Key to Eternal Youth Found!!!

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Korg Trinity

 

As a mortal, ignorant, finite being, you couldn't ever hope to understand what eternal youth would do to you. Clearly, you don't understand the full implications of watching everything you love die again and again. It is possible to become tired of living, you know.

I'm not saying I along would live longer... I know my family, who I have brought up to aspire to the same ideals as me would also dare to live long too.

And if they chose not to although I would be sad for them and for the loss... but that would not deter me from life....

What you are saying is the existence of emotion is an excuse to choose death eternal over life eternal... Very floored logic if you ask me.

How can an eternity of not existing be better than an eternity of life?

Ever heard the expression Time heals all wounds??

It is not childish or ignorant it is just the realization that any existence is better than no existence at all.

Peace,

Korg.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

Well I guess death was invented because evolution was always wanting to get a better efficient body for the next generation as the environment changed. But as we now control the environment to such a large extent and are no longer part of the food chain. I guess the saying that "You cant take it with you when you go" has now changed to something like "I ain't gonna go anyway".
Since cells replace themselves every so many years, and the molecular structure every few months. I guess it wont be long before the natural copy is an exact replica of the original without the stray bits of DNA falling off to create an imperfect reproduction which is to a certain extent interpreted as ageing.
Surely we are at a point where hormone replacement is one of the main anti aging tools. All the Hollywood female stars take HRT. and are looking pretty good into there sixties, But I guess its expensive, so here we go again! a tool for keeping the rich alive so the poor end up in boxes earlier.

reply to post by Korg Trinity

How can an eternity of not existing be better than an eternity of life?

Not existing removes the possibility of pain and torment, something that very easily arises as a result of living through centuries of loss, fear, and despair. When you have lived long enough to see how easily a life can be destroyed or turned upside down, when you have lived long enough to see how willfully the human species lives in ignorance, when you have lived long enough to watch everything that has ever given you joy die away again and again and again...there comes a time when you decide life no longer holds the same appeal for you because it no longer means what it used to.

It is not childish or ignorant it is just the realization that any existence is better than no existence at all.

Compared with what there is to see of existence and all the possibilities therein, you are an infant. You know nothing whereof you speak. I don't mean to sound rude, but you literally possess a tiny miniscule fraction of awareness regarding the possibilities of existence.

Some examples of existence would make anyone beg for death. That is a fact.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
Not existing removes the possibility of pain and torment, something that very easily arises as a result of living through centuries of loss, fear, and despair.

Talk about throw the baby out with the bathwater!! - remember death is not the absence of feelings it is the absence of self. just like it was before you were born. oblivion. nothingness.

So you are unhappy with the color of your car.. do you: -

1. part exchange it for anew one?
   
2. Take it to be resprayed?
   
3. Blow it up with cemtex?
   

my point is simple, if something is making you unhappy do something about it and if there is nothing you can do about it, why worry about it? but to just destroy it because there is an aspect you don't like is just crazy!!

Compared with what there is to see of existence and all the possibilities therein, you are an infant. You know nothing whereof you speak. I don't mean to sound rude, but you literally possess a tiny miniscule fraction of awareness regarding the possibilities of existence.

Exactly why I want to live a very very very long time. It's this very realization that compels me to live, to not miss a thing to learn all there is to learn. What the heck can one do with a measly 80 years??

Some examples of existence would make anyone beg for death. That is a fact.

Although I understand where you are going with that comment, let me tell you something I read in the papers a few years back.

There was this Rugby player (think American football without the padding) He was injured in a match that left him paralyzed from the neck down. he was a healthy 20 something guy up until that point.

Now because of the way he thought he thought his life was over... so he checked himself into a euthinasia clinic somewhere in Europe and ends his life.

Sad huh??

Want to know something sadder?

a few years later I read a paper stating that a motor neuron by pass had been successful and the possibility of restoring movement to paralyzed people is likely to just a few years away.

So this guy ended his life which is for all time for the sake of a few years of paralysis....

Was that few years of paralysis really so bad a torture that he would prefer not existing at all...

Peace,

Korg,

reply to post by Korg Trinity


So you are saying that life will always hold the same level of delight and fascination no matter what you see, feel, hear, or encounter over the course of your immortality? You believe that your perspective, the view you hold now, would not change over the course of a couple thousand years?

You don't know what you're asking for.

www.cracked.com...

I advise that you carefully read and consider the entirety of the article I have linked above.

Extending human mortality by enormous amounts through technology isn't saying people will be 'condemned to immortality' like a character in some fable.

Its a personal choice (or it should be). If ennui sets in sometime in your 2nd or 3rd century simply stop taking the medication. I think fears in this area are unwarranted.

The potential downsides are more of a practical nature. Its more likely extended life is a commodity you will have to work to purchase [lifetime extension expiring -insert coin to continue]. Can a society stand when the celebrities live forever and the poor get old and die.

Also troublesome would be the concentration of wealth and power individuals could amass over multiple centuries. Its a bad enough problem with multi generational dynasties, it could be worse if the founder never dies off. That would take some thinking about.

The technology would challenge us socially. In the same way other technology does. Thats not a reason to refuse the challenge. Theres nothing particularly glorious and noble about getting old and ceasing to exist against your wishes.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Korg Trinity

 

As a mortal, ignorant, finite being, you couldn't ever hope to understand what eternal youth would do to you. Clearly, you don't understand the full implications of watching everything you love die again and again. It is possible to become tired of living, you know.

Hmmm...You must have FAILED to grasp what
the thread is about...

Why would ANYONE die if everyone can be imortal...How STUPID! is that.

Now, if the issue was that ONLY me could be imortal, then
HELL yes i would say NO..

BUT, that wasnt the issue was it...Soo your point as to watching everyone die
is totaly BUNK...

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by justwokeup

 

I dont understand the negativity. If somebody offers me the ability to live to 500 i'll take it (unless its as a brain floating in a jar like Futurama).

I doubt any of this will come fast enough for me but if it did I would want to see what comes next. I want to be around when we crack the fusion problem. I want to be around to see the dawn of strong AI, the advent of colonisation of the solar system. The list is endless.

Religious people have nothing to fear, you will remain free to choose to die of old age while others live on. Nobody will stop you.

Easy. When life becomes as plentiful as water, people take it less seriously. Imagine what the world would be like if people started to take life for granted, even more than they do now. No one would care about someone's pain and suffering. Emotions would become like food, consumed and forgotten until the next course. Everything would fade away like so many books that have been read so many times you can practically feel it crumbling beneath your fingers, dying within your mind. Nothing lasts forever, but the closer we come, the more we want.

We're never satisfied. And if we attain immortality, we will only use it to immortalize our own vanity and cruelty.

edit on 6-5-2013 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)

And another fail...

Only AGE is plentyful..Not life..
Sure we would live long enough to see cures
for all kinds of sicknesses. And we probly
will be able to replace every part of the body.
But injuries can be fatal to..

Have you found your "souldmate" AI...??

If not...

Listen to this, she/he is living on the other side
of the world from you, or even for the sake of
the argument on another frikkin planet...
And time is the ONLY thing on your side to find her/him.
Call me back when your 99 and dieing and lemme
know if you TRUELY, without any doubts found her/him...

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Korg Trinity

 

So you are saying that life will always hold the same level of delight and fascination no matter what you see, feel, hear, or encounter over the course of your immortality? You believe that your perspective, the view you hold now, would not change over the course of a couple thousand years?

Of course your perception will change over time as you gain more knowledge and become wiser... but that shouldn't make you feel tired of life...

There should be a perception of development of oneself rather than a perception of decay.

Korg.

reply to post by Korg Trinity

Of course your perception will change over time as you gain more knowledge and become wiser... but that shouldn't make you feel tired of life...

There should be a perception of development of oneself rather than a perception of decay.

Physics tells us that nothing lasts forever. There are several perfectly good reasons for this. Did you even bother to read the article I linked?

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Korg Trinity

 

Of course your perception will change over time as you gain more knowledge and become wiser... but that shouldn't make you feel tired of life...

There should be a perception of development of oneself rather than a perception of decay.

Physics tells us that nothing lasts forever. There are several perfectly good reasons for this. Did you even bother to read the article I linked?

Yes I did, though I could counter each negative with a positive if you wish I can post my answers to the reasoning?

Korg.

reply to post by Korg Trinity


Yes, I would appreciate that.

IMO it's a greedy and selfish mindset. Why would you deserve to live that long? It's not ethical. When your 50 and your teeth fall out, your have tons of health problems and have to rely on meds, you should simply die and not waste any more resources. I personally don't want nor expect to live beyond 50.

reply to post by strato


That's why it's called eternal youth. Have problems reading much?

Originally posted by strato
IMO it's a greedy and selfish mindset. Why would you deserve to live that long? It's not ethical. When your 50 and your teeth fall out, your have tons of health problems and have to rely on meds, you should simply die and not waste any more resources. I personally don't want nor expect to live beyond 50.

That is your choice of course... But if you try and stop me from living long.. well then there will be war!

But I am not stating you would life a long time and decay... I'm saying you would live in good health for a very long time.

Peace,

Korg.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Korg Trinity

 

Yes, I would appreciate that.

O.k. here we go then

#5. Evolution Will Turn You Into a Freak

Contrary to what many people believe, humans are still evolving. That's not a big deal if you have the kind of immortality that only lasts 1,000 or 2,000 years, but of course real immortality means you'll still be walking the earth, in your current body, a million years from now.
Science has no idea where future mutations might lead us by that point, so it's anyone's guess what your neighbors will look like in the future.

Their bodies and brains are going to continue to adapt to an ever-changing world. Yours won't. Will your digestive system be able to handle the same food they eat? Will your brain enjoy the same entertainment? Will your non-evolved tongue even be able to speak the languages they speak in the year one million AD? Would an unfrozen caveman be able to do all of that now?

This one is one of the easiest ones to counter...

Firstly I am not stating that just I live for a long time but that we all do, or at least those that choose to. So the idea that somehow we will be left behind some how is just wrong.

What's more is the people whom are living longer will ultimately be the designers of their own realities as technology allows us in a few decades to interact with the world in ways we can only dream of today.. think holodeck a la star trek style.

You may never need to actually interact in any other way other than the way you want as the machine could act as a cultural translator in something akin to telepresence.

#4. Nobody Can Ever Find Out

Let's say some kid goes rummaging around in your basement, finds that witch's old portrait of you and discovers that you are immortal. Word spreads and suddenly you're famous the world over. Sure, a lot of people might not buy the story at first, but folks have become famous for much less.

Sounds pretty sweet, right? Probably get a reality show out of it. But that's just scratching the surface. You're not just going to be famous; you're going to be a god. You have eternal life, which means you must know the secret to eternal life, which means you will immediately be the center of the world's newest and most popular religion. You'll be like a guy revealing himself to be Jesus, and proving it. Why would anyone continue to worship an invisible deity when they have a god walking around amongst them? Each morning your yard will be packed full of several thousand terminally ill people, or parents with their sick kids, asking you to grant them the same immortality you have.

As with my answer above, this would be true if this technology was not available to everyone.

Why would you hide something that is common knowledge?? Why would living long be coveted from you by those that want it if it is available to all that want it??

#3. You're Still Getting Older (Mentally)

We're not saying that if you were to be magically granted immortality, you'd eventually get Alzheimer's anyway--we assume that the Elixir of Life you sipped will keep your brain physically young just like the rest of you. We're saying it won't matter.
Imagine if your cell phone number changed every week, and every week you were forced to memorize the new one. It gets exponentially harder because all of those old numbers are still in your memory, clogging up the works. Then imagine someone asked you to instantly recall the number you had five numbers ago.

That's one reason your memory degrades as you get older. Your brain and its ability to store and recall memories is limited, but the amount of stuff you're asking it to remember keeps piling up over the decades.

This ones just crazy and totally untrue.

Your mind and memory doesn't work like that. There are people out there in their 90's that have better memories than those in their 20's.

This vid is long but is awesome for looking at memory and the brain.



The brain is an amazing thing as it is and can store an amazing amount of information. Even if there was an upper limit on total memory a brain can store... which is very difficult to ascertain in just a few decades we will have created the ability to dump memory to from the brain or to simply upgrade the storage capacity of our brains with implants.

more to cont....

#2. Time Speeds Up Until You're Insane

How many of you out there are old enough to notice time speeding up? For those of you who aren't, can you remember when you were a kid and the school year finally ended and the summer was about to begin? It seemed like you'd been waiting half your life for it, while at the exact same time your mom was going, "Gah! Summer is here ALREADY?! " The fact is your perception of time speeds up with age. It's just math

So when you're 100 years-old, a minute will seem six seconds long compared to a minute when you were 10. If you live for 1,000 years, a 50-year marriage spent with a woman for her entire adult life, will have the same significance to you as the girl you dated for a few years back in college. If you live for 100,000 years, she'd basically be the nameless chick you made out with at a Weezer concert.

Firstly the reason time seems to speed up as you get older has something to do with the internal body clock and the way we measure time in our brains.

Time is actually measured by the brain through the use of an accumulator. neurons fire and the impulses counted by an accumulator, when we address the accumulator to asses how much time has gone by we count how many neurons have fired and this is how much time we perceive to have passed.

As we age the neurons don't fire as much as so when we address the accumulator it says less time has passed than it had for the same period when we were younger.

This is the reason why adrenaline can make time seem to slow down as the brain fires more quickly. this vid is an awesome demo of this.



Now for your number one....

#1. You'll Eventually Get Trapped Somewhere (Forever)

We spend so much time being afraid of death that we forget the one, overwhelming benefit death offers every species: cutting short suffering. Obviously when we talk about immortality we're picturing always being young and healthy, not laying in a bed suffering from lung cancer forever and ever.
But it's a dangerous world out there, and any number of freak accidents could get you stuck somewhere, with no escape, for the rest of time.

Say an earthquake strikes the building that you're in, and it collapses while you're in the basement parking garage. You're pinned under a million tons of concrete and drywall. All you can do is wait for rescue. Only don't count on being rescued, because the people in charge of doing that tend to give up when # gets too hard to dig through and they've pulled enough people out to say, "We tried."

This one highlights something I would agree with in part. If dying by old age or disease has gone just how exactly how would we die.

The truth is you are more than likely going to die of an accident or through some violence of some description. But that is a consequence of a long long life.

As for being trapped for a long long time, yep it's a possibility but how many people do you know that have been trapped in an earthquake??

I'm willing to bet next to none...

So this risk factor although is indeed a reality it is such a small consideration and a risk I certainly would be willing to take to avoid death.

Again this point throws the baby out with the bath water. The negative of the number one is a grain of salt in terms of risk against an elephant of positives, if you follow my meaning.

Anyway...

Peace,

Korg.

reply to post by Korg Trinity


The truth is, you can't know anything about the positives because you don't know there ARE any positives. You are assuming things will always stay the same throughout immortality.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Korg Trinity

 

The truth is, you can't know anything about the positives because you don't know there ARE any positives. You are assuming things will always stay the same throughout immortality.

Nope.. not saying that at all... Quite the opposite in fact.. your negatives are all about the individual staying the same while everything else changes.

I am simply stating that all things will change and adapt. Nothing will remain static.

Korg.

reply to post by Korg Trinity

Nope.. not saying that at all... Quite the opposite in fact.. your negatives are all about the individual staying the same while everything else changes.

I am simply stating that all things will change and adapt. Nothing will remain static.

And I am simply stating that anyone who wants to stay young forever is already young and therefore has no idea what it means to be old. And if you are old and want to be young again forever, then you have some serious appreciation issues. Why is it some people want to live forever and others have no problem with dying?