Spirituality & Becoming What We Aren’t.

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
When your ideas drop away what is behind is what you seek.

That's what you seek, and no one else. You sell hedonism and absence of thought. Why don't you embrace what you've found, be happy, and never use words and thoughts again? Why don't you go live your doctrine? Because here you are, "being", contradictorily using thoughts and words how they should be used, instead of being your contentless self, not a single thing changing but how you see the world.

You practice the opposite of what you preach.

Seeking comfort from words and thoughts is not the answer. Words and thoughts are things - they are content - they are of the appearance, they never stay the same and conflict and contradict. Nothing that appears will ever truly comfort you.

Then why do you use thoughts and words? Why are you sweeping under the carpet what you yourself do in favor of what you yourself wish to be?

Perhaps the greatest philosophy is that we should stop lying to ourselves.

At no point have I ever said that thought must be discontinued. At no point have I said that one should or could be thoughtless. Thoughts and words arise - they happen. Seeking comfort in anything is not wise - words included.
You will find no comfort in words or things.
The background behind thought - which is silent - is what is sought not by me (I am found) but by all seekers. They are looking for relief, for rest, they are looking for peace.

reply to post by Itisnowagain

At no point have I ever said that thought must be discontinued. At no point have I said that one should or could be thoughtless. Thoughts and words arise - they happen. Seeking comfort in anything is not wise - words included.

My mistake.

You will find no comfort in words or things.
The background behind thought - which is silent - is what is sought not by me (I am found) but by all seekers. They are looking for relief, for rest, they are looking for peace.

The background behind thought is sleep. Everyone needs a good nights rest.

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
The background behind thought is sleep. Everyone needs a good nights rest.

Yes - wouldn't you like to be in the blissfulness of deep sleep but be awake.
Prior to the light coming on when you open your eyes and things appear there is peace. The light that is seen is just light but the mind makes so much more out of it.

reply to post by Itisnowagain

wouldn't you like to be in the blissfulness of deep sleep but be awake.

Not necessarily. Sleeping overnight is enough for me; everything in moderation.

Luckily you do not operate heavy machinery.

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

wouldn't you like to be in the blissfulness of deep sleep but be awake.

Not necessarily. Sleeping overnight is enough for me; everything in moderation.

Luckily you do not operate heavy machinery.

I am awake. I did say '........blissfulness of deep sleep but be awake'. Awake and not dreaming of somewhere or some when else - so heavy machinery is taken care of if it is present. One is completely with what is appearing.

reply to post by dodol

Being Spiritual is Being Aware of Everything (especially our bodies, imho)
We always think when we don't need to (in small mind), this what makes us less spiritual.
All physical activities when is done with Awareness (Mindfulnes) automatically become spiritual activities

Everything is impossible to be aware of.

We always think—when we need to and we don't need to. It's just a matter of if we wish to pay attention to ourselves or not. We cannot be more or less spiritual than we already are.

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by dodol

 

Being Spiritual is Being Aware of Everything (especially our bodies, imho)
We always think when we don't need to (in small mind), this what makes us less spiritual.
All physical activities when is done with Awareness (Mindfulnes) automatically become spiritual activities

Everything is impossible to be aware of.

We always think—when we need to and we don't need to. It's just a matter of if we wish to pay attention to ourselves or not. We cannot be more or less spiritual than we already are.

But you believe in things - you think you are a thing among other things. This is not the realization of spirit - it the denial.

reply to post by Silencey24

As with anything else, spirituality can be dogmatically religious depending on the person. However without the formalization of organization or belief it be a mistake to lump everyone as spiritual into one category as everyone will have a different view.

Reading though these post I can find no real fault in anything posted and that to me is spirituality. Being able to look at other view points and try to understand and accept them. I may not follow these beliefs but I will acknowledge them as valid. A faith in knowing there are things that I do not know yet, may never know or just don't have the ability to comprehend is another.

However this is just my view and not really anymore valid then another, I just figured I'd give my two cents to the fact that you all are essentially debating thoughts and feelings which is nigh unknowable. And even thats alright, at least it's being talked about and understanding being made!

I agree. All methods of through which someone wishes to refine their spirituality is valid, as spirituality differs between each and every individual.

reply to post by Itisnowagain

But you believe in things - you think you are a thing among other things. This is not the realization of spirit - it the denial.

Well, it all depends on how you define things. But yes, spirit is another abstraction of ourselves, and therefore I deny it. Promoting an abstraction of oneself is self-denial.

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

But you believe in things - you think you are a thing among other things. This is not the realization of spirit - it the denial.

Well, it all depends on how you define things. But yes, spirit is another abstraction of ourselves, and therefore I deny it. Promoting an abstraction of oneself is self-denial.

Spirit is not thingness. The mind is wording, it makes things but in reality there are no things - there are thinks.
This right here and right now is what is happening - it is all there is but what it is cannot be named or labelled a thing. It is moving and changing constantly - this experience.
The mind cannot grasp it but it is what is.
Words try to shape the formless forming and then make a solid pretend world that does not exist and you try to live in it.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

"Spiritual not religious" typically means, "I will admit that something is wrong with the religions I am familiar with, but will not take the leap to eschew them". It is a statement that betrays a lack of comfort within ones own self with the ideas that they have come to have.

Aah beautiful. You too have noticed this. We deceive ourselves into believing we have made a superficial change, but at the same time retain our very religiosity.

reply to post by Itisnowagain

This right here and right now is what is happening - it is all there is but what it is cannot be named or labelled a thing. It is moving and changing constantly - this experience.
The mind cannot grasp it but it is what is.
Words try to shape the formless forming and then make a solid pretend world that does not exist and you try to live in it.

This is pointing out the obvious. I've asked you this many times, but why make a principle out of something everyone already does?

Words have no direct 1 to 1 correspondance to objects. Language is a reflection of reality. When I think of a horse I understand there is no real horse in my head. Thinking is an ability like sight. If you don't know how to see, then close your eyes.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope


I don't understand what you mean by 'making a principle out of it'. Can you explain what you mean please?

reply to post by LesMisanthrope

This right here and right now is what is happening - it is all there is but what it is cannot be named or labelled a thing. It is moving and changing constantly - this experience.
The mind cannot grasp it but it is what is.
Words try to shape the formless forming and then make a solid pretend world that does not exist and you try to live in it.

This right here and right now is nothing, it is the formless forming, it is never solid - it is spirit.
The words build a pretend world that is believed. Things are thinks.
There is only this really - what is wrong with this? What is right about this?
It will always be this but this will always appear different.

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
What's to let go if they are not real? What unreal thing are you letting go of? No, you're hiding something, a part of yourself, in favor of something you could never become. It is your desire to do away with thoughts, it is your own idea you've thought about and put into words. You should let this thought go with all the rest.

Desire is the very thing that holds you back, tells you that you are not whole. I have no desire to do away with thoughts, I just do away with thoughts. If you desire to be rid of thoughts you are thinking. Simply watch them drop away, dissolve back into the nothingness whence they came.
I have already stated that thought is required to transfer knowing into words. This is much different than letting thoughts reign at all times.
What I still do not understand is your need to defend that which brings you misery.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope

Hey OP,
I've noticed you hanging around the "Spirituality, Ego" topics for quite a while now, and also taking part in the neo-advaita non-duality circle jerks for a while now. I wonder the most, what is your motivation for posting this thread?

Spirituality without religion is like saying that I am a human being before I am an american, male, philosopher, xx years old, hazel eyes, etc...... The religion is a label. The Spirituality is the Inherent true nature of all sentient beings prior to selecting any religions or taking part in any labels. It's not that "hard" to consider.

But thinking is the enemy—isn’t that so my friends?

It's a tool. It's neutral. Like eyes, ears, smell, touch.

We are told that we must, through sheer acts of will, meditation and introspection, suspend our thinking processes in favour of what—not thinking?

In favour of revealing your true nature, which thinking and the thinker cover up.

The label “spiritual” is a costume

All labels are costumes

Is happiness only found in spirituality?

You can find relative and fleeting happiness in women, cars, money, materialism, narco's, etc. But true ever lasting happiness is found within, found in Enlightenment.

Is spirituality the key to a proper conduct?

There is a set of Universal morals and ethics written in the heart of every human. Those who access it, live selflessly Enlightened. All others have it covered up by ego/mind/thinking/selfishness.

It vows the hedonistic comforts of joy, satiation and bliss. It promises states of ecstasy and understanding in our own self-denial. It is the mental preparation for death, not the mental preparation for life. It is the doctrine of what we desire to be, not what we are.

Skewed view and relative projections. If you would just hear some of us out, and real penetrate into the crux of the matter, you'd have a realization and epiphany into the direct nature of existence, and there after you'd never be the same.

That's what's lacking. I once used to take all the same stances as you, but mine were even worse because I was an Atheist and strict materialist. Until a realization/epiphany happens, these things are not understood and hence bias forms.

(by the way, let the non-dual circle jerk begin)

reply to post by HarryTZ

If you desire to be rid of thoughts you are thinking. Simply watch them drop away, dissolve back into the nothingness whence they came.

There is a Source to all thoughts. Grab on to One and Don't let it go, and it will lead you to the source of all thoughts, which will eventually extinguish all of the coming and going of them, leaving only pure crystal clear thoughtless-at-all-times Spontaneous-Now-Oneness

Originally posted by dominicus
There is a Source to all thoughts. Grab on to One and Don't let it go, and it will lead you to the source of all thoughts, which will eventually extinguish all of the coming and going of them, leaving only pure crystal clear thoughtless-at-all-times Spontaneous-Now-Oneness

This is an interesting concept. Would you care to elaborate on it?

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

 

"Spiritual not religious" typically means, "I will admit that something is wrong with the religions I am familiar with, but will not take the leap to eschew them". It is a statement that betrays a lack of comfort within ones own self with the ideas that they have come to have.

Aah beautiful. You too have noticed this. We deceive ourselves into believing we have made a superficial change, but at the same time retain our very religiosity.

People who haven't noticed it are either unwavering in their devotion to their cultural religion, or lying to themselves abjectly.

Everyone believes something. Maybe we are hardwired, or maybe just encoded with cultural bias. But we all believe something. Even atheists, who believe in science and/or man.

Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan

People who haven't noticed it are either unwavering in their devotion to their cultural religion, or lying to themselves abjectly.

Everyone believes something. Maybe we are hardwired, or maybe just encoded with cultural bias. But we all believe something. Even atheists, who believe in science and/or man.

True spirituality is about dropping all belief, all bias, all judgement -- and letting the bliss of Knowing engulf you.