Mike Zullo and Joe Arpaio prove Obama's birth certificate, social security number, and selective se

Originally posted by kerazeesicko
--snip--
Expert: No Doubt Obama's Birth Certificate Is Legit
--snip--
Not just some YouTube expert..

--snip--

I'm going to revisit this thread in the hopes that someone out there still takes the time to look at something for themselves.

The provided link is appreciated, but I hope you would take the time to go read the full article. It is from 2 days after the release of the LFBC. The gentleman who works with Adobe is not offering any validation through personal investment of time. It basically is just an opinion that he is not surprised that there are layers because it is possible under some conditions with some software.

The term "YouTube expert" invites the implied perception of someone less qualified and less worthy of consideration. While the gentleman linked in the quote offered a short opinion in an interview, he provides no examples of what he is talking about and has invested what was probably no more than 15 minutes of his time for a short interview.

The young man who did the videos I linked to cared enough to invest the time to create a video of considerable length the day of release showing what he had seen personally. (He has been CEO of his own company since 2008, btw.)

Then he went on to do three more videos in 4 days in order to respond to questions. In cases like the OCR question, he makes no claims at being an expert, but he DOES address it.

Originally posted by flyswatter
--snip--
"He makes it VERY clear that he has absolutely no clue about how OCR software works, whether it be on the computer or from within the software on an MFP."
--snip--
"This kid is clearly not stupid, but he demonstrates his lack of understanding of what he is talking about in the first 2 minutes of speaking, and if you keep going, it just gets worse."

See, this speaks to what I said about actually looking for yourself other than going along with the rest of the herd because "Everyone knows there is no such thing as Bigfoot". Someone just skimming this thread could very well read your comment and accept your opinion without ever seeing the 4th video he posted. (Did you??) This "kid" poked it with a stick himself rather than assume anything. (same day)

I will grant that his biggest mistake is including "Faked In Adobe Illustrator" in the title. It's a mistake I would guess thousands would make considering the generic association with that particular file extension.

Being curious enough and showing enough respect to comments to acquire OCR software and creating a 4th video to reply as well as educate himself speaks well of him, imo. It's a lot more work than a 15 minute phone interview talking about what "might" have happened.

This was only posted as an invitation to the curious self-educators out there to "poke this with a stick". I wont respond to any more snide remarks because it was never my intention to pick a fight with anyone. If that had been the case, I would have turned it around and asked someone to "PROVE IT" when it comes to seeing the LFBC. I have yet to see anything other than signed affidavits saying that there is a LFBC on file with the proper authorities in Hawaii. Not once, yet, have I seen anyone on the record saying that they have seen the actual physical document, themselves.

(The ones we have been given to view as supposedly the definitive proof that said documents exist on file in Hawaii.)

Notice how carefully this statement seems to be parsed:
Link

"I ... have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen," she said in a brief statement. "I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago."

In today's world of legal "wiggle room" wording, that statement is sufficient to put the place of birth and eligibility issue to rest for any reasonable person and still provide a safe distance from any document images that may have been tinkered with. At this point, clear statements need to be made. Games with semantics only continue to feed the fires of suspicion.

vid 4


I will gladly view any links provided. I have never contested either the fact that the man was born in Hawaii or eligible to hold the office. Go back and read what I've said. My only point has been that he could have been born on Mars & I couldn't tell by what they've shown...

Save your "birther" accusations for those who deserve them. I've yet to insult anyone on ATS who's disagreed with me...

Originally posted by CornShucker
The young man who did the videos I linked to cared enough to invest the time to create a video of considerable length

It does not matter how long or short a youtube video is, it does not show Obama's birth certificate.

You still do not understand that the image of Obama's birth certificate on the web is NOT Obama's birth certificate, so you cannot use it to claim it is a fake.

Originally posted by Nicks87

Originally posted by kerazeesicko
--snip--

Who is quoting "youtube experts"?

--snip--

That would most likely be me.

Originally posted by hellobruce

Originally posted by CornShucker
The young man who did the videos I linked to cared enough to invest the time to create a video of considerable length

It does not matter how long or short a youtube video is, it does not show Obama's birth certificate.

You still do not understand that the image of Obama's birth certificate on the web is NOT Obama's birth certificate, so you cannot use it to claim it is a fake.

How 'bout you take a moment for a few nice, calm, deep breaths and then go back and actually read the complete post that I put well over an hour into creating and then editing for clarity...

At No Time have I ever claimed that the man's actual record are fake. I Have Never claimed he wasn't born here, a natural born citizen or ineligible to hold the office he's been elected to.

I'm trying my best not to lose patience with you. I understand why you might feel he is being attacked over this. It isn't by me, though. I am NOT a so-called birther!!

My problem is with a system that on one hand (and it's getting worse all the time) views our distrust or suspicion as "Un-American" and on the other seems to go out of its way to create those very same emotions.

I don't look at the COLB or LFBC situation much different than I do the Zapruder film. Here we had a man in the extremely unique position of being in the right place at the right time with the right resources to document the murder of an American president in full view of the American people. If it hadn't been for the type of curiosity that Mr. Renshaw possesses, we would never have known that, after Mr. Zapruder trusted the government with his film, he got it back in other than its original condition. (I'll let you research that on your own. It will not only be a good education on an important part of our country's history, but it might take your mind off this subject for a while.)

Please don't assume that you can get in my head. Some days there's barely room in here for me. I am not your enemy.

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus


Dual citizenship does not void natural born citizenship. For this matter we can look to Perkins v. Elg. Elg's parents were Swedish immigrants. Her father was a naturalized US citizen but her mother was not. She was born on US soil. Shortly after turning four her family moved back to Sweden. In 1929 she received a US passport from the US consul in Sweden and moved back to the US. In 1934 her father renounced his US citizenship because he wanted to preserve his allegiance to Sweden. In 1935 Elg was notified that she was now an illegal alien. She of course took this to court. In the Supreme Court's decision they stated that because she never renounced her citizenship she was still a US citizen. Furthermore, they stated that because she was born on US soil she was a natural born citizen and explicitly said that she could even run for President if she so wished.

Now how about that Lynch v. Clarke case you continue to ignore that makes all of these arguments moot?

Originally posted by hellobruce

Originally posted by CornShucker
The young man who did the videos I linked to cared enough to invest the time to create a video of considerable length

It does not matter how long or short a youtube video is, it does not show Obama's birth certificate.

You still do not understand that the image of Obama's birth certificate on the web is NOT Obama's birth certificate, so you cannot use it to claim it is a fake.

Thats because Obama's birth certificate only exists in cyberspace. There is no real one.

Have you seen the REAL one? I think not... so how do you know it's real?

Cuz Obammy say so???

Originally posted by Nicks87
Thats because Obama's birth certificate only exists in cyberspace.

Wrong actually.... but you do not even need a birth certificate to become President - where are the BC's of all previous Presidents....

Originally posted by hellobruce

Originally posted by Nicks87
Thats because Obama's birth certificate only exists in cyberspace.

Wrong actually.... but you do not even need a birth certificate to become President - where are the BC's of all previous Presidents....

edit on 12-6-2013 by hellobruce because: (no reason given)

Noooo, right actually.

Have you held it in your hand? Did you go to Hawaii and get special privileges to see it for yourself?

No, you didn't, so you are talking out of your rear end. You have no idea if it's real or not and nothing you have said, including the childish "birther" remarks prove otherwise.

Your argument has been debunked and you have been exposed as a govt shill.

Originally posted by Nicks87

Originally posted by hellobruce

Originally posted by Nicks87
Thats because Obama's birth certificate only exists in cyberspace.

Wrong actually.... but you do not even need a birth certificate to become President - where are the BC's of all previous Presidents....

edit on 12-6-2013 by hellobruce because: (no reason given)

Noooo, right actually.

Have you held it in your hand? Did you go to Hawaii and get special privileges to see it for yourself?

No, you didn't, so you are talking out of your rear end. You have no idea if it's real or not and nothing you have said, including the childish "birther" remarks prove otherwise.

Your argument has been debunked and you have been exposed as a govt shill.

Sorry, are you seriously suggesting that everyone in the US will have to see the birth certificate up close?

Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus

 

Dual citizenship does not void natural born citizenship. For this matter we can look to Perkins v. Elg. Elg's parents were Swedish immigrants. Her father was a naturalized US citizen but her mother was not. She was born on US soil. Shortly after turning four her family moved back to Sweden. In 1929 she received a US passport from the US consul in Sweden and moved back to the US. In 1934 her father renounced his US citizenship because he wanted to preserve his allegiance to Sweden. In 1935 Elg was notified that she was now an illegal alien. She of course took this to court. In the Supreme Court's decision they stated that because she never renounced her citizenship she was still a US citizen. Furthermore, they stated that because she was born on US soil she was a natural born citizen and explicitly said that she could even run for President if she so wished.

Now how about that Lynch v. Clarke case you continue to ignore that makes all of these arguments moot?

The flaw in that argument is that Obama (or rather his mother and adapted father on his behalf) would have had to renounce any US citizenship he had because Indonesia did not allow dual citizenship (and Mom wanted to put her son through the Indonesian school system). He was NEVER a dual citizen and your legal case history is totally irrelevant.

Even assuming that Obama was born in Hawaii (that's still an unresolved issue as far as I am concerned as I have seen no proof), he could not have been a US citizen when he went to school in Indonesia. This no doubt explains why he was regarded as a foreign student when he went to study in America and why so many of his educational records are classified. It's just another dirty little secret about his past that those who helped him into office don't want YOU to know.

Originally posted by micpsi
The flaw in that argument is that Obama (or rather his mother and adapted father on his behalf) would have had to renounce any US citizenship he had because Indonesia did not allow dual citizenship

Proof please.

He was NEVER a dual citizen and your legal case history is totally irrelevant.

Proof please.

Even assuming that Obama was born in Hawaii (that's still an unresolved issue as far as I am concerned as I have seen no proof)

You can see Obama's Hawaiian birth certificate here.

Politifact has a good article on it here.

he could not have been a US citizen when he went to school in Indonesia.

Proof please.

This no doubt explains why he was regarded as a foreign student when he went to study in America

False. See the article here.

reply to post by micpsi


I believe wrabbit discussed the Indonesia thing in this thread. Regardless his parents couldn't have renounced his citizenship. According to Section 349(a)(5) of the Immigration and Nationality Act:

F. RENUNCIATION FOR MINOR CHILDREN/INCOMPETENTS

Citizenship is a status that is personal to the U.S. citizen. Therefore, parents may not renounce the citizenship of their minor children. Similarly, parents/legal guardians may not renounce the citizenship of individuals who are mentally incompetent. Minors seeking to renounce their U.S. citizenship must demonstrate to a consular officer that they are acting voluntarily and that they fully understand the implications/consequences attendant to the renunciation of U.S. citizenship.

Furthermore:

Finally, those contemplating a renunciation of U.S. citizenship should understand that the act is irrevocable, except as provided in section 351 of the INA (8 U.S.C. 1483), and cannot be canceled or set aside absent successful administrative or judicial appeal. (Section 351(b) of the INA provides that an applicant who renounced his or her U.S. citizenship before the age of eighteen can have that citizenship reinstated if he or she makes that desire known to the Department of State within six months after attaining the age of eighteen. See also Title 22, Code of Federal Regulations, section 50.20).

So even if he did renounce his citizenship he could have easily had it reinstated when he returned to the US. Of course no one has been able to provide the paperwork showing he did renounce his citizenship and no employees at the US Consulate in Indonesia have claimed that he did. It should also be noted (once more) that his school records are not classified. Anyone's school records can only be provided to the person they belong to or direct family members. I couldn't access your school records if I wanted.

Originally posted by Nicks87
You have no idea if it's real or not

As I said - to become President you do not even have to have a birth certificate.... but you ignore that fact! No previous President had to show his BC, but as soon as Obama comes along all the birthers start demanding it.

So far birthers have lost every single silly court case they have attempted - over 200 of them. The court has declared that Obama is a natural born US citizen, and was re-elected for another 4 years.

I imagine in 4 years time when Obama leaves office the birthers will claim that they were victorious at last as they got him out of the Presidency!

I'm not buying it. There are literally 100s of millions of people around the world that would like to Obama out. Of those many are millionaires, Billionaires, Judges, Police officers, intelligence officers, High ranking diplomats in many countries in charge of millions of people. With all those resources nobody could prove that Obama is fake except for two guys and one of them is a Sheriff in Arizona who is doing this part time? Do you realize how absurd that sounds when you put it like that? Just saying.

Originally posted by hellobruce

Originally posted by Nicks87
You have no idea if it's real or not

As I said - to become President you do not even have to have a birth certificate.... but you ignore that fact! No previous President had to show his BC, but as soon as Obama comes along all the birthers start demanding it.

So far birthers have lost every single silly court case they have attempted - over 200 of them. The court has declared that Obama is a natural born US citizen, and was re-elected for another 4 years.

I imagine in 4 years time when Obama leaves office the birthers will claim that they were victorious at last as they got him out of the Presidency!

"Birther, birther, birther!"

You sound childish and pedantic, stop with the school yard name calling and stop trying to change the argument. I said you cant prove that the BC is real and you keep saying: that to be president you don't "have to have a BC."

Prove to me it's real and then you can continue the argument.

So, how's the Zullo/Arpaio show coming along?

Have they arrested Obama yet? Have they found a court willing to accept their claims? Have they got the impeachment process rolling?

C'mon guys, the nation demands an update!

Originally posted by Nicks87
Prove to me it's real

Why do I have to do that? As I said, you do not even need a BC to become President, a fact that silly birthers keep ignoring. They ignore it as they are not interested in the facts, they just hate Obama being President!

They never asked to see any previous Presidents birth certificate, or other records, but as soon as Obama comes along silly birthers start making all sorts of demands.

Originally posted by hellobruce

Originally posted by Nicks87
Prove to me it's real

Why do I have to do that? As I said, you do not even need a BC to become President, a fact that silly birthers keep ignoring. They ignore it as they are not interested in the facts, they just hate Obama being President!

They never asked to see any previous Presidents birth certificate, or other records, but as soon as Obama comes along silly birthers start making all sorts of demands.

edit on 18-6-2013 by hellobruce because: (no reason given)

"Silly birthers" there you go again with the name calling. You gibber like a child about not needing a birth certificate to be president but wouldn't that be the strongest piece of evidence to prove that Obama was born in America thus filling the requirements set forth by the constitution?

...And like you said, "the PDF is NOT the birth certificate". So where are these facts that support Obama was born in the USA?

Originally posted by Nicks87
You gibber like a child

Actually birthers are the ones gibbering like children, all because a black man is the legal POTUS! Remember, birthers have lost every single court case they have attempted, over 200 of them!

about not needing a birth certificate to be president but wouldn't that be the strongest piece of evidence to prove that Obama was born in America thus filling the requirements set forth by the constitution?

Funny how no previous POTUS showed his BC, but as soon as Obama comes along birthers start whining and gibbering and demand to see it. After he showed it they then demanded his long form, and even after he showed that they kept whining!

So where are these facts that support Obama was born in the USA?

Over 200 failed birther court cases, and Obama has been declared a natural born citizen by the court.... but birthers ignore that as it destroys their silly conspiracy!