I'm worried about ATS..

It's just not the same any more I don't know, something's gone into the #ter and it's hard to put my finger on it, maybe it's me, I don't know.. lol

I've learned so much here, and at the same time honed a "craft" of sorts in the use of language to evoke a response where it might be said that the meaning of communication is the response you get (even when that response might have been dead silence either because you didn't have a clue what I was talking about or because I left you dumbfounded as intended) and I've sharpened my blade of reason to the point of an epiphany, just by sharing and imagining what goes on in the minds and hearts of my fellow men and women, while picking up their treasure and gems as they are presented from time to time, and I tell you it's brought me both to gales of laughter and to tears, both of shared sorrow and suffering but also, worst of all, as pity.

Pity for you, well not all of you, but for some among you, while you sit in a very constrained worldview and reality shaking your fist at "the man" consumed with enmity, bitterness and distrust, as if the whole world as gone to hell in a handbasket, while the milky way galaxy rises every night, proclaiming the glory of all creation.

Something's just not right, imho. Something's gone haywire. We are fast forgetting, on the whole, a heritage and an inheritance prepared for us from the time before time which is the great glory and magnificent splendor not just of creation, but of life itself as created beings. We were so fraught over Obama's apparent war on freedom.. um, that we gave it all away, to Obama (if you devote a lot of time to hating him and your government), that we went and forgot the unfettered, unconstrained and liberated freedom within which we already reside.

Free to choose how to respond to life and to impact others and the world around us in a wholly positive way. Not just to react, or to just react emotionally based on fight or flight. I'm talking about the Parietal Lobe on the very top of the brain, as opposed to the lizardlike brainstem. It's just a different place from which to operate and play with the various frames of reference or models by which to view the world and one's relationship to it, at all levels ie: with an open mind capable of thinking outside of the box, not just continuing to bounce around inside it in the very same way over and over and over again ad infinitum like a dog chasing it's tail, or a rat in the same crazed maze (without escape or even satisfaction).

So when I look at all the ignorance that abounds I find that what is evoked for me isn't a mirthful restoration of my sense of humor, on the other side of the sorrow we share together, and a sense of community, but pity in the knowledge that the rats are totally locked in, and that I will never be able to show them the door or the gateway of their eventual liberation. So it both worries me, and takes away my joy, thus increasing my sorrow because we're all in this together. Don't get me wrong I'm not calling you all stupid and suggesting that I alone am the enlightened one (although you get all kinds at a place like ATS). No what I'm saying is that I'm losing heart at the loss of that quintessential special something that seemed to embody ATS, but that has now been cast aside in favor of Obama and Guns, where the memes abound, on all sides - and you reach the point where you come to realize that well that you people or many of you are just not based in reality anymore.

There I said it. But neither was I! I too got taken in, to a degree by all the hyperbole and unfounded conjecture and baseless senseless OPINION put forward as absolute truth, with conviction! I don't know if I should be entertained at the absurdity of our human condition, while munching popcorn, or if I should fall down on the floor weeping at what's been lost, or leap to my feat in absolute hilarity cackling like a madman at the utter absurdity of it all..?!

But if the pity that I've starting feeling begins to increase, then my humor will decrease in direct proportion, and I will have no choice but to leave and resign, in tears first of sorrow, then perhaps laughter in joyful Liberation?!

Which means that I'll have to deal with my own ATS addiction. LOL!

So please don't let it go all to hell in a handbasket, and I don't mean the world "out there" but the one within out of which everything arises, don't become a mindless hoard on any side of any debate. It's not the huddled masses, that too is another "mass man" (to use a phrase coined by Jung) that we must throw off, so that we can enter the fray with our whole being and see the world, the real world, and each other and ourselves as we really and truly are (possessing a marvelous divine aspect).

At the very least I think our reality tunnels are getting too hardened and much too narrow, and so I guess I'm not here to rant against ATS as much as I am asking and begging you to use the power of your own imagination and freedom to become the truest and greatest you that you can be, while holding at all times an open mind that isn't simply bent on being right to another's wrong, who can bracket that urge in order to seek first to understand and then to be understood, and on the listening, to be truly heard.

I'm willing to work on the beam in my own eye, but I just find the one I see growing in my brother's eye to be, well, horrifying in some way where we're all fundamentally connected in terms of having a human experience (even though that experience to each person is uniquely their own). It's like we're going in totally divergent directions where never the twain shall meet.

I fear I'm losing you as I desire heaven and reason mixed with spirit in a state of bliss, but I can't go without everyone, so for God's sake people - don't dumb down any more, and open you mind and..

Deny Ignorance!

Cheers,

NAM
January 31st, 2013 (dated in case I do just leave never to return).

so you think our reality tunnels are getting hardened too much too narrow?
as they say ' ats is what you make it'.

Be the change you want ATS to be.

The good old days of John Titor Learism are over its a new age now.

The wide range of people who make up the membership here is like a community. There are some I don't understand and there are others I almost always agree with. Just like in real life. Sure there are subjects that get over exposed, but I see it as a valuable cross section of the general consensus.

In real life I deal with a huge spectrum of personality types. I like it that way. I, for one, would be bored if this forum was populated by members who were mostly of the same mind-set.

We see these kinds of threads all the time. Instead of going into this in some detail myself, partly because it's very late here and partly because I feel as though couldn't possibly put it better myself, I think It's best to simply quote our site owner and what he has previously said on this kind of thing. I really do think it's something we all ought to read when we begin to feel a little bit helpless or tired of thing's here. It'll bring some enlightenment your way, that's for sure. It did for me anyway.

The progression of an ATS'er..

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
I've responded to topics like this previously, and know I wrote something meaningful and eloquent, but can't find it now.

BACKGROUND: I've been running "bulletin boards" since there were such things, and the phenomenon of "forum fatigue" is real and happens everywhere... even in real life with clubs and groups. Before ATS I was part of the management team of the most-popular and most-successful forum group on CompuServe, the Computer Arts Forums (17 different forums at its peak). And before that, I helped run two successful dial-up BBS systems. I've seen what you're describing in all cases.

The chronology works something like this:

DISCOVERY: OMG! You (the rhetorical "you") discover this new venue full of people who think like you, and share many of your desires. In the case of ATS, the content is so deep and broad, there seems to be no way you can take it all in.

JOIN: YES! You join ATS and tentatively jump into the discussions, somewhat apprehensive because everyone seems so much more well-informed than you. Hopefully, your comments will be accepted.

ACTIVE: OMFG! After a brief period of getting used to the newness of ATS and getting to know a few members, you have confidence that you can contribute threads that will get some attention, and look forward to the responses you'll receive. You may even be thinking of your threads, or thinking of the replies you'll make, when you're offline doing other things.

HERO: YES! You've author a few threads that made it to the site home, and have reached a stage where you feel you have the respect of many members. Your comments now carry some gravitas.

SATURATED: LOL. Over time, you begin to see what you think are the same topics over and over, or, perhaps mildly rehashed versions of what "feels" like one of the same topics over and over. At first you're not aware of the saturated feeling, but you find yourself visiting fewer of the "aggregation" pages of ATS, looking for new and active threads -- you're just scanning the recent posts page thinking things like: 1) seen it, 2) know it, 3) hoax, 4) stupid, 5) WTF? -- and so on.

FATIGUE: FUUUUUUUUUUUU... The saturation has given way to fatigue as you no longer seem to find anything that holds your interest, or too many topics that feel like rehashes of rehashes of rehashed issue that have been done to death.

COMPLAIN: It seems a fair number of members who reach the fatigue point would rather complain about the perceived problem than do something meaningful about it: spend the effort to author new threads that exemplify their interests and push new ideas into the conversation mix. Not everyone is capable of that, and this is the primary reason you see "active long-term members" become inactive.


In reality, nothing has changed. I'm serious about this.

YOU have changed. You've absorbed everything you have the desire to absorb from ATS, and the inevitable happens, very little seems new or fresh any more. But to those just joining (like you in the discovery phase), EVERYTHING seems new and fresh.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

So, I feel as though, rather ironically, all I have to say here is something I never said at all because quite frankly, IT says and explains it all, at least in my opinion.

I took an almost year long hiatus from ATS and recently came back, and this place is almost unrecognizable.
I'm not saying it's "bad", but it's not the ATS I remember. As you stated in the OP, something's not clicking and I can't really put my finger on it.

Feels kinda like visiting your high school 15 years later. There are a few familiar faces, but for the most part it's like "Who are these strange people."

You are ATS,ATS is you.
You get out what you put in.


Go search for something that hasn't been reported,hashed over .
Something original.

The main problem is the decrease in attention span.

Go put out something thought provoking and see the response.
Throw some trivial stuff out there and see the response.

It is parallel to what and how our society thinks and it has changed dramatically in a few years.

It's not just ATS,it's across the board.
Spoon feed me something that I can repeat somewhere else.
Instead of digging and investigating.

What is the solution then? Should we all join the "global" collective and give up sovereignty at every angle? I am truly curious as to what you think will solve our collective stupidity

There are things constant in this plane, that is time and space.. Even when you leave, pass away from this life it will continue.

in a little less then a month we will be just a few thousand miles away from extinction.... Yet most if not all human being do not care, nor have even stopped long enough to look up and wonder what it is... I am talking about...



Ats is just a window we look out of and see the world, yes indeed she is tinted with ads but it is still ats, it is alive with words and sparks of intellect. I have long stopped worrying about ats, it has its own social problems just like any other community.. As far as your reflection in the eyes of your brothers and sisters, there is nothing you can do about that really, I have learned thru surprise and pain, that your brothers and sisters do not want help... The ones that do are not on ats...

the mental and psychological and spiritual aspect of man is corroding due to outlandish technological leaps and bounds stimulated by greed... In 2013, we live in a age, where someone can survive without having to live in a community socialize and learn mannerism to be civilized, no instead we have technology that chronicles and substitutes human needs with its devices.

with that said, this feeling you have this way of the world you see, will pass it will change, as it always does...

I sense a dark age at our feet.. The subconscious, is an amazing instrument in sensing the times to come...

Its only going to get harder to feel good, so do your best to condition yourself now..

reply to post by Garkiniss

I took an almost year long hiatus from ATS and recently came back, and this place is almost unrecognizable.

I would like it if you would elaborate on this. I keep hearing older members say similar things. I read tons of old threads and the only thing I see different is the membership now seems to be MUCH broader. This, of course, means more types of input, More fanatics, more goofs, more smart ass comedians, but also more points of view to consider.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


I understand what you mean! I've been here for a while, but it's just people wanting to be right, nowadays. In which, I say you are correct, sir! I can't put it into words like you can, or place my finger on it. But no one wants to discuss things. They just wanna like, debunk your perspective. If truth is a perspective, and people deny your perspective. Is that not the epitome of ignorance.

Just my 2 cents. I see what you are saying, an agree. But nothing we can do but be the change you want.

Originally posted by Leuan
What is the solution then? Should we all join the "global" collective and give up sovereignty at every angle? I am truly curious as to what you think will solve our collective stupidity

Excellent question! That's what keeps me from leaving.

The answer in truth is - I don't know. I'll have to think about it and get back to you on that. Duh!


.....maybe there is a truth of some kind, and that if we gave up the sovereignty of our hardened and narrow reality tunnels "at every angle" relative to it, then we'd get it and would achieve a state of absolute sovereignty and absolute liberation both at the same time. The courage to have a beginners mind I guess is what I'm advocating for, not one that doesn't still have the same content, it's just that the whole context has changed.

So I guess I'm advocating for an exploration of consciousness and what it means to be human.

And so if I care, like I claim - then I'd better think through how to start a thread on it over at Psychology, Philosophy and Metaphysics... or leave. Those are about my only two options at this point.

We must reclaim our power as sovereign individuals but in a newfound domain of liberation and freedom of thought and choice - have the courage to give up our life (for the sake of what it true and right) that we will find it again and in the process start completing the hero's journey.

Once more into the breach dear friends once more!

Originally posted by Rising Against
We see these kinds of threads all the time. Instead of going into this in some detail myself, partly because it's very late here and partly because I feel as though couldn't possibly put it better myself, I think It's best to simply quote our site owner and what he has previously said on this kind of thing. I really do think it's something we all ought to read when we begin to feel a little bit helpless or tired of thing's here. It'll bring some enlightenment your way, that's for sure. It did for me anyway.

The progression of an ATS'er..

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
I've responded to topics like this previously, and know I wrote something meaningful and eloquent, but can't find it now.

BACKGROUND: I've been running "bulletin boards" since there were such things, and the phenomenon of "forum fatigue" is real and happens everywhere... even in real life with clubs and groups. Before ATS I was part of the management team of the most-popular and most-successful forum group on CompuServe, the Computer Arts Forums (17 different forums at its peak). And before that, I helped run two successful dial-up BBS systems. I've seen what you're describing in all cases.

The chronology works something like this:

DISCOVERY: OMG! You (the rhetorical "you") discover this new venue full of people who think like you, and share many of your desires. In the case of ATS, the content is so deep and broad, there seems to be no way you can take it all in.

JOIN: YES! You join ATS and tentatively jump into the discussions, somewhat apprehensive because everyone seems so much more well-informed than you. Hopefully, your comments will be accepted.

ACTIVE: OMFG! After a brief period of getting used to the newness of ATS and getting to know a few members, you have confidence that you can contribute threads that will get some attention, and look forward to the responses you'll receive. You may even be thinking of your threads, or thinking of the replies you'll make, when you're offline doing other things.

HERO: YES! You've author a few threads that made it to the site home, and have reached a stage where you feel you have the respect of many members. Your comments now carry some gravitas.

SATURATED: LOL. Over time, you begin to see what you think are the same topics over and over, or, perhaps mildly rehashed versions of what "feels" like one of the same topics over and over. At first you're not aware of the saturated feeling, but you find yourself visiting fewer of the "aggregation" pages of ATS, looking for new and active threads -- you're just scanning the recent posts page thinking things like: 1) seen it, 2) know it, 3) hoax, 4) stupid, 5) WTF? -- and so on.

FATIGUE: FUUUUUUUUUUUU... The saturation has given way to fatigue as you no longer seem to find anything that holds your interest, or too many topics that feel like rehashes of rehashes of rehashed issue that have been done to death.

COMPLAIN: It seems a fair number of members who reach the fatigue point would rather complain about the perceived problem than do something meaningful about it: spend the effort to author new threads that exemplify their interests and push new ideas into the conversation mix. Not everyone is capable of that, and this is the primary reason you see "active long-term members" become inactive.


In reality, nothing has changed. I'm serious about this.

YOU have changed. You've absorbed everything you have the desire to absorb from ATS, and the inevitable happens, very little seems new or fresh any more. But to those just joining (like you in the discovery phase), EVERYTHING seems new and fresh.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

So, I feel as though, rather ironically, all I have to say here is something I never said at all because quite frankly, IT says and explains it all, at least in my opinion.

edit on 31-1-2013 by Rising Against because: (no reason given)

Exactly what I went through.
That is the time to refresh and look at things as if you were new.
Surprised that didn't ban me through the complaint phase.

When tons of the same threads start popping up, something else could be going on that you "needn't worry about."

The gun issues hit a heart string, perfect time to pull an unexpected bait and switch.

Just my opinion.

Peace.

Originally posted by tanda7
reply to post by Garkiniss

 

I took an almost year long hiatus from ATS and recently came back, and this place is almost unrecognizable.

I would like it if you would elaborate on this. I keep hearing older members say similar things. I read tons of old threads and the only thing I see different is the membership now seems to be MUCH broader. This, of course, means more types of input, More fanatics, more goofs, more smart ass comedians, but also more points of view to consider.

As I said, it's hard to put a finger on it. There's nothing specific that makes it different, it's just different.
The only way you could experience this is to cut out ATS for a year and come back.

I suppose you spend a while on here and you make friends/allies and learn how/when they'll respond. You learn who the jokers are, the b.s.ers, the religious nuts, and the far left and right extremists. Coming back, so many people I use to have conversations with are gone now. So many new faces, new voices.
People seem quicker to attack, less patient. To be honest it feels a little more hostile than it used to be.
I even saw a Mod use a one word response, which probably doesn't seem like a big deal to noobs, but a couple of years ago you'd get a warning for that sort of thing, and now the people moderating are doing it. As I said, there's no one thing in particular. It's just... different.

SATURATED: LOL. Over time, you begin to see what you think are the same topics over and over, or, perhaps mildly rehashed versions of what "feels" like one of the same topics over and over. At first you're not aware of the saturated feeling, but you find yourself visiting fewer of the "aggregation" pages of ATS, looking for new and active threads -- you're just scanning the recent posts page thinking things like: 1) seen it, 2) know it, 3) hoax, 4) stupid, 5) WTF? -- and so on.

I'm still in that phase.

Then just go post a funny picture.

reply to post by Garkiniss


It's just...diferent.

Cue Twilight Zone theme

I have been coming here for years. But I think what the op is describing (or trying to) is that the site and it's members seem to have become more 'mainstream' (I know that's not the correct example, but probably the closest)

As said above, where once issues were debated, over days and weeks, now posters seem to want instant gratification and instant answers. There is more of a I am right / you are wrong mentality coming from a lot of the newer members.

Where once sensible, logical dialogue could be expected. Now there are too many personal inferences being used in debate.

Too many non relevant threads, not enough grown up debating. Where once conspiracies were weeded out through rationale and evidence. Now there are conspiracies everywhere.

I realise I sound pompous, and I am NOT generalising. But I think this is what the op, and other op's in the recent past are talking about.

reply to post by NewAgeMan



Well written. I share your frustration in many ways. Here is what I know of this: Fast and furious prophecy fulfillment mirrored by shock and awe over the reversal of Evil back to Good is approaching. I don't know when it will happen, but mark those words. It's coming. In a blink of an eye and like lightening flashing, the clouds will be parted and the light will shine.

Remember these words: Source

"The character and fate of all humankind reside with these spirits. All the hosts of humanity, generation by generation, are heirs to these spiritual divisions, walking according to their ways; the outworking of every deed inheres in these divisions according to each person’s spiritual heritage, whether great or small, for every age of eternity. God has appointed these spirits as equals until the last age, and set an everlasting enmity between their divisions. False deeds are thus an abomination to the truth, whereas all the ways of truth are for perversity equally a disgrace. Fierce dispute attends every point of decision, for they can never agree. In his mysterious insight and glorious wisdom God has countenanced an era in which perversity triumphs, but at the time appointed for visitation He shall destroy such forever."