What is Cancer? What causes it? Is it curable?

reply to post by MamaJ

So sorry for your loss. I can't imagine what that must be like. I had a friend who committed suicide. He was an interior painter all his life back when they still used lead in paint. The autopsy revealed high lead content in his brain. We just didn't know about these things back then.

I, too, am sorry for your loss, MamaJ.....and have suffered my own, as well, and only add that as a nodd to empathy.

Originally posted by Julie Washington

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by Julie Washington

FACT: High Dose Vitamin C KILLS Cancer Cells

Hmm...FACT: Linus Pauling died of cancer. I guess he didn't get the memo.

You know it's crap posts like this that add nothing to the thread.

I beg to disagree. This thread is an absolute orgy of internet-experts in a flurry of cut-and-paste from sites that agree with their central premise. Excuse me for contributing the occasional speed bump, but I'd like to alert you to one essential consideration.

ATS has a current membership of 280,452. I have asked before, how many of y'all have cured their own cancer using complimentary means? I may have heard back from...drum roll...one. Conversely, there are numerous cancer survivors here who went though the conventional medical process and lived to tell about it. Myself included.

My beef? Cancer kills. Early detection and treatment are essential for any hope of a cure. Time spent going the complimentary route can narrow if not eliminate the window of opportunity to survive this monster. It's not like these breathless internet faith healers stick around to accept any accountability in such cases.

Talk is cheap, and you don't know what you are going to do until you get the diagnosis. Of course, living healthy is the best defence against disease. But when the person in the white coat says to you or a loved one,"You've got cancer", then, and only then, can you speak with confidence on the subject. Anything less is...well, simply a 'crap post'.

reply to post by Julie Washington


The article is similar and might be the same as the one another member listed.

An In vitro test...

I can kill cancer cell with many things In vitro.

I will take these test seriously when they are done in vivo. Until then Vitamin C does the same amount of help as bottle of water. No direct correlations. The alarm clock does not pay my salary analogy.

reply to post by Julie Washington


Interesting, Its a suppression and treatment now? heck a lot of things you do will suppress it, eating proper diet and exercising.

What about the curing effect?

Wonder if you can get rich by advertising that "if you get cancer, eat lots of vitamin C, it will cure you, don't go to doctors"

The thing is if someones Malignant Cancer, there is no way they going to be sitting at home, being a guinea pig to test Vitamin C effect on cancer, instead of known methods. If the cancer gets suppressed, it because they changed their eating patterns and keep their body active, im not letting Vitamin C take all the credit and misrepresented as a cancer cure.

reply to post by Skywatcher2011


Dude you pretty much said eating healthy is a good way to PREVENT free Radicals that MAY or MAY NOT cause cancer. I agree. by the way, maybe you are buying too much into the "Anti-oxidant" business maneuver, but anti-oxidant is pretty common has always been eaten by people(if you are a proper eater) but people are stupid, so company advertise "PACKED WITH ANTIOXIDANT!", and all of a sudden people fall for it.

There so many holes and improper understanding by saying Vitamin C does all the work. I'm looking to the study where these things HEAL/CURE Cancer Directly... actually if they do, it would be the #1 way to cure and people will be winning noble prizes.

I could say something like getting 8 hrs of sleep will cure cancer,along with proper diet, you cannot disprove me.

So saying Vitamin C cures cancer is no difference, it helps you function, you body uses it, of course it will play A PART in helping your body fight it.

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck


Sorry you see it that way as someone who has personal experience with cancer and loss. I am cutting and pasting maddeningly in hopes that people get some valuable, little known information that may help them, beforehand
so that they can proactively take charge of their health and perhaps stop this happening to them.

I'm not trying to be a "breathless internet healer," your words here. Nor am I any expert or just here cutting and pasting to support my particular view. It's not about my ego, in other words, but someone's survival, hopefully. And I believe the information I have provided is not widely known, is a subject for very new, recent research into cancer and other diseases, their causes, and therefore, possible treatments.

reply to post by luciddream


So how about some very particular blood screening, then, trying to nail down what might be inhabiting your body that doesn't belong there. That's the point of all my "cutting and pasting" that Mr. Canuck referred to. Lots of places to look for answers. Any help in a time of dire diagnosis should be viewed as just one more bullet in your arsenal to fight for your life. How about looking at it that way?

I was very much hoping Druid42 that you might return and comment on the sources, particularly the last which deal specifically with parasitic infections and all kinds of cancer.....as I promised sources and went to a lot of trouble to provide them for you, as you asserted I wasn't getting it.

Here's hoping you will read what I provided, do your own research, and we can together shed some light on little known facts so more people at risk out there can protect themselves, and stop viewing cancer as such a mystery, when it very likely isn't.

Tetra

I think a lot of ATSers are hitting on the right points!


In another thread, i said this:

As I understand it, improper dietary pH leads to acidic blood, allowing candida blooms in the body, which triggers autoimmune responses, leading to a decrease in red blood cells (hemolytic anemia) which causes an oxygen deficiency, which leads to many, many types of diseases including cancer. These problems can take decades to develop, which is why it's usually people over 40 who start having symptoms.

I think the body's natural, preferred pH is something like 7.4 - slightly on the alkaline side.

I could have this sequenced wrong, or perhaps I'm leaving something out, but there seems to be a connection between pH, fungus and blood health.

Ingesting large amount of sugar also seems to be a factor:

CandidaDiet.com

I’ll explain how sugar plus simple carbohydrates can cause a Candida infestation - even though the sugar is acidic: We naturally need our immune system to be in top form in order to fight off any illness, whether it’s a disease, fungi, or viral infection, so of course in most cases it’s needed to prevent a Candida infestation. However, when we have an excess of sugar in our blood, the available insulin is tied up with the job of preventing the vitamin C in our system from moving into the white blood cells, which would lead to lower white blood cell activity. This is literally the action of rapidly shifting blood sugar levels which puts a stress on the adrenal glands. Simply stated, the result is eventually immune suppression, so this, combined with other factors such as the sugar presenting a literal feast to the already-present Candida in the system, eventually leads to a Candida albicans infestation. Also, it doesn’t matter whether the sugar is refined or not, because it’s the serum glucose levels that make the difference.

Originally posted by tetra50
reply to post by JohnnyCanuck

 

Sorry you see it that way as someone who has personal experience with cancer and loss. I am cutting and pasting maddeningly in hopes that people get some valuable, little known information that may help them, beforehand so that they can proactively take charge of their health and perhaps stop this happening to them.

Hey, I agree 100% that proactive measures are a great idea! I refer to the point at which one has contracted/developed/whatever the disease, and folks line up to talk them into eschewing so-called 'allopathic' medicine in favour of complimentary treatment. That ought to be a crime, IMHO. You've read my rationale in the post above.

By all means, though, continue encouraging folks to aggressively fight any initial onset, with good health..

The increased number of cancer cases in recent times is not by accident. I cannot speak about the causes, but I can tell you what the result will be. Due to heavy research in trying to find a cure unknown (for now) aspects of the human genome will be revealed. The discovery will surpass even the wildest expectations. The DNA will be scientifically proved to be the thread that connects every living thing in the universe (both seen and unseen!). It will be proved to be the bridge that connects space-time to non time-space. It's all part of a grand design.

It is painful only when you perceive it from this fragmentary existence.

reply to post by tetra50


Yes i agree, it should be veiwed as another idea for the treatment, but it doe snot equal to cure and comparison with known method.

What i see here is, people looking down and shtting on known methods(chemo, radio) and claiming alternative DOES cure. Which to my science side of the moment gets irritated, to claim such things without proper study describing the actual effect and process of such alternative INSIDE your body.

Just because im supporting known methods does not means im siding with the corporation, it just means i trust the known methods that increases their survival rate by 10-20 yrs on terminally ill cancer patients(not all are lucky), and this has been proven. You can see after and before treatment.

Things such as Vitamin C is so ambiguous you don't know really know what actually did the work.

Was it immune system? was it a change in diet? was it water? was it exercise? was it sleep? all these deserve credit but Vitamin C is put on pedestal as the cure all disease agent. Yes i know Vitamin plays an important role in cellular metabolism, immune and is the primary source of energy for cells to utilize.

Originally posted by luciddream
reply to post by tetra50

 

Yes i agree, it should be veiwed as another idea for the treatment, but it doe snot equal to cure and comparison with known method.

What i see here is, people looking down and shtting on known methods(chemo, radio) and claiming alternative DOES cure. Which to my science side of the moment gets irritated, to claim such things without proper study describing the actual effect and process of such alternative INSIDE your body.

Just because im supporting known methods does not means im siding with the corporation, it just means i trust the known methods that increases their survival rate by 10-20 yrs on terminally ill cancer patients(not all are lucky), and this has been proven. You can see after and before treatment.

Things such as Vitamin C is so ambiguous you don't know really know what actually did the work.

Was it immune system? was it a change in diet? was it water? was it exercise? was it sleep? all these deserve credit but Vitamin C is put on pedestal as the cure all disease agent. Yes i know Vitamin plays an important role in cellular metabolism, immune and is the primary source of energy for cells to utilize.

Hey,, I think you got me confused with the vitamin c advocacy folks. I wasn't one of those.

Originally posted by Skywatcher2011

Originally posted by luciddream
Im seriously tired of people with no knowledge parroting crap. "Take this alternative megadose of Vitamin C, it will cure HIV and Cancer and whatever."

Btw, I have studied biochem, organic chem, bio, A&P as well as genetics and numerous health books.

I think I know a thing or two about Vit C. I also take copious amounts of it a day and feel great. Not saying it cures cancer, but I am sure it will help prevent "natural" cancer along with a proper diet and limited harmful exposure to external factors which support causation of cancer.

I thought that since vitamin c is water soluble and not fat soluble that there is only so much that the body can absorb and the rest (like the other water soluble vitamins) just come out in your urine.

The big fat soluble ones are A, D, E, and K (I think).



From memory(so it's probably wrong), I think I remember reading something that hinted that cancer is the natural order of things. All cells have telomeres or a repeating of the "stop" codon at the end of their DNA strand. Usually, when creating a new cell, the DNA is read and these instructions are used to make a new functioning cell. When it gets to the end (polymerase is the enzyme responsible) it reads the stop codons and stops copying the DNA that goes into the new cell. Every time the DNA is copied and a new cell is created the telomeres or stop codons get a little bit shorter. Eventually, the stop codon is gone and ends of the DNA that code for something get dropped off. Usually the cell dies (senesence), but I imagine sometimes this isn't the case.

This, of course, is just one of the ways that your DNA can get damaged and may result in it still living, but functioning in a way that we'd call "cancerous". Basically, a lot of things around you can hurt a cells DNA, but it's a crap shoot as to whether it'll hurt it in such a way that causes "cancer".

Everything from fast moving high energy radiation that smacks into the DNA and damages it like x-ray radiation and UV radiation to chemicals to just being alive and having your cells divide can cause cancer and probably will eventually. I imagine that things that damage your cells like cigarette smoke and inflammation cause them to divide more than normal and the telomeres get shorter until the cells become cancerous.

I remember that there is an enzyme called telomerase that is present in the bodies sex cells that repair the terlomeres since those cells divide abnormally fast.

I think that's a characteristic that they share with cancer cells; not the enzyme telomerase, but dividing abnormally fast. It's what current mainstream treatments use to kill the cells. All the cells in the body get poisoned, but the fast growing cells die before the healthy cells. It's why you lose your hair. Hair is a product of another fast growing cell.

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck


Speed bump? Hardly. A voice of reason? Definitely. You are one of the members that provide a different perspective, allowing us to step back and think for a bit.

Ain't gotta say your opinion is valued.

reply to post by luciddream

There so many holes and improper understanding by saying Vitamin C does all the work. I'm looking to the study where these things HEAL/CURE Cancer Directly... actually if they do, it would be the #1 way to cure and people will be winning noble prizes.

You have a very strong point there. If Vitamin C was a miracle cure, there would be no more cancer in the world. That may be tough for some to swallow, but it does appear as truth.

So saying Vitamin C cures cancer is no difference, it helps you function, you body uses it, of course it will play A PART in helping your body fight it.

I will also agree that Vitamin C plays a vital role. I believe proper nutrition is also a key.

Face it. None of us eat healthy. None of us have a "Proper" diet. I'm guilty of going through the drive through at times, on rare occasion, and I myself don't watch everything I eat all the time. I like to splurge at times on different meals, that I know are bad for me, but taste different.

Do our bodies lack certain ratios of vital vitamins and nutrients at times? Surely. Is it safe to say it balances out by eating healthy? Ok.

Is fast food filled with garbage, preservatives, and all sorts of things that are bad for us? I think so. Does the cumulation of food intake from such sources produce cancer? I think not.

We haven't nailed down the source yet.

If I were ever to be diagnosed with cancer, I would dispense with chemotherapy altogether. That would be my choice based on my understanding. People should do what they feel comfortable with. The mind is more powerful than anything.

There are many examples of people that chucked the idea of traditional medicine. Suzanne Summers is a good example and she is doing quite well. Her mind was stronger than her disease.

I would probably do a macrobiotic diet in conjunction with an alternative medicine over chemotherapy. I'm old, so I have lived........no way would I take that 50/50 chance. Either be sick as hell and die or die gradually with dignity and a good pump of drugs.

My heart goes out to anyone who has experienced this tragic disease.

reply to post by Mayson

Everything from fast moving high energy radiation that smacks into the DNA and damages it like x-ray radiation and UV radiation to chemicals to just being alive and having your cells divide can cause cancer and probably will eventually. I imagine that things that damage your cells like cigarette smoke and inflammation cause them to divide more than normal and the telomeres get shorter until the cells become cancerous

What tells the cells to divide? That's the key to this mystery.

Examples: Our finger and toenails and dead cells, and so is our hair. Our skin, which is also the largest organ in the human body, have dead cells that are constantly being replaced. Dead cells inside our body are flushed out through the urinary and alimentary tracts.

What causes those cells to duplicate to replace the ones that have died? What's the mechanism that tells a cell to divide? I'm keeping this in the context of normal cell division. The DNA is the blueprint, and the blueprint is copied into the new cell, but what tells the body to "read" the blueprint, and make a copy thereof?

The more and more I see diets and cancer it points to the fact there's a microbe involved.
This ketogenic diet would limit the availability of the microbe's sugar supply?

You can kill it using pulsed electromagnetic fields.
You can kill it by changing the terrain.

All point to microbes...

Gerson is very high in carbohydrates how does this cure cancer?
Well the availability of the pancreatic enzymes would be higher and they modulate immunity etc?

Limbo