Aircraft Carriers have been obsolete for a long time

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by CarbonBase
reply to post by Jepic

 

Really? How many destroyers does it take to equal the lifting capacity of a CVN? And, if that was the case, why didn't the US send ALL of it's destroyers to Haiti after the Earthquake? Personally, I don't give a lot of 'credit' to any warship in time of conflict. They're expendable. Question is, How much damage do you think that CVN is going to inflict against say, 10 destroyers, before the destroyers can take the CVN out? Just the CVN against the destroyers, and you can't use US destroyers.

Let's be conservative and say the destroyer has 100 missiles. A CVN has between 75 and 90 aircraft. Now it's very unlikely that the CVN will be able to get all 90 aircraft airborne before the missiles hit. Let's do the math. The carrier is out. The rest of the group is potatoes. I'll lose a destroyer. Okay, two at most with a third badly damaged but still able to get to port. I'll give you that. Your group is completely in the bottom though.

lol your dumb do all of the missiles on your destroyer/s fire like a video game instantly one after the other because they were all loaded in there tubes?? haha wow man no logic. all child hood imagination.

Also have you forgotten about the aircraft always flying patrol? 2 of your destroyers would have already been damaged and possibly sunk before you even came into range. don't forget about attack helicopters with anti armor missiles, i just don't think you can comprehend how overbearing a carriers potentially combat output is, its not a goddamn civilian airport those aircraft are coming out faster than you think.

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Yes. Missiles boxes can pretty much fire one after the other.

And I think you got it all turned around. Those aircraft including the helicopters would be destroyed before they were close enough to fire.

Those missiles are coming out and at you even faster than your aircraft. Much, much faster. In fact I don't think you comprehend how fast compared to your aircraft.

You've also selective memory i see, those missiles attacking the aircraft lifting off still have to contend with the carriers missile defenses. You think a carrier would let that happen, the coordination you praise for an effective destroyer formation is inherent in a carriers combat logistics and armaments, there is absolutely nothing you can do short of ramming a carrier with the destroyer itself lol. back to viking tactics eyy? dude just stop....

The carriers missile defenses are absolute rubbish compared to that of a destroyer fleet. Simply, you do the math. A destroyer has around 100 missiles. There are ten in a fleet. That would be a 1000 projectiles overwhelming your carrier defenses. There is nothing you will be doing other than swimming. Swimming for shark entertainment if you gave the fleet a hard time.

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
reply to post by Jepic

 

You really think the air power from the Aircraft carriers , the subs, the other navy destroyers that are in that flotila would let that enemy destroyer get close enough to sing the Aircraft carrier?

You really think the destroyer fleet would let the carrier group get close enough to them?

lol again, what is the destroyer group gonna "reach out and touch" the carrier with? missiles? you mean those ones the laser targeting system is playing pong with? lol

Yea... You forgot about the deployed smoke screen over your carrier group again...

Originally posted by CarbonBase
reply to post by MConnalley

 

Nice. Also, smoke doesn't affect a laser if you build it right. How about 1,000,000 destroyers vs The U.S.S. Enterprise (The star trek one I mean), that's about as realistic as the original argument. Man, the morphine is really kicking in now! How about Godzilla vs destroyers. I'm putting my money on Godzilla, and not the crappy one that got killed by harpoons! I'm talking about the 300 ft tall, reactor snorting bad-ass from the epic Japanese films!

Yes it does affect lasers. Simple thing I've learnt in science experiments. For any potential power a laser might have, there is a certain smoke density that will block the beam.

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley
Jepic, do you not know how many counters to missile technology there is? There's missile to missile systems, computer targeted and tracking Automated weapon platforms, and last but not least my favorite, lasers buddy, have you not read about the latest news on our lasers, they are designed to bring down drones and missiles. Missiles are also quickly becoming a weapon of the past, I want to watch your grin as you hit that missile fire button on your all powerful destroyer hahaha and watch as it blows up for seemingly no reason, because the new Navy lasers are not visible and then you slowly boil from a laser attack to the Bridge of your ship, no more command crew and a capturable ship intact and ready to be escorted to the nearest allied port.. :] easy.

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Good luck getting through the smoke screen with your new laser which by the way is far from being the likes of Star Trek or Star Wars.

Lasers are still in the infant stages. They won't help much against consolidated missile technology.

What smokescreen, were have you been, in a hole, laser tech has already went to elementary school and is now getting a phd, its not visible light spectrum, its infrared, the only people you would be blinding is yourself lol just stop trying you clearly don't know what your talking about please just stop, your making people dumber.

Lol a carrier can troll you and blow up each hundred thousand dollar missile with a 1 dollar a pop laser that can continue firing if need be,

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Too bad it has nothing to with spectrum. At the end of the day it's still particles in the air that can be blocked by putting even more particles in the air such as a heavy smokescreen.

Light is not made of particles its frequency, like a radio wave, just the "signal" is oscillating so quickly it becomes visible as light, infrared being a frequency that it oscillates at a point which makes it not visible, ever wonder why they use yellow for fog lights? the yellow light is slower than standard white light or any other color of light so it doesn't bounce around quickly in fog like normal car headlights do and create bloom blindness, yellow light is slow therefore allowing you to see more detail.

reply to post by Jepic

First you have to get within range of the aircraft carrier with your destroyer...... and my awacs can find you, my attack plane can reach out and touch you from a long way away..... and the refueling planes make it even further. Fox 1, Fox 2 standoff attack missiles against your destroyer originally from my aircraft carrier far, far awayyyyyyy

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley
Jepic, do you not know how many counters to missile technology there is? There's missile to missile systems, computer targeted and tracking Automated weapon platforms, and last but not least my favorite, lasers buddy, have you not read about the latest news on our lasers, they are designed to bring down drones and missiles. Missiles are also quickly becoming a weapon of the past, I want to watch your grin as you hit that missile fire button on your all powerful destroyer hahaha and watch as it blows up for seemingly no reason, because the new Navy lasers are not visible and then you slowly boil from a laser attack to the Bridge of your ship, no more command crew and a capturable ship intact and ready to be escorted to the nearest allied port.. :] easy.

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Good luck getting through the smoke screen with your new laser which by the way is far from being the likes of Star Trek or Star Wars.

Lasers are still in the infant stages. They won't help much against consolidated missile technology.

What smokescreen, were have you been, in a hole, laser tech has already went to elementary school and is now getting a phd, its not visible light spectrum, its infrared, the only people you would be blinding is yourself lol just stop trying you clearly don't know what your talking about please just stop, your making people dumber.

Lol a carrier can troll you and blow up each hundred thousand dollar missile with a 1 dollar a pop laser that can continue firing if need be,

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Too bad it has nothing to with spectrum. At the end of the day it's still particles in the air that can be blocked by putting even more particles in the air such as a heavy smokescreen.

first of all a smokescreen even if deployed would dissipate almost immediately in open ocean, you know, wind :] also again who the hell has an "air burst" smoke launcher " directional at that, you almost need a targeting computer, for what? to fire smoke? lol dude, the infeasibility in your mind is well, mind boggling.

Also look up "phalax (CIWS)"

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Depending on the wind current and speed, you can adjust smoke guns accordingly.

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
reply to post by Jepic

 

You really think the air power from the Aircraft carriers , the subs, the other navy destroyers that are in that flotila would let that enemy destroyer get close enough to sing the Aircraft carrier?

You really think the destroyer fleet would let the carrier group get close enough to them?

lol again, what is the destroyer group gonna "reach out and touch" the carrier with? missiles? you mean those ones the laser targeting system is playing pong with? lol

Yea... You forgot about the deployed smoke screen over your carrier group again...

first of all the destroyers are no were near the carrier, the imaginary smokescreen, lol i cant believe im having to explain this over and over you slow person, the missile don't fire like a gun straight they ascend then descend, is the a smokescreen in the sky to? lol how prosperous you make it all out to be, just stop.

also what the hell are you talking about a 1000 missles? wtf? again its not a bloody videogame there not all firing at once and even the once that are loaded are only 6 of them that means after your volley, you have to reload them. theres not a 1000 god damnit.

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by CarbonBase
reply to post by Agit8dChop

 

Good call. Plus the carrier can control ALL weapons on it's escorts. Plus, the carrier would have constant tracking and targeting data on the 'destroyers' no matter where it was on Earth,. Plus, the OP stated that destroyers are 'faster' than 'carriers' (INSTANT FAIL). Plus, carriers actually exist, while the 'destroyers' this poster is talking about DO NOT!

We are talking hypothetical here of course. It's not like I'm speaking of space battleships against carriergroups. I'm talking a realistice platform.

Well if yours can do it, the destroyer fleet could also be "tracking and targeting data on the carrier group no matter where they are on Earth."

And destroyers are faster than aircraft carriers (not that it matters much) as they can go above 30 knots while a carrier can only go up to 30 knots.

What does it matter that there faster? only that they would be rushing to there deaths. and only if the destroyers of jepic land had satellites in space transmitting the data, assuming American black projects haven't "shot down" all of you data and navigational satellites. hell we could hack those satellites potentially to transmit false data to your destroyer group and set a trap.

I'm talking about a hypothetical military on par with that of the US. Imagine it's a revitalised Russia we are talking about here. So satellites are in the game.

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley
Jepic, do you not know how many counters to missile technology there is? There's missile to missile systems, computer targeted and tracking Automated weapon platforms, and last but not least my favorite, lasers buddy, have you not read about the latest news on our lasers, they are designed to bring down drones and missiles. Missiles are also quickly becoming a weapon of the past, I want to watch your grin as you hit that missile fire button on your all powerful destroyer hahaha and watch as it blows up for seemingly no reason, because the new Navy lasers are not visible and then you slowly boil from a laser attack to the Bridge of your ship, no more command crew and a capturable ship intact and ready to be escorted to the nearest allied port.. :] easy.

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Good luck getting through the smoke screen with your new laser which by the way is far from being the likes of Star Trek or Star Wars.

Lasers are still in the infant stages. They won't help much against consolidated missile technology.

What smokescreen, were have you been, in a hole, laser tech has already went to elementary school and is now getting a phd, its not visible light spectrum, its infrared, the only people you would be blinding is yourself lol just stop trying you clearly don't know what your talking about please just stop, your making people dumber.

Lol a carrier can troll you and blow up each hundred thousand dollar missile with a 1 dollar a pop laser that can continue firing if need be,

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Too bad it has nothing to with spectrum. At the end of the day it's still particles in the air that can be blocked by putting even more particles in the air such as a heavy smokescreen.

first of all a smokescreen even if deployed would dissipate almost immediately in open ocean, you know, wind :] also again who the hell has an "air burst" smoke launcher " directional at that, you almost need a targeting computer, for what? to fire smoke? lol dude, the infeasibility in your mind is well, mind boggling.

Also look up "phalax (CIWS)"

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Depending on the wind current and speed, you can adjust smoke guns accordingly.

yeah in jepics fantasy land were destroyers are equipped with smoke launchers that you know perfectly explode above the water magically in the right spot. No jepic, theres no smoke launchers, there no sweet spot were the wind will carry it to the right place, all that wind is gonna do is carry it away.

look any hypothetical nation that wishes to survive a war with us will match us in strength not throw mass numbers of inferior technology at them

The invention of the nuclear bomb actually made most weaponry obsolete. But since they are only used as deterrents, countries still had to rely on other means to achieve military goals.

An aircraft carrier is impressive when it's parked off someone's coast, but more then that, it takes up a large chunk of ocean, and it's planes are able to be up in the air from a possibly better location then they otherwise would have taken off from. Which would help in a blockade. Aircraft carriers also are fairly weakly defended themselves, so they generally travel with their own personal armada to protect them.

Also, China has recently invested in several aircraft carriers, granted their first one was a refurbished USSR one, it still shows that they are spending billions learning how to make their own carriers. While they may be obsolete nowadays with planes that like go into warp drive, lol, they still serve a military purpose.

I guess this is all speculation on my part

Originally posted by CarbonBase
reply to post by Jepic

 

Ok, whatever you say. But if you think a CVN can only manage to push 30 knots, it tells me what I need to know. Anyway, what kind of destroyer's did you say the carrier would be facing again? Oh, that's right you didn't !

A destroyer with 10 VLS boxes. 20 artillery guns on each side.
The whole electronic/cyber warfare package.

I've been away for a bit but this thread is getting pretty wild.

A carriers speed is classified after 30 knots

A thousand missles at once! Really?! Maybe from a thousand ships.

There isn't much of a chance that your "fleet" of destoyers will ever make it back home.

reply to post by Jepic


OK. The only thing I can think of is this is some sort of alternative reality Universe, and that it's time for more morphine! 20 artillery guns on each side? Sounds dangerous! Are they all C+ cannons or rail guns? It would help to know. By the way, the airplanes on my carrier are powered by UWTB, so they are INVINCIBLE! AwwwwwHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA ! Regards, Capt Nemo !

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley
Jepic, do you not know how many counters to missile technology there is? There's missile to missile systems, computer targeted and tracking Automated weapon platforms, and last but not least my favorite, lasers buddy, have you not read about the latest news on our lasers, they are designed to bring down drones and missiles. Missiles are also quickly becoming a weapon of the past, I want to watch your grin as you hit that missile fire button on your all powerful destroyer hahaha and watch as it blows up for seemingly no reason, because the new Navy lasers are not visible and then you slowly boil from a laser attack to the Bridge of your ship, no more command crew and a capturable ship intact and ready to be escorted to the nearest allied port.. :] easy.

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Good luck getting through the smoke screen with your new laser which by the way is far from being the likes of Star Trek or Star Wars.

Lasers are still in the infant stages. They won't help much against consolidated missile technology.

What smokescreen, were have you been, in a hole, laser tech has already went to elementary school and is now getting a phd, its not visible light spectrum, its infrared, the only people you would be blinding is yourself lol just stop trying you clearly don't know what your talking about please just stop, your making people dumber.

Lol a carrier can troll you and blow up each hundred thousand dollar missile with a 1 dollar a pop laser that can continue firing if need be,

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Too bad it has nothing to with spectrum. At the end of the day it's still particles in the air that can be blocked by putting even more particles in the air such as a heavy smokescreen.

Light is not made of particles its frequency, like a radio wave, just the "signal" is oscillating so quickly it becomes visible as light, infrared being a frequency that it oscillates at a point which makes it not visible, ever wonder why they use yellow for fog lights? the yellow light is slower than standard white light or any other color of light so it doesn't bounce around quickly in fog like normal car headlights do and create bloom blindness, yellow light is slow therefore allowing you to see more detail.

What light is made of is still a debate even nowadays. Some say it's particles, other waves. Others even say it's made of both. No one is sure. Point is any beam of any kind can be stopped with a smoke screen of certain density and aerosols.

Originally posted by jaxnmarko
reply to post by Jepic

 

First you have to get within range of the aircraft carrier with your destroyer...... and my awacs can find you, my attack plane can reach out and touch you from a long way away..... and the refueling planes make it even further. Fox 1, Fox 2 standoff attack missiles against your destroyer originally from my aircraft carrier far, far awayyyyyyy

I'll meet you with some missile while you are still out of range. AWACS and aircraft gone. Satellite guided munitions baby.

reply to post by MConnalley


Its futile, he went from the original OP in a real time situation.....

To all the sudden having made up technologies on his destroyers..........

Hes clearly trolling, or clearly.....ummm.....having a hard time understanding the reality of naval warfare....

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
reply to post by Jepic

 

You really think the air power from the Aircraft carriers , the subs, the other navy destroyers that are in that flotila would let that enemy destroyer get close enough to sing the Aircraft carrier?

You really think the destroyer fleet would let the carrier group get close enough to them?

lol again, what is the destroyer group gonna "reach out and touch" the carrier with? missiles? you mean those ones the laser targeting system is playing pong with? lol

Yea... You forgot about the deployed smoke screen over your carrier group again...

first of all the destroyers are no were near the carrier, the imaginary smokescreen, lol i cant believe im having to explain this over and over you slow person, the missile don't fire like a gun straight they ascend then descend, is the a smokescreen in the sky to? lol how prosperous you make it all out to be, just stop.

also what the hell are you talking about a 1000 missles? wtf? again its not a bloody videogame there not all firing at once and even the once that are loaded are only 6 of them that means after your volley, you have to reload them. theres not a 1000 god damnit.

No they don't. Cruise missiles have a pretty wide range of movement. And you still don't get it. The smoke screen is around your carrier group. Artillery takes care of that.

And when I meant 10 VLS boxes, it's just that. A VLS box contains 10 tubes. All 10 tubes loaded and ready to go at any time.

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by MConnalley
Jepic, do you not know how many counters to missile technology there is? There's missile to missile systems, computer targeted and tracking Automated weapon platforms, and last but not least my favorite, lasers buddy, have you not read about the latest news on our lasers, they are designed to bring down drones and missiles. Missiles are also quickly becoming a weapon of the past, I want to watch your grin as you hit that missile fire button on your all powerful destroyer hahaha and watch as it blows up for seemingly no reason, because the new Navy lasers are not visible and then you slowly boil from a laser attack to the Bridge of your ship, no more command crew and a capturable ship intact and ready to be escorted to the nearest allied port.. :] easy.

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Good luck getting through the smoke screen with your new laser which by the way is far from being the likes of Star Trek or Star Wars.

Lasers are still in the infant stages. They won't help much against consolidated missile technology.

What smokescreen, were have you been, in a hole, laser tech has already went to elementary school and is now getting a phd, its not visible light spectrum, its infrared, the only people you would be blinding is yourself lol just stop trying you clearly don't know what your talking about please just stop, your making people dumber.

Lol a carrier can troll you and blow up each hundred thousand dollar missile with a 1 dollar a pop laser that can continue firing if need be,

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Too bad it has nothing to with spectrum. At the end of the day it's still particles in the air that can be blocked by putting even more particles in the air such as a heavy smokescreen.

first of all a smokescreen even if deployed would dissipate almost immediately in open ocean, you know, wind :] also again who the hell has an "air burst" smoke launcher " directional at that, you almost need a targeting computer, for what? to fire smoke? lol dude, the infeasibility in your mind is well, mind boggling.

Also look up "phalax (CIWS)"

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

Depending on the wind current and speed, you can adjust smoke guns accordingly.

yeah in jepics fantasy land were destroyers are equipped with smoke launchers that you know perfectly explode above the water magically in the right spot. No jepic, theres no smoke launchers, there no sweet spot were the wind will carry it to the right place, all that wind is gonna do is carry it away.

look any hypothetical nation that wishes to survive a war with us will match us in strength not throw mass numbers of inferior technology at them

edit on 24-4-2013 by MConnalley because: (no reason given)

I think you are terribly underestimating the precision of modern weapon systems. Yes you can be assured that those guns will lay the smoke down just right and sweet boy.

lol just STFU! im done here, there's is no enlightening you. Its been bad real bad

reply to post by Jepic


Carrier group?

what a sec your saying a destroyer could bring down a carrier, there fore the destroyer must be close enough to the carrier to hit it.

... so, why all of a sudden is the carrier the one trying to get within range for a destroyer? Who's chasing who here?

also, the carrier itself might not catch the destroyer, but his jets would.