Here is what I have to say about my experience

The vids and related articles i remember posting are in this thread(better). And the last one is documented proof of everything haarp and chemtrail related. whether you believe it or not. Its documented on a .gov website. What more could you possibly ask for. You want people to look at your "proof" but you seem to not care about what others say in the matter. So why should any one listen to what you have to say if you dont/wont give others the same chance.

reply to post by D3AD537


If they're unmarked, non-commercial, and they circle "all day" you shouldn't have any problem getting a good camera and taking good pictures of them so we can identify them. We have an aviation section here that has identified specific aircraft from nothing more than a few instruments, so we shouldn't have any problem identifying your planes.

reply to post by D3AD537

You want people to look at your "proof" but you seem to not care about what others say in the matter. So why should any one listen to what you have to say if you dont/wont give others the same chance.

I do listen, but I also expect proof such as scientific research to validate such proof.

Which btw hasn't happened in this thread or any other chemtrail thread before it.

You see; I can provide such evidence for contrails, are you able to do that with chemtrails?

reply to post by D3AD537


And as I said at least once on the thread, military aircraft are used in testing at both the missile range, and laser lab. That means they fly around and circle over a certain area doing their testing. Besides which, even if they took off from the airport near you, you wouldn't see a contrail from them. Contrails don't start until over 30,000 feet, not from take off like many people believe they do.

reply to post by Zaphod58

If they're unmarked, non-commercial, and they circle "all day" you shouldn't have any problem getting a good camera and taking good pictures of them so we can identify them. We have an aviation section here that has identified specific aircraft from nothing more than a few instruments, so we shouldn't have any problem identifying your planes.

Let me also add that there are ways to identify those crafts using simple plane tracking software such as...

flightaware.com...

www.flightradar24.com...

planefinder.net...

Use one or all if you like to help identify those circling planes.

So OP get down and start tracking those pesky chemtrail planes..

reply to post by D3AD537

You want people to look at your "proof" but you seem to not care about what others say in the matter.

If I didn't care would I persist in asking where is this proof you say you posted?

Specifically, proof of this

Hmm i remember as well posting something about our own government admitting to using HAARP and chemtrailing somewhere. its documented proof just as well as yours is documented.

Can you link directly to your post?

Originally posted by waynos
and I don't even know if these were the first.

The first contrails were seen in 1915, and the first persistent contrails were seen in 1921.

Originally posted by D3AD537
reply to post by waynos

 

say i do have the money and the plane and the right tests for this job..does anyone honestly think it'll be that simple to follow an unmarked government craft spraying what ever it is that theyre spraying without getting everything taken and/or arrested. Don't you think if i was to go in the sky on a scheduled day, they would stop spraying from their unmarked aircrafts for the day to not risk being exposed as fraudulent?? just play with the ideA

Like I already said, if the chemtrail persists for hours and spreads to cover the sky, what's the problem ? You don't need to get anywhere near the plane.

You have said a few times you have seen unmarked govt planes. So post a photograph of the planes you have observed, like I have here

www.abovetopsecret.com...

You said earlier that people aren't outside and looking up as much as you, well I have thousands of photos like those, all identified, no unmarked planes and no chemtrails, so show me yours.

Originally posted by Zaphod58

Originally posted by waynos
and I don't even know if these were the first.

The first contrails were seen in 1915, and the first persistent contrails were seen in 1921.

I thought it was 1918? There are written accounts from American soldiers about contrails overhead during the Meuse-Argonne fighting

From Wakes of War: Contrails and the Rise of Air Power, 1918-1945 Part I-Early Sightings and Preliminary Explanations, 1918-1938:

In early October 1918, while the American Expeditionary Force was engaged in the Meuse-Argonne offensive, several hundred AEF members noticed a number of strange clouds that seemed to emanate from high-flying aircraft and stretch across much of the sky. Three of these observers thought the phenomenon unusual enough to take special note of it. After the war the three independently brought their observations to the attention of the public.

The first of the three to have his account of the strange clouds published was Captain Ward S. Wells, Army Medical Corps, who was serving with the 60th Infantry, 5th Division, American Expeditionary Force, during the Meuse-Argonne campaign. In early October 1918, Ward and his unit were in the Bois de Hess just back of Montfaucon, about ten miles to the west and a little north of Verdun, where they were waiting to take over a portion of the front. 5

Ward noted that it had been raining for several days when at last there dawned "a wonderfully clear and beautiful morning, with not a cloud in sight." During this particular morning, according to Ward,

Our attention was first drawn to the sky by the sudden appearance of several strange and startling clouds--long, graceful, looping ribbons of white. These were tapering to a point at one end and at the other where they dissolved into nothingness 60 degrees across the sky, were about as broad as the width of a finger held arm's distance from the eye. On close observation we noticed some distance ahead of each cloud point the tiny speck of a chasse [sic] plane.... [N]ever before had I seen a plane writing in white upon the blue slate of sky. (6)

Wells had described his observations in a letter to his brother Everett Wells. Because he considered the phenomenon described by Ward to be "quite unusual and perhaps worthy of record," Everett himself wrote to Scientific American quoting at length from Ward's letter. An editorial note at the end of the letter echoed Everett's sentiments: "The observation of clouds formed in the wake of an airplane is, so far as we know, novel. Perhaps some of our readers can bring forward other examples of this, ..." (7) Such a comment coming from the editor of a scientific journal who presumably had a broad, general knowledge of scientific affairs suggests that we are here close to the earliest report of a contrail sighting.

And a bit later:

There are at least two other reports of contrail sightings that predate 1920. Both took place in Germany. One was written by Alfred Wegener, a German polymath who not only had a PhD in astronomy but also exhibited wide-ranging interests in geology and meteorology. It was Wegener who first advanced the theory of continental drift which he codified in his 1915 book The Origins of Continental Drift. Wegener reported his contrail sighting in a German meteorological journal at the beginning of 1920, making it likely that the observation took place near the end of 1919. According to Wegener, "during three airplane flights over Munich at a height of 9 km. a cloud 50 km. in length was formed." Wegener also presented an explanation of contrails of which more anon. (11)

The second German sighting occurred on May 9, 1919, when a pilot flying over Berlin at about 26,000 feet noticed the generation of a cloud stream that extended for about forty miles behind his plane. This stream eventually spread out to form a cloud layer that was about 3,000 feet thick. The pilot saw a similar phenomenon two days later. (12)

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


From what I've read in other sources, they were mentioned in 1918, but were from a previous sighting in 1915.

Oh sorry, it was 1919, from 1915.

The earliest known account of a contrail is a passing mention attributed to Ettenreich, who in 1919 reported of an incident from 1915 where he saw “the condensation of a cumulus stripe from the exhaust gases of an aircraft”

contrailscience.com...

In addition to the above comments there is also this page Here which contains similar reports, one of which is a piece by Flt Lt Ramsbottom of the RAF 2nd camouflage unit with which I was already familiar before viewing that page.

This shows that persistent contrails were an issue that was known and openly discussed more than half a century before Chemtrailers started noticing it, therefore that particular claim is debunked and academic interest did not begin in the 1990's at all.

Do you recall my first post to you in this thread? In there I talked about Chemtrail sites making claims that are provable lies. Well, You have actually proceeded to post many of the things I was talking about in that post. Reading them again won't them any less false than they have always been before. it might have been better to discuss those links one by one in an orderly manner. Instead you have actually done what most chemmies on here do and posted link after link in post after post and you have not given anyone time to respond to an item before posting the next one. The result is the thread is a bit of a mess and responses are getting lost as they are about four posts behind you and this is not conducive to good discussion. It may be better, perhaps, to discuss one thing at a time.

reply to post by tsurfer2000h

And btw that would be called cloud seeding and that is nothing new or secret.

yes..

with

Chemicals.. ~Doh! you fail ..

Originally posted by D3AD537
reply to post by Komodo

 

Hmm maybe you can help with the video im trying to make. basically video taping the planes dumping the stuff and taping the rain or snow if you get any and the thunder and lighting storms being produced if you have any where you're from.

I wouldn't mind at all .. if I had a video cam.. but even though if I posted it..it wouldn't do much good on this site, because..

75% of the members here think YT isn't credible enough to validate what someone sees or shoots...trust me.. been here awhile

Originally posted by Komodo
reply to post by tsurfer2000h

 

And btw that would be called cloud seeding and that is nothing new or secret.

yes..

with

Chemicals..

~Doh! you fail ..

Yes, silver iodide.

But cloud seeding is carried out directly into existing cumulous clouds, it does not occur into cirrus clouds or clear blue skies.

It does not leave thick visible white trails in the sky and, when successful, results in rain within 30 minutes, not hours or days later.

If you are trying to say cloud seeding is the same as chemtrails you are mistaken, or lying. Why is being wrong so funny?

reply to post by Komodo


This might help clear up your confusion

www.thetruthdenied.com...

reply to post by mrthumpy


Interesting link. Is that a chemmie that is starting to wake up to reality? Maybe after learning what cloud seeding really is he might move onto jet contrails?

reply to post by waynos


It is a good one isn't it - not one they can really argue with. Some of them do see sense (up to a point) and they've realised that screaming chemtrails or HAARP about every last little thing when it's easily disprovable only does their cause harm. Some of them have even realised that the photos of barrels and tanks on aircraft are in fact exactly what we say they are!

Originally posted by Komodo
reply to post by tsurfer2000h

 

And btw that would be called cloud seeding and that is nothing new or secret.

yes..

with

Chemicals..

~Doh! you fail ..

Better stop breathing then, 'cos your breath - that's chemicals too - trying to stop chemtrails fail!!

Originally posted by D3AD537
Does anyone here at all ever researched frequencies, vibrations, tones,....what to do you think haarp is...what makes you think they only use haarp for the ionosphere...seriously...you say you have common sense and logic and reasoning behind you...what makes you so sure tptb wouldn't hide such a secret? they've hid secrets and still are. there is proof in the skies. have any of you actually talked with someone in a high ranking position and they told you straight up yes or no about this issue...don't use your t.v as "reliable" either. higher ranking officials lie everyday
to confuse the mass. It's been proving countless times .Many of you here have a sense that tbtp do not have our best interest and know they lie...but for some reason you think they're telling the truth about this issue if you believe everything they say?? What isn't frightening about them controlling the weather??? let me guess...you like being property of tptb..you think they're protecting you?? The truth out weighs the lies heavily on this issue...There are more videos from people on the streets disproving this issue and MORE than people in power lying to us everyday. You think their scientists are telling the truth as well. Why do you think people from universities dove into this issue and do it for non profit...if you were a scientist and the government paid you big to lie about the truth to the public...would you do it??

Science is what makes us think that it is used in the ionosphere. There is no measurable interaction between HAARP and anything outside of the ionosphere. I explained it in a previous thread - there is over a 50km difference between the weather-producing portion of our atmosphere and the lower parts of the ionosphere that HAARP can begin interacting with.

If you can show the above to be false, by all means, do it.

Originally posted by D3AD537
The vids and related articles i remember posting are in this thread(better). And the last one is documented proof of everything haarp and chemtrail related. whether you believe it or not. Its documented on a .gov website. What more could you possibly ask for. You want people to look at your "proof" but you seem to not care about what others say in the matter. So why should any one listen to what you have to say if you dont/wont give others the same chance.

You will not be able to produce anything that has a government person or a HAARP administrator admitting that HAARP is used with "chemtrails" or as a weather control device, because this information does not exist. HAARP does not (read: cannot) control the weather, as it has no measurably effect on the troposphere.

I dont think anyone here is trying to say that weather control is not possible, and I dont think that anyone is saying that "chemtrails" cannot exist. What is being said is 1) HAARP does not control the weather 2) you cannot possibly discern what is in a trail from the ground and 3) there is no documented proof of chemtrails.