Why do people still believe that UFO's are alien?

reply to post by micpsi

They did not find us after one trip. They found us by accident after millions of forays out into space.

Ok. Millions of forays through trillions of cubic light years. A trillion is a million million. But I didn't say it couldn't happen, did I?

Originally posted by micpsi


What makes you think it was ever a question of finding us in one trip? You really beg the question. But then debunkers always do. ETs could have been travelling through space for thousands or even millions of years. They did not find us after one trip. They found us by accident after millions of forays out into space. You raise phony problems in order to maintain a phony position. It's a totally discredited tactic used by debunkers.

That's an excellent phony point.

reply to post by ZetaRediculian


How do you confirm a space vehicle versus a "unidentified flying object" ?

I don't see your argument as you are just trying to split hairs like other skeptics.

Are pilots not qualified enough to make reporting on unusual sightings? What's more professional/suitable than pilots, who are fit to determine what should be flying and what shouldn't?

Do you expect a report from astronauts? Or a news report from the government?

Here's the 2013 citizen hearing talking about how 3 different pilots spotting the same UFO in a short amount of time, 2 commercial plane pilots and 1 military pilot all witnessed the same thing.
There are many other videos of the hearing with definite "evidence" that there are "unidentified" flying objects flying around.






Now that we've gotten the question of "Are there UFOs flying around" aside,

The real question is: what are these things.

So the thread title is illogical if you say "Why do people believe that UFO's are alien" ?

Why? First of all if it is not from this planet it is deemed "alien", this of course has not been confirmed but is most likely the case. Second, because we don't know what they are yet, so people can believe what they want because UFOs exist.
If not alien like I said, please add more suggestions to what they are instead of the "nope, can't be aliens" argument.

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by micpsi

 

They did not find us after one trip. They found us by accident after millions of forays out into space.

Ok. Millions of forays through trillions of cubic light years. A trillion is a million million. But I didn't say it couldn't happen, did I?

So you're telling me there's a chance?

Originally posted by peashooter
reply to post by ZetaRediculian

 

How do you confirm a space vehicle versus a "unidentified flying object" ?

I don't see your argument as you are just trying to split hairs like other skeptics.

Are pilots not qualified enough to make reporting on unusual sightings? What's more professional/suitable than pilots, who are fit to determine what should be flying and what shouldn't?

Do you expect a report from astronauts? Or a news report from the government?

Here's the 2013 citizen hearing talking about how 3 different pilots spotting the same UFO in a short amount of time, 2 commercial plane pilots and 1 military pilot all witnessed the same thing.
There are many other videos of the hearing with definite "evidence" that there are "unidentified" flying objects flying around.

Now that we've gotten the question of "Are there UFOs flying around" aside,

The real question is: what are these things.

So your thread title is illogical if you say "Why do people believe that UFO's are alien" ?

Why? Because we don't know what they are yet, so people can believe what they want because UFOs exist.
If not alien like I said, please add more suggestions to what they are instead of the "nope, can't be aliens" argument.

edit on 10-6-2013 by peashooter because: (no reason given)

I'm not sure what the rant is about. I just asked three questions based your comments. Here they are again:

That's a lot of sightings. Which ones were confirmed alien space vehicles?

Which ones are confirmed misidentifications?

How are you sure they aren't seeing things?

I haven't made a point yet or split hairs. I didnt say anything about pilot qualifications, astronauts or governments. You have already identified me as a "skeptic". That's all in made up in your head. I guess people can think they see something without it really being there.

reply to post by ZetaRediculian


Understood, I'm not saying there are no mistakes in sighting UFO's, but many have shown up on radar so this cancels out the possibility of seeing things for those specific cases. Some have reported seeing UFO's the size of couple football fields.

One interesting case involved a US pilot ordered to fire 24 missiles at an UFO which showed up on radar to be the size of a bomber.

I have posted this in anther thread but here's the story:
www.dailymail.co.uk...

Here's an article about 10 popular sightings which showed up on radar
listverse.com...

I keep an open mind with regards to whether aliens exist or not.

I know we can't prove they do exist, but imagining the mind-boggling size of our as yet wholly unexplored universe except for the moon, we cannot say with any certainty that they don't exist either. Just because we've never seen an alien doesn't mean they don't exist.

I think anything could be possible in a universe we know virtually nothing about.

We don't 'know' they do exist, but by the same token we don't know they don't exist either.

reply to post by peashooter

One interesting case involved a US pilot ordered to fire 24 missiles at an UFO which showed up on radar to be the size of a bomber.

Rockets. Not missiles.

The Torres case actually sounds like a perfect example of radar spoofing. That's one of the problems with radar, it can be tricked both intentionally and by nature.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by Jefferton
First serious post.

So many people believe this to be true. They can't understand why others don't believe.

Is there even on scrap of evidence to prove it? I wanted to believe for so long. But over the years the fakes have killed my belief. How do you still believe??

edit on 10-6-2013 by Jefferton because: (no reason given)

edit on 10-6-2013 by Jefferton because: (no reason given)

"The fakes killed your belief"? You didn't look very hard for other cases, did you? Examine these and give me what you think happened:

Westhall School, Australia 1966:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Broad Haven School, Wales 1977:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Ariel School, Zimbabwe 1994:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

As for UFOs:

JAL Flight 1628 over Alaska:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

American West Flight 564:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Now I appreciate the line on UFO/CE3 encounters, is it black budget ops or something else? To me, based on the geography of these random incidents, I don't believe it to be black budget operations and nor do I believe these incidents to be mundane, something weird went on here. And there are plenty more cases without satisfactory explanations floating around out there (pardon the pun).

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by peashooter

 

One interesting case involved a US pilot ordered to fire 24 missiles at an UFO which showed up on radar to be the size of a bomber.

Rockets. Not missiles.

The Torres case actually sounds like a perfect example of radar spoofing. That's one of the problems with radar, it can be tricked both intentionally and by nature.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

edit on 6/10/2013 by Phage because: (no reason given)

I'll ignore the hair splitting between rockets vs missiles, since I'm no expert in those definitions but you clearly understood the point.

One of the problems with radar is that it can be tricked, point taken, how does this apply to the thousands of sightings/many other cases which radar has confirmed to the point where military jets are scrambled to intercept the UFO?

What's your response to the sightings all over the world from different pilots/government forces?

Your comment in the other thread said "Hover over a city in broad daylight at an altitude such that the craft doesn't look like a dot. That would convince just about everyone. Even me."

But the post by Zcustosmorum showed just that, hundred of people witnessing the same thing. The only difference is that you haven't seen it, but people all over the world has seen unexplained flying objects both from the ground and in the air.

Originally posted by peashooter
reply to post by ZetaRediculian

 

Understood, I'm not saying there are no mistakes in sighting UFO's, but many have shown up on radar so this cancels out the possibility of seeing things for those specific cases. Some have reported seeing UFO's the size of couple football fields.

One interesting case involved a US pilot ordered to fire 24 missiles at an UFO which showed up on radar to be the size of a bomber.

I have posted this in anther thread but here's the story:
www.dailymail.co.uk...

Here's an article about 10 popular sightings which showed up on radar
listverse.com...

edit on 10-6-2013 by peashooter because: (no reason given)

Thanks, that's better!
It is hard to account for some of these things in known terms and there does seem to be a lot of cases that fall into that category. For the most part, when I look at any given case, it seems to me that there could be some other possible explanation. Sometimes the cases are so complex that it would be impossible to "explain" them without sounding like you are grasping at straws. At the same time, i think it's unreasonable to demand a reasonable explanation when none is possible and then label them aliens. I'm not sure if that made sense.

reply to post by peashooter

What's your response to the sightings all over the world from different pilots/government forces?

Are you asking me to respond to every pilot/government report? Sorry. Not gonna do that.

How about if I say that a great many of them are likely misidentifications or the result of weather phenomena. Those that aren't tend to fall into different "categories" such that it becomes difficult to ascribe all of them to any single origin. In other words, to my way of thinking, throwing them all into one bucket really isn't very helpful.

reply to post by Zcustosmorum

The JAL case seems to have been due to a cloud but, of course, anyone can make their own mind up.

post by Arbitrageur

Originally posted by ZetaRediculian
reply to post by Zcustosmorum

 

The JAL case seems to have been due to a cloud but, of course, anyone can make their own mind up.

post by Arbitrageur

We have a challenger

Ok, from your point of view, 1 down, 4 more to go

I struggle to believe that this incident was a cloud when you throw this into the mix:



I'm specifically talking about the fact that they tried to hush this case up, doesn't sound like a cloud to me, but we all have our opinions.

Good thread! Although I seem to have enough "worldly" problems to keep myself busy rather than worrying about "what are ufos and are they alien?"

For now all the speculation in the universe is not going to provide a definitive answer.

I am sure "the aliens" will provide disclosure when we are worthy

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by peashooter

 

What's your response to the sightings all over the world from different pilots/government forces?

Are you asking me to respond to every pilot/government report? Sorry. Not gonna do that.

How about if I say that a great many of them are likely misidentifications or the result of weather phenomena. Those that aren't tend to fall into different "categories" such that it becomes difficult to ascribe all of them to any single origin. In other words, to my way of thinking, throwing them all into one bucket really isn't very helpful.

So you are saying that when you add 80 zeros, it equals zero and not 80?

It gets even worse when you lump in different phenomenon and theories like alien abduction and ancient aliens. It just becomes a spin.

Originally posted by krazykanuk
Good thread! Although I seem to have enough "worldly" problems to keep myself busy rather than worrying about "what are ufos and are they alien?"

For now all the speculation in the universe is not going to provide a definitive answer.

I am sure "the aliens" will provide disclosure when we are worthy

I do hope so. I want to want to believe.

reply to post by ZetaRediculian


Agreed, we all are in the same boat regards to the origin of these objects. As long as people acknowledge the fact that sightings are occurring on a frequent basis, and that very likely there are objects flying in our skies that we have no idea about, we can make good progress in learning about them. Hopefully the government will spill their research about these objects in the future (I'm assuming they've been secretly studying them for a long time)

reply to post by Phage


Phage, let me reword my question (actually not a question) but let's say a generous 50% of those sightings are error, the remaining ones still confirm that we have unknown objects flying in our airspace.

Why worry about these sightings if we cannot find the origin? The more people who care about these sightings means that the more likely the government will openly allow information/research on these objects.

reply to post by Zcustosmorum


Well here's the thing, if it does hold up that it was a cloud, then all of mr Callahan's ranting and raving is meaningless. Is it possible they were covering up that they didn't know what it was or an embarrassment? Just speculating, which is fair to do.

If it does hold up, it would also give us a good example of how things can get misidentified and reach legendary status to the nth degree.

Originally posted by ZetaRediculian
reply to post by Zcustosmorum

 

Well here's the thing, if it does hold up that it was a cloud, then all of mr Callahan's ranting and raving is meaningless. Is it possible they were covering up that they didn't know what it was or an embarrassment? Just speculating, which is fair to do.

If it does hold up, it would also give us a good example of how things can get misidentified and reach legendary status to the nth degree.

Of course we can speculate, it's about all we can do due to the current climate of this phenomenon.

I wouldn't really give incidents such as this "legendary" status, it's more a case of explained or unexplained and if they don't know what it was, then the choices for what it could be are very limited indeed