Should Scotland be an independent country?

reply to post by Logarock


No, it was definitely not a case of apathy. Parliament and the Welsh Parliament looked into continuing to fund it, did the research and asked opinions.........and came to the conclusion it really wasn't worth the expenditure.

No patronising from Westminster either. The Welsh wished to have a devolved a Parliament, paid for by Westminster, who agreed. Not sure how that is patronising - i would say quite the opposite, it demonstrates trust and understanding.

It is simply that Welsh people, generally, don't speak Welsh - it is far too complicated!

Originally posted by Flavian
reply to post by Logarock

 

No, it was definitely a case of apathy. Parliament and the Welsh Parliament looked into continuing to fund it, did the research and asked opinions.........and came to the conclusion it really wasn't worth the expenditure.

No patronising from Westminster either. The Welsh wished to have a devolved a Parliament, paid for by Westminster, who agreed. Not sure how that is patronising - i would say quite the opposite, it demonstrates trust and understanding.

It is simply that Welsh people, generally, don't speak Welsh - it is far too complicated!

OK I am going to say this and then duck and run ....

Is there really such a thing as the Welsh people - I mean they are just an English tribe, are they not ? [ right running now, head down ]

Seriously, when the Romans invaded there was just Brittania or Albion, there was not Scotland Wales England - we are descended from the tribes of Albion, the borders happened after tribal wars.

We are all the same gene pool actually ..

reply to post by HelenConway


I'm the same, but I prefer to be called British, because I am. If we kept devolving our origins, I'd be 75% scouse and 25% ballyboden, but nobody does that now - people used to, when England was divided and the Romans came along, people still said "I'm a Mercian" or "I'm a Northumbrian" rather than "I'm English" (well, the Latin equivalents, but I'm not posh enough to know those).

Why do we continue to divide ourselves in to this and that and scots hate english and english hate welsh and welsh hate irish and so on and so on and so on? We should all stand together and save our hate for the French.

That should be decided by the Scots, and no one else.
2nd

Its not independance that worries me,its Salmonds version of independance.He laps up the E.U. and would never give the people a referendum on it.We all know the Scots are sick of E.U. migrants taking jobs,social housing and in effect lowering wages.
The man is a toe rag,bribing the dumb and poor with free presciptions etc while trying to cause division with the English by charging them fees for university.
The man has delusions of grandeur,horrible little liar that he is.
Allegedly he is an 'astute politician' i.e. a good liar.
If independance means being Europes bitch then i say no thank you and will vote to stay in the union.

Originally posted by Submarines
That should be decided by the Scots, and no one else.
2nd

I vote Scots out of the union, if that is what they want - then we would not have to listen to the whinging - i am sorry to my Scottish friends on here - I love ya, but please, it is painful for us in the rest of the union to hear this constantly.

If you are unhappy - you can leave, you have a vote soon, no one is stopping you ?

Whe are we going to have an English parliament that is what want to know

Originally posted by Dispo
reply to post by HelenConway

 

I'm the same, but I prefer to be called British, because I am. If we kept devolving our origins, I'd be 75% scouse and 25% ballyboden, but nobody does that now - people used to, when England was divided and the Romans came along, people still said "I'm a Mercian" or "I'm a Northumbrian" rather than "I'm English" (well, the Latin equivalents, but I'm not posh enough to know those).

Why do we continue to divide ourselves in to this and that and scots hate english and english hate welsh and welsh hate irish and so on and so on and so on? We should all stand together and save our hate for the French.

there is a reason why we stopped saying we are British and you are very intelligent so you know very well why that is...

Originally posted by HelenConway

Originally posted by Submarines
That should be decided by the Scots, and no one else.
2nd

I vote Scots out of the union, if that is what they want - then we would not have to listen to the whinging - i am sorry to my Scottish friends on here - I love ya, but please, it is painful for us in the rest of the union to hear this constantly.

If you are unhappy - you can leave, you have a vote soon, no one is stopping you ?

Whe are we going to have an English parliament that is what want to know

Trust me,its painful for us Scots to have to listen to the posh eton tories that you English love to vote for.
'I am sorry to my Scottish friends on here'-no you are not,you are passive aggresive.

Originally posted by glen200376

Originally posted by HelenConway

Originally posted by Submarines
Whe are we going to have an English parliament that is what want to know

Trust me,its painful for us Scots to have to listen to the posh eton tories that you English love to vote for.
'I am sorry to my Scottish friends on here'-no you are not,you are passive aggresive.

Umm come on .. most English people did not go to Eton and can't stand those toffs.

It was because Labour no longer listens to people who work - and let ten million people into the country taht they got kicked out.. they were nasty as hell, and most of them went to expensive public schools too,

Originally posted by glen200376
.
'I am sorry to my Scottish friends on here'-no you are not,you are passive aggresive.

I am not passive aggressive - please do not make this personal.
I said quite openly I am sick of hearing the Scottish media / public moaning,.. it is painful.

We in England do not have our own parliament - what about us ?

You have a vote - use it and stop whinging as a country .. please.

Originally posted by HelenConway

Originally posted by glen200376
.
'I am sorry to my Scottish friends on here'-no you are not,you are passive aggresive.

I am not passive aggressive - please do not make this personal.
I said quite openly I am sick of hearing the Scottish media / public moaning,.. it is painful.

We in England do not have our own parliament - what about us ?

You have a vote - use it and stop whinging as a country .. please.

oh the irony,yet you moan about not having an English parliment.Maybe you should encourage your fellow English to whinge as a country?

reply to post by glen200376


Glen what is your problem?
you wanted a vote on independence - you have a vote on independence?
i support what ever choice you make.

Why do you think the English should not have a representative parliament ?

while i was born and live in england, i regard myself as a brit due to my mixed ancestry (having a large dose of scottish going back to both sets of grandparents, as well as irish ancestry and family and welsh family too)...
from a purely cultural point of view i would see it as a great shame if the union broke up and would be interested to see if dual nationality would be possible due to my heritage.
i gotta say though that surely scotland missed the boat on this by a considerable time - i have my doubts as to wether they would prosper economically anymore - if they had got independence in the mid 70's then they would have possibly made a fortune from north sea oil and gas, rather than BP and their ilk

If it is the will of the people of Scotland to throw off the yoke of the UK they of course they should have the right to self determination.

As should any member of any union that ceases to be of a benefit to either or both parties. Dissolution of old bonds and ties and the right of self governance are the rights of all men.

Unions of nations are simply getting too big to effectively represent all of the people without ignoring the wishes and values of large swaths of the population. Smaller nations and governments is going to be the future not some kind of one world nonsense.

reply to post by TheWetCoast

I Do believe that Scotland should be free.I want Scotland to be free and I dream of the day that it will be.

Scotland is free, please explain exactly how it isn't?

I belong to the Boyd Clan and I will serve the Boyd Clan in any way I can.

You are about four or five hundred years out of date - do you realise how ridiculous you sound?

Independence from England

Scotland is independant from England - Scotland is an equal partner in The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland along with England, Wales and Northern Ireland.

I am Canadian

?
Are you Canadian or Scottish?

The Scottish people will express their Right To Self-Determination in the upcoming referendum.

For the record, The Union was instigated at the wishes of Scottish noblemen, it has never been a repressive or one-sided relationship / agreement.

reply to post by MadhatterTheGreat

Any country who wants to be independent and free from another country has every right to be.

I agree entirely.
Which is why a referendum on the issue is scheduled.
Where's the problem?

But for the record; the referendum isn't on whether Scotland will be 'free' from England but whether it should break away from The Union and be entirely independant.

I have a friend from Belfast, and he longs for the day when Ireland is independent from England,

The Republic of Ireland is entirely independant of The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
Northern Ireland is an equal member of The Union.

Your friend is in the minority; latest survey's show that over 90% of Protestants and 60% of Catholics in Ulster identify with the UK and wish to remain in The Union.

Whether you like it or not your friend is very much in the minority.

reply to post by SprocketUK

Give them a referendum.

They are having one.

It is scheduled for Autumn 2014 which is when Salmond and the Nationalists want it, everyone else wants it to be held earlier.

For the record, I very much believe we are Better Together.

I think that devolved power to all constituent nations and the regions within some sort of Federal framework would be beneficial for all of us.
We have a better chance of changing The Union into something to be proud of if we are united in the things that really matter.

But, as it should be, it's a matter for Scotland to decide which direction they wish to take.

Alex Salmond is a horrible, empire building bigot who will probably turn out to be the best advertisement for the Better Together side during the campaign.

Interesting thread, but jam packed full of North Americans who - with the greatest of respect - don't know their arse from their elbow about British issues. Of course, people might well be from X, Y or Z clan or whatever (and possibly have the tartan to prove it) but you're wildly mistaken if you think any aspect of that is relevant to modern Scotland or Britain. I'll never understand why 'roots' are so important to some people.

I'm fully English myself, but my partner is Scottish - actually from Kilmarnock like the OP's clan, funnily enough. Anyhow, Scotland is not 'owned' or 'oppressed' by England in any way, shape or form. The Scots (like the Welsh and Northern Irish) are equal members of the union and permitted a great deal of freedom to run their countries as they choose. However, all of these nations take more from the British pot than they put in - that's how they afford things like free prescriptions and university places that English people don't get.

The Scots, of course, are fully welcome to their referendum. There is no reason at all for Scottish people not to be free to decide their future direction. Almost every study concludes that they'd be foolish to break away, but that's a decision for them alone to make - I know for a fact that Scotch people will be welcome in the union regardless of their decision.

reply to post by boymonkey74


it's the united kingdoms, but it seems one monarch is always in charge.

currently, the future king of scotland is charles. as he holds the title of the duke of rothesay.

he has it because the english kicked the scots asses all over the highlands and then some.

the only way to get it back is to restore, reclaim the title of rothesay back to scotland, and proclaim a new king independent or a part of the united kingdom.

maybe the scots can locate sean connery and proclaim him king connery the first, ruler of scotland.

the world would be outraged if the english declared war against james bond.

Yes they should be free, I am Scottish and i want independence and will vote yes in the referendum.


FREEEEDOM!!!!!

Originally posted by randomname
reply to post by boymonkey74

 

it's the united kingdoms, but it seems one monarch is always in charge.

currently, the future king of scotland is charles. as he holds the title of the duke of rothesay.

he has it because the english kicked the scots asses all over the highlands and then some.

the only way to get it back is to restore, reclaim the title of rothesay back to scotland, and proclaim a new king independent or a part of the united kingdom.

maybe the scots can locate sean connery and proclaim him king connery the first, ruler of scotland.

the world would be outraged if the english declared war against james bond.

There have been Scottish kings who have ruled england too - James the 1st, Mary Queen of Scot's son.
We also had 2 scottish PMs recently Blair and Brown.

I thought Charles had a scottish grandmother -

Anyway - who cares the English people and the Scottish people will always be 'ruled' by their leaders and it is these leaders that are th e problem IMO.