Patriotic Group To Build Armed 'Defensible' Neighborhood Fortress

reply to post by MidnightTide


I noticed there was a donate button on that Sipsey blog. What services is his blog giving the community that they should want to donate?

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus


I am well aware that this is not about peeing on someones lawn.

I was just making a humorous example.

First, before anything else, I totally support the right of people to do this if they want. Just want to make that clear.


But I have to be honest - I have been so entertained reading about this because my husband and I invented this place!!! Only we called it "Gunland." And now someone actually wants to build it?!! I cannot believe it. My mythical gunland may be becoming a reality.

I hope everyone read the The Patriot Agreement. The Patriot Agreement states that you have to own guns plus a minimum amount of ammo to live there - or you're out. You have to prove you can shoot at least once a year, you have to teach your children to shoot, you have to stockpile at least a year's worth of supplies, you have to celebrate Patriot's Day... or you're out. The only real "violation" that I can see is not owning a gun. So this is about creating a 100% gun culture. I see vague statements about "Liberty" and "American Exceptionalism" (????) but the whole focus is on guns. I could not have written the template for my Gunland better if I tried.

I am not saying they should not be allowed to have this - in fact I'd be much happier having people of this mindset grouped together safely behind their own version of the Berlin Wall - but I feel a bit like there is no way this can be real. This is a bad joke I made that has come to life. People really believe guns are this important. I am speechless. But go ahead and do what you like....behind that wall. I'm real big on that wall. Please build the wall.

Hope this gets off the ground. Really curious to watch. From faaar faaar away....

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
reply to post by MidnightTide

 

I noticed there was a donate button on that Sipsey blog. What services is his blog giving the community that they should want to donate?

edit on 14-1-2013 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

Beats me, lots of people in the conspiracy community (the bloggers, youtubers) ask for money. I just came across that blog on another site that found who was a leader in this patriot group that has a few skeletons in his closet.

It's a shame that OP came into this with his mind already made up about it. I think a lot more interesting discussions could have happened if comments were met with a thoughtful nod and an 'I see your point but don't necessarily agree because of ___' instead of everyone that disagreed being called disinformation government spies.

Personally, I think it would be cool to live in an underground bunker, like on the show Eureka.

That being said, I think instead of running away from what the founders of the fortress are considering to be the problem, they should be staying in their communities and setting good examples.

Keeping your nose out of your neighbor's business is their definition of liberty?... look away when you see a man punching his wife or children?, who will tell men in this community that they need to pay child support?, not step in when you see neighbor kids drowning a kitten in a bucket of water?

We need neighbors. We need neighbors that don't think exactly like we do. If my whole street thought exactly like me who knows what kind of crazy stuff we'd eventually get up to, cut off from the rest of society, feeding off each other with our conspiracy theories and agoraphobia.

I see the main difference between the fortress in idaho idea and regular gated communities is that the government freely comes and goes in the gated communites. I can picture the fortress wanting to restrict that. I can see that causing problems for the residents.



Also, I need to add that after a few years of hiding in a fortress and being told that anyone outside the walls wants to kill you or strip you of your rights, what happens to women and children that the patriarchs of the families eventually reject? Such as divorce or kicking out grown children? Just shove them out the gate into the world they've been brain-washed or raised into believing wants them dead? I think abused women would be afraid to leave their husbands and children would have very poor footing for setting out into the work force and society in general.

reply to post by ProfEmeritus

reply to post by mbkennel


Yours was my favorite summation:

There has always been a strain of radical utopian philosophy which pops up among humans across the centuries. Recent examples are of course Communism, Fascism and various leftist hippie communes/kibbutzim or sometimes similar religious cults.

The gist of all of these are, at their core, "Everything Would Be Wonderful If We Didn't Have the Wrong Kind Of People Around", for various nationalistic, ethnic, religious, intellectual or ideological definitions of "wrong kind of people".

None of them really work---and they degenerate into unfree authoritarianism or selfish, brutal chaos all over again because people find out that those neighbors that they thought were the Right Kind Of People actually Think Different.

And in the end, it is only real-life Englightenment philosophy and practical application of an accepting and large democratic republic, with all of its fissures and flaws and conflict which elevates us from thousands of years of barbarianism and tyranny. The USA of 1791 had started to achieve this, and was nothing like the utopia supposedly imagined by these regressive, paranoid and incompetently angry supposed "Patriots".

This is such a true and honest assessment. Extremes of all kinds lead to problems.

This community that puts so much emphasis on staying out of each others business, live and let live, and freedom sure has a lot of rules. Why would I have to own a gun or teach my kids to use one? Seem to me that you would be trading one overlord for another.

Originally posted by PrincessTofu
It's a shame that OP came into this with his mind already made up about it. I think a lot more interesting discussions could have happened if comments were met with a thoughtful nod and an 'I see your point but don't necessarily agree because of ___' instead of everyone that disagreed being called disinformation government spies.

Personally, I think it would be cool to live in an underground bunker, like on the show Eureka.

That being said, I think instead of running away from what the founders of the fortress are considering to be the problem, they should be staying in their communities and setting good examples.

Keeping your nose out of your neighbor's business is their definition of liberty?... look away when you see a man punching his wife or children?, who will tell men in this community that they need to pay child support?, not step in when you see neighbor kids drowning a kitten in a bucket of water?

We need neighbors. We need neighbors that don't think exactly like we do. If my whole street thought exactly like me who knows what kind of crazy stuff we'd eventually get up to, cut off from the rest of society, feeding off each other with our conspiracy theories and agoraphobia.

I see the main difference between the fortress in idaho idea and regular gated communities is that the government freely comes and goes in the gated communites. I can picture the fortress wanting to restrict that. I can see that causing problems for the residents.

edit on 14-1-2013 by PrincessTofu because: typo

Also, I need to add that after a few years of hiding in a fortress and being told that anyone outside the walls wants to kill you or strip you of your rights, what happens to women and children that the patriarchs of the families eventually reject? Such as divorce or kicking out grown children? Just shove them out the gate into the world they've been brain-washed or raised into believing wants them dead? I think abused women would be afraid to leave their husbands and children would have very poor footing for setting out into the work force and society in general.

edit on 14-1-2013 by PrincessTofu because: (no reason given)

100% agree with this. One of the statements in the article mentioned that they will educate children, not indoctrinate them. Baloney...training kids to use guns, making people own guns, Patriot Day, setting the place up like a military compound. The whole thing reeks of indoctrination. Indoctrination to an ideology that makes most people very uncomfortable. I guess its only that when the message doesn't support this guy's twisted world views.

I did spend the time to check these folks out and their ideas are admirable. However, they want to build an expensive compound right next to one of the biggest volcanoes on the planet which is now overdue to go off. Doesn't this strike you as lacking a little common sense as well as logic? It does me. My best,

Originally posted by airforce47
I did spend the time to check these folks out and their ideas are admirable. However, they want to build an expensive compound right next to one of the biggest volcanoes on the planet which is now overdue to go off. Doesn't this strike you as lacking a little common sense as well as logic? It does me. My best,

Since you put it like that.. I'm not hating the idea. Where do I donate?

I'm sorry, that was unkind of me. I apologize. I do not wish these people any ill will, just prosperity and happiness.

Interesting about the volcano, though.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
Oh yes! I just moved out of a place like that. Same thing, Christmas lights had to be off the porch or house by Jan 15. They would cite your property and send notices, and would fine. That was just one thing. They also could limit how many objects you have on your porch, how tall the plants could be, what kind of plants you put in the garden areas, they could cite you for not having enough mulch, for the lawn being too high, for patchy areas of grass not growing properly, or for having non-natural planting materials. Well you couldnt put rocks or gravel, though rocks are natural but they meant you cant put materials that do not biodegrade. No rubber mulches or anything like that, and no edging either. They could cite you for having faded siding too. When repainting the color had to be approved.


Yet when I complained my neighbors were leaving giant metal rods in my yard behind the garage they said they can't help me but I could get it hauled out at my expense.

Oh yah and my neighbors WERE letting their dogs pee on my bushes.

And absolutely none of this is about any mythical U.N. "Sustainable development" (actual sustanainable development people are pretty laid back about aesthetics if you're well-meaning and trying to do something decent), and every bit about this is in the name of preserving the holy of holy 'property values'.

These types are very much anti "sustainable development" and hate people who have the gall to use their own land for something useful like growing healthy food instead of duplicating high-water and high-fertilizer consumption identical corporate gardens.

reply to post by ProfEmeritus


If, in their minds, they are seceding from the U.S., they are wrong. They will still have to abide by the laws of their state, and the country, some of which are bound to be different than what they are professing to do. I don't see how this can end any better than what we saw in Waco.

Trust is earned and I don't trust you....

reply to post by olaru12


That's your prerogative. I wont lose any sleep over it. lol!.

Oh yes! I just moved out of a place like that. Same thing, Christmas lights had to be off the porch or house by Jan 15. They would cite your property and send notices, and would fine. That was just one thing. They also could limit how many objects you have on your porch, how tall the plants could be, what kind of plants you put in the garden areas, they could cite you for not having enough mulch, for the lawn being too high, for patchy areas of grass not growing properly, or for having non-natural planting materials. Well you couldnt put rocks or gravel, though rocks are natural but they meant you cant put materials that do not biodegrade. No rubber mulches or anything like that, and no edging either. They could cite you for having faded siding too. When repainting the color had to be approved.

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus

Amazing!. Maybe we were neighbors, although none of the houses here have sold in 5 years. In fact, over a dozen of them are now vacant and owned by the banks, because the housing market is dead. In addition, people now know what a rotten Association we have, and nobody wants to move in.

Why would I have to own a gun or teach my kids to use one?

reply to post by DarthOej

When our children were younger, we actually lived in an area where learning how to use a gun was mandatory for all 6th grade students. They were required to go to a 2 week summer camp run by the county, and were taught how to shoot, learn gun safety, etc.

Just had a thought...since the Mayan bubble burst, I bet you can buy delux 2012 bunkers for a steal, fix 'em up and flip 'em to meet the emerging 2nd amendment bunker boom. I'm sure most amenities would overlap between the two scenarios, so it'd be easy. ....next time on "Property Virgins"

And absolutely none of this is about any mythical U.N. "Sustainable development" (actual sustanainable development people are pretty laid back about aesthetics if you're well-meaning and trying to do something decent), and every bit about this is in the name of preserving the holy of holy 'property values'.

reply to post by mbkennel

Of course, you and I( my post above on this page) know that what the Association actually ends up doing is lowering the property values, because their restrictions result in the fact that no one wants to move here. Actually, I believe that a motivating factor for these people, most of whom have no children, is that they have no life, are very insignificant people, and feel the power they have over other people who are trying to merely just live their lives.

It's a shame that OP came into this with his mind already made up about it.

reply to post by PrincessTofu

Please read what I actually said:

This is an extremely interesting idea. It certainly gives people the opportunity to avoid some of the liberal, socialist trends that are accelerating under the current administration. I'd like to know how many people would consider joining such a community. Furthermore, I'd like to know whether those that are opposed to the current direction of this country, would be willing to help build such a community if one were available in your state? One of the things that could accelerate such a movement, would be if the free militias of the various states were to endorse and agree to be part of such communities. If such communities were fairly self-sufficient, they could barter and avoid income and sales taxes. In addition, the idea of teaching schools without socialist leanings seems very attractive. I know that economic issues may make it very hard for many people to join, but theoretically, would you be willing to participate in such an endeavor?

Nowhere did I say I agreed with it, or that I support it. What I did do, is ask for an open, respectful discussion of the idea. I said it was an important idea. Furthermore, if you actually read through the entire thread, you would see I tried to encourage honest debate. Personally, since this thread is pretty much winding down, and dying, let me give you my personal view:
1.)It is an Interesting idea
2.)It is not the solution to the mess we are in.
3.)It is an indicator of what many feel (68%) is the wrong direction this country is going in.
4.)I would never join such an endeavor.
5.)However, in a free country, people that want to participate in this should be free to do so, as long as they do not violate any laws.

I wish to thank the participants in this thread for their input. I hope, if nothing else, it encouraged people to think about problems and possible solutions for the economic and divisional problems that I hope people realize we have in this country, and in fact, in the world at large.

Originally posted by gidwa
reply to post by ProfEmeritus

 

If, in their minds, they are seceding from the U.S., they are wrong. They will still have to abide by the laws of their state, and the country, some of which are bound to be different than what they are professing to do. I don't see how this can end any better than what we saw in Waco.

Good grief people. READ THE SITE.
They clearly say that all resident must obey ALL FEDERAL and STATE laws.

Why does everyone think these people are trying to form their own country?

Again, if its real.