Should we take eggs from aborted babies?

Double post

Originally posted by Honor93
reply to post by newcovenant

 

so, which "years ago" ??
please, be specific as this ought to be good.

Years ago every child was accounted for and had a chance of growing up "normal" because someone took care of them.

any idea when the first orphanage opened in the US ?
but you're right, all those kids were accounted for and provided a chance of growing up "normal", weren't they?

When both parents started working and welfare increased families and kids got lost in the shuffle we lost track of a generation and they came back to haunt us.

maybe you're correct to some extent cause that same 'lost generation' is now sitting in the position of POTUS and cabinet ... but yeah, they were lost in the shuffle alright

If birth control were part of a reasonable health care package

what's the point when it is already free to everyone who wants it ?

The one that's getting worse thanks to slow learners and fast forgetters.

you said it, not i

Uh yeah. I was adopted from an orphanage. Lots of kids were in the 50's. When the first one opened is kind of nothing to do with the subject. Not all of them were perfect and there are some horror stories but for the most part the orphanages, foundling homes and Catholic charities kept the babies from unimaginably worse fates that will and do, befall children today. And by years ago, I am talking about 40-50. When kids didn't have to worry about getting snatched off the streets and could walk to the store by themselves. Sure, there were predators but they were few and far between. Not a dime a dozen like today. The rest of your comments are just typical and really don't deserve the respect of a reply.

Should we take eggs from aborted babies?

OMG!!! This is wrong on so many levels. I just puked in my mouth a little.

Oh the things these souless humans come up with. Seriously!!!
No wonder God is ready to destroy this system.

Its screwed beyond repair.

I would think being that person born of an aborted fetal egg would make for some serious bad juju.
What a curse one would gave on their shoulders and maybe not even realize it.

This is sick. Just flat out sick. Someone please put these scientists in nut houses!!!

reply to post by newcovenant

oh no ya don't, you said it, now prove it.
which years were sooooo grand that all of the children were PROVIDED a chance at a 'normal' childhood ???

yes, i'm well aware of the abuses endured in orphanages, the point was for you to clarify YOUR statement. please proceed or admit your error. i simply dispute your assertion.

40 or 50 yrs ago would allude to the volume of abuse getting attention, not its beginnings.

in the last 60+ yrs, we've not had such 'safety', it's an illusion.
yes, we walked to school, the stores, the bowling alley, the neighbors without many of the concerns of today, however, child snatching has always been a problem.

remember the show "Most Wanted" ?
that whole show developed/resulted from a child abduction.
(Adam Walsh)

just typical ???
do you mean truthful ? hence you cannot formulate a reply ?

reply to post by adjensen

What magic happens that turns a non-human being into a human being?

The answer differs among people, but for me, what happens is one of the most magical things in our world. The birth of sentience/consciousness. And I think this happens no sooner than 5th month of pregnancy.

Are you saying that any offspring from these harvested eggs would not be a human, because its mother was not a human?

It is biologically human, but not a human being/person.

In addition, the court has upheld the right of prosecutors to charge those who, outside of the procedure of abortion, cause harm or death to the unborn. Witness d-bag Scott Peterson.

The result? In the United States, a human being is defined as someone who is wanted.

Defend that.

Foetal homicide laws also usually depend on trimester. But you are right, it is strange that different laws sometimes apply based on whether the unborn is wanted or not. The legislation should be harmonised. Consistency is not something laws are good at, tough, this is true for many other areas.

I am probably going to get flamed for this post, nontheless I will post it.

First of all about the aborted fetus eggs. Is the aborted fetus considered human or not?
If it is then it should not be aborted and even if it is it has had no say in what(if anything) the body can be used for, We just should not use parts from humans who have had no say and worst no chance to say no.

And if it is not considered human? The child developed from that egg has a non human mother? Get that a human with a non human mother? Where will that take us? One could argue that since the mother is non human so is the child? What then? A new sub species?

What is the difference than of using other non human eggs? From genetic engineering? Yeah then we will start with genetically engineered eggs and sperm, which would lead to everyone wanting a "perfect human" which would be genetically engineered, and at the end would lead to everyone on earth being genetic siblings and end genetic diversity leaving humanity at the which of one unchecked disease to basically end humanity.

If we ever go down this route it will come back to bite us one time, not in one year or ten but maybe in 200, 500 or 1000 years hence, but what do you care heh? what does anyone care? you wont be here, your kids wont be here probably neither your grandkids so why bother? whoever is here can take care of it, so why bother?

Oh yeah someone posted it costs $30,000 to adopt one child? what the hell? Who was insane enough to put such a price tag on it? regardless of what it is used for, if the adopters to not have to pay that it could provide for the child for at least a few years

Just to put this here while I am at it I am anti-abortion (except in rape cases, or question of survival of the mother) , The mother HAD a choice not to get pregnant and since they did they HAVE a responsibility to carry to term and to raise the child AND the father also HAS the responsibility to provide support till the child grows up.

If they don't I don't consider them human.

If I was in a position to do so If anyone knowingly got pregnant and wanted to have abortion, it would be allowed but she would be sterilized at the same time, and any father that did not provide support for the child (or wanted the mother to have an abortion) would be sterilized. No sense letting a murderer murder more than once.

Another ethical point to consider. Suppose that scientists were able to harvest from any aborted fetus and it just happened to be the produce of a rape, since the rape/incest thing is always thrown out there as reasons to keep abortions legal. wouldn't seeing all these rapist's grandchildren be a form of punishment to the original victim?

But I think the most ethical question of all is that in very few cases are the family medical histories of both parents of the aborted child readily available. Often times the father is never mentioned. And in cases of incest, the would be child may have be prone to all sorts of genetic defects that may have made it unviable in the first place. So wouldn't we potentially be narrowing our gene pool and introducing unintended consequences to our survivability as a species?

Many sci-fi stories are based on aliens that can no long have children because there is not enough variance in DNA to continue the species. Usually due to cloning and designer babies that their science allowed. Isn't this a step in the same direction?

reply to post by kaleshwarchand777


I think the way you expressed concern about what could be potentially dangerous in the future will be ignored the same way people deny climate change. Ya know they just do not see it as their problem their quick fix now is far more important to them than future repercussions form it. They just do not care as long as they get theirs now.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
What is terrible about it? We already use stem cells from aborted fetuses. I mean, they're dead. It's not going to hurt them. It's the same as being a doner. Is that disgusting, too?

The murdered children who are being raped of their eggs are NOT doners.
They are murder victims. They had their lives stolen from them.
And now they are going to have THEIR eggs stolen from them as well.
Those eggs were the future children of those murdered children.

Talk about GHOULISH!

Do you think it would be okay if you were murdered and your children were ripped away from you just to be experimented on in a lab or to be raised by strangers?? Would that be okay?

reply to post by FlyersFan


Even if we were going by your assumption that abortion is murder, are you implying we should outlaw organ donations by murder victims? How is mode of death relevant for whether donation of something from already dead body is ethical or not?

reply to post by Maslo


Seriously? You don't see a problem with killing someone and then stealing what is most precious to humans .. their (potential) offspring? Do any of us want our children stolen from us to be experimented on .. or stolen from us to be adopted by others??

We aren't talking about taking a kidney from a murder victim (that's a good topic but for a different thread). We are talking about something sacred and personal ... human eggs stolen from a person who won't have a say in it at all. It's THEIR EGGS .. not ours.

How would you feel if you were strapped down and murdered and then your children or eggs were stolen from you and used as experiments or used to grow other humans that would be given up for adoption?

It's the ULTIMATE VIOLATION ...
It's rape and murder and theft and total disregard for that dead child ...
This behavior is for GHOULS .. not human beings. It's beyond evil.

Originally posted by Maslo
are you implying we should outlaw organ donations by murder victims?

We can't take organs from murder victims if they don't want us to. Their will is made known by them agreeing or disagreeing to organ donation when they get their drivers permits. It's stamped on them.

STEALING eggs from a dead child is not 'organ donation'.
It's theft of what is most precious to humans ... their (potential) children .. their progeny.
The dead children had their lives stolen from them.
And now GHOULS want to steal their eggs to experiment on.

reply to post by FlyersFan

We can't take organs from murder victims if they don't want us to.

We can, when they are underage and parents or legal guardians agree with it. Which would be the case here if abortion is like murder. And even if we accept this notion that abortion is like murder, then it is abortion that is wrong. Taking the eggs is not.

reply to post by Maslo


Think of the pretzel logics that MUST be used to allow the harvesting of eggs from an aborted female. Her mother DID NOT WANT HER yet her mother WANTS her eggs to be harvested for use by others. If the birth mother is so magnanimous towards those with fertility issues, why not carry the pregnancy of the "egg donor" to term and put the baby girl UP FOR ADOPTION?

If the woman was raped and that is her reasoning for the abortion, why would she want to (via egg harvesting) perpetuate the generic line of her attacker? If the reason for the abortion is "health of the mother" would not the harvested eggs carry a fairly good chance of carrying on the the same medical fertility concerns in the future generations to be born of that egg's genetic line?

There is no valid reason (other than "because we can") to ghoulishly harvest the eggs of the aborted. None what so ever.

reply to post by FlyersFan


A star for you FlyersFan for your eloquent defense of the unborn. This topic is ghoulish beyond compare--as I would guess (from your screenname) that you live in the SE PA area, you probably have been following the Gosnell trial. Horrific beyond human understanding...yet being "defended" by the silence of abortion proponents and by lack of PA State and Philadelphia County inspections and regulation. Why? Because abortion is about the money it makes NOT about the health and welfare of women not about humanity. That this egg harvesting story would come to the public at this time only (to me) amplifies the lack value our culture places on human life.

reply to post by Glinda

Her mother DID NOT WANT HER yet her mother WANTS her eggs to be harvested for use by others.

I dont see any contradiction.

If the birth mother is so magnanimous towards those with fertility issues, why not carry the pregnancy of the "egg donor" to term and put the baby girl UP FOR ADOPTION?

Because it requires going through with pregnancy and birth. Taking the eggs after abortion does not require that, its far easier for her. Besides, a child is not exactly an egg, some people might want eggs only and not a finished child.

If the reason for the abortion is "health of the mother" would not the harvested eggs carry a fairly good chance of carrying on the the same medical fertility concerns in the future generations to be born of that egg's genetic line?

No, often the cause of such problems is not genetic.

There is no valid reason (other than "because we can") to ghoulishly harvest the eggs of the aborted. None what so ever.

To satisfy the demand for human eggs.

On the contrary, there is no good reason to not allow it (at least I dont see one, besides "its icky", which is not a reason for me). And since freedom is the default for me, in the absence of good arguments why not allow it, I can only support it.

reply to post by karen61560


So If the child asked who the egg came from what would be a truthful answer?
Once that child was an adult I would hate to think what emotional problems they could have if they knew the truth.

reply to post by FlyersFan

Originally posted by FlyersFan
The murdered children who are being raped of their eggs are NOT doners.

The emotional language hardly makes it any different. This is not a CHILD, it's an aborted fetus and it's already dead.

They are murder victims.

No, they are not. Murder is a legal term and a crime. Abortion is not.

Do you think it would be okay if you were murdered and your children were ripped away from you just to be experimented on in a lab or to be raised by strangers?? Would that be okay?

You're twisting the story all up. We're not talking about murdering someone (a crime) and stealing their children[another crime) for scientific experimentation (another crime). We're talking about an aborted fetus, who is already dead. I don't know the details of this procedure, but I'm pretty sure the person who has the abortion has to sign to donate the eggs of the fetus to science.

I understand being against abortion, but I don't understand being against stem cell research, etc.

reply to post by squizzy

Originally posted by squizzy
So If the child asked who the egg came from what would be a truthful answer?

The truth.

Once that child was an adult I would hate to think what emotional problems they could have if they knew the truth.

The truth will set you free. The worst emotional damage done to me was from my parents keeping the truth a secret. You'd be surprised how much kids can understand and accept.

reply to post by Maslo


Besides, a child is not exactly an egg, some people might want eggs only and not a finished child.

Really? What does a fertilized egg eventually become? A child. So if you don't want a "finished" child" why would some one be interested in eggs?

What is the ending desired? A child, correct?

But "a child" (thats NOT WANTED) has to be destroyed to get "a child" that IS WANTED.