The Atomic Bombings on Japan were war crimes and here is why!

What is worse war or the idiots trying to make it humane? War is suffering and death and winners and losers. When you start to add political correctness to war something is very wrong inside your mind.

reply to post by daaskapital


When a leader engages in war he leaves his people open to whatever weapon the enemy has. This is why it boggles the mind when whole nations of people don't scream out, NO ON WAR!

Hmm? Was it not a war crime that the Japanese attacked sleeping American military personnel in Pearl Harbor only to prevent the fleet from "possibly" stepping in to defend its allies against Japanese aggression during that time? What about the 9,000 balloon bombs they sent into the jet stream, only to be released to hit innocent American civilians on our homeland? I feel bad that the innocent in Japan were killed by the atomic attacks and I do not agree with it, but the fact is, hundreds of thousands more would have been killed if those bombs had not been dropped. Get a life and stop trying to find every evil America has done and research the millions upon millions we have helped, saved and continue to help. During time of war and time of peace, the United States military is feeding and helping our enemies and friends! They build shelters for the poor, protect the innocent from ethnic cleansing, and so much more!

Thing is if you take the Nazis and their allies out of the equation...no WW2.

Originally posted by malachi777
Hmm? Was it not a war crime that the Japanese attacked sleeping American military personnel in Pearl Harbor only to prevent the fleet from "possibly" stepping in to defend its allies against Japanese aggression during that time?

Perhaps. Some would consider it an act of war while others would consider it a war crime.

What about the 9,000 balloon bombs they sent into the jet stream, only to be released to hit innocent American civilians on our homeland?

Yes, that is a war crime.

I never stated that Japan was innocent. They committed horrible war crimes, but for the thousandth time, this thread does not focus on them.

I feel bad that the innocent in Japan were killed by the atomic attacks and I do not agree with it, but the fact is, hundreds of thousands more would have been killed if those bombs had not been dropped. Get a life and stop trying to find every evil America has done and research the millions upon millions we have helped, saved and continue to help. During time of war and time of peace, the United States military is feeding and helping our enemies and friends! They build shelters for the poor, protect the innocent from ethnic cleansing, and so much more!

I do not try to "find all the evil America has done." I research one topic, put it on ATS and i get verbally bashed for it (just because it states things people don't want to hear). To be honest, i expected it, but my god some people here are just insane.

I understand that the USA has done good things. The same goes for every other country involved...

Thanks for the reply.

reply to post by daaskapital


I am fine with you researching this fact. Yes, I said fact! My issue is with the continuous bashing of the United States. No country is perfect and all have committed atrocities. My question is this, "Why not post the positive events my country has and still does do in the world?" Give us Americans a little comfort in knowing that there are still people who appreciate that my brothers and sisters have spilled their blood and died to help innocents in the world. America bashers believe our military soldiers make great income fighting for America and others. I'll have you know, they make less salary than a McDonalds employee. Do you really think we enjoy our relatives dying for others, especially people who hate us and what we believe in?

Did this tactic fall under the Hague Convention as well?

During World War II, Japan released 9,300 balloon bombs that were intended to be carried to the United States by a high altitude wind known today as the "jet stream". Less than 400 of the bombs are known to have made the 6,000-mile journey. At least 35 of these bombs are known to have landed in Montana. At the start of the balloon-bomb program, which ran from November 1944 to April 1945, Americans were still unaware of Jet Streams. However Japan realized that these winds could transport the bomb-carrying balloons to the United States within days. Although the position and speed of the jet stream is variable, in the winter it often streaks across the Pacific from Japan to the United States. When inflated with hydrogen, each 33-ft. wide balloon could carry up to 794 lbs. of ballast and bombs. As they floated upward to a height of 4-8 miles they were taken into the jet stream and carried at speeds of up to 200 miles per hour toward the U.S.A. Little was known about the jet stream during WWII, but today meteorologists recognize the significance of these high altitude, high speed winds.

A clear indiscriminate use of aerial ordenance. 9,300 bombs sent 400 landed. Not very efficent, but very sneaky, and without warning. It appears the intent was there to break international law by Japan. However, two US bombs were dropped on military targets (with leaflet warnings) and the enemy surrenders.

Originally posted by milominderbinder


There was roughly 0.0% chance that we would have invaded Japan anyways. It was completely unnecessary and totally counterproductive to American interests.

WRONG.

Had Olympic come about, the Japanese civilian population, inflamed by a national slogan - "One Hundred Million Will Die for the Emperor and Nation" - were prepared to fight to the death. Twenty Eight Million Japanese had become a part of the National Volunteer Combat Force. They were armed with ancient rifles, lunge mines, satchel charges, Molotov cocktails and one-shot black powder mortars. Others were armed with swords, long bows, axes and bamboo spears. The civilian units were to be used in nighttime attacks, hit and run maneuvers, delaying actions and massive suicide charges at the weaker American positions.

LINK


The sooner the Americans come, the better...One hundred million die proudly. - Japanese slogan in the summer of 1945.

The production, movement and distribution of supplies was one of the most important aspects of the defense preparations on Kyushu.(20) Preparations included the storing of munitions in caves and other underground shelters to protect them from air raids and naval bombardment. The original Japanese plan called for the supplying of each division with one campaign unit of fire, and by July 1945 this quantity was actually in the possession of the area armies. One campaign unit of fire was sufficient ammunition for one campaign - generally understood to be a three month supply.(21) This called for the following rounds per weapon: 1,000 rounds per field piece, 25,000 rounds per machine gun, and 240 rounds per rifle.(22) However, by August 1945 with the greatly increased number of troops, it was necessary to reduce ammunition stocks to a one-half unit of fire for each unit (about 1 1/2 months). This reduction in ammunition supplies made it necessary to adjust supply plans for the high priority areas and to plan for the rapid transfer of ammunition from one area to another when the invasion was actually launched and the place and direction of attack had been determined.(23) The Japanese were preparing and may have been able to bring their ammunition supplies back up to the three month level given the amount of time between August and November.

Planes were to be released in waves of 300-400, at the rate of one wave per hour, against the invasion fleet. Sufficient fuel had been stored for this use, but only about 8,000 pilots were available.(24) Although the pilots were poorly trained and no match against experienced American pilots, they were capable enough to carry out suicide attacks against ships. At the end of the war, Japan had approximately 12,725 planes. The Army had 5,651 and the Navy had 7,074 aircraft of all types.(25) While many of these were not considered combat planes, almost all were converted into kamikaze planes. The Japanese were planning to train enough pilots to use all of the aircraft that were capable of flying.

OPERATION KETSU-GO

Naturally, the American plan considered Japanese resistance. It noted the possibility that the invasion "will be opposed not only by the available organized military forces of the Empire, but also by a fanatically hostile population", which would result in high casualties. In a study done by the United States Joint Chiefs of Staff in Apr 1945, at least 456,000 casualties were to be expected for Operation Olympic alone. Some other evaluations were also done, and their casualty estimates ranged anywhere from 30,000 to 1,000,000. In preparation, the United States manufactured 500,000 Purple Heart medals to award to those injured in combat.

Operation Downfall was never carried out. With the use of the atomic bombs and Russia's sudden declaration of war on Japan, WW2 in Asia ended without the need for the potentially costly invasion. At the date of this writing, over 100,000 of the Purple Heart medals still sat in American government warehouses.

Preparations for Invasion of Japan 14 Jul 1945 - 9 Aug 1945

Theres a great timeline on what America did, to prepare for the actual invasion. Without the Atomic Bombs, This WAS the reality.

reply to post by Siberbat


Those balloons actually killed people, in America. They killed 6 in Oregon.

The bombing of Japan and the needless suffering that happened does bother me.

I hate war!

Also...Japan should not have bombed Pearl Harbor either.

reply to post by daaskapital


Thank you OP S&F

It has always struck me a little bit odd, how the USA, the ONLY country to use this vile instrument of mega mass destruction in an aggressive act is allowed to dictate who can have what when it comes to defending themselves

War is a crime full stop we need a more grown up solution

Six innocent women and children who were headed to a picnic, not warmongers!

There was roughly 0.0% chance that we would have invaded Japan anyways. It was completely unnecessary and totally counterproductive to American interests.

Then why did the plan Operation Downfall?

Hmmm.

Tell ya what is a crime the Bataan death march, the rape of Nan King, and other well known atrocities.

Simple fact chemical weapons during the first world war killed more people than those 2 nukes.

Originally posted by malachi777
reply to post by daaskapital

 

I am fine with you researching this fact. Yes, I said fact! My issue is with the continuous bashing of the United States.

I was mainly talking about other members...

No country is perfect and all have committed atrocities. My question is this, "Why not post the positive events my country has and still does do in the world?" Give us Americans a little comfort in knowing that there are still people who appreciate that my brothers and sisters have spilled their blood and died to help innocents in the world.

I agree.

My answer to your question:

I don't focus all to much on American interests or events. But this thread was an exception (because i was interested in the specific event and was researching the topic around the time of the thread's construction). If i come across a positive American even in which i take interest to, i will definitely post it on ATS.

I guarantee you that the servicemen of the allied nations will never be forgotten. That goes for the Americans British, Australians, French and every single other country out there.

America bashers believe our military soldiers make great income fighting for America and others. I'll have you know, they make less salary than a McDonalds employee.

I know. I was actually looking it up once. It is retarded. People who join the French Foreign Legion get paid better. Why do American service men/women get paid so little?

Do you really think we enjoy our relatives dying for others, especially people who hate us and what we believe in?

No. It isn't only the Americans who are hated. Pretty much every soldier from every allied nation is hated nowadays.

Originally posted by pacifier2012
Your argument was destroyed in the first line..."where possible..."

It was not possible and would not have been had an invasion occurred. The lives lost in a full scale military invasion of Japan by the US would have exceeded those lost with the atomic Bombs.

You so far off you made me laugh.

You make me laugh.

Japan giving up had nothing to do with America.

Japan was afraid of Russia, who was on the way. Japan knew that if Russia invaded, the Japanese Imperial system would be lost to communism.

Japan only surrendered to America because they were afraid of Russia. The bombs had nothing to do with it.

Russia won WW2, not America, like America thinks.

Read some history.

Japan gave up because of Russia.

edit- so the bombings of non combatant civillians did not save lives at all. It did kill many many innocent men, women, children and babies.

Originally posted by Siberbat
Did this tactic fall under the Hague Convention as well?

During World War II, Japan released 9,300 balloon bombs that were intended to be carried to the United States by a high altitude wind known today as the "jet stream". Less than 400 of the bombs are known to have made the 6,000-mile journey. At least 35 of these bombs are known to have landed in Montana. At the start of the balloon-bomb program, which ran from November 1944 to April 1945, Americans were still unaware of Jet Streams. However Japan realized that these winds could transport the bomb-carrying balloons to the United States within days. Although the position and speed of the jet stream is variable, in the winter it often streaks across the Pacific from Japan to the United States. When inflated with hydrogen, each 33-ft. wide balloon could carry up to 794 lbs. of ballast and bombs. As they floated upward to a height of 4-8 miles they were taken into the jet stream and carried at speeds of up to 200 miles per hour toward the U.S.A. Little was known about the jet stream during WWII, but today meteorologists recognize the significance of these high altitude, high speed winds.

A clear indiscriminate use of aerial ordenance. 9,300 bombs sent 400 landed. Not very efficent, but very sneaky, and without warning. It appears the intent was there to break international law by Japan. However, two US bombs were dropped on military targets (with leaflet warnings) and the enemy surrenders.

Yes, every act the Japanese done also fell under the Hague Conventions. Therefore, the balloon-bombings were war crimes, because Japan was aiming to attack the USA without care for civilian injuries.

I've said it before and here I say it again: There is no argument between adults which justifies the loss of life of children. Ever. What kind of person sleeps soundly at night with the blood of children on their hands? They're called senator, king, president, prime minister, general. All titles that have erroneously been associated with honor. Your children and my children might be compelled to represent them in war, but never their children. Think a member of the Bush family will ever be a double amputee?

Originally posted by jasonl1983
I've said it before and here I say it again: There is no argument between adults which justifies the loss of life of children. Ever. What kind of person sleeps soundly at night with the blood of children on their hands? They're called senator, king, president, prime minister, general. All titles that have erroneously been associated with honor. Your children and my children might be compelled to represent them in war, but never their children. Think a member of the Bush family will ever be a double amputee?

Agreed

Originally posted by tamusan
reply to post by daaskapital

 

In sieges and bombardments all necessary steps must be taken to spare, as far as possible, buildings dedicated to religion, art, science, or charitable purposes, historic monuments, hospitals, and places where the sick and wounded are collected, provided they are not being used at the time for military purposes.

First. The desctruction of these types of buildings were not unique to the atomic bombings. The U.S. had been firebombing Japan, for months prior to the atomic bombings, causing vast portions of Japan to be burned to the ground. Also, nearly all capable citizens and inftrastructure of Japan were mobilized in support of their war effort, and were no longer considered civilian. Before the first atomic bomb was dropped, the U.S. dropped leaflets over 35 cities, which described the coming horror.

Second. Spend some time researching the atrocities commited by the Japanese war machine.

Third. My Japanese wife, her family, nor any other Japanese I've met has said anything negative about the U.S. using the atomic weapons on Japan. Instead, they speak of peace and nuclear disarmament.

I think you're just trying to stir up some more anti-American sentiment.

Tight lipped on the subject huh? Then ask your wife point blank: Honey, do you think the U.S. was right dropping those two bombs on your cities to stop Hitlers charge?

Ya know..If I went into a country that had bombed two of my home countries cities to utter Oblivion - I would not speak of it either but only have "nice" things to say about that country. Anything less would be foolish - they could do it again!

reply to post by sonnny1


The idea was to contrast the tactics of Japan and the US. The use of the ballon bombs were indiscriminate over a wide area of effect. My point is that Japan breached the Hague Convention with the use of these weapons on civilian targets as early as 1944. These weapons were intended to be used to terrorise a civilian population. The OP criticised the use of the US WMD's as an illeagal and thereby immoral use of weaponery. On the contrary, the Japanese poplulus was forewarned and the targeted cities were legitimate military targets (weopn production, command and control, communications, and ammunition storage). The use of the atomic bombs were used on precise locations on not over a wide geographical area. The ballons were a futile attempt to redirect resources and terrorise civilians.

The balloons reached Alaska, Canada, Mexico and 16 U.S. states, travelling as far east as Michigan and Texas. Most of the balloons were sighted or found in British Columbia, Washington state, Oregon, California, and Montana.