Michael Hastings – “Foul Play Or Not” – Do you have a plausible theory?

Did you consider the three possible Flip Flopping scenarios offered?
Hope you realize that I’m not saying these are the only possibilities… Just offering some thoughts to get the ball rolling…

Normally – stories have a natural progression.
They “flow”.
The events of life can usually be seen as flowing-from-or-with the events that preceded.
In this case, we see that the LAPD gambled their entire reputation (as regards this case) on the expectation that the fiery high speed crash flowed naturally with the most likely explanation…(their suspicion)…drugs.
They did not consider the possibility that this was a “crime” or “crime scene”…until after (and, perhaps, well after) the scene had been entirely compromised.
(I am not saying it was a crime…so don’t take the above accusation further than its purpose…which is to reiterate what I have suspected and hypothesized since early-on.)
Now that their professional suspicion/opinion has been sent to the pile of “less likely explanations”…the “flow” must be revisited. (Not likely, though, that LAPD is going to launch an “official” investigation, now…)

To explain this tragedy without resorting to the insertion of a flip flop requires (virtually) that the conclusion flows in line (in synch) with the tale that precedes.

I have highlighted the observations of Jeremy Scahill, regarding Michael’s general demeanor five days prior to the crash…
To be fair…and show that someone-else had another take on Michael’s demeanor & behavior…here is a quote from his editor, Mr. Rosenthal (from Gene Maddau’s piece in LA Weekly)…

“…The NSA stuff really rocked him a bit… I’m not a doctor, but he certainly was agitated in the last day or two of his life…”

This statement actually elicits another question… Was this “last day or two” observation derived from personal communication (if so – was it face to face, by phone or by e-communication)…or deduced from the story that emerged after his death (of the email and communication with Jennifer Robinson)?

Oddly, strangely, or maybe just interestingly…in both, any or all of the background stories we’ve heard regarding his last days…there was at least one commonality --- an expressed concern for his life/safety.
We might argue interminably…whether said “concern” was the result of heightened paranoia, or legitimate observations/fears…but the fact remains that regardless of who’s perception on his psychological or emotional state you count most likely…they each/all contained this constant (or some variant thereof).

While I have many thoughts on this subject…and have identified them with great definition in contemplation at times…they’ve all kind of settled into a quagmire, at the moment, and are moving in and out among each other in ways that make them difficult to distinguish…and thus, to enumerate.
Hopefully, that will change shortly, and we can resume this line of inquiry.

reply to post by WanDash


Just in saying and take this as you want...I spent last weekend in LA with some friends who told me about Mr. Hastings last weekend alive, which was spent with my friends at a house they rented. They said he was constantly getting high (like every 30 minutes) and was taking molly. They said he never once mentioned he was in fear for his life and was simply a very big partier. My friends were in no way surprised he smashed his car up after witnessing how crazy and f*up he was. I realize this is the internet and you most likely wont believe me but the people I was staying with are legit. One was with Current TV and the other works for one of the most popular shows ever. They were adamant he was really messed up on drugs so much so they considered kicking him out of their house. This changed my perspective on the whole thing.

CJ

Just saw a piece written by Cherie Roberts for OpEdNews, in which, it would appear, the article's focus is on un-researched and/or insubstantial conspiracy theories, regarding the death of Michael Hastings.
Sadly - while chastising others for bad info...it appears that she may have fallen prey to the same...stating that...

'___' -- a hallucinogenic, was also reported to be positive along with pot.

Excuse me if I'm wrong...but...on the last page of the Coroner's report...which was also the last page of the toxicology report, don't we see the following...?

9156B Dimethyltryptamine Screen, Blood
Analysis by Gas Chromatography (GC)
Dimethyltryptamine --- --- --- None Detected

I know we have considered the disclaimer/s of potential interferents...but...how does one get from "None Detected" to "reported to be positive"?

I don't know...
I'm not a professional journalist...
...and...
Please pardon the interruption...

Originally posted by ColoradoJens
reply to post by WanDash

 

Just in saying and take this as you want...I spent last weekend in LA with some friends who told me about Mr. Hastings last weekend alive, which was spent with my friends at a house they rented. They said he was constantly getting high (like every 30 minutes) and was taking molly. They said he never once mentioned he was in fear for his life and was simply a very big partier. My friends were in no way surprised he smashed his car up after witnessing how crazy and f*up he was. I realize this is the internet and you most likely wont believe me but the people I was staying with are legit. One was with Current TV and the other works for one of the most popular shows ever. They were adamant he was really messed up on drugs so much so they considered kicking him out of their house. This changed my perspective on the whole thing.

CJ

Thanks ColoradoJens
I have no reason to doubt you, your story or your friends' story.
You could be absolutely correct. Am still waiting to see if another journalist who claimed to be with him the day before he died...will speak up. If their story jives with that of your friends...then, that would inject a significant boost into the family's expressed concerns regarding rehab.
Will stay tuned for further developments.

ETA: Sorry - I'm not familiar with 'molly'... Is this a "speed"...or...what"?
Thanks.


ETA: Found some interesting information on the subject here.
Looks like this might have been the source of the "amphetamine" found in his blood...if your friends' story is true.
I would think, however, that the amount/s of amphetamine found in his blood via the toxicology report would suggest that he was not "driving under the influence" of this substance...and may not have had any since his 'partying' with your friends... Can't say for certain, as I don't know what amount/s of amphetamine would reside in someone's system from the use of MDMA ('molly').
Thanks again - more to think about.

reply to post by WanDash

In light of the information offered by ColoradoJens, I need to back up, and see how/if it actually alters the scene.

Before the coroner’s report, I had placed a nice shiny halo above Michael Hastings’ head…in my shrine.
Much of that “shine” evaporated upon first news of the coroner’s report… And, since then, as other perceptions and angles have come to light, I’ve been diligently trying to put “the shine” back on.

And with this “new” information – all the effort I put into getting the shine back on seems to have been for naught. However…

The story that surrounds ColoradoJens’ information…has me lost for the moment…
Someone rents a house for the weekend…in/around L.A. (southern CA)…and has house guests over who are involved in the “news” or “entertainment” industries.
Were the guests told that they could stay the night?
Was it a “sleep over”?

From the tale of ColoradoJens’ friends…Michael’s antics were anything-but welcome… And, it would appear…oddly…that even upon hearing of his demise – neither grief nor horror were their first responses…but rather – glee (good riddance – he was such a nuisance).
It might be argued that I have gone too far with that statement…(and I may have)…but, if honesty is anywhere at work here…there was nothing about “a friend” or “we couldn’t believe the change in his behavior” or “anysuch” in the recount…just – “We weren’t surprised at all!” (And, to me, it rather sounded like – We might have done it ourselves, if we thought we would get away with it…)

If we take another step back – we see the numerous tales published as a result of the coroner’s reports… And – if Michael’ was at this weekend slumber party…then, we can pretty much assume that the L.A. Times’ article was inaccurate (when stating that he had arrived in L.A. from New York, the day before)…as well as the other articles that parroted the LA Times article.

But, then, we have another issue to consider…as…many (maybe 1/3rd to 2/5ths) of the articles published, stated that his brother (or – in some – “family members”) had come to L.A. “in the days leading up to” his death.
To clarify – I think a couple of articles stated that his brother arrived the day before his death.

If any of the articles regarding family members (or a brother) coming to L.A. in the days leading up to his death, are true – then, of course, it seems apparent that he was willing to leave them alone in the city for the weekend, while he partied with people that (it would seem) didn’t even like him…
And – while I’m sure there are occasions where such scenarios do take place – it is a strange one to accept in our list of “givens”.

CurrentTV was purchased from Al Gore (and partners) by Al Jazeera’…which shut the TV channel down, as of August 20, 2013.

Think I’ll just pose a thought/question…and sign off, for the moment, as I have other matters pressing…

Of all topics on these boards - which tend to consistently inspire the most heated, anger-filled and even hateful comments (debates)?
Politics and Religion (imo).
We know that Michael Hastings was vocal to very vocal…and even growing more so...with regard to his disdain for the direction of the current administration (at least)…
Is it possible that he was challenging, contesting or otherwise disagreeing with “the majority” of the other partiers’ views…

If there is not enough amphetamine in his blood at the time of death, to justify the story that he was popping ‘molly’ every 30 minutes over the course of a weekend… Someone might be exaggerating a tale, to prove that – “God got him!”
(could be?)

(And,'yes', I know the tale could be interpreted to say that he was getting high...on other substance/s...in addition to popping 'molly'...but - it's unclear... And if that is the case - it was apparently marijuana...if we are to count the toxicology report of any value.)

(just observations and/or conjecture and/or hypotheticals…in the absence of other answers)

reply to post by WanDash


Hi WanDash, just to clarify a couple of points

1) My friends rented a house near Cochella for the shows there. One friend who was staying with them asked if he could bring a friend who turned out to be Mr. Hastings. Looking at the timeline of the shows and his death they obviously were wrong - it could not have been his last weekend alive.

2) There was no glee in his death. They simply were not surprised given the nature of his "partying". I actually had a beer that Hastings had bought while there but didn't drink (brought home by my friends).

3) I created a thread regarding how Mr. hastings may have been killed via remote control of his car...They can hijack your car - I was completely of the opinion prior to last weekend that there was foul play involved.

4) My friends were adamant that the guy was completely out of control and these are LA tv people who themselves can get quite crazy. Like party with the best of them. If they were shocked by his behavior it must have been pretty hardcore. Also I said he was smoking pot every thirty minutes, and apparently took some molly.

Just saying, I felt like you did and one tale doesn't make anything fact. It did open my eyes and as an ATS'er of course I was blown away by this story and drinking of one of Mr Hastings beers and asked a lot of questions. All answers came back that he was really out of control.

CJ

Originally posted by ColoradoJens
reply to post by WanDash

 

...3) I created a thread regarding how Mr. hastings may have been killed via remote control of his car...They can hijack your car - I was completely of the opinion prior to last weekend that there was foul play involved.
...

Thanks again ColoradoJens
I remember the thread.
I have not been "convinced" of car-jacking or foul play...but have tilted that way pretty-much from the start.
Could be because of how the story was first framed (that caught my eye)... Could be other reasons that I've either admitted to...or have been blinded to.
As it stands, I continue to see mountainous hurdles for most any explanation (that I or others have come up with) on either side of the fence.
I know it might seem that I am attacking your story &/or friends...but, I'm really just wanting to do my best not to swallow a story without first questioning anything about it, that bears an odd look, shape, feel, sound or smell.

Please accept my apology...if the questions presented appear to attack you or your friends. That is not my intent.

I would like to address your other points in another post.

reply to post by WanDash


No need to apologize as I appreciate your approach - clearly my story has some holes in it - the fact that there is no way the weekend of the Cochella shows was his last alive being the biggest - perhaps they said "one of his last weekends alive" -maybe that was my bad. Again, I don't know how much I'd trust the story of a stranger with no backup on the claims but I was shocked at how shocked my friends were with his behavior. They have no reason to lie and when first telling me the story they were surprised I knew who Mr Hastings was...

CJ

reply to post by ColoradoJens

ColoradoJens

To #1 – Thanks for giving a little more on the back story. Now I can see ‘why’ your friends didn’t confront Mr. Hastings regarding their disdain for his behavior. Do you know if they approached the guest that invited Mr. Hastings about curbing his enthusiasm? Was that guest as appalled as your friends? Was that guest male or female? I’m guessing, by looking online, that this “event” was in April, 2013…?

To #2 – I can understand defending your friends… And – I can further accept that no defense is (might be) necessary… We are, however, at a disadvantage (as we have been from the start), with limited information on all fronts. The better picture (in completeness & accuracy) we can develop on each witness and piece of information – the better the odds that “we won’t get fooled again”.

To #4 – I can only believe that you believe your friends…on this. Not enough information (context) for me to be able to jump in that boat with you…(yet, at least)

Appreciate your willingness to participate in this past one passing post! That is refreshing.

I've been following this for a few days and really don't know which way to go with it. It just seems that any US citizen who discovers anything suddenly dies in an accident or commits suicide. So whether it was an accident or not, doesn't detract from the theory that there is something seriously wrong with what's happening over there.

Originally posted by Scorchio
I've been following this for a few days and really don't know which way to go with it. It just seems that any US citizen who discovers anything suddenly dies in an accident or commits suicide. So whether it was an accident or not, doesn't detract from the theory that there is something seriously wrong with what's happening over there.

Hi Scorchio
As you say - we don't know if it was an accident or murder (yet). And, as you say - so many suspicious accidental deaths and suicides among 'whistleblowers' and/or their media-mouthpieces. Doesn't seem confined to "government" either... Goes on all the time in the industrial & business world/s, organized crime, etc... It's always going to be a way that people deal with the threat of being unmasked. I doubt, though, that the phenomenon is found only in the US. Maybe we (USA) just have more secrets per capita than other nations...

reply to post by WanDash


Yeah, my story doesn't have much weight other than he said she said and clearly there are some garbled facts. Of course being a drug user CAN make someone more susceptible to being set up - either drugs in the system or on them and viola, there is the excuse the general public believe. I don't know what happened but I do know that my friends (husband and wife) are not ones to spin tall tales, other than their tv exploits which I can guarantee you are aware of.

The friend who brought him is another reporter/documentarian (male).

Not that matters but both friends said Hastings was not just getting wasted, but he was also in his own world. He did jazzercise at 7:00 in the morning to really loud music that pissed everyone off. He sang songs loudly until people told him to shut up. The Boston Marathon bombing happened when they were there and both said he was convinced immediately of a cover up. But again he never mentioned his own circumstances and they felt like he was not in fear, just nuts. The stories and the conviction in telling them changed my mind, at least to the extent of saying, I really have no clue as to who this guy was when before I thought I had an idea - anyway - enough of my little tale and back to a good thread.

Here is a blatant hint of the show my male friend has been involved with since it began.



CJ

reply to post by ColoradoJens

Well – I disagree. I think your information has substance and weight – I just don’t know what the weight of the substance is…yet. May never know. May only get closer than we started…but – it does add more color to the scenery.
Do you know what kinds of effects such a substance as ‘molly’ might have on a psychologically wounded/impaired (PTSD, ADHD, bi-polar, borderline-schizophrenic…etc…) individual?

With the timeline adjustment of the weekend escapade, we’re still faced with questions regarding “volume of chemicals evident in the toxicology report” to justify/explain extreme behavior.
In part, it would seem that your information has opened the door (wider) to the possibility that “extreme” (or – at least – obnoxious) behavior was not so unbelievable as to be entirely ruled out.

As to him singing so loudly that others told him to shut up – I wish I would have had the guts to say that to my sister (and now, her daughter) since FOREVER! (Oh – my God!)

Your point about him “being in his own world”… That is VERY interesting. If the one brother who suggested that he suspected Michael’s new drug of choice being DiMethylTryptamine…and at some point adding that he ‘thought he was invincible’… I know that some/most of the subjects who participated in the study of said substance…emerged from their experience with significant alterations to their Life-&-World-views… Questioning this reality seems to be a common result.
So – while someone might not be under the influence…by pharmacological standards…they might still be under the influence…by psychological standards.

Sorry for rambling. Just – the “new colors” get me going that way.
Thanks again.

While you, I, and apparently others...might find the reported antics of Michael Hastings, on the weekend in April appalling, reprehensible or otherwise juvenile…for some, it may be considered normal and expected, or at least – within the bounds of “a weekend getaway”.
Who knows…?

With a recognition that this event took place two months prior to the car crash, and recognizing that it was not until May that the NSA-info and subsequent heightening of Michael’s concern/suspicion kicked into overdrive…we cannot take the comments regarding ‘no concern for his life or safety’ as pertinent.

Further – in recalling the incident where he brought shame to his family by insulting another reporter/journalist…and considering the impressions left on ColoradoJens’ friends…it would appear that he did not handle drunkenness, stoning or other such heights very well. Perhaps there were some wires crossed in his psyche…
Again, though – Who knows…?

Both of these wild & flailing incidents, though, apparently stemmed from some kind of blitz (imbibing, smoking, ingesting, etc…)… There may be other (or even – many other) examples of such behavior, that we are unaware of…but, for the moment, we are only aware of instances where said behavior was a by-product of too much something-or-other – and – the toxicology report does not appear to support that too much something-or-other can be blamed for the events of the night in question.

I am entirely reminded of “The Boy Who Cried Wolf”… Don’t know that it is applicable in this case.

Anyway – Back to musing on…Natural Progression (Flow) –or– Flip Flop

reply to post by WanDash


I think at this point I am pretty disappointed in the information these passed few days.

I am now torn between "Stand-Up Guy" and "Punk Kid". I really hate to say that. Damn, I really hate to say that.

However, if this tidbit is true, and he was as "Wild" as is being said, then it is reasonable to understand why his family was seeking rehab for him. It really sounds like he was getting Out Of Control.

I have to be honest here. .. After the Toxicology results were published I had more of a reason to believe that this was most certainly Operator Error. I had even tried to justify the findings by suggesting that the 2 days, which passed after his death, would have been enough time for the drugs to work out of his system. Although, I do still believe to some effect that enzymes and bacteria may have continued to break down the drugs.

Like you, I do Not think that there was enough drugs in his system to have caused the accident.

Cried Wolf? .. .. .. or Cried Helicopter. .. ?

There are several things that I have put a great deal of though into as of late.

One of those being that he thought there was increased helicopter activity over his residence and that it was specifically meant for him. I would call that a definite symptom of paranoia.

Alphabet Soup is a Bunch of Smart @$$ People.

Do you suspect at all that if he in fact was being investigated by any agency that they would have known of his party antics? I am certain they would have. It is those groups that pay Particular Attention to detail even with minor information like how often he trims his finger nails.

And, do you suspect that If they were looking to murder him, they would have tried to take advantage and exploit his weakness? $10-$20 worth of drugs is a hell of allot cheaper than what is being suggested, as it is also Much More Practical than what is being suggested.

Suicide or Accidental Suicide .. .. ?

Could be either. BUT, the lack of a note and the reckless abandon and total disregard for human life leaves me questioning that, .. Seriously.

The wheels keep churning and new information is becoming available fairly regularly now. Unfortunately, it is information that does Not help his credibility as an individual.

With each passing day the fog lifts and things become a little more clear. Eventually, I believe that all of the "Foul Play" theories will end up having less than a leg to stand on.

What is Most Important is the Truth and What really happened.

P.S. . .. Sorry for the lack of participation as of late, I have been working on a short story, which has consumed a great deal of time, for the writing contest that is posted in the Short Stories Forum. Today I have realized that it is Not about ability, but rather Popularity.

Anyways,. .. .. Keep Up the Good Work Wan, I remain optimistic that we will find what we are looking for.

reply to post by ShadellacZumbrum

I understand the let-down.
If you think about it, though, a one-weekend episode does not provide a large-enough sampling to draw conclusions.

Reminds me of a time when I had a case that implicated a number of “too big to fails”…
The attorney/firm I was dealing with brought in the US District Attorney to review what I had put together, and see if he would prosecute.
…to cut a long story down to anecdotal-size – he said – “if the victim isn’t a gleaming white angel – no-one will care”.

We have been conditioned to need heroes.
It seems that we are just as conditioned to need to defrock them.

In this case – Michael Hastings became a candidate for Hero by virtue of the possibility that he pestered The Dark Powers That Be enough that they had to rouse from their royal chambers long enough to…shut him up.

If, instead, he was a hapless victim of his own devices, or if the story remains so unclear that no conclusions can be argued strongly…then…if he was no angel ---- no one will care.

We may be inclined to marginalize or discount his work and accomplishments…in addition to “writing him off” our individual lists of candidates for Hero…upon hearing or finding that he did not wear the shiniest of halos…or because he may have demonstrated some grating, annoying and/or antagonistic personality traits.

But – let’s be honest…
To be good at his profession requires bulldog determination – which, likewise, often requires a willingness to be provocative & instigatory…which may translate to – unpleasant in many people’s books.

He held Hunter S. Thompson in high regard.
It is possible (more like – probable) that the behavior others (normal people) counted unbecoming or unacceptable – he considered…above-normal

reply to post by WanDash


I just wanted to be clear that I don't think less of him, just disappointed.

Hell, most of my heroes have engaged in disappointing activities and ill repute in their time. It is just a way of life.

In my mind I have not discounted the Good he has brought to Investigative Journalism. I am even certain that he has inspired others to follow his tracks, to which I am sure others will.

He definitely can be credited for a certain unpleasantness (Just ask those who were his Targets), but, as you said, sometimes, depending on the line of work, it is required to cut through the Bull S[SNIP]T.

Although You and I may see it Completely Differently, the majority of the populous looks at the news and makes a judgment based on what they believe are the facts, and there in lies the true "Character Assassination".

This is so off-the-wall that it could fit into Short Stories…and even compete with ShaddelacZumbrum ’s The Obsidian Monolith (not very well…but, possibly in a similar genre – being fiction) – and – by the way, Shadellac’ – nice read

…but…back to possibilities.

Are these out there?
You bet!

What about Sorcery/Witchcraft as an explanation for the events of that night?

What if…what we all might count a Classic Fail…was, rather…Total Success? (What if he was looking for another world… … …and…found it…?)

Knowing some of the possible manifestations of “massive delusion”… What if…under the almost-complete-delusion of invincibility…he decided to give the delusion a final(?) test…?

All I am addressing, here…is…there may be more possibilities, than…Republican & Democrat.

Be back.

reply to post by WanDash


Looking for Alternative Explanations are we . .. . .?

At the risk of Never being taken seriously again I am going to throw a little something out there.

When I was a young teenager there was a nice little old lady who lived next door to me. She was a little scary looking. Her teeth were disfigured and pointed in different directions and her hair looked like it had never been washed. She grew up in Louisiana where she spent most of her life and had an extremely strong French accent that made it hard to understand what she was saying most of the time. My mother always referred to her the "Cajun HillBilly" although her name was really Claudine.

She was what she called a "Root Worker". That is someone who practices Hoodoo. If there was still such a thing as the Salem Witch Trials she would more than likely be included with those who were hunted down.

Anyways, Claudine taught me a lot of interesting things about hoodoo.

There are different colors of Hoodoo
White is for protection
Green is for money
Red is for love
And
Black is for death and or revenge

There are also some other colors but I can't remember them all.

Now, here is where it gets a little hairy... .. .

She also taught me some things that might be considered "Spells" but really are not as you don't really say anything, but rather just perform and action.

I am going to give this information, BUT, it is strictly for informational purposes only. This means DO NOT TRY THIS ! ! as there may very well be some truth to it. By the way, it is also important to note that sometimes these things can backfire with severe consequences.

So let's start with some simple things .. .. Like.. .. .
You want someone to suffer from an accident or some other bad event. .. So. . Just sprinkle some Salt on them when their head is turned making sure that the Salt lands on them and remains until the individual moves making the salt fall to the ground.

OR

Let's say someone has come to your house and you never want them to come back. . .. Invite the person/s into your house, leave the room that they are in and take 3 short pieces of string and tie them into knots. When the unwanted guest/s leave, follow them out of the house walking behind them and just as soon as they have crossed the threash hold, Drop the 3 knotted strings onto the ground.

Here is another one that I always found pretty interesting.

When a puppy is winged from the tit, the Very First Time it eats puppy food, If you urinate in the food before you give it to the puppy and then let the puppy eat it. .. The puppy will be permanently attached to you for its entire life. Supposedly, you can take the puppy a thousand miles away and drop it off somewhere and leave it, it will find it's way back to you regardless of where you are.

Here is one more .. . .

If a woman finds a man that she wants to permanently have control of. If, while on her cycle, she adds a little of that mixture to red meat while she is cooking it and then feeds it to him, she will have absolute unlimited control over him. He will latterly Kill, Move Mountains, do whatever it takes to be by her side.

What about Sorcery/Witchcraft as an explanation for the events of that night?

I submit that Michael could have been having an affair with a girl who cooked MEAT for him.

Take that all for what it is worth. I have never tried any of those things because I was scared, Which is why I also never Accepted ANY food or drink that Claudine offered.

I am sure that there is plenty of information that can be found on Google if you want to find more information on this.


P.S. .. . I am glad you found the Short Story to be a Nice Read.

reply to post by ShadellacZumbrum


I thought that surely you would be the first to scoff at the possibilities.
Thanks for proving me wrong!

That's some pretty interesting stuff.
Seems to me, as well, that various government agencies (and - historically - Rulers in general) have sought-out the services of everything from 'soothsayers' to 'Rasputins'...etc...
I recall one of the first "pin me deep in my seat" movies, was a Brian De Palma film starring Amy Irving, Kirk Douglas, Andrew Stevens, Charles Durning, Carrie Snodgress...etc...called "The Fury". The premise was, of course, that the government spied and developed individuals with 'psychic' abilities.
Read "Firestarter" shortly after seeing that movie...and, the theme was similar.

My thoughts on the matter are - there may be Foul Play explanations that could never be proven.

Thanks for not hanging me out to dry...!