Many in Muslim world want sharia as law of land: survey

reply to post by logical7

you are wrongly equating Jihad with terrorist activities.

muslims will support violent jihad in extreme circumstances just like citizens of any nation will support war, physically and financially when their country is attacked/invaded.

IF America had been founded as a Muslim country... they would have been glorifying Jihad through films and video games. For example, the film "Red Dawn" and the video game "Homefront" would be about Jihads fought by Americans against Russian or Chinese invading forces.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
don't believe that Islamic law would last very long in a country that upholds blasphemy, ungodliness, fornication, homosexuality, adultery, abortion and all sorts of ungodliness...

This post is an excellent example of why secular rule of law is so important!!!

"blasphemy" being against the law ... that always makes me laugh. Be it coming from a Muslim or a Christian or whatever. One persons version of 'blasphemy' is not someone elses.

Christians believe Jesus is God incarnate. Muslims do not. Does that mean that Christians are correct when some Christians say Muslims are guilty of 'blasphemy' for not accepting Jesus as God? Who decides what is supposedly 'blasphemy' and what isn't? Would you want laws in the land that say that Muslims are guiilty of blasphemy because they dont' accept Jesus as God? Would you want laws in the land that put Muslims to death for 'blasphemy' because they don't accept Jesus as God? That wouldn't be fair .. would it? Neither would Sharia be fair because it would push it's own version of 'blasphemy' on people.

'ungodliness' ... . That goes along the same lines as 'blasphemy'. One persons version of 'ungodliness' is not another persons. It's aburd to write laws against 'ungodliness'.

'Fornication' .... like rape victims who are whipped and put in jail for adultry in Sharia law. No ones business except for the people involved.

'Adultry' ... no ones business except for the people involved.

'homosexuality' ... no one's business except for the people involved.

THANK GOD FOR SECULAR RULE OF LAW! Otherwise, we'd have religious fanatics trying to push THEIR VERSION of reality on everyone else. No thanks. I prefer the year 2013 to the year 600 ...

reply to post by FlyersFan

THANK GOD FOR SECULAR RULE OF LAW!

I guess when people make use of secular law to insult Jesus you would still be cheering for "secular" law.

You don't exactly count as a Christian, with your mocking of Moses and Abraham. So I'll have to take your post the same way as I'd take the post of an atheist.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
I guess when people make use of secular law to insult Jesus you would still be cheering for "secular" law.

Under secular rule of law .. some people do. And yes .. it's better to allow that then to have some religious person dictate what is supposedly 'blasphemy' and what isn't. One persons view of 'blasphemy' is not the same as another.

I noticed that you totally ignored the example I gave about Christians - who are 1/3 of the world's population - believing that the muslim religion is guilty of 'blasphemy' against God because they reject Jesus as God.

So again ... your problem with so called 'blasphemy' .... and your problem with homosexuals .. and your problem with adultry ... and your problem with 'ungodliness' .... it's all YOUR problem and ya'll don't have a right to push your version of what is 'blasphemy' or 'ungodliness' on others because, frankly, your version is easily just as wrong as anyone elses.

You don't exactly count as a Christian, with your mocking of Moses and Abraham. So I'll have to take your post the same way as I'd take the post of an atheist.

Deflection attempt on your part. My religious beliefs are irrelevant.
LOGIC is relevant. My post has it. Sharia does not.

reply to post by FlyersFan


I've gotta pipe in here -not all Christians believe Jesus is god.
Hercules isn't Zeus afteral

reply to post by FlyersFan

Under secular rule of law .. some people do. And yes .. it's better to allow that then to have some religious person dictate what is supposedly 'blasphemy' and what isn't. One persons view of 'blasphemy' is not the same as another.

Jesus didn't live by secular law, which allowed one to mock God.
You are naive in thinking "secular" law is some kind of freedom for Christians. It is not.
Secular law is why non-Christians are stomping over Christians in their own country.... for starters, by banning Christian prayers in schools.

And then you guys moan about how you are all being "persecuted".

the muslim religion is guilty of 'blasphemy' against God because they reject Jesus as God.

Well, Jesus never claimed to be God, and instead prayed to God himself. We've been over this several times before.

So again ... your problem with so called 'blasphemy' .... and your problem with homosexuals .. and your problem with adultry ... and your problem with 'ungodliness' .... it's all YOUR problem and ya'll don't have a right to push your version of what is 'blasphemy' or 'ungodliness' on others

According to the bible... blasphemy, homosexuality, adultery, ungodliness is your problem as well.
But wait, you follow some weird form of Christianity that you have customized to fit in with your personal beliefs regarding, so I guess you could say YOU are exempt. But other Bible believing Christians... not so much.

For those who worship secular laws, may I ask - where do secular laws come from?

They certainly did not just came out of the blue in 1776, or even during when our cave and jungle dwelling ancestors.

As much as atheists would like to deny it, an 'outside' agency gave us - mankind - moral and ethical guidelines to follow so that we may progress and evolved as a race. We mankind were the only ones given, or monkeys and lions would be competting against us in the race to the stars today.

And it is those moral and ethical guidelines that had been INCORPORATED into a nation's constitution, so that a society may be protected, be equal and progress through agreed upon laws.

As we mankind blossomed and expanded, so that must laws continue to grow with us, to ensure the continual peace, prosperity and progress of mankind.

Those laws that are archiac and irrelevant, must be dropped so that it may not hinder our progress, BUT only on the condition that it is irrelevant, TO the survival of society and mankind, AND NOT because of one loud vocal minority that selfishly wants that law scrapped so that they may enjoy themselves today and say screw to the future generations.

Saying our Messiah is a god is blasphemy, and something the vatican have to do about it. Fortunately, two thirds of christians are protestants and do agree with the muslims that our Messiah is a DIVINE TEACHER.

Adultry law had its roots since our civilisation began, when we move out of the caves into cities. Stealing your neighbour's wife is barbaric crime and will only lead to bloodshed as vengence is sought. Thus the necessity for such law, even today.

Most society had formulated Divorce law, so that in the event of adultry, one can easily divorce and need no vengence and bloodshed. BUT, that's only for societies that allow divorce. There are many others that do not do so still. To scrap Adultry laws is to await bloodshed to happen, and the pain and suffering to many innocents related to the family including children.

Homosexuality law is another that had roots since our civilisation began. It is a no-brainer. To allow same sex marriage is to ensure the end of mankind, or the enslavement of fertile young women to become like breeding dogs for the homosexuals to ensure there is economic mass to sustain their lifestyle when they grow old.

I agree that homosexuals should not be discriminated, or bullied. They too are human. But there is a line drawn when they want marriage and its rights. It would only lead to disaster later on when homosexuals aged.

Today, due to society's reticience on homosexuality, homosexuals agenda to convert heterosexuals to their cause is limited. But it will change when even marriage is allowed them, for like any social group, it is in their nature to protect its right, and the way to do so is to influence the majority in everyway - media and education of our young, to such lifestyle.

It will thus eventually lead to disasters, which unfortunately, not many are far-sighted enough to watch out for.

Most of these 2 points as well as many others, such as legalized drug consumption, etc had invaded into western secular laws, that many whom had been unaware, will only lead to the moral and ethical deprivation of society and nation, instead of attempting to fix our society for all to live in peace and harmony as our ancestors had been taught to.

Thus, can anyone who is rational, who has a family and stakes in the nation, wonders why muslims will choose Shariah law as a means whereby humanity can be retuned to its original moral and ethical codes, as they do seem pretty strict but does attempts to make everyone and the next generations to be equal and fair to progress and evolve, than the sadly humankind regressing western secular law?

I am a product of the West. My aim here on this post is not to show that shariah law is better than western secular law, but only to show the shortcommings of our egalitarian secularism, whereby instead of protecting the current and future generations, we had only been stupidly listening to the loud and vocal minority to screw the future and live just for today. May we retune back or only disaster to society awaits.

Originally posted by MaxSteiner
I've gotta pipe in here -not all Christians believe Jesus is god.

The VAST majority do. It's in their creed.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
Jesus didn't live by secular law, which allowed one to mock God.

So what?

You are naive in thinking "secular" law is some kind of freedom for Christians.

Secular law keeps everyone free from people like you who want to push their religions onto others. Secular law keeps us all safe from Sharia .. keeps us safe from over zealous Christian rule of law over the land .. keeps us safe from __________ (fill in religious hoooooey of choice).

According to the bible... blasphemy, homosexuality, adultery, ungodliness is your problem as well.

Again .. so what? It does not matter what the bible says. No one should be forced to follow what the bible says anymore than be forced to follow what that Qu'ran of yours says.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
Well, Jesus never claimed to be God, and instead prayed to God himself. We've been over this several times before.

Yes we've been over it a million times. And you have been shown a million times that He did indeed claim to be one with God the Father. But because that biblical fact blows your religion out of the water ... you refuse to see it.

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
For those who worship secular laws, may I ask - where do secular laws come from?

Irrelevant. The fact is that secular rule of law protects us all from having to live under the yoke of someone else's religious beliefs. It is the only fair law. It is the only safe law.

Saying our Messiah is a god is blasphemy,

Says you. The VAST MAJORITY of Christians disagree.

So, seekeroftruth, how would you like to have religious law be the law of the land? Considering that the vast majority of the 2 billion Christians on the planet believe Jesus is God ... how would you like to see laws in this country stating that to say otherwise is 'blasphemy' and that you will be put in jail and executed for saying that Jesus isn't God??

Would you like that? No?

How about this .. how would you like a law in this country stating that you must publically state that Muhammad was a real prophet of God and that he wasn't delusional when he claimed those 'revelations' .. and that if you dont' state that then you'll be tossed in jail and then executed for 'blasphemy'??

Would you like that? No?

Then thank your lucky stars that we have secular rule of law.

One persons' version of truth is another persons version of 'blasphemy'.

Stupid word .. 'blasphemy' ...
No one knows what it is. Not really.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Yes we've been over it a million times. And you have been shown a million times that He did indeed claim to be one with God the Father. But because that biblical fact blows your religion out of the water ... you refuse to see it.

He is indeed 'one with God the Father', BUT NOT what you blasphemously claimed that 'he is god'. There is a difference between the 2.

Being one with God the Father is to follow our common Creator's teachings and be in accord with Him as our Messiah was sent to teach us all, which is agreed by muslims.

'He is God' as you blasphemously claimed, is another matter which est 2/3 of worldwide christians will dispute, inclulding muslims who had been taught by prophet Muhammad to revere him and other prophets of the Book as well. for their teachings and central tenets are the same as they came from the same source, which sadly, some who claimed to be muslim do not do so.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

1. So, seekeroftruth, how would you like to have religious law be the law of the land? Considering that the vast majority of the 2 billion Christians on the planet believe Jesus is God ... how would you like to see laws in this country stating that to say otherwise is 'blasphemy' and that you will be put in jail and executed for saying that Jesus isn't God??

Would you like that? No?

2. How about this .. how would you like a law in this country stating that you must publically state that Muhammad was a real prophet of God and that he wasn't delusional when he claimed those 'revelations' .. and that if you dont' state that then you'll be tossed in jail and then executed for 'blasphemy'??

Would you like that? No?

Then thank your lucky stars that we have secular rule of law.

One persons' version of truth is another persons version of 'blasphemy'.

Stupid word .. 'blasphemy' ...

No one knows what it is. Not really.

1. As a christian, if I am tossed into jail for following the teachings of our Messiah, then by all means do so. What is jail compared to the sufferings and pain our Messiah had to go through inorder to help mankind?


2. The only reason why I would thank secular laws is that it allows freedom of worship. Even in Egypt today, the land of the Muslim Brotherhood, allows that.

And I thank secular laws so that atheists or gnostics, whom are only fellow human brothers and sisters whom have yet to know our common Creator on a personal level, as it is meant to, get to live free.

And also, it was religion's moral and ethical guidelines that are incorported into secular laws, properly defined, so that all differences within humanity may come together as a society to achieve common goals and aims in life.

I doubt if I had change your mindset, for egos are often fragile and need defensive walls to protect, even if it is constructed upon by falsehoods and ignorances. My only hope is that the ignorant you may take your time to ponder over what I had said, read more widely to understand and comprehend real truths to deny your own fallacies and limitations.

Cheers.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

2. The only reason why I would thank secular laws is that it allows freedom of worship.

Yes, but the god that's worshipped first and foremost in the world today is mammon. It doesn't matter what god people pay lip service to, when the money is debauched, morals eagerly hop on board for the ride to hell, which is where we're at, busily stoking the coals with torches made of paper money. Nothing has value.

Surely, the random, anything goes, moral relativism POV is very useful to the amoral dreams of the self involved. There you can justify anything. On the other hand, with the antithetical perspective, you have to change continuously to meet a higher standard. You have to lose pieces of what you formerly believed was yourself but which was only ballast and anchors in a world of illusion. You have to be willing to depart from the things that break your heart, even though it might feel like you are going in reverse most of the time.

www.thetruthseeker.co.uk...

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
He is indeed 'one with God the Father', BUT NOT what you blasphemously claimed that 'he is god'.

1 - That's YOUR interpretation. MOST Christians disagree with you.
2 - What you call 'blasphemy' is not 'blasphemy'.
3 - What the Muslims think of Jesus is irrelevant to Christians. Their text was invented 600+ years after jesus walked the earth and is highly contradictory to the historical documents of Jesus time period (the gospels).

As i said .. one person's 'blasphemy' is another persons truth .. and one persons truth is another persons' 'blasphemy'.

That's why it is RIDICULOUS to scream 'blasphemy' ... and I get a chuckle when ever anyone accuses others of it as you just have. It's ABSURD. You have no idea what blasphemy is. Neither do the muslims posting on here. Everyone has a different idea of what 'blasphemy' is and to allow any of those people who scream 'blasphemy' to impose their religious ideas on others through Sharia or any other religious law of the land is ignorant and INSANE.

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
I doubt if I had change your mindset, for egos are often fragile and need defensive walls to protect, even if it is constructed upon by falsehoods and ignorances. My only hope is that the ignorant you may take your time to ponder over what I had said, read more widely to understand and comprehend real truths to deny your own fallacies and limitations.

blah blah insults and false accusations of my ego being involved blah blah ....

Strictly the facts ...

Religion has should NOT be incorporated into the laws to run the country.
Secular rule of law is the only fair law.
Secular rule of law protects everyone from the ridiculous archaic religious laws of Sharia and extreme Christianity (and others).

People who want laws against 'blasphemy' are ridiculous.
Blasphemy can't even be defined or agreed upon.
This isn't the year 600 .. it's 2013. We are not ignorant peasants.

reply to post by FlyersFan

This isn't the year 600 .. it's 2013. We are not ignorant peasants.

Yes, we are.

80 percent of NY high school graduates are functionally illiterate.
www.americanthinker.com...

“One-Third of Fourth Graders are Functionally Illiterate”
townhall.com...

as many as 20 percent of American adults may be functionally illiterate
www.npr.org...

Peasants just gotta learn how to sign their name on the dotted line so they can waive all those rights someone told them they have and they're good to go.

reply to post by FlyersFan


I am sadden that despite my efforts and time for you, you still continue to wallow in the comfort of your fallacies, and worse, spout illogical self centred beliefs.

But I do pardon you, for the insignificant nobody me know human nature well. As mentioned, you need the defensive walls of lies and falsehoods to protect your fragile ego, and being an empath, you have my pity, not that you will ever appreciate anyway.

As to the rest of your post, there is nothing worthy of a response, as falsehood and ignorances are your comfort and I have not the heart to pull the rug out of you.

May you and your kind enjoy your delusions.

Cheers.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Well that's true, but 2.2% don't

As for the Secular being the only fair law, we don't have that in the UK, and I'd say our political system is as fair as yours, we've got a state religion and everything.

Matthew 19:17, Mark 10:18
And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.

Matthew 27:46, Mark 15:34
My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

Mark 16:19
So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.

John 8:40
But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God.

John 14:28
My Father is greater than I.

John 20:17
I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

Acts 17:31
Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

1 Corinthians 11:3
The head of Christ is God.

1 Corinthians 15:28
And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

Colossians 3:1
Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.

1 Timothy 2:5
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

1 Peter 3:21-22
Jesus Christ: who is ... on the the right hand of God.

I don't want sharia law, but if I was at the end of the thug law in London that they are I think I might.

reply to post by ANOK


There's bad apple Officers in every city.

That said, I still wouldn't want a Religious World Order. Its been tried.