The Smoking Gun That THEY WANT YOU TO KEEP! The REAL Story.

Hi ATS.

Like many of you, I am on the verge of total exhaustion regarding the subject of spree killers. Three such events, in such a short time is more than a mind or a heart can really keep up with. People are, quite understandably, emotional over the stress.

Having said that? Now it seems people are trying to find a scapegoat to sacrifice - or are personalizing these events into some belief that this is all a false flag to take away the Second Amendment.

Meanwhile we seem to be ignoring the HUGE elephant in the room with us.

There is a common denominator to be found. One that doesn't involve any of the agendas being pushed lately. It is something much more simple, and sinister than any of the theories that are currently causing so much bitter dispute on the boards.

There is a special interest group behind it all, IMO. But it's not anyone with a direct desire to take away any assault weapons. This special interest is one of the largest lobbies in Washington, has power beyond any and all rational understanding, and they dictate their own terms, to a large degree, regarding almost every aspect of their own interests.

I speak of the legal drug dealers today. I am talking about big pharma and their profit generating chemical, spun off dozens of times into new variants. A drug that, for some, is a miracle product - but for others is enough to turn mild psychiatric symptoms into fully blown psychotic breaks.

I am talking about SSRI's. Street name, Paxil, Lexapro, Cymbalta, Effexor, Wellbutrin, Celexa, Zoloft, and Prozac.... among many others.

THIS, people, is the connecting thread. I have evidence to support my claim.

Newtown Shootings: A Caution About Violence and SSRIs
SSRIs rank high in the top ten drugs that cause violence

As the debate moves forward about how to keep events like the shooting in Newtown from happening, the inevitable topic that comes up is how to best detect and treat young people with mental illness.

Many of our politicians have opined on this subject, sometimes as a way of deflecting from the issue of gun control. While it is obvious that better screening and treatment of troubled adolescents can be of enormous benefit, we also have to exercise caution.

But more relevant to the discussion, is that these very drugs we hope can treat mental illness are at the same time drugs that cause violent behavior including suicide and aggression toward others. In fact, SSRI’s are the leading drugs in a recent list compiled of the Top Ten Drugs that cause violent behavior.

Source

Japan Revises SSRI Warnings--Hostility, Violence

In Japan reports of violence linked to SSRI antidepressants have raised public awareness to the danger these drugs can pose. A Japanese psychiatrist acknowledges: "To say that being able to tell the difference between depressives and mild manic-depressives is the test of a psychiatrist's true skill is no exaggeration."

The absence of any empirically valid diagnostic tool in psychiatry puts patients at risk of trial and error --i.e., Russian roulette--diagnostic and treatment methods

She indicates that The Japanese Ministry of Health, Labor and Welfare has investigated news reports about antidepressant users "who developed increased feelings of hostility or anxiety, and have even committed sudden acts of violence against others."

After its investigation, the Ministry decided to revise the label warnings on SSRI antidepressant stating, "There are cases where we cannot rule out a causal relationship [of hostility, anxiety, and sudden acts of violence] with the medication."

So, why are millions of American children being prescribed a class of mind-altering drugs that in some people INDUCE VIOLENCE against self and others?

Source

In fact six out of the ten most violence inducing legal drugs are from this family of medications.

Thankfully, one doesn't have to take my word for it - besides being able to Google quite a bit of information on the topic - I can provide an in depth study from an expert and a link to a site devoted specifically to discussing the real world horror stories from those with experience, both doctors and patients.

All of this mindless dot connecting going on and nobody seems to be connecting the real dots on the paper. The companies that have the distinction ( shame ) of being the top three lobbying groups in America must be good at their jobs - because not many folks are pointing the blame finger in the right direction:

If you had to guess the biggest lobbiers in the country, who would you say? Insurance companies? Oil and gas? Big Business?

No, no, and no again.

From 1998-2012, pharmaceutical companies and health products have led the political lobbying charge in the US by spending over $2 billion over the period. Their total lobbying spend in 2011 alone was $241,481,544.

As of September of 2012 it's back in the Republican column--although only with 54%.

Those percentages add up to big money. Drug company donations totaled more than $54 million in 2010, and have already passed that amount since the summer for the 2012 presidential and congressional elections. Additionally, in the first three months of this year alone the industry spent spent $69.6 million on lobbying.

What's their motive???

Once depression came to be defined by its symptoms, however, the definition of the mental illness took on a life of its own. Mental health advocates, for instance, liked the fact that it produced high estimates of the amount of depressive mental disorder so that it seemed as if depression was a “public health problem” of massive proportions. Clinicians could get reimbursed for conditions that might actually be non-medical problems. Perhaps most important, pharmaceutical companies found that they could portray people who suffered from widespread psychosocial problems in their advertisements while at the same time marketing their products as treatments for depressive mental disorders. And, of course, many individuals find it more acceptable to frame their problems as the result of a mental disorder and to take psychotropic drugs to attempt to relieve their distress than to see their suffering as the result of psychosocial problems. So, although the internal dynamics of the psychiatric profession initially led to the changes in the diagnostic criteria, once the criteria arose they have been perpetuated by a variety of groups that benefit from them.

Source

Right there, in black and white. No mystery.

~Heff

Funny that you mention this as Obama has not only been talking about Gun laws but also mental health, really makes you wonder whats going on

Yep..

you nailed it right on the head Heff..

I firmly believe that THAT is the real problem here..

been saying for years..

thanks for bringing it to light...

Also i firmly believe that they do just label a majority of people as depressed because it is a blanket and covers alot of symptoms, remember depression does not come from within it is due to external factors. Not being able to feed your kids, pay the bills or being in a abusive relationship would make anyone depressed. Go see how many of the 1% are depressed and saddened every day with there piles of money. The constraints society puts on us is what makes us depressed. If this world keeps moving in the same direction(Elite in control, Global Warming, Mindless Sheeple) we wont be around to much longer.....

The first, sensible and solidly put together response to the very real dangers of chemical coshes and what is most likely the reason behind the massacre. Often cited as the 'first line of defence' by medical practitioners, SSRIs have become a scourge on society and their devastating effects are ripping peoples’ minds apart.

Edit: it has become de facto in the medical profession to treat a damaged mind, first, with synthetic chemicals before considering any alternative. Jon Ronson's The Psychopath Test delves into the mental health minefield exquisitely and offers a brutal reality of how much (including the mental health profession) we don't know, other than the immense profits derived from 'treating' mental health.

I have been taking a few of those over the past few years. I can say that taking/getting off of these are a NIGHTMARE to say the least. You are actually changing the chemical levels of the brain when you take these. That being said, I have been through MANY events getting on/off of these meds. But I can say for certain( and I am a gun owner/lover), I have NEVER thought about doing these sorts of things. I have been through a divorce, and job loss, but still never once contimplated such actions. It all comes down to a personal choice in the end. We all have had crazy thoughts, but it is those who act upon such thoughts, that are to blame, no one/thing else imo.

SSRIs saved my life. So they're not all bad.

S&F

Great read and solid evidence. This is why I signed up for ATS. There's a lot of medicating going on and not a lot of care. Positive human interaction, stability, and support can't be offered by pills. Of course those things aren't cures, but they are especially important for people with mental health issues.

reply to post by thesmokingman


I was on Cymbalta from the ages of 12-16 and during that period i had some of my the darkest day, I gained excessive weight on the medications then one day i realized that these drugs are just masking the problem and that the depression comes from my situation. Needless to say i quit cold turkey and didn't have one regret. I look back and see how much of a daze i was in and that i accomplished nothing over those 4 years. Those pills did not help me and through meditation and a deep understanding of my spiritual side i feel 100x better then i was on those "life savers"

Im still not convinced of anything except that we are being manipulated in general.

What if this were a conspiracy by the gun lobby to sell more guns?
Gun sales are skyrocketing right now... and some big corps are raking in the dough.

We are fairly predictable after all...

Who knows? There are millions of possibilities here.
Fun to speculate about though.

reply to post by thesmokingman


The statistical data seems to indicate that the highest at risk group for the violent behaviors are young males. I've had issues with SSRI's in the past myself and ended up spending 6 days of my life in a hospital ( medical, not psychiatric ) because of how sick Cymbalta made me after taking it for about ten days.

These medications are the height of irresponsibility IMO. I have PTSD and, during a consultation visit with a very prominent expert, I asked why the only options are narcotics or SSRI's? It seemed to me that, with the marvels of modern medicine, surely there would be better options. This doctor laughed and said that pharmaceutical companies don't really invest in R&D like we think they do. Then tend to take an opportunistic approach. If a new chemical or new process is discovered in other fields, they'll look at it. In the case of the SSRI's? It's simple. Take a drug called Prozac, change one molecule, do a trial, and market it as Effexor, change another molecule? Lexapro... and so on.

Oh, and most of these medications are rather expensive. Even the ones that have generic analogs already still tend to charge a pretty penny for their poisons.

It speaks to the heart of the matter. Guns aren't killing these people. Greed and apathy are. Guns are just a side effect of convenience. The greed is big pharma and the apathy is in our lawmakers who came up with a neat new word for bribery ( lobbying ) and now will do whatever their best customers ask.

The apathy is also on all of us - for letting things get this way.

~Heff

Drugs are very dangerous, especially the legal ones.
I tried an antidepressant several months ago to see if it would reduce my tiredness. I'm normally one of the calmest people you could meet, but it resulted in me having extreme anxiety/panic attacks and crying fits. I essentially became an entirely different person. It got so bad that I had to go to the hospital and be put in an observation room. I can certainly understand someone who is on drugs long-term suddenly flipping **** and killing a bunch of people... I couldn't even handle it for 3 days, yet tons of people have been living on em for years.

reply to post by Painterz


For people with real mental disorders they are not bad and do help them to feel better, but when you go to the doctor and say i am depressed due to bills, kids or spousal problems that certainly does not constitute for the doctor handing you a proscription that actually changes your brain chemistry. Every time i went to my psychiatrist i would see at least one man or woman coming in from the drug company with his little pens and notepads to handout and go and speak to the doctor. Drug reps are like the freaking lobbyists of doctors offices.

So we are in agreement that quite a few already on this thread have/are taking these meds, and unless theres something your not telling us, NONE of us have commited these attrocities. They have even SAVED lives as you can see. My point being that as well written and thought out this thread is, the medicines are NOT the problem as we can see.

reply to post by Hefficide


The awful truth is that the Newtown massacre has become the ultimate marketing boom to Big Pharma and the arms industry. Look at the record-breaking sales of guns — empty sales racks everywhere and now parents who will be more heightened to their child's oddities will be frog marching them down to the local quack who in turn will reach for the chemistry set for a prescription. Your assertions should be the national — and international — focus, but I fear you are right and the lobby is just too strong.

Hello,


this is how ATS should look at things, how threads should be made, how claims should be backed up with, valid sources.

Thank you Heff, I've not heard the word, nor read the word Big Pharma in the last two weeks.

Instead of attacking people with baseless claims we should always ask " cui bono " , To whose benefit?", literally "as a benefit to whom?"

Thanks.


SS

reply to post by thesmokingman


With respect, you have missed the entire point of the thread which is the first on ATS to address what is most likely the real reason behind the Newtown massacre. It goes further and brings to light the issue regarding a world whose inhabitants are being coshed chemically with little regard for the long-term effects.

reply to post by thesmokingman


Not at all. If we were to gather six people to a game of Russian roulette - five of those six would walk away alive. That doesn't imply that Russian roulette is safe.

This chart shows that roughly twice as many people had symptoms from the real SSRI's than with the placebo - in every category.



If even 1/100th of a percent of the people taking these medications are affected to the degree of a psychotic break? That's a LOT of potential murderers in the wings. A huge number.

~Heff

Originally posted by Newagekid2012
Also i firmly believe that they do just label a majority of people as depressed because it is a blanket and covers alot of symptoms, remember depression does not come from within it is due to external factors.

Not necessarily a true statement. Depression is a disease of the brain. Outside factors are an aggravating factor.

Not being able to feed your kids, pay the bills or being in a abusive relationship would make anyone depressed. Go see how many of the 1% are depressed and saddened every day with there piles of money.

Attitudes like this only worsen the disease.

The constraints society puts on us is what makes us depressed. If this world keeps moving in the same direction(Elite in control, Global Warming, Mindless Sheeple) we wont be around to much longer.....

edit on 25-12-2012 by Newagekid2012 because: (no reason given)

How long do you want to be around?

Heff makes some very strong points concerning the issues of how we treat mental illness. The Reagan Administration did not help matters when they defunded the NIMH in the US. We now incarcerate the mentally ill, consequently turning them criminally insane.

reply to post by Hefficide

i agree.. but i think ats and sites like it are as responsible for making people crazy and thinkin they need meds to begin with as anyone..

with all the fear mongering going on the last 3 years.. you couldnt log into ats and not see doom and gloom
you couldnt turn on the tv and not see doom and gloom

i just think its funny how ats doesnt want you making a conspiracy out of newtown

but they allow 5000 threads on nibiru.. something they know is complete bs

so is ats part of your conspiracy?