If it came down to it, and you saw no other option....would you start a revolution?

Originally posted by tadaman
If it came down to it, and you saw no other option....would you start a revolution?

edit on 19-3-2013 by tadaman because: (no reason given)

If you can convince your neighbour to raise arms against the state, then a revolution is possible. If you cannot rally your neighbour than you are nothing but a keyobard ranter living in fanasy land.

A revolution always start in a tiny small point on a body, then grows like a virus spreading fast until the whole host is dead or cured.

reply to post by johncarter


honestly, I am convinced...someone somewhere did exactly what you asked for me.

Can I? well, I am fairly certain of it. If I really wanted to, anything is possible.

Like for example:

I am living in Spain at the moment. If I REALLY wanted to, at the next large protest, Tomorrow, the next day, (every day there are protests and they are getting bigger and more frequent here)...any day...

I could, Take a republican flag (republic from the civil war), and while everyone is out front of the regional palace of congress chanting and screaming, throwing small cut off parts of sticks of Dynamite (like HUGE fire crackers) and they and the cops are distracted with the usual routine, I could sneak around back and climb the regional congressional building. It is not a hard climb and security is lax around back...the tall gate gives off a false sense of security, its a false comfort zone.

I could take a megaphone and my flag, and proclaim a state of revolt and that the republic has risen again. That would be HUGE.....Replace the regional flag on the top of the building with a republican flag and let myself get arrested. If I got lucky they would beat me in front of everyone. They park their riot vans in the front out side of the gate where everyone assembles, that is always their control choke point (and where I would be brought to be taken away). That is were I could resist and invoke historic masacres from when the republic fell as they rough me up. They arent really prepared for this sort of thing up north. It would happen RIGHT in front of the assembled protesters. There is just a physical line of police and a few feet, no barricades. They would get rushed and have to fall back within the gates. People here have a history of brutality under the dictatorship and would instantly respond.

I could do it when the miners are protesting since they actually FIGHT the cops. Look it up, Asturian miners protests. They battle, they dont just make signs. They make fortified barricades and security forces get hurt when they try to muscle them. It is best to be patient and simply listen to what they have to say. Cops here are scared when they are up in arms. Their road blocks and when they tear up train tracks dont stop until they say so.

I could wait for one of their protests. When the cops try and detain me they would have an army of pissed off miners picking them up and throwing them across the street. I know how to word what I would have to say and what historic miners revolts to invoke to get our hot Spanish blood to boil.

After that I could do other acts of motivation so as to agitate the many protests and manifestations that happen literally everyday. Instead of cops pretending to be violent protesters, I could organize a few people to do outrageous acts of symbolic call to arms. It would work too...The situation here lacks nothing. After that its just a matter of keeping momentum and getting the existing separatists movements involved locally under a united revolutionary banner. The republican flag and a new united symbol. That would give the impression of a national revolution. Instead of surrounding congress in Madrid, we could instead GO INSIDE AND KICK EVERYONE OUT.

That would be the climax and goal of the movement. That one symbolic action of the common man literally kicking the elected out of their "palace of law". After that a revolution would be guaranteed. OR they would listen.

I am not even from Spain originally /havent really thought about it until this moment and I know how to pick a real fight here. I was born and raised in the US....so I would do a little better there.

I have always been what you could call a sort of motivational speaker for people. Not professionally or anything. I just like seeing people pick themselves up and get geared for life again when I see them down. I am good at it, people really respond. I know how to tell people what they need to hear. It wouldnt be hard to change the message to fit the audience. They do kind of need to hear it.

BUT, like many have said already and I agree with them, we are not at that point yet. I wouldnt hesitate to lead from the front though if we were. That much I am certain of.

and again. This is a hypothetical situation, but a possible future reality as well.

I would hack the local tv stations and stop the mind control from propaganda from the news and shows that are dumbing down people. If no tv then more people will wake-up. I would also attack the banks and share out the wealth to people in the world but tbh its only paper that is worthless when revolt hits. Maybe share the gold and build a community with fresh food.

Edit: Also stick the bankers and political people with blood on their hands in Antarctica where they can do no damage to us again.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope


Sadly, you're absolutely right. And it's a damn shame.

Answering that question on line is a sure way to get yourself on a list. Remember... They're watching.

Originally posted by PsychNurse
Answering that question on line is a sure way to get yourself on a list. Remember... They're watching.

When the banks and tv stations are offline due to security breech they can't blame me lol

reply to post by tadaman


Out of sheer curiosity, WHO ARE YOU?

To try and expose individuals on a discussion forum by asking or calling out with this kind of question is an injustice and will not garner any real people ready to defend in the time of need.

"Defend" is the main word, it implies 'defensive mode' not aggravated assault.

It is "Offensive" that rogue organizations make purchases of weapons in quantities large enough to murder every citizen several times over and refuse to answer to it.

Perhaps you should address this question in reverse to the ones who will be starting the revolution.

reply to post by antar


I already stated my reasons in the OP. I explained that this was really my way of opening the discussion and I took the first step and said my take on it. I answered my own question. I also said that you are free NOT to answer if you just want to participate or criticize me.

I am offended that you are offended......

and who am I? : I AM.

EDIT:
BTW, who except YOU just now said anything about killing civilians?

To the OP

You sound like somebody who is angry and frustrated and ready to rage on something. As bad as things seem from your post, it really is not bad enough for you to actively seek revolution yet (obviously I dont know about your personal life). That time will be once your family has suffered enough you have to no choice BUT to leave and summon SHIVA on something.

I personally am not married so I have nothing to lose from that standpoint. I do have a girlfriend and like being alive so I do have that to lose. My tipping point would be once the opportunity to create better life is gone. At least right now some responsibility for the situation of things is from the 'oppressed' themselves. We elected these people (or was it the SuperPACs?).

Basically I believe once life has lost its potential for happiness and enjoyment for the average person there will be a revolution. It would take a charismatic person with great speaking skills to paint a picture of how much better it would be after revolution for a movement to start right now. The thing is that once SHIVA has been summoned, there's no turning back and nobody can tell you what it's like on the other side.

Originally posted by rickymouse
The last revolution the USA had just shifted the power and that was it. We have been led to believe that the common person did better, but that was a lie. The regular people did not have any change for the better, just another batch of people in charge.

No revolution because it will not help. It will probably get worse. Just another batch of power hungry people in charge.

Who are we going to put in charge? A medical doctor who will side with the medical community and allow them to suck all our money away? A scientist who will shift the money to science? An importer who will sell our jobs to other countries, or an agricultural organization exec who will force us to eat more crappy poisoned food. You name it, everyone wants power who would be interested in taking over. The middle class wants control, the legal system wants control. Everyone tries to make us fear. Too late, all of the above have happened, the country is severely divided.:shk:

Well put Ricky and bumped. When the revolution's over the revolutionaries
are destined to become the status quo. Happens every time. It was argued
here and also well that out founding Fathers had an agenda-- and however
noble that agenda went like clockwork. We're past the top of the arc on
usefulness of the present system without a reset, no doubt... I just hope
whovever gets the tiller know their history and astronomy.

No, because Obamas doing a good enough job on his own without my help, and i wouldn't want to stop his momentum and get the finger pointed at for being a terrorist by the state sponsored media

Originally posted by tadaman
If it came down to it, and you saw no other option....would you start a revolution?

It wouldnt be hard considering the times we are living in and the emotional state we are all in. We are in survival mode.

It wouldnt be to win....it would be to simply kill as many of them as possible. By "them" I mean the political class and the captains of the banking industry. I am not even suggesting limiting it to a single country. I am asking if you would start a world wide revolt. No borders, no limits. The whole planet would be fair game.

If you had nothing to lose, would you go to war?

As a 24 year veteran of Special Forces having watched insurgencies all over the globe I think the US is far from starting any active insurgency. The economy for the majority is still too stable (but declining) and the government is still too benign in its treatment of the lower classes for them to rebel. As far as I know no insurgency has ever been started while the lower class was still comfortable in their poverty.

Insurgencies are political movements that result from real or perceived grievances, or neglect that leads to alienation from an established government. Eight dynamics are common to an insurgency. Knowing and understanding these dynamics helps to understanding the insurgency. The eight dynamics are leadership, objectives, ideology, environment and geography, external support, internal support, phasing and timing, organizational and operational patterns.

rdl.train.army.mil...

All the components are required but first and most important is leadership. Leaders do not arise from the disaffected lower class (see below) but they do need their sympathy and support. They arise when (as you stated) they have an unresolved grievance (perceived or real) and have been placed in a position in which they have little left to lose from acting outside the normal governmental system of juris prudence and the election cycle. Usually for one to switch from talk to acts especially acts that are outside the law one must feel the alternative to the potential consequences for those acts is preferable or no worse than the status quo.

Leadership

2-13 Insurgent leaders provide vision, direction, guidance, coordination, organization for an insurgent movement. Successful insurgent leaders use, interpret and shape the frustrations of a dissatisfied populace into the insurgent strategy. They often provide solutions to grievances by advancing alternatives to existing conditions that support the insurgency. Effective insurgent leaders make their cause and solutions known to the people to gain popular support. Individual leaders of an insurgency are often members of the elite of society who have been somehow alienated from the power structure. Their education, background, family connections, social standing, and experiences contribute to their ability to organize and inspire the people who make up the insurgency. To be successful, they must break the ties between the people and the government and establish credibility for their movement.

rdl.train.army.mil...

This is how TPTB in the US stave of active insurgency by emphasizing the divide between those who would otherwise rise to take positions of leadership by the use of a strategy of emphasizing class warfare. The lower class (followers for the most part) will not accept the leadership of those capable of organizing cells and planning and conducting operations.

That and keeping the poor (lower less educated class) comfortable enough in their poverty to be complacent, amicable to propaganda but not so comfortable as to be able to afford weapons and other signs of self sufficiency. Making firearms for personal protection and potential uprising too expensive for the lower class is a key part of this strategy.

If it were not for the comfortable level of poverty and complacency of the poor lower class in America and the artificial antipathy the media manufactures between the educated and successful and the uneducated and government dependant we'd be in the midst of a full on insurgency right now.

The stability of the dollar (as artificial and fragile as it is) is all that is keeping America from a violent divide along rural and urban lines. There are two distinct and very separate cultures that have very different sets of values and social norms. A problem with the value of the dollar and or a disruption in the food supply which is heavily dependant on the regular flow of logistics we are as the saying goes - 9 meals away from complete anarchy.

That is why the Federal Government is gearing up for all out Civil War - the fragile elements in thier system of control are failing.

reply to post by Golf66


That was as extremely well written as I see it as true.

The US is a separate issue all together. I cant imagine that a united front would ever be formed. The cultural differences and large area of land it occupies would prove too difficult to organize for a new movement.

It would take small /local entities to emerge and once they (IF) they manage to cut out a wedge of an area of influence, they could communicate and coordinate. In the end it would be like the civil rights movement. State by state and town by town.

Considering the response time and force to even a small incident, even gorilla warfare would be ineffective.

The only targets one could even afford to go after would be leadership while making as small a foot print as possible and risking as little as possible in terms of equipment and people. If such self sustaining momentum was generated in a large area after something like what you say, financial collapse /implosion of all logistics internally, then more could be planned for and done after voids of control are created.

Urban areas would be absolutely untenable. The population´s inclination to resist any young movement as well as the unfortified nature of modern cities would make them a death trap. In Urban areas acts of sabotage would be almost useless as well since they would only hurt the civilian population. They would be better kept in tact and used for information and planning. Make their safe zone YOUR safe zone. Just blend in and keep your eyes open. Rest.

Rural staging grounds and a drawn out cat and mouse game would be best for "confrontation". Also the best strategy for an enemy not sure of who his enemy is, IMO is to make him see YOUR enemy as his own and you as an ally against him.

A heavy handed authority would be quick to punish its own forces for dissidence or lax discipline since it would not have real loyalty but instead a working fear /hate nature to command. It would be wise to use that to ones advantage.

That is why keeping urban areas in tact and combat free would be absolutely necessary. They would need to be used as staging grounds for counter propaganda. They would also be an excellent place to study the interaction of command and the counter insurgency forces to the end of knowing when to turn the flame up or down on activity and where so as to make a week point snap and turn on itself. Force the heavy hand to focus on its own activity and punish its other hand it does not see. Imagine the goofing off of Vietnam in the rear behind the front line but in the modern US.

Supply the stress as well as the play. Commanders will not be able to stop people from entertaining them selves and letting off steam. Just like the Vietnamese, we would have to be in that comfort zone for them. Supply everything they arent allowed to have as well as some subtle dissidence that will not go unnoticed, or unpunished. It couldnt be like modern warfare where there is NO interaction besides "time on the job". The time off in a combat zone is also critical for a counter insurgency. Being in ones own country would make it easy to fall into intermingling and losing discipline as time wore on.

I dont know. I guess I am talking out of my ass here, but I was inclined to respond with my thoughts about it.

If all hell broke loose I would be worried about other things and not this nonsense. BUT Somehow its good to at least get it out of the system and out of the mind.

anyways, LOL,

I think I am done, I have said my peace and I am now starting to talk about things I have no idea about.so, I think I will just shut up and listen. I will take a back seat from here on out in this thread. I am not in a position to teach so I dont have anything else to say. I also think the conversation ran its course and served its purpose.

and thank you for your service BTW.

Its what they want. If they have no one to fight its kinda hard to justify.