The UFOs are gone!

reply to post by ZetaRediculian


By definition, yes UFOs exist. Unidentified flying object. Does it mean that the object flying is e.t.? No just that it hasn't been identified.

reply to post by ZetaRediculian


Hey Zeta and thanks for your response.

You brought up the idea of aliens, but I didn't intend anything in my post to have to do with aliens. I was talking about UFOs as aerial craft that perform extraordinary maneuvers. I always try to take things one step at a time, because it's easy to string inferences together and to forget to justify each one.

Assuming that UFOs exist (and I'm pretty sure they do), I'm not sure who or what is controlling them.

But I will say this - the idea that humans are solely responsible for them (using some exotic, advanced technology) runs into what are in my opinion enormous problems when you consider the UFO reports from the 1940s and even prior.

You could also point to the 1966 Westall school (Australia) and the 1994 Ariel School, Zimbabwe incidents, if you wanted to make a link between UFOs and non-humans. There are threads here on ATS on both of those incidents, and I'm sure you've seen them.

You could also point to any number of close encounters of the third kind that have been reported throughout history, although most of these don't have the level of multiple witness corroboration as the two just mentioned above.

More controversially (feels odd saying that), you could point to the abduction phenomenon and those accounts. Some of those could of course be explained in more prosaic terms, but many also resist such explanations. I'm unimpressed by some of the more standard explanations, insofar as they're intended to explain all such experiences. Of course, there could be multiple discrete explanations that together explain all such cases in prosaic terms. But then you're still left with things like the 1966 and 1994 cases above. And if you assume temporarily that those are both genuine incidents, then you have to reassess the entire body of reports (other close encounters of the third, second and first kind, and the entirety of the abduction phenomenon) in light of that. Because remember - all it takes is a single genuine report, and that will send ripples throughout the entirety of the body of evidence.

reply to post by intrptr


Ok but it's not like aliens are gonna be needing lights on their spaceships.

reply to post by Brighter


You are welcome. I am famaliar with the Zimbabwe case and will check out the other one. There are some really interesting events and they do make you wonder. My feeling is that to really investigate them, you really need to look at every angle. There is usually a lot going on when one of these things happen. There is the psychological aspect of individuals, the interactions between the witneses before and after. The investigators and how they investigated and so on.

I have seen the Zimbabwe documetary with the psychologist doing the iterviews with the children (was that Mack?). I think with stuff like this, you have to be very critical. Whether or not there were actual aliens visiting the school, to me, does not matter. If they weren't aliens, then you have a very strange psycho-dynamic something or other that would be just as fascinating...at least to me. Maybe others would find that boring, I wouldn't. Not mundane either way. Perhaps I would like that more...again, not saying that is what it is.

My feeling with the abduction stuff is that its not related to the UFO stuff. I think they should be treated seperately since there is a completely different thing going on perceptualy. Linking them tells a "story" or paints a picture that may be false.

But lets do take it one step at a time. "who or what is controlling them." How do we get that they are intellengently controlled? Again, I think this is a perception and really at the crux of it all. We do have radar info. The Belgian one comes to mind since you mentioned extreme maneuvers.

reply to post by ZetaRediculian


Man that guy is hogging all the blue lights! Who does he think he is?? Mr. Extrablue?
That I cant tell ya, kids dont need stinkin Iphones, I am vehemently anti i phone, especially for kids.

Originally posted by zonetripper2065
reply to post by intrptr

 

Ok but it's not like aliens are gonna be needing lights on their spaceships.

they dont need them just like my kid doesn't need the iphone he has. its the ones without the lights that you can't see you have to worry about. you know, the invisible ones. why is it that the ones in all the star trek episode have them?

Originally posted by Wide-Eyes
reply to post by flexy123

 

I blame Youtube.

Exactly. But the real problem is that so many people's experience of the world seems to be limited to YouTube, to the internet, and to their own modus operandi. It's as if it's impossible for them to fathom that people actually can live without cameras always at hand to share every damned detail of their lives with the world.

I don't know if ANY of the documented UFO - unidentified flying objects - sightings recorded through history were of extraterrestrial origin. They may have been, but there is no way for me, or for anyone, to affirm that with certainty.

What I do know is that I've seen very odd things, in very different parts of the world, and their behavior seemed to defy the laws of physics as we know them.

In most of those cases I didn't even have a camera on me.
In some of those cases I wouldn't have had the time to record anything even if I had a camera and even if the idea had crossed my mind (but it didn't, and it's an important point).
If I had wanted to record anything, and had recorded it, I would not be seeking to make it public via sites like Youtube. (I would have taken it to relevant experts.)

So, no photos from me.
But I still did see what I saw. The absence of photographic evidence does not make the experiences any less real.
Or less baffling.

Of course, it might be very difficult for anyone to believe my accounts (if I chose to talk about them in the first place) without any photographic evidence. I can understand that, absolutely.
But so what? That's not my problem.
I still did see what I saw. And it was damn strange.

Originally posted by Charmeine
reply to post by ZetaRediculian

 

By definition, yes UFOs exist. Unidentified flying object. Does it mean that the object flying is e.t.? No just that it hasn't been identified.

yes, of course.

Originally posted by zonetripper2065

Ok but it's not like aliens are gonna be needing lights on their spaceships.

Hmm I wouldnt say that myself, if you look at alot of old reports often the lights were usually the effect of something else, such as portholes and windows lite up from interior lights, or the exterior surface of the ship being surrounded in a glow or the under surface glowing, not necessarily individual lights for navigation. Although some UFO's tended to be described as having the type of lights we associate with planes, thing is UFO's have been seen to move at slow speeds on regular occasion so they might need some sort of navigation beacons such as aft and stern for such occasions "hey you almost backed into me you doofus where did you get your saucer license damn it! turn your indicator on when docking manually" **shakes third fist out window** perhaps their tech isnt as advanced as we think it is.

But as to the OP, they could be right... makes some sense when you think about it.

Who knows somewhere out their some guys being royally bollocks'd by his higher ups for starting a long lasting species spanning collective hysteria and obsession with UFOs in the human race after he stopped one day to take a slash and got seen with his craft by a local 100 years back...

Thing with cameras being better these days, they arent really any better and in some ways their worse, they're just alot more portable/instant and user friendly and as such more people with no camera skills have access to them all the time, id say its not the cameras fault we get bad pics even these days its the people taking the pictures who simply stink at it. Sure you can point and shoot but that only works in good conditions. That being said id say the larger majority of the UFO photos today are simply mis identification after the event, ie only found on the pic well after the photo was taken, flying birds/insects, planes, flares, camera glitches etc.

If there really are fewer sightings now than in decades past it could be because of:

1. More polluted air.
2. More contrails--a lot more.
3. People looking at computer screens, not the sky.
4. Getting a suntan isn't nearly as popular as it used to be, plus concern about depletion of the ozone layer, both related to fear of skin cancer.
5. Fear of radiation from nuclear reactors in some areas.

If a higher percentage of sightings go unreported now than in decades past it could be because of:

1. Not having a well-known reporting center such as Project Blue Book often mentioned in the MSM.
2. Nonbelievers, if anything, having become more harsh and quick to attack even close friends for even suggesting that there might be something to the phenomenon, let along claiming a sighting.
3. Falloff in interest among witnesses, since it doesn't seem to make any difference in people's lives, global warming, poverty in the world, countermeasures against natural disasters, disease, war, etc.
4. Expectation of disclosure being at a low level, plus knowledge that a run-of-the-mill sighting won't change that.

If witnesses are less believed now than in decades past it could be because of:

1. The flood of fake UFO garbage on YouTube.
2. The growth in UFO fraud in general.
3. The well-rehearsed smirking of newscasters and other such practice by the MSM.
4. Fewer personal sightings by the public at large, for the reasons listed at the top of this post.
5. UFO burnout among the general public.
6. Lack of disclosure by TPTB.
7. incredible failure of ALL ufologists, Governor Symington & staff, and Senator McCain & staff, not to mention witnesses and other ordinary citizens to request weather and FAA radar data under the Freedom of Information Act in the Phoenix Lights case.

But all that doesn't mean there's a falloff in tourism from a far.

If there is nothing to the phenomenon:

1. Why are there so many strong multiwitness, multimode sightings on record?
2. Why do generals, admirals, members of the U.S. Congress/Cabinet, and even presidents, get such a rude runaround when trying to find out what is known about the phenomena?
3. Why is it fairly easy to catch government officials lying when you are investigating a UFO report (as John Greenwald has described when discussing his experiences getting documents under the Freedom of Information Act, the several changes of story on the Roswell incident, the change of story about fighter jets in the Stephanville case, etc.)?
4: Why are so many military personnel transferred and/or sworn to secrecy when involved in UFO cases?
5: Why do the operation manuals for every type of aircraft used by the U.S. military have a section on procedure for reporting UFOs?
6: Why are officials in several national governments accusing the U.S. of UFO coverup?
7: Why are airline employees afraid to report what they see in the air?
8: Why do military pilots exhibit such radical change in demeanor after being involved in UFO chases?

Not gone. Next time there's a high-profile case, let's all do a better job of investigating.

reply to post by flexy123


Actually, You are wrong. They are no longer in the sky, they have landed. Hell, I have one living 3 houses down from me.

Originally posted by zonetripper2065
reply to post by intrptr

 

Ok but it's not like aliens are gonna be needing lights on their spaceships.

Perhaps they don't "care" whether they are stealth-like at all.
Maybe these 'lights' are some sort of byproduct of the energy used to manipulate the crafts?
Such as the golden orbs ranging in all sizes, moving in perfect L (90 degree) angles seen all over the world.
Who knows, the UFO could very well be the entity itself, cutting through our own dimension into another, minding it's own business.

Dunno, but people are seeing some pretty strange things. If the gubment was capable of this stuff, then that would mean we should have upgraded from internal combustion a long time ago... RIP Tesla.

Still discussing the existence of UFOs /whether that would be drones, aircraft or something else) is laughable, because they DO EXIST. Just look alone at near to hit airplane objects, it's enough to even look at the declassified UK documents to see it's real. Now are they material or ethereal, drones or spaceships, who is flying them is the question.

reply to post by zonetripper2065


How many monkeys do we (humans) still use like lab rats? There is another how many lab rats do we still use?



And as far as to this OP. Suppose till you get outside and not want everything just handed to you you will never see one. Perhaps you have seen plenty of them on youtube but fail just like so many others at knowing what you see.

Originally posted by ZetaRediculian
reply to post by Brighter

 

You are welcome. I am famaliar with the Zimbabwe case and will check out the other one. There are some really interesting events and they do make you wonder. My feeling is that to really investigate them, you really need to look at every angle. There is usually a lot going on when one of these things happen. There is the psychological aspect of individuals, the interactions between the witneses before and after. The investigators and how they investigated and so on.

I have seen the Zimbabwe documetary with the psychologist doing the iterviews with the children (was that Mack?). I think with stuff like this, you have to be very critical. Whether or not there were actual aliens visiting the school, to me, does not matter. If they weren't aliens, then you have a very strange psycho-dynamic something or other that would be just as fascinating...at least to me. Maybe others would find that boring, I wouldn't. Not mundane either way. Perhaps I would like that more...again, not saying that is what it is.

My feeling with the abduction stuff is that its not related to the UFO stuff. I think they should be treated seperately since there is a completely different thing going on perceptualy. Linking them tells a "story" or paints a picture that may be false.

But lets do take it one step at a time. "who or what is controlling them." How do we get that they are intellengently controlled? Again, I think this is a perception and really at the crux of it all. We do have radar info. The Belgian one comes to mind since you mentioned extreme maneuvers.

edit on 3-2-2013 by ZetaRediculian because: (no reason given)

I agree that this is an important point, as evidence for their being under intelligent control is what separates them from natural phenomena.

I think there are two main characteristics that suggest that some of these objects are under intelligent control: 1) their aerial maneuvers, and 2) their physical characteristics.

There are many maneuvers that suggest intelligent control, for example flying towards and then pacing our aircraft. For instance, in the 1986 Japan Airline case, the UFO actually continued to pace the 747 as the plane made a complete 360 degree turn. The object was also caught on the 747's on-board radar and on military (Air Force) and the Anchorage ground radars. The two smaller objects were to his left, pacing the 747. They then abruptly flew right in front of the 747, and positioned themselves in a 'stacked' formation, one on top of the other, and maintained a steady speed in front of the plane. After several minutes, the two objects changed their configuration again into a side-by-side formation. In other cases, you commonly see flight characteristics such as being able to silently hover in mid-air, and then suddenly take off in a particular direction, and then stopping without decelerating and then hovering.

The physical characteristics of these objects also suggest that they are under intelligent control. Sticking to the same Japan Airline case, the large object was described as being a walnut or disc shape (symmetrical), and as large as two aircraft carriers. The two smaller UFOs that the captain described each had a rectangular matrix of glowing nozzles. When they were close enough to the cockpit, he could feel the heat from them on his face. Other physical characteristics that you commonly see reported involve other symmetrical shapes, windows or portholes, blinking lights, search lights that shine onto the ground or into a flying aircraft's cockpit, and more. All of these suggest them having been intelligently designed, and so one could infer that if that is the case, then they're also intelligently controlled.

Now combine both the flight maneuvers and physical characteristics, and together they make a convincing case for these objects being under intelligent control.

Definitely take a look at any books by the authors that I mentioned in one of my previous posts. A good start would be Dr. Peter Sturrock's "The UFO Enigma: A New Review of the Physical Evidence".

reply to post by flexy123

Originally posted by Connman
reply to post by zonetripper2065

 

How many monkeys do we (humans) still use like lab rats? There is another how many lab rats do we still use?

And as far as to this OP. Suppose till you get outside and not want everything just handed to you you will never see one. Perhaps you have seen plenty of them on youtube but fail just like so many others at knowing what you see.

Agreed, lol. You need to take a huge dose of fear first my friend. No fruit loop is going to be given knowledge of the universe sitting at his computer chair scoofing at videos. Besides. Most of you wouldn't want to actually see one tho you sware up and down you do. Its very spiritual, And its not for everyone. Become a master of your emotions, redefine fear and love as tools because if you don't They will influence you with overwhelming emotions, positive or negative. And the abilities and humility it forces from you will drive the recces monkey brains to go nuts because they have an ego. And it can be wounded. lol. Im not ripping on all RH positives. Just many negatives iv met tend to be more down to earth and aware. Opposed to the anxious counter parts. That all to often, its hard to pick a good one. But just like special people they both come from both sides. So kudos to you if your O+ and you avoid the whole competition thing of whose better. No one is better, but empathy is a start.
And i tend to vouch for the empathetic because well, they tend to be more loyal. No offense. But many of you fine RH positives out there have close ties to said bloodlines. Everyone is different, some are closely similar to others, some are closely similar in large numbers and others are recessive traits that have emerged. Im trailing off lol. But yeah ask any questions. Also random fact about myself.
I can produce goosebumps down my spine and make my hair stand at will. Can raise my body tempurture breath and heart rate. i have full eyebrow control (random) Im working on being able to dilate my pupils at will. As far as i can tell i can tap into nervous system responses? My great grandma had healers hands she would misinform me as a child, so did my mom and my grandma. saying she learned * touched therapy*... i wish i knew sooner before she passed away.she was 102 or 3 happened last year

il have enough posts soon enough to talk in the ats chat and get ahold of ATS live and have a good ol chat with them. See what they know about my visitors and maybe inform a few about the creatures that lurk. And how/what do you do suggesting you ever saw one.

Originally posted by rabzdguy
They do exist, always have always will.

I agree but realise that TPTB will never allow open disclosure and the ET's will not force disclosure until our world leaders agree to it. A vast proportion of the sightings recorded are real UFO's but they are lost within the sheer mass of faked, spoofed clips that are deliberately put into the mix to disinform, dissuade and obscure the truth. This massive disinformation campaign has been in operation for years and it does its job well.

The plain truth is that there is no way we can prove the ET reality until either TBTB and/or ET agree for it to happen. All footage whether film or video clips or photographs can be dismissed as fakes, all witness testimony can be discredited either the testimony or the person (or both). All scientific evidence can be argued as fake and without mainstream science actually saying it is real then again we are left with unverifiable evidence.

Most likely anyone with real evidence would quickly be pursuaded to say nothing or face the consequences and they might just as likely disappear or die in an untimely suicide.

Bottom line we cannot PROVE this ET reality in any real meaningful way and until there is a sea change at top levels of govt , I fear this will always be the case.

I for one think the body of evidence is overwhelming but as I said unprovable and I like many others wonder how we will ever get the truth out to the masses or indeed when this will be.

reply to post by Nedusa


i went thru 2 computers that got blue screened. I never got any threats that i remember. but for that whole month. My IP was being tapped and someone was monitoring my facebook msgs. Inbetween what id be trying to tell my friends that live in town my brand new comp * ironically* purchased with a check i got the day i slept over at my friends house and saw that creature. I played wow at the time, and the comp i was using was crap. Everytime i would talk in facebook the screen would go black and then a blue screen would pop up with memory dump and the comp would shut off not even restart. i was like O.O wut. >turns comp back on. >Continues story. >blue screen. i turned it back on logged on facebook, didnt talk to anyone and my comp didn't shut off. Wow ran at 20 frams per sec, why did i pick a compaq. I went back to walmart the next day and got an acer. I got curious and tried talking about the creature again, this was 2 days after i had seen it. and the brand new comp out of the box blue screen and memory dumped. I was like like O.O stares at window. O.O stares at open door O.O visualizing seeing that faceless being crawling around the corner. Or its panther form sleeking thru and leaping onto my bed.
*shudders* well that paranoia eventually went away. and so did many of my other fears were toned down for an extended period of time. I used to have arachiphobia and i still hate spiders. but il kill a mofo if i see it no problem.