In 2009, Ed Snowden said leakers "should be shot." Then he became one

reply to post by neo96


The world has changed quite a bit in the last 4 years. And so did opinions. People are starting to wake up a little bit at a time. If the trend keeps up and people continue to act in accordance with their ethical beliefs the world will become a much better place.

reply to post by neo96


People change...people change their minds, at least if they have anything resembling an open mind.

Reminds me of a pun:

"Yesterday I could not spell Collage Gradiate. Today I are one!"

I am wondering more and more if this guy joined up thinking he was "serving his country", just like many in the armed forces, and quickly came to the conclusion that he was actually serving the ruling elite and corporate America instead?
Far from spying on supposed enemies of the country, he found himself embroiled more and more in surveillance on his fellow Americans who simply disagreed with the government. Not to mention the criminality, lawlessness and zero oversight of the agencies he was representing as they used the vast surveillance apparatus for blackmail to be used for financial and political gain.

Or.... this could all be an elaborate setup to further the cold war needed for the elites as their schemes are falling apart around them? The focus of the mainstream press seems to be wholly on the actions of this man and his "spying" and new traitor status, rather than on the vast government surveillance state that has been built and used illegally against American citizens. They all seem rather quiet on the latter!

No matter what he thought at the time, he is a hero for what he did.

If people cant change, then we are in some serious troubles. Part of our life is a matter of change and to learn from our mistakes.

Also, ES could just be protecting he's ass by stating that and therefore keep nosy agents of he's tail.

I love memes

Ed Snowden passed background checks from the NSA.

These people do not hire anyone with any kind of questionable past. Ed Snowden played the game exactly as he was supposed to and was able to pass as one of them for as long as he wished. Now, it remains to be seen whether or not this is merely the tip of the iceberg and if he has even more damning evidence to share.

He passed polygraphs. The NSA talked to his extended family, friends of his friends. They sifted through old bank statements. They know the date this guy lost his virginity.

If anything, this proves that Ed Snowden has been completely vetted and the NSA deemed him patriotic enough to serve the country. When Ed Snowden decided that the NSA wasn't serving the country, he either made a rash decision and bailed, or he gathered as much as he could, leaked a portion, and has retained enough to keep him alive. And remember, this guy worked for the NSA, he isn't a dummy.

neo,
I have been on this site for about 3 years now. You used to really intimidate me. Now I've CHANGED MY MIND. You read "the blaze" and call yourself knowledgeable????

See, sometimes it takes a newbie a while to learn the 'real' ropes....as so many others have pointed out here. Wow. Yeah, sorry, your credibility is now shot with me, and your gold lining means NOTHING.

Glenn Beck is a hysterical nutcase paranoiac who is doing nothing but MAKING TROUBLE. Anyone who can't see that is blind to what is really going on. Quit leaning on him - he's a loon.

Or don't.
In either case, you're wrong.

You don't like to hear me say that? Tough. I don't like the tripe you spew on this site.
NOW THAT I SEE IT FOR WHAT IT IS.

I've left MANY a job after discovering how it "really works" from the inside. And I've lost respect for people who once seemed honorable (or at least widely respected) once I became disillusioned.
:shk:

Manning and Snowden are both heroes. Jeremy Scahill is as well. Beck is a JOKE.

reply to post by Zcustosmorum

Anyone who is hunted for treason by the US is... a hero? Congratulations! For a site that 'denies ignorance' this might be the most ignorant thing I have ever read. Paranoid and dangerously delusional. Wow.

reply to post by RickFlemming

Says the member who just joined about 7 weeks ago....EDIT: and this is his FIRST POST......
welcome to the real world where deception, lies, and psyops are being EXPOSED. Keep paying attention, RickFlemming. You've more to learn.

Obama and Bush are the ones who should be prosecuted as Traitors, along with Rumsfeld, Cheney, and a host of others. Wake up, friend. It's an ugly truth. The cover has been blown off, at last.
WELCOME TO ATS

It looks like some people suffer from the beaten wife syndrome. They have gotten tortured for so long they actually believe the aggressor had merit in causing all the suffering. Man what is this world coming to?

Originally posted by RickFlemming
reply to post by Zcustosmorum

 

Anyone who is hunted for treason by the US is... a hero? Congratulations! For a site that 'denies ignorance' this might be the most ignorant thing I have ever read. Paranoid and dangerously delusional. Wow.

The only thing wrong with the site is that people like you can flamebait all they want, and people like me have to put up with your dellusional nonsense. Lots of people quit or got banned because they took the bait and the mods punished the wrong person.

This is an alternative site. It should not be pro establishment, it should not even be neutral.

Originally posted by neo96
Note there is some language in that 3 page article that is not too ATS friendly as a reminder.

So this guy is a 'hero' ?

Not seeing it anywhere, and the more that comes out about this guy think far too many people are building him up in their minds to something that he's is not.

This is from another site that cleaned up the language

External quote from www.theblaze.com...

Page 3 of the first link

Yeah that is some 'hero' a hypocritical one.

arstechnica.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

edit on 26-6-2013 by neo96 because: (no reason given)

are you saying that if the person that gives us bad news has their character challenged then the bad news aren't true?

-rrr

This is not surprising, and it does not really say anything important in my opinion. This is because even IF Snowden had already cooked up the idea to do what he did at the time he said this, he would have been saying it simply because he would not want to give anyone the impression that he could act in such a manner. This is just a bit of social engineering from my point of view, and it is something that professional espionage agents use in every single one of their engagements...Even with people they know. Why? Because letting your guard down, for just a second, in such a profession could have serious repercussions.

A professional espionage agent, from my point of view, is usually an agent with diplomatic immunity. Someone who steals secrets like Snowden did, and then simply attempts to sell them, without actually stealing information while employed by another country or agency, is not a professional espionage agent. A professional need not always have diplomatic immunity either, because true espionage should have consequences associated with stealing secrets from another country. Someone with immunity will not be put to death, for instance, and will probably not even be imprisoned. They will be exchanged or returned to their country. An immune spy is someone who has an official position within the government, usually working out of an embassy in a foreign country.

Its a bit suprising that neo96 is usually antigovernment in most regards, wants the smallest possible government, is pro guns, but when it comes to fighting corruption he starts making exceptions here and there. Sure on paper russia and china are enemies, but they are not taking away our freedoms, the politicians in washington are doing that.

If you have to go to china, russia, the moon, pluto to get the message out, then that is what you will do. Russia and china have nukes, biological weapons, chemical weapons, exotic weapons, you name it. Snowden did not give secrets out to the governments, he spoke TO THE MEDIA in hong kong, which gave him immunity from prosecution because DUH its outside usa jurisdiction. Lets do the math and stop acting retarded!!

Opinions change over time, especially as you're exposed to new, more controversial, programs. Just look at President Obama's claimed he was going to end President Bush's enhanced interrogation tactics before he got into office. Since then he has done just the opposite, most likely (and hopefully), because he was confronted with either it's high success and/or deterrent rate.

Originally posted by neo96
I love how people are making excuses for Snowden.

He said what he said.

it's not making up an excuse. I put myself in his shoes because I used to think conspiracy theorist were crazy and should be thrown in a psychiatric ward.

^ A display of Ignorance for not knowing facts.

3 years later here I am knowing alot of stuff that probably not even you know. I used to have a friend from canada, he gave me access to a few websites that are in Tor. If you knew what those sites actually were, you would have been shocked.

With that in mind, what edward snowden revealed in the end isn't news for me.

Point however, like someone said, opinions change, mine did. Am I a hipocrite for changing my mind from ignorance to actually being educated?

Be thankful that a CIA came out, most of them would never leak anything out even if they felt what they knew was wrong.

reply to post by neo96


Who cares about Snowden? Has anyone here considered the implications of the information he leaked? Or have they just wondered and debated over whether or not Snowden should be shot?

God damnit America, pull your violent Neanderthal head out of your ass before it gets too late & someone else has to do it for you. Your country is falling into a slippery and dangerous hole rapidly before your eyes - and you fools are fighting over the internet about who you think deserves to die.

Sorry to burst your bubble U.S.A. - but there are much more important things to concern yourself with presently. And if you don't get your act together soon, then Snowden and your little whistleblower celebrity witch hunt will amount to nothing, as such senseless controversies always do, and you'll be left with only the collateral ash of your once proud nation. You'll feel pretty stupid then when it's you or your loved ones that are forced to face a firing squad - be it foreign or domestic. Both are equally at danger of becoming a haunting reality, and both are intrinsically fatal to yourself.

So let the meatheads decide what they do to Snowden. You guys should focus on what you're gonna do if these outrageous fascist operations get the social foothold they're searching for. You're only playing into evil men's hands by even concerning yourself with the fate of men like Snowden.

And all that being said - I personally don't like the guy much either. But I certainly am not arrogant, obnoxious or primitive enough to suggest he be shot. I hope you guys think long and hard about these words. Because if you don't, we're all gonna pay the price - including me. And that sucks.

Peace. What will be will be. Focus on the present moment & what you can do about it. Snowden is not your concern. Seeking knowledge & taking action should be your priorities now. The charade of nationalistic paranoia and inflated pride is only going to accelerate your people's decline. Think about that before you pursue such petty vendettas against men you've never met, and whose crimes are about as real as the establishment they "betrayed" - the house of cards in the open wind that you've come to call your "government". You cannot betray that which has no loyalty to you. The System is hunting Snowden because he's an Enemy of the State and a threat to their very powerful illusion of authoritarian superiority. Not because they want to protect you and your kids.

If you posed a threat to the stability of the house of cards in the wind, you'd be targeted with the same paranoid venom as Snowden & Assange & their kin have been. And now you must ask yourself... what exactly does your trusted government consider a threat to the stability of their house of cards?

The answer seems to be just about anything these days - and that's what your security agencies are looking for now. Anything, on anyone, for any reason, at any time, with any motive/agenda they please.

Oh how glorious it is to be free!... to obey the System at all times at any cost.

Goodluck Snowden. You're gonna need it you poor bastard!

reply to post by TheAnarchist


I concern myself with Snowden and Manning, not for their sakes.. because let's face it.. they're screwed, but for the next Snowden or Manning. I want these folks to know that I am here. I support what you are doing for our rights in my name, and I am trying to make it mean something.

These guys can either die for something, or die for nothing, but I don't think many people have actually read the end of 1984.

He loved Big Brother, guys. He -loved- him.

Originally posted by RickFlemming
reply to post by Zcustosmorum

 

Anyone who is hunted for treason by the US is... a hero? Congratulations! For a site that 'denies ignorance' this might be the most ignorant thing I have ever read. Paranoid and dangerously delusional. Wow.

Has it been anywhere stated that Ed Snowden has been charged with treason?

Please note: From the Washington Post - This is also for the edification/clarification of the rest of the participants in this thread.

U.S. charges Snowden with espionage NOT treason. There is a fundamental distinction between them.
By Peter Finn and Sari Horwitz,June 21, 2013
U.S. defense contractor Edward Snowden discusses his motivation behind…

Partial text from the article:
[Federal prosecutors have filed a criminal complaint against Edward Snowden, the former National Security Agency contractor who leaked a trove of documents about top-secret surveillance programs, and the United States has asked Hong Kong to detain him on a provisional arrest warrant, according to U.S. officials.

Snowden was charged with theft, “unauthorized communication of national defense information” and “willful communication of classified communications intelligence information to an unauthorized person,” according to the complaint. The last two charges were brought under the 1917 Espionage Act.

The complaint, which initially was sealed, was filed in the Eastern District of Virginia, a jurisdiction where Snowden’s former employer, Booz Allen Hamilton, is headquartered and a district with a long track record of prosecuting cases with national security implications. After The Washington Post reported the charges, senior administration officials said late Friday that the Justice Department was barraged with calls from lawmakers and reporters and decided to unseal the criminal complaint.

Why does anyone care about Snowden?

You should probably focus on the actual information he leaked.