In 2009, Ed Snowden said leakers "should be shot." Then he became one

reply to post by neo96


You talk about all these people who have made him
a "hero" saying this and that. But you also fall into the
same boat because you, from day one, have been looking
for excuses to run the man down. Basically, your mind is made
up, so, that makes you just as bad as the people you hate for
calling him a hero.

You keep on mentioning that we have been spying for years.
So, does that make it right?


Some people are so conditioned with patrioism, that they forget
the terrible things their governments do very easily.

reply to post by Jay-morris

You talk about all these people who have made him a "hero" saying this and that. But you also fall into the same boat because you, from day one, have been looking for excuses to run the man down. Basically, your mind is made up, so, that makes you just as bad as the people you hate for calling him a hero.

Snowden did that all by his lonesome.

You keep on mentioning that we have been spying for years. So, does that make it right?

Already asked and answered a half a dozen times not going to repeat it for yet another page.

Some people are so conditioned with patrioism, that they forget the terrible things their governments do very easily.

Yet once more no they haven't forgotten.

Obama is running scared on this. He's in a real bind and will never seek ES's arrest and trial because if he does they will have to risk exposure of their criminal surveillance state. Obama is in a further bind because he is hopelessly humiliated by many national leaders throughout the world and there isn't a thing he can do about it. American bullying, incompetence, and spying have been revealed for all to see. What is most significant about ES's revelations is that they PROVE what most of us have suspected all along and now there remains NO possibility for plausible deniability.

reply to post by neo96


Sorry, but you had a hatred for him from the start. Nothing
was going to change your mind. So, what you say is pretty much
pointless because you can only look at it from one side. Funny
thing is, your moaning at people on this thread for doing exactly
the same thing, in your eyes.

Governments will be the death of us all. They do things like this, start
pointless wars, and put our lives in danger all the time. We need more
people to come out with things like this.

Yes, you will always get the conditioned patriots against it.
Man! Governments love the conditioned patriots. So easy
to control!

I just cannot belive that some people still think you can vote your way out of this. What reality are some people living in cause it is not the same as the rest of us!

reply to post by Rocker2013


Did you see the hit piece on Glenn Greenwald too? It's so obvious what these fascists are doing, and it's sickening.

Glenn's response to the hit piece

reply to post by Jay-morris

Sorry, but you had a hatred for him from the start. Nothing was going to change your mind. So, what you say is pretty much pointless because you can only look at it from one side. Funny thing is, your moaning at people on this thread for doing exactly the same thing, in your eyes.

Open my eyes to what?

Government spying ?

Christ already that is not 'news'.

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by Jay-morris

 

Sorry, but you had a hatred for him from the start. Nothing was going to change your mind. So, what you say is pretty much pointless because you can only look at it from one side. Funny thing is, your moaning at people on this thread for doing exactly the same thing, in your eyes.

Open my eyes to what?

Government spying ?

Christ already that is not 'news'.

What ES revealed and proved to all was the existence of an all pervasive surveillance state and the manner of its totalitarian operation. That is the biggest news of the decade. It's so big that the entire world is very concerned about it and American credibility along with its reputation are at stake as never before.

You say it's not news.........I say it's very big news indeed.

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by Jay-morris

 

Sorry, but you had a hatred for him from the start. Nothing was going to change your mind. So, what you say is pretty much pointless because you can only look at it from one side. Funny thing is, your moaning at people on this thread for doing exactly the same thing, in your eyes.

Open my eyes to what?

Government spying ?

Christ already that is not 'news'.

What ES revealed was the true extent of NSA spying on ALL Americans as well as the rest of the world. Ed Snowden proved the existence of an all pervasive surveillance state run by the NSA, and the manner of its totalitarian operation. That is the biggest news of the decade. It's so big that the entire world is very concerned about it and American credibility along with its reputation are at stake as never before.

You say it's not news.........I say it's very big news indeed.

reply to post by Guadeloupe

What ES revealed and proved to all was the existence of an all pervasive surveillance state and the manner of its totalitarian operation. That is the biggest news of the decade. It's so big that the entire world is very concerned about it and American credibility along with its reputation are at stake as never before. You say it's not news.........I say it's very big news indeed. signature:

Not so much for those of us who grew up in the era of keyhole satellites, and tracking cookies on the net and Echelon.

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by Guadeloupe

 

What ES revealed was the true extent of NSA spying on ALL Americans as well as the rest of the world. Ed Snowden proved the existence of an all pervasive surveillance state run by the NSA, and the manner of its totalitarian operation. That is the biggest news of the decade. It's so big that the entire world is very concerned about it and American credibility along with its reputation are at stake as never before.

You say it's not news.........I say it's very big news indeed.

edit on 27-6-2013 by Guadeloupe because: (no reason given)

Not so much for those of us who grew up in the era of keyhole satellites, and tracking cookies on the net and Echelon.

edit on 27-6-2013 by neo96 because: (no reason given)

Your response does not make sense .......please elaborate.

reply to post by Guadeloupe


Elaborate this:

Not so much for those of us who grew up in the era of keyhole satellites, and tracking cookies on the net and Echelon.

What ES revealed was the true extent of NSA spying on ALL Americans as well as the rest of the world. Ed Snowden proved the existence of an all pervasive surveillance state run by the NSA, and the manner of its totalitarian operation.

Snowden didn't reveal anything that wasn't already common knowledge how many times do that have to be repeated.


Keyhole satelittes big 'news'
Internet tracking cookies big 'news'
Echelon monitoring all communications traffic big 'news'.

One last time telling people something they alreadfy know is not 'the biggest news of the decade'.

That would be Kanye and the Kardashian's etc.

reply to post by neo96

In 2009, Ed Snowden said leakers "should be shot." Then he

saw just how corrupt the government truly is...

with new information comes a new mindset..

Originally posted by reeferman
reply to post by neo96

 

In 2009, Ed Snowden said leakers "should be shot." Then he

saw just how corrupt the government truly is...

with new information comes a new mindset..

Actually no because government always out does itself with the 'next big news' has already been made just not reported yet.

Snowdon is a manufactured phenomenon. It's not that he revealed anything significantly new. It's just that the media have chosen to focus on him to embarrass President Obama.

The real question is why.

There is no question that the media has turned on Obama. Obamacare rang some chimes in the wrong places and has been fought tooth and nail. Then there was Benghazigate. Who orchestrated that fiasco? Nobody is that incompetent, except on purpose. Now there is Snowdon telling us stuff we already know, but with a difference.

The media is really puffing his story up.

We have known about programs like Echelon for years. There have been other NSA whistleblowers who, it seems, nobody will report on but Russia Today.

What's up? Why is this guy different?

Is it that he is somebody that Obama's demographic, among whites, can relate to and identify with? In that sense is he a human guided missile aimed at Obama's support?

I think there is something to that. There must be. The NSA doesn't give a rat's fanny about your emails and couldn't possibly read them all if it did.

The story is not Snowdon. It's Obama.

If your aim was to A-word the President, knock his policies to kingdom come, institute martial law in America, bomb Syria and keep Hillary Clinton from becoming President, I cannot think of a more propitious time to do it than the present.

There is speculation that Obama's endorsement of Hillary Clinton for 2016 sounded a sour note in the ears of one Vice President of the United States. The Ready For Hillary Super PAC is gathering momentum with only some 900 days to go before the next election. There are no Republican contenders thought to be in the appropriate weight class for 2016.

You are an oligarch. You and your friends are not happy with the President. What do you need in order to "get rid of him", as Lyndon Johnson once said of a Texas agricultural official later murdered?

1. You need a compliant Vice President.

2. You need to avoid the kind of investigations that followed the assassination of JFK. You do that by alienating support for the President by orchestrating events that make him look incompetent or even worse, malevolent.

3. If you really want martial law, you need a segment of the society, a minority, guaranteed to go berserk nationwide if anything happens to him.

4. You need a President, in office, on your side, who can run in 2016.

Remember Colombia, when the Secret Service went on a hooker holiday just before the President was due to arrive "in country". Was that really just a little raunchy RnR?

Can this be seriously happening? I certainly hope not, but this sort of thing has happened before.

Originally posted by ipsedixit
Snowdon is a manufactured phenomenon. It's not that he revealed anything significantly new. It's just that the media have chosen to focus on him to embarrass President Obama.

The real question is why.

There is no question that the media has turned on Obama. Obamacare rang some chimes in the wrong places and has been fought tooth and nail. Then there was Benghazigate. Who orchestrated that fiasco? Nobody is that incompetent, except on purpose. Now there is Snowdon telling us stuff we already know, but with a difference.

The media is really puffing his story up.

We have known about programs like Echelon for years. There have been other NSA whistleblowers who, it seems, nobody will report on but Russia Today.

What's up? Why is this guy different?

Everybody knows about Echelon? Really? My mother doesn't know about Echelon but she sure as hell knows about Snowden, she knows about the surveillance. How about your mother or your neighbour or the checkout chick at your local supermarket? Do a survey of 'regular' people and I guarantee you they will only vaguely have heard of Echelon but know about Snowden and they'll know about PRISM.

And that is why Snowden is different.

This is only about Obama in so far as he is ultimately responsible for allowing PRISM to run.

Snowden is part of a larger movement who call themselves Cypherpunks.

Here's a definition:

A cypherpunk is an activist advocating widespread use of strong cryptography as a route to social and political change. Originally communicating through the Cypherpunks electronic mailing list, informal groups aimed to achieve privacy and security through proactive use of cryptography. Cypherpunks have been engaged in an active movement since the late 1980s.

Cypherpunk - Wikipedia

This is their fight and, indeed, the fight of every citizen who values their privacy. To label it as anything else is flagrantly factually incorrect.

reply to post by Archie

I'm not questioning the validity of cypherpunks or any movement to resist surveillance. Such movements are undoubtedly valid and good. In the present situation, overall, they are a lot like the Arab Spring. They are available for manipulation.

You could never convince a Libyan who believed in the Arab Spring that strings were being pulled in the United States to gain control of Libya's oil resources by using dupes to overthrow the person protecting those resources.

The Arab Spring continues to be a valid expression of Arab aspirations. But there is more going on. I think the Snowdon situation is analogous.

It's very ominous too because there have been a couple of other prominent NSA whistleblowers recently, whose warnings about the surveillance situation have gone almost unreported.

The media cooperated in 9/11, not asking pertinent questions and mouthing official statements about what happened. Suddenly Snowdon is getting lots of press, from the controlled media, where other NSA whistleblowers of the recent past did not.

It is very suspicious to me, how this is unfolding, on top of all the other suspicious negativities that have gathered around the President at the time of his re-election and during his second term.

Originally posted by ipsedixit
reply to post by Archie

 

You could never convince a Libyan who believed in the Arab Spring that strings were being pulled in the United States to gain control of Libya's oil resources by using dupes to overthrow the person protecting those resources.

I completely agree and this is a really good point but I think you have to be careful in making that analogy. I don't believe that this is a 'front' for anything. It is giving the people some of the information they need to overthrow the government but, when the time comes, I don't think those same people would be stupid enough to elect an alternative government that wasn't going to be in America's best interests or that would usurp her sovereignty. Although it would be truly ironic if that did happen.

reply to post by neo96


It's called infiltration. You gotta let the bad guys think you're on their side if you ever expect them to accept you. I'm sure he suspected they were listening, but could pretend that he was speaking candidly and somewhat anonymously.

It's just a possibility... I'm just saying, you don't know how long he'd been planning this. Chat logs cannot be proven to be the genuine thoughts of the person typing. Some people just want to fit in, others just want to argue...others may be purposely covering their tracks by spreading disinfo, and then others have their own agenda for saying what they say online.