NYC asks: What happened to the 1,116 missing 9/11 victims?

reply to post by ipsedixit

Sometime after he did this, the format of the SSDI was changed so that you couldn't look up something on the index without including the name of the person you were looking up. The effect of this was to destroy the ability of people to verify this information and to make searching the SSDI for info of this type impossibly arduous.

I think the format was changed to make it harder for illegals to find valid SS#/name combinations.

reply to post by MrInquisitive

So I get your point about how this passport didn't suffer from the collapse, but how did it so conveniently avoid being immolated in the crash and ensuing fire? Were other items from other passengers also found? I haven't heard about any. Did the hijacker bust out a window and toss it about before the crash? This seems the only possibility given the lack of other similar items from the passengers of the doomed flight.

You must not have read a previuos page in this thread.
There were quite a few items found that were from passengers.

If office papers were blown clear why not plane papers?

reply to post by ipsedixit

I personally believe that the original intent of the planners of 9/11 was to evacuate the buildings prior to initiating the controlled demolitions. I think that the way they were able to sell the plan to their influential backers among the power elite was to assure them that real casualties would be kept to an absolute minimum, consisting primarily of firefighters and emergency responders.

So they felt it was OK to kill firefighters and other responders? As if they weren't worth as much or would be missed as much by their families?
How do you rationalize something like that? I'll kill a few hundred of this group but none of that group?
Not to mention that the buildings would never be close to empty. Stock trading goes on 24 hrs and other companies were certain to have employees arriving from 6:00 AM on.

Your Personal belief is so totally messed up. It doesn't take into account the realities of humans, business and the true facts of that day.

reply to post by ChuckNasty

Last time I read, the Pentagon was hardened for nuke attacks. Here's a video link to a 'dead horse.'

You read wrong.

Considering the only time that I've seen my father break down emotionally in my life, was when he was describing all the bodies he helped pull out of the rubble from the towers ( he's OSHA ) for a brief second - I don't think that this question NYC is asking, is very appropriate.

Originally posted by samkent
reply to post by ipsedixit

 

So they felt it was OK to kill firefighters and other responders?

I believe so, yes.

As if they weren't worth as much or would be missed as much by their families?

I think unavoidable collateral damage would cover it. The buildings had to come down before the firefighting stopped.

How do you rationalize something like that?

Some people are more cold blooded than others. The plotters were like that, the sort of people who would lie to start a war with a country that had nothing to do with 9/11 for example.

I'll kill a few hundred of this group but none of that group?

It's brutal, but the people we are talking about, the Bush administration, Cheney, etc. are brutal. They have been convicted of war crimes in connection with "extraordinary rendition" in Malaysia. If you imagine them as the Nazis, it is easier to understand, but really they are more like international gangsters. They aren't really ideologically motivated as the Nazis were. The blather about freedom and democracy that they use to justify their military aggression is just malarkey to fool the dopes in the general population who support them.

Not to mention that the buildings would never be close to empty.

That is factually incorrect.

Stock trading goes on 24 hrs

Not at the New York Stock Exchange. They have a trading day with a beginning and an ending.

and other companies were certain to have employees arriving from 6:00 AM on.

I never said that people weren't evacuated.

Your Personal belief is so totally messed up. It doesn't take into account the realities of humans, business and the true facts of that day.

There is a video on the web that tells about the efforts being made by a group of psychologists to help people deal with the realities of 9/11. It's definitely a shock to the system when one realises that one's government would attack its own citizens, but that is not an uncommon occurrence in history.

reply to post by ipsedixit

I'll kill a few hundred of this group but none of that group?


It's brutal, but the people we are talking about, the Bush administration, Cheney, etc. are brutal.

No you are saying that the Bush admin and dozens/hundreds of other people had the same mentality to allow them to slaughter thousands of innocent people with no remorse.
Not realistic. Especially when you have no proof.

Originally posted by bacci0909

Originally posted by intrptr
Maybe a floor or two would "crush" people.

911 collapse was a hi speed blender filled with steel girders, blocks of cement, ground glass and office furniture.

Oh yah, and a few bits of flesh.

Ahh, ladies and gentlemen we have the newly developed "high-speed blender effect". As with the pancake theory and the suggestion that the "plane" that hit the pentagons wings vaporized upon impact, we are again supposed to allow the events of this fateful day to defy any resemblance of basic physics and common-sense logic. Got it

Honestly I'm a bit late responding to this thread but I had
to reply to yours because it sound more like breakfast recipe
than a building collapse theory.
Just shows how ridiculous some of the official explanations are of the attack
on 911.

Originally posted by samkent
reply to post by ipsedixit

 

It's brutal, but the people we are talking about, the Bush administration, Cheney, etc. are brutal.

No you are saying that the Bush admin and dozens/hundreds of other people had the same mentality to allow them to slaughter thousands of innocent people with no remorse.
Not realistic. Especially when you have no proof.

This is precisely the situation that has existed in the United States since the onset of the Iraq War. This is still going on. The American people and their elected leaders are devoid of remorse, with some laudable exceptions.

There are numerous apologists for the profligate slaughter of innocents that America has conducted for decades right in these forums. If you need an excuse for anything, you can find it in these forums.

Do you think they were dropping chocolate bombs during the "shock and awe" campaign against totally innocent people?

Originally posted by bacci0909

Originally posted by intrptr
Maybe a floor or two would "crush" people.

911 collapse was a hi speed blender filled with steel girders, blocks of cement, ground glass and office furniture.

Oh yah, and a few bits of flesh.

Ahh, ladies and gentlemen we have the newly developed "high-speed blender effect". As with the pancake theory and the suggestion that the "plane" that hit the pentagons wings vaporized upon impact, we are again supposed to allow the events of this fateful day to defy any resemblance of basic physics and common-sense logic. Got it

Yeah, because obviously the CIA teleported them away to a secret Haiburton FEMA camp because they all knew secret information about George Bush is much more plausible.

Somebody should alert the technicians at Braun to a new "collapsing" blender technology that blends material into complete invisibility. This could revolutionize the recycling industry.

Originally posted by ipsedixit
Somebody should alert the technicians at Braun to a new "collapsing" blender technology that blends material into complete invisibility. This could revolutionize the recycling industry.

Having been involved with many an impact investigation in the aviation world, the post actually was more correct than you imagine. When you have hundreds of tons of debris falling upon itself, soft squishy things like people often do get pulverized into unrecognizable and unrecoverable bits.

reply to post by NavyDoc

When you have hundreds of tons of debris falling upon itself, soft squishy things like people often do get pulverized into unrecognizable and unrecoverable bits.

Oh Please!
You are clouding the 911 issue with facts.

But seriously I don't see how they can expect bodies to come out in big pieces when you watch that boiling mass falling to the ground.

Ground beef spends substaintially less time in the grinder before it exits to the tray.

Originally posted by NavyDoc
Having been involved with many an impact investigation in the aviation world, the post actually was more correct than you imagine. When you have hundreds of tons of debris falling upon itself, soft squishy things like people often do get pulverized into unrecognizable and unrecoverable bits.

Thanks for the information. I definitely would like to hear about other aviation incidents that included "hundreds of tons of debris falling upon itself". Which were those?

Originally posted by ipsedixit

Originally posted by NavyDoc
Having been involved with many an impact investigation in the aviation world, the post actually was more correct than you imagine. When you have hundreds of tons of debris falling upon itself, soft squishy things like people often do get pulverized into unrecognizable and unrecoverable bits.

Thanks for the information. I definitely would like to hear about other aviation incidents that included "hundreds of tons of debris falling upon itself". Which were those?

If a few thousand pounds of aluminum on impact can do such to a human body, logic (yes I know logic is not appreciated in such threads) dictates that thousands of tons of concrete and steel would do even more on impact.

Originally posted by NavyDoc
If a few thousand pounds of aluminum on impact can do such to a human body, logic (yes I know logic is not appreciated in such threads) dictates that thousands of tons would do even more on impact.

Look, I know that people can get ground up in violent accidents. I'm not contesting that. Did it happen? Nobody can answer that question authoritatively. The government of the United States has not directed any institution to look for evidence of an explosive demolition of those buildings. In fact officials have said that there is no reason to do so.

Private individuals have looked for evidence of explosives and have found evidence.

Who's kidding who here?

Incidentally, logic is used all over the place in these forums. It is fine when it isn't being abused in silly captious arguments.

Originally posted by ipsedixit

Originally posted by NavyDoc
If a few thousand pounds of aluminum on impact can do such to a human body, logic (yes I know logic is not appreciated in such threads) dictates that thousands of tons would do even more on impact.

Look, I know that people can get ground up in violent accidents. I'm not contesting that. Did it happen? Nobody can answer that question authoritatively. The government of the United States has not directed any institution to look for evidence of an explosive demolition of those buildings. In fact officials have said that there is no reason to do so.

Private individuals have looked for evidence of explosives and have found evidence.

Who's kidding who here?

Incidentally, logic is used all over the place in these forums. It is fine when it isn't being abused in silly captious arguments.

A silly argument like making fun of the other poster with blender cracks when he actually had a valid point? Silly arguments like that? He made a valid observation, you made disparaging remarks, and I corrected you.

Originally posted by samkent
reply to post by ChuckNasty

 

Last time I read, the Pentagon was hardened for nuke attacks. Here's a video link to a 'dead horse.'

You read wrong.

Yer right, it was in the process of being upgraded. Even if complete, the upgrades wouldn't protect the building from much.

Originally posted by NavyDoc
A silly argument like making fun of the other poster with blender cracks when he actually had a valid point? Silly arguments like that? He made a valid observation, you made disparaging remarks, and I corrected you.

It's a very marginally valid point.

People who think that the WTC towers collapsed as a result of fire are stuck between a rock and a hard place. It is much easier to explain over a thousand missing bodies if one says that they were blown to smithereens by explosives. The blender idea is reaching, I think.

Originally posted by ipsedixit

Originally posted by NavyDoc
A silly argument like making fun of the other poster with blender cracks when he actually had a valid point? Silly arguments like that? He made a valid observation, you made disparaging remarks, and I corrected you.

It's a very marginally valid point.

People who think that the WTC towers collapsed as a result of fire are stuck between a rock and a hard place. It is much easier to explain over a thousand missing bodies if one says that they were blown to smithereens by explosives. The blender idea is reaching, I think.

Not at all. THousands of tons of rubble collapsing on people and a fire that cooked for months afterward is a very logical reason why a thousand people are still not identified/accounted for (which is the truth...they are not missing as much as they are not identified.)