Photographic and video proof, and the problems behind them.

reply to post by xpoq47


Wow! That sounds incredibly complicated and should definitely put a lot of what I mentioned to rest once it is up and running. I thank you for posting that information!

Perhaps there are people calling out pictures of UFOs as 'fake' because UFO pics and vids have been faked in the past.

Nowadays, people don't know what to believe anymore. Even if real footage or pictures have been taken, they're simply going to rule it out as fake because they have been deceived in the past.

IMO, I think this is more of a psychological thing than just people be either skeptical or being jerks.

reply to post by Dondylion

I must admit that vid was entertaining.

Still, nothing but low quality imagery, "spots" and "dots" and "stuff" that could be all sorts of artifacts, reflections and the like. Some might be space junk, some might even be ATS military technology.
The fact remains that we don't know.
So still NO evidence for "[...]something incredible and not of this world." , sorry.

Now answer me this:
Considering the amount of HD recording media and the time it has been around, why don't we have at least ONE recording like this by now?

Originally posted by Marcelli
Perhaps there are people calling out pictures of UFOs as 'fake' because UFO pics and vids have been faked in the past.

Nowadays, people don't know what to believe anymore. Even if real footage or pictures have been taken, they're simply going to rule it out as fake because they have been deceived in the past.

IMO, I think this is more of a psychological thing than just people be either skeptical or being jerks.

Yeah, I get that, but it still shouldn't happen constantly, you know? Just because you've been fooled in the past doesn't mean that everyone is out to get you. It also doesn't mean that everyone is going to fake something like that. All it does is harm the person posting the evidence's credibility when people can't get over their own fears of being mislead, you know?

I dunno, it might just be me being naive. I was raised to always give people the benefit of the doubt until they have been proven wrong. I'm one of those people who believes someone's story until it's been proven false or believe an image to be true until it's proven otherwise.

Originally posted by ColCurious
reply to post by Dondylion

 

Now answer me this:
Considering the amount of HD recording media and the time it has been around, why don't we have at least ONE recording like this by now?

edit on 3-2-2013 by ColCurious because: (no reason given)

I'll answer your question with another question. How often do you carry a camera with that quality capabilities around with you?

BTW, this will be the last time I respond to one of these posts. I would like for the thread to stay on topic, please, as I stated in a post on the previous page.

reply to post by Dondylion

Okay then...
Despite your inability to answer my question, I will answer yours.

Originally posted by Dondylion
When are we going to stop doubting those that come out with good videos of a UFO?

The moment we finally get to see one "good video of a UFO".

Originally posted by Dondylion
When are we going to stop complaining that not everyone has the means for an HD camera or carries them around with them 24/7/365?

The moment when at least ONE person out of THOUSANDS who DO have access to HD recording media provides the ONE good recording.

Originally posted by ColCurious
reply to post by Dondylion

 

Okay then...
Despite your inability to answer my question, I will answer yours.

Originally posted by Dondylion
When are we going to stop doubting those that come out with good videos of a UFO?

The moment we finally get to see one "good video of a UFO".

Originally posted by Dondylion
When are we going to stop complaining that not everyone has the means for an HD camera or carries them around with them 24/7/365?

The moment when at least ONE person out of THOUSANDS who DO have access to HD recording media provides the ONE good recording.

edit on 3-2-2013 by ColCurious because: (no reason given)

There was no inability. When everyone in the world has access to an HD camera and carries them about 24/7/365, we won't see that type of clarity. I'm not sure why you cannot grasp the fact that not everyone carries their HD cameras with them everywhere they go, let alone has one of those.

Wow, why so angry? Calm down, mate, not the end of the world here. Why does there have to be 1080 HD clarity video for people to stop complaining about not everyone having them? Not everyone can afford a $2,000 camera, let alone carry them around 24/7. Why complain about something that meaningless? Instead of complaining, why not put those efforts towards positively identifying the object in the video or proving it to be a hoax with evidence?

reply to post by Dondylion

I'm not angry at all no worries.

Originally posted by Dondylion
There was no inability.

Well, answer the question then.
How come we don't have at least ONE recording like the one I posted of the F-18, considering the large amount of HD cameras that IS around by now?

Originally posted by Dondylion
I'm not sure why you cannot grasp the fact that not everyone carries their HD cameras with them everywhere they go, let alone has one of those.

I'm not sure why you cannot grasp the implications of the simple statistical probability I pointed out.

Yes, not EVERYONE has the means of recording in HD... however, ENOUGH people actually DO have the means and should have provided at least ONE(!) good recording by now, given the phenomenon was real.

Originally posted by Dondylion
Yeah, I get that, but it still shouldn't happen constantly, you know? Just because you've been fooled in the past doesn't mean that everyone is out to get you. It also doesn't mean that everyone is going to fake something like that. All it does is harm the person posting the evidence's credibility when people can't get over their own fears of being mislead, you know?

I dunno, it might just be me being naive. I was raised to always give people the benefit of the doubt until they have been proven wrong. I'm one of those people who believes someone's story until it's been proven false or believe an image to be true until it's proven otherwise.

I'm glad there are people like you that do take consideration into what people claim, but I've been there, done that, and I ended up being fooled in the end; which probably makes me one of the 'people' I've described in my previous post.

As for blurry pics and footage, we'll never know if they're the real deal; it's entirely up to you to believe it or not. So in this case, there's no need to argue.

Originally posted by ColCurious
reply to post by Dondylion

 

I'm not angry at all

no worries.

Well, answer the question then.
How come we don't have at least ONE recording like the one I posted of the F-18, considering the large amount of HD cameras that IS around by now?

It's probably out there, just shot down by so many people I described in my OP by screaming it's a fake or hoax video.

I'm not sure why you cannot grasp the implications of the simple statistical probability I pointed out.

Yes, not EVERYONE has the means of recording in HD... however, ENOUGH people actually DO have the means and should have provided at least ONE(!) good recording by now, given the phenomenon was real.

edit on 3-2-2013 by ColCurious because: typos

Again, as I've stated multiple times, a video or multiple great quality videos probably do exist somewhere out there, but they've been shot down by so many as a hoax no one believes it to be true. That's what I'm trying to explain in my OP. People always clamor about demanding HD evidence of UFO's, yet when they receive said evidence, it's immediately marked as CGI or a hoax. Because of that, we will never actually know whether a video or photograph is genuine unless someone actually takes the time to PROVE it's a hoax instead of saying things like this:
Hoax! CGI! Someone photoshopped that UFO in teh picture! etc etc etc.

People nowadays don't even take the time to prove that a video has been hoaxed. They just scream CGI without proof of such and move on. It's especially notable in the first few posts of various threads here in this forum. When others see a user(s) type hoax/fake/edited they don't actually do the research required or continue down the thread to see if someone proves it as such. Yes, there are users on ATS who do actually go through and break down why the object in question isn't a UFO, but that's a lot different than proving a video/image has been manipulated in any way.

That's the point I'm trying to make.

Originally posted by Marcelli
I'm glad there are people like you that do take consideration into what people claim, but I've been there, done that, and I ended up being fooled in the end; which probably makes me one of the 'people' I've described in my previous post.

As for blurry pics and footage, we'll never know if they're the real deal; it's entirely up to you to believe it or not. So in this case, there's no need to argue.

Don't get me wrong, I've been fooled as well, many a time. However, that shouldn't stop you from considering what they claim as true until it's proven otherwise. Isn't the saying "Innocent until proven guilty"? Why don't we do that with images/videos of UFO's and their posters as well? Why can't we assume and consider them "innocent" of hoaxing the images or videos until they have been proven otherwise?

That is very true. The argument comes in where people say things like this:


Caption: "Look a UFO.....Let me get my worst quality camera."

constantly without giving a thought as to maybe all people aren't rich or don't carry their HD cameras about with them 24/7.

I have sailed the waters around fl. For years and we have had five major sightings. Only one was photographed and that was seen on hard copy tv series. But then it was so big it was seen coast to coast. What I am saying is, I never had the equipment to take good photos other than recently, a cell phone and that sucks.

We have had three near our home here and none would have shown up well unless one had high end camera. For instance last year I watched a blinking light dart up and down while moving into the gulf. I am a pilot and nothing we have can stop and reverse direction like this without killing the pilot. Yet had I took a picture, it would have been dismissed as a pixel or such, so why even report these, or bother bringing it here to this site.

Just for the record, my sighting go back into the 50's when the best camera I had was a cardboard brownie.

reply to post by Dondylion
The NASA UFOs I discovered & released to the public via the EBE winning Documentary, "The Secret NASA Transmissions"(the Smoking Gun) & the 2 part doc. "Evidence" (a case for NASA UFOs), were a perfect example of how this Photo Evidence issue was overcome.

The video was downloaded live & unscrambled... from Space Shuttle Missions to NASA ground control & I got it, via a giant dish on the roof of the Cable Company that I managed the programming for. Unimpeachable NASA video that took the UFO research community by surprise. At last we began to discuss the content...

No more "farmer in the field' UFO video! (as the skeptics called all UFO videos back then!)
NASA has since confirmed the 100% authenticity of the live downloaded signals, in a letter to me from the D.C. NASA HQ! I sent them the tapes! We only disagreed on what it was we were looking at. They merely dismissed it all by saying that 'space debris' was always an issue...but they did NOT use "ice" as an excuse, as celebrity skeptic Jim Oberg rants on about..& note that even old Jimbo agrees the video is authentic!

So what more is there to say? We've moved the UFO discussion to content...

& more thanks to NASA for now providing via the web, live video streaming from the ISS , which today is monitored by thousands of newly interested NASA UFO researchers!

reply to post by xpoq47

Now that is a serious ufo hunter.
I've read your work on that project before, very impressive. I'll be looking forward to any results you produce during your investigations.

reply to post by Dondylion

Maybe it is out there, I don't know. If it is, I haven't seen it.
I just cannot see how a genuine and outstanding recording like that wouldn't go viral.

Everything I've seen up until this day was nowhere near the F-18 vid I posted.
So, as far as I'm concerned, there is no photographic evidence until proven otherwise.

And that was the topic of this thread, wasn't it?

The issue is about plausible deniability. For human to accept that there are species greater and stranger than them challenges and confronts their self image. Similar to the challenges that took place to accept the world was round and not flat.

The evidence is overwhelming, millions of witnesses, radar and photographic. All that remains is identifying them, the problems is with the political repercussions when it happens...

reply to post by Dondylion


Haha! That pic's pretty funny!

Anyway, back on topic, I actually do believe in aliens, don't get me wrong here. I believe that we can't possibly be alone in a universe that is so vast and ever expanding. In fact, there were paintings in the 15th or 16th century that depicted flying saucers over an Italian coastal city (forgot the name, but I've seen it in a book about aliens), not to mention the pictures taken in the eras where photo manipulation would be a lot more difficult to do than today.

But it's just that anybody in this time and place could produce a fake picture or video solely to have their fifteen minutes of fame. It's sad really, because when real evidence emerges, from a mediocre camera, people deny it.


I'm not a skeptic, I believe in this kind of thing; but I'll be a true believer once I actually see these flying objects or even get abducted.

Originally posted by kwakakev
The issue is about plausible deniability. For human to accept that there are species greater and stranger than them challenges and confronts their self image. Similar to the challenges that took place to accept the world was round and not flat.

That's one of the main reasons why I believe governments cover up a lot of the witnessed events and such. People just aren't ready to hear we aren't the best thing in the universe. Humans have big egos when it comes to them as a species. We believe we're "top dog" and to confront the possibility that we aren't isn't something people aren't ready to accept.

The evidence is overwhelming, millions of witnesses, radar and photographic. All that remains is identifying them, the problems is with the political repercussions when it happens...

That is very true as well.

reply to post by Marcelli


That's the whole reason behind me starting this thread. People believe that because someone comes out with evidence that's less than perfect, it should just be dismissed. Then, when they get their "perfect" HD quality evidence, it's automatically called a fake. For some reason, people assume that everyone in the world knows how to use CGI or image manipulation programs and are ALL out there for their 15 minutes of fame. That's one of the main reasons why I know many people (including myself) have not put our evidence forward. It would automatically be dismissed as fake because of clarity, or people would complain because the quality isn't "good enough".

reply to post by Dondylion


When looking into the possible exopolitical situation, this is the case. The events around Roswell are a primer to the situation as the facts are stronger then the debunks. The witness testimony from third kind and + encounters also paint a picture where humans are more like cattle in their treatment with some situations. At this level things are very complex, just look at the geopolitical situation and times it by 10 to get a rough gauge of the complexity involved.

All I do know is that life is still progressing on Earth, like watching an ant farm. There is a strong case that nuclear war is not a possibility as previous unknown interventions have disarmed such capability when required. As for mini nukes it is hard to say where the line is, but civilization is still progressing. If humans do turn out to be a failed experiment then let it be so, until then keep on punchin.