Cameron: Britain would fight another war with Argentina to keep the Falkland Islands

Originally posted by yourmaker
How would the British feel if Argentina had a possession they took by force centuries ago right beside the Isle?

Would they not want to re claim it or something? Or at least the recognition that they are right off their coast?

It just seems odd that years after colonialism here we are fighting over an island a world away..

That right beside the Isle notion of yours is also way off the mark, ignoring the taking by force, and the re-claim remarks.

The Falklands are 480 kilometres away from the South American mainland, now that is quite a swim, by anyone's standards.

So to reverse analyse your argument, do you think Britain should "re-claim" France, Belgium, Netherlands, and Ireland, as these all lie within your magic 480km reclaiming zone.

reply to post by woogleuk


Great post and I agree 100%
Cheers everyone I think this is my longest thread I have made mind you most of my posts are just repeating the same thing to people who do not read the whole thread nor do any research at all.

reply to post by boymonkey74


If you like long threads about the Falklands where people make themselves look like idiots, feat your eyes on this masterpiece



www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by Watchfull


To be Devil's Advocate here. those countries all achieved independance by democratic means (mostly, I think we fought a little war or two with the French...)

What the OP just said is correct. The Falklands were colonised by Brits who DIDN'T displace any natives, unlike what we did in India, Australia or (dare I say it) Ireland. But that'll open up another can of worms if we were to derail the thread with that!

Originally posted by waynos
reply to post by boymonkey74

 

If you like long threads about the Falklands where people make themselves look like idiots, feat your eyes on this masterpiece

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Oh boy, just started reading that one! Thanks for the heads-up.

If Scotland can have a referendum on it's fate(2014), and the UK will abide by that, then so can the residents of the Falklands, easy fix. Get then to vote on it, and both sides respect the outcome of the vote, that would end the heated rhetoric.

The 19th century saw a lot of territory change hands, we can't go and say in the 21st century "hey that used to be our land back in the 1800's now we want it back".

Britain took it over in 1833, and no war was fought at the time for it, Argentina left without a fight because they couldn't match the English navy. The war in 1982 actually is what solidifies the British sovereignty over the islands.

Originally posted by yourmaker
How would the British feel if Argentina had a possession they took by force centuries ago right beside the Isle?

Would they not want to re claim it or something? Or at least the recognition that they are right off their coast

But there's the rub. Britain never took the Falkland's by force. If you believe they did then methinks a quick dash to the history books is in order. When the English claimed the Falkland Islands there was no population.

Also, just to help you out with geography. The Falklands are not "right off their coast", they are 400 miles away. South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands which are also coveted by the Argentines and they are 1,300 to 1,600 miles "right off their coast." At what point does “right off their coast” becomes a legitimate argument, because the whole Eurasia is “right off” the coast of England!

Regards

reply to post by Blue_Jay33


They are in March I hope it will be the end of it but I don't think Kircher will let it lie.
Oh and the 20 or so Argies who were there were not a settlement they were prisoners.

Originally posted by jayman0111

Originally posted by waynos
reply to post by boymonkey74

 

If you like long threads about the Falklands where people make themselves look like idiots, feat your eyes on this masterpiece

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Oh boy, just started reading that one! Thanks for the heads-up.

I remember that one.... Jeebus, that was painful..

Originally posted by Blue_Jay33
If Scotland can have referendum on it's fate(2014), and the UK will abide by that, then so can the residents of the Falklands, easy fix. Get then to vote on it, and both sides respect the outcome of the vote, that would end the heated rhetoric.

Just as well there is a vote planned for March then!

reply to post by Blue_Jay33


Exactly, and Scotland will remain within the UK, and still be British (apparently even the Queen will still be your head of state).

But you will be fully independent of England, and our government.

But also, should Iceland decided they want all your Haggis and finest scotch, England will still be there to defend you, just like the Falklands, because, independent or not, you will still be British!.

Personally I can't wait a for a border poll over here on this side of the water to sort-out who wants what. Can't see Dublin wanting the north though, but again, that's another thread.

Mis mayores respetos a aquellos usuarios británicos a favor de la paz, pero me parece patético que la mayoría de los usuarios de este foro, que yo consideraba profundo y culto, estén a favor de iniciar una guerra contra mi país. Salvajes, ¿Consideraron que gente fuera de la política podría quedar con brazos mutilados, con familiares muertos, llenos de luto y de tristeza? ¿Que somos todos iguales, más allá de la nacionalidad? En definitiva, ¿Que no es una partida de Age of Empires?
Estuve de viaje en Inglaterra, allá la gente fue de lo más cordial. Gente atrasada hay en todos lados, en mi país y en el de ustedes. Pero si bien los Kirchner son un cáncer para la Argentina, Cameron también lo es para Gran Bretaña: porque no solo de economía vive un pueblo, TAMBIÉN DE LA PAZ. De la fraternidad. Y es lo que nos hace humanos.
No quise discutir sobre las invasiones inglesas a mi país de 1806 y 1807, de la Vuelta de Obligado. No. Son políticas ajenas al pueblo, y de ningún modo me pondría en contra de ciudadanos comunes y corrientes. Esto es, contra ti mismo.

My greatest respects to those british users in favor of peace, but I find pathetic that most users of this forum, that I felt deep and composed of educated people, worship in favor of starting a war against my country. Wilds, Did you consider that people outside of politics could be left with mutilated arms, with dead relatives, filled with grief and sadness? What we are all equal, regardless of nationality? In short, that is not a game of Age of Empires?
I travelled to England and met very cordial people. Backward people are everywhere, in my country and in yours. But while the Kirchners are a cancer for Argentina, Cameron also is that for Great Britain, because a country does not lives only on the economy, the peace is also important... the fraternity. And that's what makes us humans.
I did not discuss English invasions of 1806 and 1807 inside Argentina, the Vuelta de Obligado. No. They are policies outside the village, and in no way I would be against ordinary citizens. That is, against yourself.

Originally posted by Ramcheck
The Empire is over, move on. Free the Malvinas.

Las Malvinas son Argentinas.
Itll be a different war this time. Argentina wont be alone.

reply to post by soyander


Welcome to the thread
We all want peace and what many of us are saying is we do not want a war but we will defend our people and their home just as you would and any other nation on the planet would.
The constant sabre rattling from your president has got us nervous and we do not want a war between our people again.
But I will make it clear just as Cameron has (I hate him too) we will fight anyone who tries to take our land from our people.
Your junta tried and I know the junta lied to your people just as Kirchner is doing to you now.
In March the people who have worked the land of the Falklands for over 170 years will vote democratically on who to be with, lets respect that like in international law.
We have offered a 50/50 split on the mineral resources around the Falklands but Kerchner wants it all, hopefully you will elect someone who will see sense and then both our nations can get better acquainted and look forward to a prosperous future together

BTW My fave football player is sergio aguero, he scored in the last seconds and helped my team Man City win the Prem

reply to post by mikeone718


Saber rattling again, anyone tries to invade we will defend it with the EU behind us.
I do not want war but Mike wouldn't you defend the people of the states if they were invaded?
We were not the aggressors in 82 we were the defenders and again we will not be the aggressors now we will just defend our land and people.

The thing here is that in Malvinas as of course in the UK you´re beeing told the history as your government wants, the facts are that we, the Argentinians were living there prior to the 19 th century and we got there trough spanish and local ships: we settled there after the 18 th with argentinians that were the first people living there from then on. The first one´s to discover them were the Spanish fleet in 1520- 1540; this fact is prooved by the recognition of them in the nautical charts of Reinel 1520-1523, of Diego Rivero 1529 and from Agnese in 1536-1545, but specially from The Islerio, from Alonso Santa Cruz in 1941; in then the islands receive the names of Sanson, San Anton and Los Patos.
Years after this, John Davies described them, but also with a bad description and a wrong localization in the maps, he even didn´t land on them.
The sovereignity wrights were concedeed to the spanish, right after that the first inhabitant of the Malvinas was the french Luis Antonio de Boungainville in 1764, founding Port SanLuis, A year after this Byron explored the Trinidad island, and after this they stablished port Egmont in 1766.
When Spain noticed that they usurped their territory in the Malvinas, called like that for the french people that came here from Saint Maló, claimed their sovereignity rights to France, which was aceppted by them based on the Treaty of Tordesillas and because of their discovery, after this an eviction from the french was made in 1767 and the british were evicted by Francisco de Paula Bucarelli. Because of the smallest number of the Spanish fleet they were¨obligued¨ to give Port Egmont again to the Brits, but keeping their sovereignity rights over the islands, and keeping secret a promise of evacuation from the Brits, which took place the 22nd of May in 1774, where Port Egmont was abandoned. After this, Spain continued their reign in the region till Buenos Aires declared their independency in 1820, assuming the control of all the territories that belong to the Spanish.

So based on history they were never British, till their massacred our people in the islands in 1833, taking by force their control in a planned invasion.

The total number of spanish governments, where there were 2 Argentine included, born in our soil, is listed below:

1. Capitán de Navío D. FELIPE RUIZ PUENTE, de 1767 a 1773.
2. Capitán de Infantería D. DOMINGO de CHAURI, nombrado gobernador interino de 1773 a 1774. 3. Capitán de Fragata D. FRANCISCO GIL y LE-MOS, de 1774 a 1777.
4. Teniente de Navío D. RAMON de CARASSA, gobernador interino de 1777 a 1779.
5. Teniente de Navío D. SALVADOR de MEDINA, de 1779 a 1781.
6. Teniente de Fragata D. JA.CINTO de ALTOLA-GUIRRE, de 1781 a 1783.
7. Capitán de Navío D. FULGENCIO D. MONTEMAYOR, de 1783 a 1784.
8. Teniente de Navío D. AGUSTIN FIGUEROA, de 1784 a 1785.
9. Teniente de Fragata D. PEDRO de MESA y CASTRO, de 1785 a 1786, de 1786 a 1787, y de 1788 a 1789.
10. Capitán de Fragata D. RAMON de CLAIRAC, de 1787 a 1788 y de 1789 a 1790. En este segundo período como Capitán de Navío, desde octubre de 1789.
1 l. Teniente de Navío D. JUAN JOSE ELI7A1 DE, de 1790 a 1791 y de 1792 a 1793.
12. Teniente de Navío D. PEDRO PABLO SANGUINETO, gobernador en tres ocasiones, de 1791 a 1792; ascendido a Capitán de Fragata desde el 8 de septiembre de 1792, y con ese grado de 1793 a 1794 y de 1795 a 1796.
13. Teniente de Navío D. JOSE de ALDANA y ORTEGA, de 1796 a 1797.
14. Capitán de Fragata D. LUIS MEDINA y TORRES, de 1797 a 1798 y de 1799 a 1800.
15. Capitán de Fragata D. FRANCISCO JAVIER de VIANA, de 1800 a 1801.
16. Teniente de Navío D. RAMON FERNANDEZ de VILLEGAS, de 1801 a 1802.
17. Teniente de Navío D. ARTURO LEAL de IBARRA, de 1803 a 1804 y de 1805 a 1806.
18. Capitán de Fragata D. BERNARDO BONAVIA, de 1802 a 1803, de 1804 a 1805 y de 1806 a 1808. 19. Primer piloto de la Real Armada D. GERARDOBORDAS, durante 1809.
20. Segundo Piloto de la Real Armada D. PABLO GUILLEN, desde enero de 1810 hasta febrero de 1811.

This is the historic and legal facts in which our claims are based, for beeing the truth heirs of the Spanish kingdom and the whole territories which belong to them.

Originally posted by soyander
I did not discuss English invasions of 1806 and 1807 inside Argentina, the Vuelta de Obligado. No. They are policies outside the village, and in no way I would be against ordinary citizens.

I bet you did not discuss the 1870s Patagonian genocide and other Argentinean (not Spanish) colonisation in South America.

Good to see the British are being accused of colonialism on an island with zero population when claimed way back before Argentina was formed.

Regards

reply to post by boymonkey74


Who told you the Kirchner are lyeing to us? You are very miss informed, sorry to tell you.
Someone has 2

Originally posted by Zcustosmorum
What a sleaze ball, this is decoration playing to the voters. And Argentina are in no position for war. Pathetic

And Rupert Murdoch and his toilet rag The Sun can get lost also, it's nothing but sabre rattling to the public.

edit on 6-1-2013 by Zcustosmorum because: (no reason given)

Neither is the UK fit for war. A Russian aircraft carrier parked in the Moray firth last year and it took 3 days for the Royal navy to get a ship there. Just as well it was riding out a storm. # joke

reply to post by soyander


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