Pythagorean Hylozoics

reply to post by Raxoxane


What I meant was within hylozoics there is no transmigration from a higher kingdom to a lower (as far as I know).

I was NOT making a statement of either my OWN beliefs, OR a statement of Truth (capital T), but just what hylozoics seems to say (to this point in my study of it).

reply to post by nimrod20032003


my bad, im pretty sure i read that in blavatsky's masterworks, still something i am suspicious of when i come across, even though im nowhere near devoutly religious or anything.

....aaaaand now he's banned.

Although OP has been banned without an explanation, I think we still can carry on this topic OP left us, for there are really lots of gems to discover in Pythagorean Hylozoics, whose new presentation is provided by Laurency who wrote,

"It has been my endeavour to formulate a world view that could be accepted as a working hypothesis by scientists and philosophers...
It has been my wish to give people a world view and a life view that accords with reality and can be comprehended even by a very mediocre mind; a working hypothesis that they could agree on and, if accepted, would make the individual, even without his knowing it, an aspirant to discipleship. That would put an end to the division and multitude of occult sects.
If the foundation has once been laid by the formulation of an exact mental system, this makes it immensely easier for a student to assimilate new facts and axioms. Then facts and axioms automatically fall into their right contexts. It is the same with esoterics as with other disciplines. The solid foundation is the first and foremost thing. Hylozoics alone affords that foundation. This will be no building erected on the sand.

As we all see, someone has already used that mental system, and succeed in arousing ripples here the other day. Personally, there is no point not giving it a try, since we're always consciously or unconsciously looking for a better working hypothesis, which can be dissolved and rebuilt along the way of seeking.

At least, We should "keep the faith" in our own heart, which guides us toward peace, love.and light.

It has been my wish to give people a world view and a life view that accords with reality and can be comprehended even by a very mediocre mind; a working hypothesis that they could agree on and, if accepted, would make the individual, even without his knowing it, an aspirant to discipleship.

Auto-indoctrination! Ooooo, just think of all the applications!

Still, good luck trying to crack universal appeal, even for those with "mediocre minds", and even if that "mediocrity" is deliberately manufactured.

Still, good luck trying to crack universal appeal, even for those with "mediocre minds", and even if that "mediocrity" is deliberately manufactured.



Just my thoughts…. Okay so I’m no expert on anything, other than a limited knowledge on the fact that I exist, I believe? and my, possibly simplistic view on this subject is that it encourages personal growth through positivity and a deeper understanding of the perceptions surrounding each of our experiences of reality and through that, a more informed view of our existence, as a premise, to yet view further and possibly dissect realms or ideas we have not, yet been able to comprehend.
All based on a theoretical method of pursuing understanding, on this premise I see a lot of investigation is needed, but based on the idea that positivity is a reality to follow to ignite unity ,so our learnt negativity does not totally destroy us is surely a subject worthy of greater debate?

Originally posted by dshly
Since i dont know much about the topic i just checked the words:
HYLO- : wood , matter
dictionary.reference.com...
-ZOI: life
www.greek-names.info...

This may seem the very basics but it gives briefly an idea on what is about: so, it is about that: matter is alive.

If this is true - matter is alive - it may go a long way toward unifying religion and science via evolution.

If the basic unit of matter (sub-quantum) is a decision-point (for wont of a better term), then increasingly sophisticated aggregations of these "switches" could at least simulate intelligence analagous to how a increasingly complex aggregations of the simple on/off (binary) switch leads to the computer and increasingly sophisticated software programs.

So evolution from "dumb" elements proceeds (seemingly) intelligently rather than purely at random because the elements are not truly dumb, i.e. intelligent design, except the intelligence is from within rather than from without.

This also would (help) explain the quantum leaps in intelligence/capability/organization that occurs in "self-organizing systems", see: en.wikipedia.org... how the simple combination of hydrogen and oxygen (and energy) creates something with entirely new/different properties from either of it's "parents": water, and etc.

"God is that in which we live, move and have our being."

...I definitely believe matter is alive, at least in some capacity... responsive maybe? After watching the water crystals thing on 'what the bleep do we know'.

I also think theres something to this, though i'm not completely sure what. I do know though that regardless of religion, right is right and wrong is wrong... we all know the difference. Nothing bad about promoting that. I'm sure it's good for the soul.

Originally posted by snakeoiladdict

Hell, maybe even thorforwinds' pop unwittingly contributed to it.

Who can say?

From the Ra Materials:

The Law of One Search Results for ‘Oahspe’

14.28 Questioner: Can you tell me who was responsible for transmitting the book Oahspe?

Ra: I am Ra. This was transmitted by one of Confederation social memory complex status whose idea, as offered to the Council, was to use some of the known physical history of the so-called religions or religious distortions of your cycle in order to veil and partially unveil aspects or primal distortions of the Law of One.

All names can be taken to be created for their vibrational characteristics.

The information buried within has to do with a deeper understanding of love and light, and the attempts of infinite intelligence through many messengers to teach/learn those entities of your sphere.


17.31 Questioner: Thank you very much. I don’t wish to take up extra time by asking questions over again. Some are so important I try to ask some similar questions in different ways to expand on the answer. Seems to be [inaudible] what we’re getting at, maybe not.



In the book Oahspe it states that if an individual is more than fifty percent for others— that is, goes over the 50% service to others, and is less than fifty percent for service to self, then he is harvestable. Is this a correct statement?

Ra: I am Ra. This is correct if the harvesting is to be for the positive fourth dimensional level.


[color=magenta]Peace Love Light
tfw [color=magenta]Liberty & Equality or Revolution

Great thread.

Just posting a reply so it will go in my subscription list, since there is not one at the top.

I see the OP member got banned again.

You think these people would have the courtesy to get banned after they have explained there theorems. But no. So extremely rude.

reply to post by nimrod20032003


So, just out of interest, what is your take on Pythagorean Hylozoics as a concept, I’m learning to but would be interesting to get a grasp on a different perspective, all i can see is a positive approach to existence?

reply to post by thorfourwinds

Ra is full of # dude. Social memory complexes are tricky things, that is! They all give you different answers depending on who within you specifically invoke and ask. For instance Rah will tell you something else then Ra would he may even tell you that its 87.1252%, and if you invoke Reh or Roh or Ro there answers may be something completely different again.

But if Ra is right and its 50% I may have to start doing some really bad stuff. The way I keep going I just may reach 20% by the end of this century in helping my fellow man..Oh and woman. No offense but being harvested does not sound like it would be all that pleasant or good, sounds like you would be alien food. dum dum dum...

reply to post by Fingle

I could totally tell you, I read like a few paragraphs of that stuff. But its supper secret you have to be at least a level 33 wizard and most knowledgeable in knowledge stuff.

However I am just here to inform you that the OP got banned. Which he so rudely did before explaining anything of what the hell he was talking about, or his ideas on it. I could totally say something about Pythagorean Hylozoics to him but, rude people who make rude threads don't deserve to be knowledged up on it. Whats the point of this thread anyways? Why the hell am I even here. Not a question.

reply to post by galadofwarthethird

Ra is full of # dude. Social memory complexes are tricky things, that is! They all give you different answers depending on who within you specifically invoke and ask. For instance Rah will tell you something else then Ra would he may even tell you that its 87.1252%, and if you invoke Reh or Roh or Ro there answers may be something completely different again.

Not really. After reading through Ra materials for at least three times, I think what Ra said is coherent. What I see from these words you said are your entangled thoughts. They all give us different answers, because of their different levels of evolution/development. How can you demand students of different levels, such as middle school, high school, or university say the same thing to a child in primary school who asked some questions? The same thing comes when a professor answers to students of different grade level.
In Ra materials, there're some metaphors or ambiguities under the law of confusion/freewill, in order to protect our freewill, which is of most importance (if you don't know why, you may ask), and there're also some errors, but they in no way intentionally do this:

18.1 Questioner: I was thinking last night that if I were in the place of Ra at this time, the first distortion of the Law of One might cause me to mix some erroneous data with the true information that I was transmitting to this group. Do you do this?
Ra: I am Ra. We do not intentionally do this. However, there will be confusion. The errors which have occurred have occurred due to the occasional variation in the vibrational complex of this instrument due to its ingestion of a chemical substance. It is not our intent in this particular project to create erroneous information but to express in the confining ambiance of your language system the feeling of the infinite mystery of the one creation in its infinite and intelligent unity.

But if Ra is right and its 50% I may have to start doing some really bad stuff. The way I keep going I just may reach 20% by the end of this century in helping my fellow man..Oh and woman. No offense but being harvested does not sound like it would be all that pleasant or good, sounds like you would be alien food. dum dum dum...

I'm not surprised you said that, for your perspective of utilitarianism, and you may not understand what 50% really means. This idea is not originated by Ra, it was said by Don (questioner) firstly, and it's from Oahspe.

17.31 Questioner:
In the book Oahspe it states that if an individual is more than fifty percent for others— that is, goes over the 50% service to others, and is less than fifty percent for service to self, then he is harvestable. Is this a correct statement?
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct if the harvesting is to be for the positive fourth dimensional level.

It's not the effects that really matters, but the cause, which almost depends on our own intentions, so It's not that hard as you thought. What we do need to understand is why Ra answered that 50% is correct.
IMHO, 50% just means mutual benefit & reciprocity, maximum of common interests, or a positive-sum game, in which we can cooperate as one harmonious society, and then become a social memory complex.

reply to post by Oness

Not really. After reading through Ra materials for at least three times, I think what Ra said is coherent. What I see from these words you said are your entangled thoughts. They all give us different answers, because of their different levels of evolution/development. How can you demand students of different levels, such as middle school, high school, or university say the same thing to a child in primary school who asked some questions? The same thing comes when a professor answers to students of different grade level.

Oh what RA said is coherent. RA however is entitled to his opinion.

In Ra materials, there're some metaphors or ambiguities under the law of confusion/freewill, in order to protect our freewill, which is of most importance (if you don't know why, you may ask), and there're also some errors, but they in no way intentionally do this:

Deliberate the error you speak of to me. Confusion is the prerequisite to free will in the long run, but everybody has free will even those under the law of confusion. They merely just confused about it, they chose there path freely. Its a tangled ride, and it runs its course, but it to will run on end.

I'm not surprised you said that, for your perspective of utilitarianism, and you may not understand what 50% really means. This idea is not originated by Ra, it was said by Don (questioner) firstly, and it's from Oahspe.

The concept is misguided. the whole service to others as well does not translate well into the way people are going on about it. There are many nuance which will grind and over time leave cracks in the whole the size of the grand canyon. In fact its nothing new, its been put in practice before with disastrous consequences.

It's not the effects that really matters, but the cause, which almost depends on our own intentions, so It's not that hard as you thought. What we do need to understand is why Ra answered that 50% is correct. IMHO, 50% just means mutual benefit & reciprocity, maximum of common interests, or a positive-sum game, in which we can cooperate as one harmonious society, and then become a social memory complex.

f
50% is permissible, even right. But what you say about that its not the effects that matter but the cause is plain unsanity. Every hear of the phrase the road to hell is paved with good intentions? RA may be entitled to his opinion, however his opinion that everyone wants to become a social memory complex, or that its such a great thing is merely an opinion.

RA is merely a cog in a machine, he holds nothing beyond that machine. And if he has to always and constantly always remind himself of what he is, well that is just annoying. Maybe one day he just may forget he is RA and succumb to the borg collective. A cell in a body no matter how important is still guided by the whole of the body, individuality has very little say in such a structure. Yet as a whole its very effective. Its just a matter and question of effective for what?

The Deep Mysteries are worth exploring to those daring few who can not help to do otherwise. No matter how many times we turn away, from either doubt, fear, or bouts of lunacy even, the call to The Path never ceases.

In MY life, and I speak of this short one I'm living now for 35 years, an on-and-off again study of The Wisdom Tranditions has taken me through Heaven and Hell (though everyone can relate to this statement, I'm sure), but no matter how far I think I set myself back, or how much time I feel I've wasted, when I earnestly return, with renewed Faith and Fear, I see I've gained ground, even if just a half step.

Nothing has been more grounding to this apparently unstable person that I can be, than an honest and thoughtful approach to 'Esoterics', no matter what I've called it in the past.

And this long pursuit--long for me at but 15 years since a first 'awakening' in this life (who knows how long, REALLY, not I) is yielding fruits that I've only read about and long sought for some time: A Balanced Mind, Grounded and Mindful living, a Compassionate and Inclusive Heart, and a Vision of Unity that overwhelms me now.

I started a babe, then a child, then a boy who found God through Jesus; a teenager who cursed the Holy Trinity; and then a young man, agnostic who pleaded to The Heavens, "God! Whoever!, IF there be ANYONE OUT THERE, PLEASE ... Let Me KNOW WHAT THIS IS ALL ABOUT!!!" ...

... a man struck with a 'Quickening' that frightened Family and Friends, drugged by the Docs, consoled by the Mystics, deepened through Hindu Saints, Grounded by Buddha, confused and intrigued by Blavatsky, educated through Hermetics (any of this sound familiar?) ...



In Hylozoics I hit MY end, and turned away, overwhelmed by it's Infinite Depth ...

But, WOW! It RESONATED stronger than anything, especially the number system; and the terms were all right, but I didn't get far. The Aspirant turned his back... for some years.

Why? I have 'suspicions' ...


Have you ever been a Christian? Have you felt the Presence of The Holy Spirit? (I relate the following feeling through Christianity, but you may know it by a different name, it doesn't mater, the feeling is the same)
You know this feeling-- when you have an overwhelming one-pointed Thought of the Love and Power of GOD, and start to get a chill, and that 'pins and needles' feeling; you want to cry, you want to dance and sing, but mostly (I) want to cry. I don't know WHAT it is, and I don't care what Laurency or anyone might call it, but what I know is that since my return to The Path and renewal of my Faith, I feel it ANYTIME and EVERYTIME I turn my thoughts toward the Goodness of Life, having Faith that I have allied my Self with the Right in This World. I do it all day, and dwell there as long as I want. There's more going on too, but nothing as important as the Feeling I get and the CLARITY I have gained, perhaps re-gained (perhaps gifted!).

I've never been lifted up so, and it feels Fantastic.

But it's not because I'm a 'student' of Hylozoics or Theosophy, or anything, but because I took and dusted off the Gems I've found in ALL my searches, keeping only those that came clean and that reflect Purely, the Light From Above. For ME, within HYLOZOICS, I've found a place, My 'Everbecomming' Temple for where to set My True Gems, all together reflecting in a way that has Illumined THE PATH, and I can 'almost' see clearly My Place In This World. Almost.

The Mysteries remain, but I feel I've The Key, and as I rearrange my Gems, at Will, in My Own Personal Temple, the Glyphs of Old come alive with color, and little by little, in wondrous ways, tell me the stories of All Time.

So I thank Laurency, The Initiates of all times, creeds and globes, and I thank The HIGHEST OF HIGHS for bringing me into BEING.

I believe we'll all find Our Own Personal WAY, and yours may take you to the Pledieas! You may hear the very Voice of RA!


I pray that on Your journeys, whether you are At Rest In The Kingdom already, or still feel like a young person who's just glimpsed a flicker of a Ray of Truth in some far off direction; I PRAY that you take TRUTH ALONE with you. Seek and find Those Glorious Illuminating Gems of Truth that which, only after an thorough examination, honestly weighing them up, with Patience and mindfulness, against your heart of hearts; take the Gems that do not crumble to dust, but those that stand the test and shine your Perfected Inner Reflection back at YOU.

GUARD YOU MIND FROM DECEPTION! (selfishness MIGHT not be Natural, but MAY just be a painful Illusion we HAVE to, and I believe CAN overcome.)

God Bless,



















or I could just be a manic-depressive

First and foremost, let me just say that it really is a shame that the OP was ([relatively] recently) banned - and this especially so now that I have arrived. ...Perhaps I should introduce myself and make this particular comment here relevant to this discussion.

To begin with, you can call me either Fr. T.E.U. or Fr. E.S.Q.S - Fr. E.S.Q.S. is more up to date, however; nice to meet you. I made this account on ATS a while back but ended up never putting it to any real use as I am a bit reticent to be perfectly honest, that is unless I happen find a topic of particular interest to me. On that point, it would also have to be particularly interesting to me - offering some sort of opportunity for real discussion - or else I would not bother with it in the first place as I am, equally, wary of engaging the conspiracy-theorist community. My experiences with conspiracy-theorist types has never been particularly good, you might imagine (and this especially so the moment they learn I am involved in the Occult and Esoteric); sometimes it seems they would sooner burn me at the stake than listen to anything I might have to say.

I am, myself, a life-long student of the Occult and Esoteric and have been involved in the Occult and Esoteric ever since my youth in fact. I will, of course, be kind enough to spare you all the details of my rather unexciting autobiography and get right to the pertinent point here. I have been studying PH, as presented by HTL (alongside other work), for approximately six years on and off (I was in university at the time I discovered it), and then about a year or so intensively with the intent of doing six more years - totalling seven - and culminating around the age of thirty-five. I intend to, effectively, master the system; to be a True Hylozoician - I will certainly not be one of those people who read (if we can even call it that) a single book on, say, Alchemy, and then go around calling themselves an Alchemist. We have enough of those sorts of people already - they are a dime-a-dozen and you can even have your pick; Alchemists, Hermeticists, Kabbalists (ad inf./ad naus.). Thus, the point that I am getting at is as follows:

The OP sought a discussion - was hoping that perhaps, some find day, someone would come along and discuss PH. Well, that day has come and that someone has arrived if anyone cares to avail themselves of the opportunity. Pity the OP is gone, but that does not mean that everyone else who had an interest in such matters should suffer unnecessary darkness.

With that, I do have a few points I would like people to keep in mind:

1. Though I am studied in PH, I am nowhere near being a master of the system; I have no doubt that it will take a good six years more or so of intensive study to achieve that. Much like the OP, I am still learning although I am more than likely further along in my studies than the OP not only in terms of PH but also given the fact of my overall interest in the Occult and Esoteric in general.

2. I have the tendency to piss people off by the way that I write (I call my response "compositions" actually), so please be mindful of that - more often then not, I am - not - intending to offend anyone however much people will likely take it that way. In any case, I follow a more stoic line and consider that it is not my problem whether you take offense at my writing; I will - not - make apologies for hurt feelings. To those who would be critical: I am fine with criticism, in so far as it is fair and constructive; anything else is just being rude.

3. I would prefer that we proceed in a question/answer format - I most certainly will not be attempting to explain the whole of PH in a single post, if that is what people are hoping for. Thus, if you have a question (or more) just ask and perhaps we can get this ball rolling.

...

Alas, I find that my concentration is waning and so now would be a good time to end this composition. I do not know when I will be able to respond, as I am quite busy most days, but I will do my best as I get the time.

Thanks for your time,

Sincerely,

Fr. E.S.Q.S. - Fr. T.E.U.

Welcome, Fr.

"Are you sure you want to 'go there?'" -- An honest question for your refection.

In Truth, I'm glad you're here. I felt sorry for the OP, but I KNOW he will find his answers in due time.

"Do what thou wilt! ..." but tread ever so carefully. And expect you!-- the 'would-be-teacher', to be corrected, and get 'learned' here, and 'there.' And KNOW that your enemies are lurking here.

If I could I would delete my post above yours, as so much has 'changed', or rather, 'evolved' in my Being-- My Temple -- since MY last post (even in such a short time, but I am 35 years old ...

(mods, please, if you so choose, delete my first post to this site, right there above ^)

Blessings, Brother Fr.

(p.s. I tried to send you a U2U here, but I haven't the capabilities, yet. Consider sent by other means --- that's a joke, you sillies ... but really, Fr. THINK about this. You don't have to do it.)

@HenryBowen:

Nearly twenty-four hours has passed since I last wrote anything here, and yet it seems that you hold the only reply Brother. On that point, let me just take a moment to apologize for making you wait so long for a response - however - I was waiting to see whether or not someone else might also reply. Alas, if I wait then I will wait forever or so it seems. Very well then, let me get to work with what I have - you certainly deserve as much.

Your first question I find to be a tad unclear Brother - you ask if I am sure that I want to "go there", but I am not altogether sure just what you mean by this; what issue are you addressing, precisely? I can take a wild guess at what you are implying, but I would much rather that you were explicit and spoke in clear and concise language. Obscure sayings only invite unnecessary confusion, after all.

On the matter of being glad that I am here: my Brother, hold your gladness in check as I may not be here as long as you might have hoped. Only time will tell, I suppose.

On the matter of the "would-be teacher": I think you misunderstand my intentions if you think that I mean to posture as some all-knowing, all-seeing "Master of the Universe" type. This could never be the case as I am only acutely aware of my own ignorance - as the saying goes (and it is true as far as I have seen): the more I learn, the less I know. That said, I do not see anything wrong with stating what is true: that I most certainly do have a familiarity with the subject matter at hand and can, therefore, likely answer a few questions should anyone wish to avail themselves of that opportunity. To be perfectly frank, I find that far too many people get upset the moment they discover an individual claiming some (level of) knowledge they do not have. In any case, I will not be made to be ashamed of knowing something others do not - that is a patently absurd expectation; I will not pretend to be ignorant on these matters to make people feel more at ease in their sense of inferiority. Beyond that, I have no doubt that I will learn a few things from my time here no matter what the duration may be.

The last thing I would like to address, before ending this response, is your last statement asking me to "think about it". Once more, I must admit that I have no idea what you are talking about Brother. I could guess, but I would rather not. Please, try to be explicit in your responses; use clear and concise language and avoid vague notions so that we can have a discussion.

Thanks for your time,

Sincerely,

Fr. T.E.U. - Fr. E.S.Q.S.