of it. I am not trying to be argumentative. If you cannot prove it, then why believe in it? If you do believe in it, then you should be able to prove it.

reply to post by iSomeone


Ritual burials began nearly 30,000 years ago.
I think religion is far older than Babylon...

At any rate, considering that art is something that is universal to human culture, and the mediums for art are numerous (people painting on the heads of nails for Christ's sakes), it makes no sense that only people in the UK would choose the medium of crops.

You want a reason to believe in the POSSIBILITY of a paranormal element?
I just gave you one. It is valid logic.

reply to post by JayinAR


I will investigate that line of reasoning. I still would like the question in my OP answered, but thank you for at least taking the time to converse with me.

reply to post by JayinAR

Here we are thousands of years later and we are even linked through a www and people are STILL only doing this in the UK.

They are starting to turn up in other places , Italy seems to have a developed taste for crop art too .


Here's one from the Netherlands , a bit crude but they'll get better with practice .


Modern Crop Circles are man made , the original plain circles that started this phenomena probably have many causes but I'm sure none of them are related to Aliens .

reply to post by iSomeone


I looked around. I didn't see any examples of circles unconnected by at least tram lines.

However, since basically all fields of crop are harvested by tractor nowadays, the odds of finding any examples are small.
For one the circles themselves would have to be very small and may well go unnoticed.
Two, doubtful to ever find pictures of any circles from a time before tractors...
Although such circles did happen...
...but there we get back into witness testimony areas.

My pleasure. I enjoy these discussions, even if folks tend to harp on the same points.

reply to post by gortex


They are even found here in Americuh.
But the vast majority are still found in the UK...