The Smoking Gun That THEY WANT YOU TO KEEP! The REAL Story.

Originally posted by CinnamonHearts
True, the media seem to like to push the "quiet lone gunman" lately. There is definitely more than meets the eye, but considering I don't necessarily believe that, at least in the last two big shootings, that the alleged shooters are even the actual shooters, it's hard for me to correlate the drugs with the shootings. It's hard to make sense of something with so much missing information. .

edit on 30-12-2012 by CinnamonHearts because: (no reason given)

I don't believe they were the actual shooters, myself. More like fall guys, set up to take the blame, and further the agenda. That mall shooter's gun jamming as it did.....BLANKS cause that. I know that firsthand. An AR-15 isn't much different from am M-16. In basic, my buddy and I had to do the "firing" at a grenade range, using blanks (of course). We spent literally half the time cleaning our rifles, because they would jam after a couple of magazines or so. You know, after about 60 rounds. Same number that it's reported he fired before his rifle jammed. And, come on, we are supposed to believe that, with 60 shots, in a busy mall, he only hit three people? More likely, he had blanks, and KNEW it was blanks, being fooled into thinking this was some sort of game or something, and another shooter was concealed nearby, and actually shot those that were hit. With the school shooting, we have someone that is supposed to have had Asperger's, a mild form of autism. Autistic people do not like loud noises, and chaos. I have a grandson with that condition. I simply can't see someone like that planning such an attack, much less carrying it out. Something is off there. In both the theater shooting, and the Arizona shooting, there were early reports of others involved. In Arizona, there was an older man, heavier set, with very short-to-no hair, who was shown as a "person of interest", seen leaving the scene. After a day or so, he wasn't mentioned AT ALL. Same as in the other cases.

Now, we have mental illness linked to cases. The guy that killed his dad and himself with a bow and knife supposedly left something blaming his (undiagnosed) Asperger's for the problems in his life.

I have to wonder...are these cases caused by these drugs, or are these cases being used to force more people onto these drugs? Mental illness blamed, people demanding action, and new laws forcing every child in school to be tested for problems, so they can "treat them" before the kid "flips out" or some such nonsense. They already force parents to vaccinate, so it isn't much of a stretch to see them forcing mental health evaluations, and forcing medications. Heck, they have already forced meds in some places. remember the scandal of schools telling parents their kids would be expelled if they didn't medicate them?

I think the drugs are a factor. I think pushing more of them is their goal. Complacent, compliant, easily controlled people.

Originally posted by Mijamija
*snip*

If there is a conspiracy involving these drugs, I think it is to keep people so "spaced out" and "numb" they will not question what is going on around them, and will become so emotionally detached that when things do happen they do not react.

*snip*

Exactly! Make people outraged at the supposed "mentally ill", and force drugs on the population at large. Perfect method of control. They already have pills for virtually everything, and this shooter business could be used to make more people take them.

Originally posted by frazzle
reply to post by Mijamija

 

If there is a conspiracy involving these drugs, I think it is to keep people so "spaced out" and "numb" they will not question what is going on around them, and will become so emotionally detached that when things do happen they do not react.

Keeping people spaced out ...

Last year, the AP reported that trace amounts of a wide range of pharmaceuticals — including antibiotics, anti-convulsants, mood stabilizers and sex hormones — have been found in American drinking water supplies. Including recent findings in Dallas, Cleveland and Maryland's Prince George's and Montgomery counties, pharmaceuticals have been detected in the drinking water of at least 51 million Americans.

Most cities and water providers still do not test. Some scientists say that wherever researchers look, they will find pharma-tainted water.

www.usnews.com...

They assure us that terrorists could never attack the US water supply.

Well, maybe they are so sure of that because they are already guarding them more closely than we think, so people don't see that they are putting in the water!

If trace amounts of arsenic can kill over time, what do trace amounts of unknown drug cocktails do to people in the long run?

reply to post by Mijamija


About the weird, numb spaced out feeling some of these medications cause, I guess in effect it is emotional zombiefication and while some people might need an emotional crutch of the chemical variety sometimes, it probably should be under stricter guidance and only if REALLY required and for a short duration.

The link I gave before was saying how UK anti depressant prescriptions have increased from 9 million in 1991 to 46.7 million in 2011, a huge increase. Surely society is to blame for the largest percentage of this increase.

Another poster mentioned her sister was prescribed anti depressants and was numb and unemotional, this seems to be the standard reaction as is the slurring and shuffling seen by certain medications, I have seen this professionally and it probably even says so on the contra indications of these medications and as such should probably only be considered under certain circumstances.

Which leads to the prescribing, here in the UK most people use the NHS and Psychiatrist consultations are on GP referral basis and as they are more costly, are generally only used in extreme cases, hence most of these prescriptions fall to the GP's, their difficulty is that the patient might relay such things as perhaps they ''can't cope'' or were suffering from ''thoughts of suicide'' etc and the GP then has a responsibility to prescribe something as a preventative measure. They have a range of things to prescribe and firstly in mild cases they should suggest the usual herbalism, massage etc though often they HAVE to prescribe something more effective, and this has to come from the list of allowed drugs, most of which have side effects. Same for those presenting a potential danger to others. GP's have a decision to make and normally under time constraints of 5 minutes per appointment.

GP appointment systems probably have a lot to answer for too in this increase in anti depressant use. Most places an appointment can only be made on the day as an emergency appointment and involves first telling the reason to the often rude receptionist, then either getting an appointment with a locum GP, a prescribing nurse, or the emergency GP at the surgery, all of which allow 5 minute time scales, sometimes an appointment isn't given, a call from a GP or nurse on the phone instead determines that the potential patient should ''go get some aspirin'' or ''let it take it's course'' etc. In order to get a longer appointment these are made in advance and often have a wait time of 2 to 3 weeks, for example if requiring a female doctor or a regular GP.

Most people I have talked to about the system agree it is off putting, infringes on privacy and lacking the trust of the old style family GP system where you had a dedicated GP for life or at least years continuously. This made it easier to talk to ones GP in confidence and trust that they care, are listening and will do the right thing with regards to prescribing, diagnosis and referrals. The current system is so overwhelmed by unsustainable levels of immigration, lack of funding, irresponsible policies and financial mismanagement that patients feel like they are factory fodder on a conveyor belt, almost despised by the GP they are so privileged to get an appointment to spend 5 minutes telling their intimate feelings to, while they routinely nod, interrupt and grimace at like they are some sort of failure and or lying or despicable. Such is the feeling of unease at getting continually unsatisfactory care, having to make repeated appointments for yet more of the same unsatisfactory care. It is no wonder people are more depressed than ever, as well as seeing most of the jobs, work ethics and traditional values evaporating before their eyes, the old tenets of society aren't there any more, who is there to trust? Have people ever felt more alone than now?

As for another poster that mentioned about these drugs in the water supply, this isn't surprising at all, there must be so many chemicals and all sorts in the water supply that isn't possible to filter. I refuse to drink tap water and when we have it made us ill, it affects my son's behaviour too. Also it might answer for the general apathy the general public has. So many jobs I have had where there was rampant tyrannical bosses, unscrupulous practices, deliberate framing of people that held influence or knew the job too well, people being sacked for being off ill and all sorts of illegal practices that were blindly ignored by those it wasn't happening to. Yet another sickness of society.

reply to post by LadyGreenEyes


Good points being made there.

I think there are too many similarities with the first reports of other gunmen on the scene that ''escaped'' and the lack of feasibility of these ''quiet'' non aggressive guys suddenly turning up in full on tactical gear, and armed to the teeth with multiple weapons, perpetrating random acts of evil, that they totally look like fall guys.

While the Newtown thing seems too patchy for me to follow and again inconsistent reporting to make a judgement yet, I followed the Aurora thing and from the first minutes of the reports coming through I seen photos that were then altered, too many things that didn't fit for it being believable.

The fact that these guys are being reported as suffering Asbergers seems very deliberate to me. Again probably for the purpose of control and manipulating public opinion.

My son is recently diagnosed as having high functioning Asbergers, doesn't like loud sounds or chaos either, can't get his head around the recent events, thinks it utterly despicable and finds violence offensive. Additionally, this diagnosis was 6 years in the waiting, mini tests, to and fro for years, schools making comments and I know for a fact MANIPULATING my son sometimes to get an effect they wanted from him, like making him shout because they were shouting in his face, then accusing him of being out of control, when he really isn't. My son if very clever and very very astute and observant, he could talk from a baby and has often said things that as a child, wouldn't normally know, things about seeing aliens and ghosts before being taught anything about them etc., This was picked up on from a routine appointment when he was 3 and when he was doing things like stacking the chairs at Montessori instead of sitting at the tables. Every time he has shown lateral thinking or made a profound statement beyond his years, guaranteed, school will find a way of manipulating him into saying something they can use as an excuse for accusing him needing more input from them or some other supposed ''group'' that basically questions him.

Would be interesting for a real profile on all these guys parents, there are things mentioned about Holmes' family in other threads and it all seems relevant to me, I know I have suffered from knowing too much sometimes and I wouldn't be surprised if all the excuses for questioning my son and attempted control of him is in some way related to the things I have seen and that I know.

reply to post by Hefficide

I am talking about SSRI's. Street name, Paxil, Lexapro, Cymbalta, Effexor, Wellbutrin, Celexa, Zoloft, and Prozac.... among many others.

Bill Cooper wrote about it in Behold A Pale Horse years a go.

reply to post by theabsolutetruth


Sounds like you should get him into some other system. My grandson was tested at a younger age, and I don't think anyone yelled at him to get a response. Maybe I should check with my oldest, and find out.....

Every scenario we have been presented with is less than feasible, as far as I can tell. I can understand getting false witness reports, but the same inconsistencies every time? That's pushing it a bit. Plus, I ave had a gut feeling that there is a lot more to all these stories than we are hearing. Not provable, of course, but there, and it won't go away. Learned a long time ago to listen to those!

Excellent thread! So good in fact that it prompted me to take the plunge and (finally) join ATS.

One thing I've seen mentioned here, though not really explored in too much detail, is the role that video games play in all of this. Now I know there are tons of threads here on ATS about the video game subject, but my thoughts relate directly to the discussion at hand.

Just in this thread alone I think I've read no less than 4-5 firsthand accounts of folks who have been prescribed SSRI's who in short order begin to withdraw socially, to seemingly lose the ability to care. To paraphrase, words like "acting" out emotions in the absence of real ones, 'anger' and 'focus' have been used. The wildly popular First Person Shooter games capitalize on every one of these emotions or lack thereof. To be good you must have focus and in many respects be angry (or at least aggressive). Now I certainly wouldn’t consider myself a gamer by any stretch, but I have played a few, and in just the little exposure I’ve had it seems like the underpinning theme is kill, kill and more kill.

So what does all this have to do with SSRI’s and the big pharma leviathans? Well, for starters it seems that the combination of SSRI’s and video games exaggerates the effects of the SSRI’s. When you couple that with the effects of distancing of oneself from society and not caring you’ve just about created the “perfect storm” to create a killing machine.

If you watch any of the MSM rhetoric (which I try to avoid) about going out and rounding up guns, in the very same breath there’s some kind of a statement about needing to shore up mental health. As others have noted, this theme almost drives people towards, not away, from seeking even more of these psychotropic drugs as the solution, not less.

Perhaps part of the solution for the use of these drugs may lie in at minimum warning users, or better yet somehow ‘prohibiting’ users, from combining the use of SSRI’s and first person shooter video games. It’s no different than the very prominent warnings about not combining prescription pain killers and alcohol. (e.g. if you do it, you or others around you may be injured or killed!).

With as little as is known about how SSRI’s function inside the brain, it seems to me there’s a pretty credible case to be made for at least making a concerted effort to understand what outside stimuli (i.e. video games, etc) cause adverse reactions to these drugs. Seems like a sensible course of action to me.

Just two pennies worth from a newby.

reply to post by Hefficide


Speaking from experience, I can tell you how evil(for lack of a better term)Paxill is. I was put on Paxill by a therapist who misdiagnosed my PTSD as depression and panic attacks. I know they sound like one in the same, but they are completely different. Any way, that stuff is bad news. I would drift off to sleep while standing, have complete blackouts and wake up a while later in another room of the house and be doing something seemingly normal,(i.e., vacuuming, doing dishes, feeding the dog, surfing the internet,etc.) but had no idea why or how I got there. After my 20th or so time blacking out behind the wheel of my car, I decided to quit taking it. Thats when the fun really began. Panic attacks out of the blue, violent episodes, headaches, paranoia, etc. It got worse before it got better, but long story short, that stuff is bad news.

reply to post by JarheadFidelis


So, question for you, because your testimonial seems both credible and recent; when you took Paxill did you find yourself progressively becoming any less social? Not trying to get into any psychoanalysis here, but more just trying to understand mindset and effect. So, for example, aside from the episodes, did you find yourself changing any of your historically normal behaviors while taking Paxill? Specifically, what I'm getting at here is did you feel like you became more interested in some things that you previously were not, and less interested in things you were?

I'm intentionally trying not to get too specific here so as not to 'lead' or predispose your answer.


BTW...Thankyou for your Service!!

Originally posted by Flyingclaydisk
reply to post by JarheadFidelis

 

So, question for you, because your testimonial seems both credible and recent; when you took Paxill did you find yourself progressively becoming any less social? Not trying to get into any psychoanalysis here, but more just trying to understand mindset and effect. So, for example, aside from the episodes, did you find yourself changing any of your historically normal behaviors while taking Paxill? Specifically, what I'm getting at here is did you feel like you became more interested in some things that you previously were not, and less interested in things you were?

I'm intentionally trying not to get too specific here so as not to 'lead' or predispose your answer.


BTW...Thankyou for your Service!!

Its hard to tell, that time in life is a bit clouded. But I know the people who know/knew me then are glad Im off of it. Their answer was always" You werent yourself" Hope that helps.

reply to post by Hefficide

Credit to Heff for exposing this organized crime/topic, IMO, the medical grunts of the nwo and their (sick) buisness are obsessed psychotic mass killers and psychopaths for offering and forcing 'legal' violence inducing psychotropic drugs to vulnerable,victimized sad or unstable people, alternative medicines /therapy to Big Pharma has to become wider education and accessible to all, I'd guess this would begin with community not conformity.
As for armed nations, unless we - the victimized targets- have an equall arsenal to combat the nwo genocidal tactics of ('legal') psychotropic weaponary and drugs then I can't see how to reach an equilibrium to any stand off to this war.
For what its worth, I recently heard a judge warn his 1st time young male cannabis user (target) /offender of a single petit cannabis charge that if he persisted in the use of the herb then he could 'catch schizophrenia, as he was the (targeted) age group and gender', I see this statement as pretty defeatist and obsured, it is the 'legal' diagnosis/misdiagnosis and labelling changing of people by the corporate medical and education system backed by the military and monotheistic monarchist monetary that is out of controll, as a race we were targeted for being 'witches' unbeleivers of monothesism, it appears every age group and sex and race are targets for dehuminization and have been for some time, we were mass murdered from their begining, we still are such targets we are still being forcefully, degradingly experimented upon and inhumanely institutionalized and targeted for not conforming to the real psychopaths obseesive behaviour and delusions of grandeux.
I would recommend immediately home educating and self medicating our own as a solution to avoiding such insanity oppressed upon us and our children...I did and would again.
This topic has to be wider spread well done Heff and all for making an imperitive start here on ATS I appreciate your work and honestly felt compelled to make this my first reply/contribution to ATS due to the alarming facts of Big Pharmas misconducts.
Misinformation, misdiagnosis of 'mental illness' and 'legal' administation of psychotropics (weaponary or otherwise) has to cease..IMO it will, as signs are already showing how such obsessive behaviour is actually burning itself out ...in the end...The Gods will rise again

Lawsuit inolving SSRI

I've just seen this law firm's commercial on tv, apparently there is a class action involving negative side effects (aka birth defects) suffered by pregnant women and their children.

reply to post by Hefficide
Treatment of Post Traumatic stress disorder may include any of the following



Antipsychotics. In some cases, you may be prescribed a short course of antipsychotics to relieve severe anxiety and related problems, such as difficulty sleeping or emotional outbursts.

Antidepressants. These medications can help symptoms of both depression and anxiety. They can also help improve sleep problems and improve your concentration. The selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor (SSRI) medications sertraline (Zoloft) and paroxetine (Paxil) are FDA-approved for the treatment of PTSD.

Anti-anxiety medications. These drugs also can improve feelings of anxiety and stress.

Prazosin. If your symptoms include insomnia or recurrent nightmares, a drug called prazosin (Minipress) may help. Prazosin, which has been used for years in the treatment of hypertension, also blocks the brain's response to an adrenaline-like brain chemical called norepinephrine. Although this drug is not specifically approved for the treatment of PTSD, prazosin may reduce or suppress nightmares in many people with PTSD.



Cognitive therapy. This type of talk therapy helps you recognize the ways of thinking (cognitive patterns) that are keeping you stuck — for example, negative or inaccurate ways of perceiving normal situations.

In PTSD treatment, cognitive therapy often is used along with a behavioral therapy called exposure therapy.

Exposure therapy. This behavioral therapy technique helps you safely face the very thing that you find frightening, so that you can learn to cope with it effectively. A new approach to exposure therapy uses "virtual reality" programs that allow you to re-enter the setting in which you experienced trauma — for example, a "Virtual Iraq" program

Eye movement desensitization and reprocessing (EMDR). This type of therapy combines exposure therapy with a series of guided eye movements that help you process traumatic memories.

There are two pieces of data that completely refute this argument. First, the vast majority of recent mass murderers weren't taking SSRIs. Instead, 80% were psychotic (see table at the end of the article) which means instead of taking an SSRI they would be on an anti-psychotic. However, many were diagnosed after the killings so we know most weren't on anything. So if SSRIs do create murders they're not creating the mass murderers which is what everyone is talking about.

Although psychiatrists are beholden to pharmaceutical companies, psychologists are not. Psychologists can't prescribe medications. So what do all of the international bodies of psychologists recommend to prevent gun violence. As most know, science is no longer reported in the media. If it were, we wouldn't have silly gun control debates. The point is, psychologists believe the SSRIs contribute in only a very minor way.

Scientists believe they know how to reduce the U.S. homicide rate. First, note that all gun control does is limit the most lethal weapons. It doesn't address the desire to kill which is much higher in the U.S. The reason for this can be partially found in another ATS thread about government social control. Another issue is constantly exposing children to violent media. Other issues relate to having a proactive mental health system, background checks and only giving access to lethal weapons to people who are capable and need the weapons.

All of these aforementioned factors can substantially reduce the homicide rate but it would take many years. In contrast, SSRIs are a relatively minor but important problemt.

reply to post by Flyingclaydisk


If this is true about SSRIs and video games, why haven't I locked up my sister in a testing facility with a portal gun and turret robots?

The game I'm referencing is the Portal games of course, and I have yet to creep on people in a sinister robot voice, threatening to toss them in a furnace.

reply to post by TheToastmanCometh


Can you perhaps elaborate? I fail to see why anyone would want to use their sister as a test subject, I think I must be misunderstanding. Or at least I hope I am.

Didn't the guy who is holding up that kid in the underground bunker allow them to give the boy his ADHD meds?

"At one point, authorities lowered medicine into the bunker for the boy after his captor agreed to it, Clouse said. The lawmaker said he did not know what the medicine was for or whether it was urgently needed."http://news.yahoo.com/standoff-ala-gunman-holed-kidnapped-boy-044359841.html

Curious. hmmm

reply to post by TKDRL


The poster I was replying to was suggesting a link between video games and SSRI's for effecting behavior. I'm on an SSRI and I play a video game called Portal about an evil robot/computer who makes the character do complicated puzzles while only using a special gun.

Portal

If that was the case that VGs are a negative influence on people like that, I was asking them why I wasn't acting like said robot computer and trapping people in a maze with cubes and a Portal gun.

The SSRI factor only applies to a small percentage of people. It's a side effect, like any others. SSRI's for example, cause my blood pressure to freak out. That is something that only happens to a small number of people. Through trial and error I finally found a SSNRI, called Trazodone, that I can tolerate. But that was after trying Effexor, Paxil, Cymbalta, Lexapro, Buspar, Wellbutrin, and one or two others that aren't coming directly to mind at the moment. All caused me to have horrible side effects. Effexor, in particular, actually did make me hyper-aggressive. My tolerance for others totally evaporated and my temper was instant and total.

Thankfully I have the same circuit breaker, somewhere in my mind that prevents us from killing others over nonsense - and even the worst of the medication never seemed to short circuit it. But it did change me enough that I can understand how and why others might go ballistic from this particular sort of side effect.

As far as video games go? I personally think that they are no more destructive than other forms of media. Having said that? I do think that all of these things do tend to cause a certain personality type to become highly desensitized to the idea of killing and violence. I've got a nephew who is a really good kid, well adjusted and bright. He's joining the military in a couple of months - all because Halo has convinced him that he'd not only be good at killing people - but that he'd like it. I find it sad because life has taught me that he'll get what he thinks he wants - and then won't want it any longer, yet he'll be stuck in a warzone until such a time as his deployment and contract last.

Oh well.

~Heff