Protestant disinfo debunked-Catholics are also Christians

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Mark 13:13-14 (KJV)
13And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Mark 13:13-14 (KJV)
13And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Mark 13 is about the tribulation, the last 3 1/2 years of Daniel's 70th week. We already know that during that time in history if a person accepts the mark they forfeit eternal life and are damned.

Would you like to try again?

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Mark 13:13-14 (KJV)
13And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Mark 13 is about the tribulation, the last 3 1/2 years of Daniel's 70th week. We already know that during that time in history if a person accepts the mark they forfeit eternal life and are damned.

Would you like to try again?

So a Christian can lose salvation if he accepts the mark, but he can't lose salvation? Is this view a trinity thing? Like he can lose salvation to one god, but not the other?

reply to post by truejew


What does the Bible say about a Christian who accepts the mark of the beast? Earlier you said nothing about the Tribulation period. You implied that a believer in time past or currently had to keep him or herself saved.

What do you mean "other" god? There is only One God.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


You said a person cannot lose salvation... Now you are saying he can if he accepts the mark... Which is it?

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

You said a person cannot lose salvation... Now you are saying he can if he accepts the mark... Which is it?

Don't twist this on me. You implied a believer had to maintain his or her own salvation, and when challenged on that statement you pointed to the only biblical exception which is a person willingly accepting the mark of the beast to avoid persecution.

reply to post by truejew


WHICH "Church"?
Why won't you answer the question?

Originally posted by charles1952
Then, switching over to the idea of confession to priests, I'd like to give a short summary of my thinking and I really invite any criticism which helps me think more clearly.

1) I have trouble thinking that once someone accepts Jesus, they are forever afterward assured of Heaven, regardless of their actions or change of belief.

2) We all sin on a more or less regular basis.

3) If we carry lots of sins, or big sins to our death, a Holy God will not be able to accept us.

4) We need a way, on Earth, to "get rid" of our sins.

5) Scripture, and Tradition, seem to say that one guaranteed way of getting rid of our sins is to confess and receive absolution from one of the Apostles.

6) I believe that authority was passed to the Apostles' successors.

7) I also believe that the Apostles' successors can delegate that authority to priests.

8) Conclusion? Confessing and receiving absolution from priests is a guaranteed way to cleanse of our sins and allow us to enter God's presence.

With respect,
Charles1952

1. I have to agree, based on the 6th and 10th chapters of Hebrews and parts of 1 John.

2. Agreed. Paul said "I am the worst of sinners." Not was. AM.

3-4. Not only the stain of sins committed, but the tendency to commit them must be dealt with.

5-8. Since Luther was a Catholic, did he have that authority? What about men he ordained?

reply to post by charles1952


Yeah. let's call for some off-topic posting labels here.

reply to post by Snsoc


But in context, Paul declares himself to be the chief of sinners not because he lived in unrepentant or wilful sin at the time of the writing of that epistle, but because he had before conversion persecuted the church.

As far as confession, I only think we need to confess to God. It says against Him and only Him do we sin. Now, the Bible does say we are to confess our faults to one another and I believe in accountability partners or sharing struggles with a pastor or deacon of one's church. But that's in general, not a sin by sin accounting to someone that isn't God. Example, you might say "Pastor, I'm struggling with lust lately.", or "Pastor, I seem to be getting angry for no reason lately from stress with my new job and sometimes lash out at my family".. et cetera.

I think it's interesting and small minded for a Christian to segregate themselves. Was Jesus segregated? Did he mean for his teaching and remembrance to be separated into different groups? Or did he mean not? He meant not.

Jesus meant to unify the world under the true gospel of the holy spirit. It bothers me when I tell people I'm Christian and they ask me, 'what Christian?' As if believing in Jesus is not enough. I have to join myself in a group of the world to be accepted as a true follower.



I cannot let the ignorance and delusion effect me - that they don't love me, they will only love a fake idea in my mind.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

You said a person cannot lose salvation... Now you are saying he can if he accepts the mark... Which is it?

Don't twist this on me. You implied a believer had to maintain his or her own salvation, and when challenged on that statement you pointed to the only biblical exception which is a person willingly accepting the mark of the beast to avoid persecution.

Does someone lose their salvation when they take the mark.

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by truejew

 

WHICH "Church"?
Why won't you answer the question?

There is only one true Church.

What is your question?

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

You said a person cannot lose salvation... Now you are saying he can if he accepts the mark... Which is it?

Don't twist this on me. You implied a believer had to maintain his or her own salvation, and when challenged on that statement you pointed to the only biblical exception which is a person willingly accepting the mark of the beast to avoid persecution.

Does someone lose their salvation when they take the mark.

Yes they do. But that's a singular exception in a specific 3 1/2 year window of time. Your implication was that people today or in time past has to protect and preserve their own salvation. You weren't talking about the mark, I noted that when you tried to support your claim by posting from Mark 13, which deals with the great tribulation.

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by truejew

 

WHICH "Church"?
Why won't you answer the question?

There is only one true Church.

What is your question?

Don't play dumb.

You mean only people in Apostolic/Oneness churches.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

You said a person cannot lose salvation... Now you are saying he can if he accepts the mark... Which is it?

Don't twist this on me. You implied a believer had to maintain his or her own salvation, and when challenged on that statement you pointed to the only biblical exception which is a person willingly accepting the mark of the beast to avoid persecution.

Does someone lose their salvation when they take the mark.

Yes they do. But that's a singular exception in a specific 3 1/2 year window of time. Your implication was that people today or in time past has to protect and preserve their own salvation. You weren't talking about the mark, I noted that when you tried to support your claim by posting from Mark 13, which deals with the great tribulation.

If a person can lose salvation for taking the mark, they can lose salvation for other sins also.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by truejew

 

WHICH "Church"?
Why won't you answer the question?

There is only one true Church.

What is your question?

Don't play dumb.

You mean only people in Apostolic/Oneness churches.

No, I mean anyone who worships one God, has true faith seen by repentance, baptism in Jesus name, and receiving the Holy Spirit, and lives a life of holiness.

In other words, they must be Apostolic in faith, but attendance in a certain type of church, denomination, or organization is not necessary.

reply to post by truejew


Well, what other churches teach that besides Apostolic/Oneness churches?

reply to post by truejew


You have a massive pro lem with that teaching.

The Bible explicitly states that anyone who accepts the mark will spend eternity in Hell, but no verse explicitly saying that there's no chance of being saved for other sins that can be committed. In fact, John says that if we sin and confess that God is faithful and just to not only forgive those sins but to also cleanse us from ALL unrighteousness.