WTC destruction, the Leftover candidates, Pro&Contra Arguments.

David Chandler's video, titled :
WTC 7: Sound Evidence for Explosions
www.youtube.com...


A fancy, expensive COVER-UP, that's how David Chandler describes NIST's Final Report on WTC 7 's collapse study in his 4 Part video, titled :

NIST Technical Briefing on WTC7 — David Chandler

The confrontations with NIST at this press conference over the issue of freefall for WTC7, together with formal written "Requests for Correction" forced NIST to reverse themselves in their final report and admit that WTC7 had undergone over 100 feet of pure freefall. The implications are huge.

Watch all 4 video's in a row, just wait at the ends, and the next one will start :
WTC7: NIST Finally Admits Freefall (Part I)
WTC7: NIST Finally Admits Freefall (Part II)
Clocking WTC7
WTC7: NIST Finally Admits Freefall (Part III)




And I wholeheartedly agree with his conclusion, and his description of NIST's methodology.
My own conclusion is based on my seismic WTC 7 studies which NIST very well know about, and which were the sole reason they removed all seismic reports written for them by outsiders, from their websites and their other 9/11 studies repository websites, like www.hsdl.org.

The above second link is David's 4 Parts combination of 4 videos posted by him on YouTube, in which he totally exposes the faulty methods used by NIST's end editors staff, to fool the bulk of the public into believing that WTC 7's collapse speed acceleration was one as from a normal, gravitational collapse all the way down, that met normal resistance from still standing structures of the building.

Nothing is further from the truth.
David showed us, and NIST, that they used an artificially prolonged period to get to their resulting 5.4 seconds fall time, and thus to fit in with their willingly faulty and thus fraudulent 5.4 seconds gravitational acceleration fall time obtained through their still secret computer calculations.
From which we to this day, never got the details. Their software, their input data, nothing which we could use, to peer review their phony report.

But David cleverly counted video-frames back with a freely available software package. From the last video-frame where NIST ended their video-frame counting, all the way back to their first video-frame they started their counting with.

And found a stunning fact.
They started their counting a full 1.5 seconds before the WTC 7's parapet roof line actually started to move down....

That's the most blatant form of falsifying and fixing your data to get it to fit in your other, also falsified computer-constructed phony data stream where NIST used far too long burning fires and far too high fire temperatures.

In every normal job, this would lead to the immediate removal of all persons involved in such an obvious blatant FRAUD.
Not at NIST however, Gross and Sunder are still working there...

www.youtube.com...
9/11 Zero - 2008 (full length)


CLICK HERE to start at this 0:38:10 point in the video :

Dario Fo, Italian Nobel Prize winner, tells us at 2290 secs in the video :

The story -how- the airplane has got there is absolutely absurd.
One cannot imagine -how-, in order to get down to the height of the Pentagon wall.
It was able to make a 270 degree turn at a speed of approximately 800 km per hour.

(0:38:10)
It was a 320 degree turn, and inside the spiraling turn, that speed was never registered. More like between 270 and 340 knots.

Then Robin Hordon, Flight Controller at Boston Center for 11 years, tells us :

That is a -really- difficult maneuver, and an experienced pilot with thousands of hours, probably would have to take between 10 and 20 attempts, before they would be able to pull off that maneuver.
A 757 is not designed to do that, a 757 is designed to be, basically, a cruise ship in the sky, it's not acrobatic, so you just can not do that with one of those airplanes.
Military fighters can do that, OK, military fighters with autopilots and being flown remotely, they have the structural capability to and are designed to be able to be that acrobatic.

(0:38:51)

Danielle O'Brien, air traffic controller from Dulles Airport :

The speed, the maneuverability, the way that it turned, we all thought in the radar room, all of us experienced air traffic controllers, that that was a military plane.

(0:39:51)

Captain Russ Wittemberg, pilot for 30 years in the military and civil aviation :

The story goes that the airplane was going 530 miles per hour, 460 Knots, and it can't go that fast, at level flight, down that low.
There up high, the true airspeed could go up and it could go that fast, but not down low, the air is too dense.

(0:40:45 / 1:39:20).

But that was the end speed at the Pentagon's West wall being registered in the CVR.

Then Nila Sagadevan, pilot and aeronautical engineer writes at 0:40:55 :

I challenge any pilot, any pilot anywhere :
give him a Boeing 757 and tell him to do 400 knots 20 feet above the ground for half a mile.
Can't do. It's aerodynamically impossible!

He clearly means 400 knots in straight flight. And I am not sure if a 757 could not do that speed for about 30 to 60 seconds. I think it could, perhaps it would loose some minor platings or sticking out parts, but it will not fall apart immediately.

For the record, 530 MPH/460 knots was the speed in the CVR when the plane hit the West wall, not during the spiraling down !

This is a rocket powered sled on rails, going 500 miles/hr, watch the side view of it :

Title : Speed.
www.youtube.com...



Not much to see in that split second that people on Route 27 must have seen it crossing that road at even a 30 knots faster speed, ain't it?

That's why I am still baffled by the precise description of that event by some of the witnesses, like Penny Elgas in particular.
One would thought immediately, after viewing that sled streaking past your eyes, how could she give such a detailed description when the plane would have gone really that fast?
It's much more likely, that it went pass her at a much slower speed, just as Sean Boger and Terry Morin said by guessing its speed by giving it more than 10 seconds to cover the distance from the Navy Annex its then 8th last Wing's roof, to the Pentagon's West wall.

Can we say, after we have studied the by FOIA retrieved Black Box data from Flight AA 77, that either that Black Box was falsified, or that plane was flown remotely?
And then still it would be a false Black Box, since even a computerized remote control system has to operate the rudder to let that plane make that kind of fluidly guided downward spiraling trajectory, leveling off at about 100 feet above ground and fly from there in a straight line to the Pentagon's West Wall.

That seems simply not possible in a manually flown 757 at speeds around and above 270-400 KNOTS, and seems totally impossible when the rudder is not used at all, to smooth the spiral off and let the plane not get into a Dutch Roll at the end of that maneuver, at those registered high speeds.
That maneuver seems to only have been done by a 757, with its autopilot function ON say captains Ralph Kolstad and Russ Wittemberg. (and he said it can not fly that fast in dense air at ground level.)
While the recovered Black Box tells us, it was off for a long time already.

I posted a video lately from a 757 captain Rusty Aimer, and he stated that he and several other experienced airline pilots have tried to reproduce that spiral maneuver in a Flight Simulator they had hired for an hour, and ALL ended up in a Dutch Roll, before they could level their plane off again, at that speed as recorded in the CVR during the spiral.
With their AutoPilot disengaged and using no rudder.
As the CFR wants us to believe Hani Hanjour did....

Pilots For 9/11 Truth Co-Founder Rob Balsamo along with Core Members Captain Rusty Aimer and Dwain Deets were recently invited by former Gov. Jesse Ventura to discuss and attempt to recreate the attack on the Pentagon for the latest investigation into the events of September 11, 2001. Unlike outdated professional flight simulator recreations offered by others, this attempt is based on the actual data being provided through the Freedom Of Information Act.

Uploaded on Jan 12, 2011.
Title : Simulator Recreation Demonstrates Pentagon Attack Impossibility
www.youtube.com...



It's pertinently NOT POSSIBLE without an Autopilot function set as ON, even for pilots with thousands of hours flight time in their books in a calm Flight Simulator ambiance.

It's in that AA 77 Black Box where we can see that the AutoPilot was disengaged many minutes before that plane started that spiraling turn around, down to the Pentagon West Wall, AND the Rudder pedals at both pilot seats were not moved at all during the WHOLE hijacked period of the flight, thus surely not in that 320 degrees turn downwards.


Has anybody with a Microsoft Flight Sim software package with the 757 in it, ever tried to fly that same spiral with that same diameter, at the same speeds inside that spiral as seen on its speedometer at the top right of this below NTSB reconstruction of Flight AA 77 ?

Title : Flight 77 Pentagon Simulation
www.youtube.com...



And then also without touching the tail's rudder !
In the center of the screen, under the steering column handle.
And most importantly, WITHOUT any of the right, center or left, Autopilot functions engaged?
Those are the three small white blocks to the right of that center bottom column handle that are white during the whole simulation, just as the CVR data shows.
White autopilot blocks mean : not engaged.
Watch also the two gas handles to the left of that column handle. Only when the plane is coming out of that spiral, those two handles are pushed fully up, full gas.
Then the plane accelerates and reaches 459 knots when the CVR recreation stops.

I am guessing you will not be able -by far- to recreate what they let you believe in that NTSB flight sim recreation of the recovered CVR data found at the Pentagon rubble heaps.
I base that on what I see in that video of captain Aimer, posted above.

One big problem I noticed however with Captain Aimers execution of that spiral :
He orders the young man to push the gas handles up to speeds over 400 knots, while still in that spiraling down trajectory. And THAT is not depicted in the CVR data, there we see speeds of 270 - 320 knots while in the spiral.

that's why I REALLY like to see someone report here that they in fact could recreate the same CVR speeds in about the same spots inside their spiral flown on their computer, and no rudder on. Or that it is totally impossible with that same radius (or diameter) of the original spiraling down trajectory.


Robin Hordon, Flight Controller at Boston Center for 11 years, tells us :

One of the biggest lies was that the guys at the FAE were incompetent.
When we loose an airplane, we take ACTION. We do not sit, we do not delay, we do not.., we go to protocol, boom boom boom boom -snip- they did not take a coffee break.

According to him, the bottleneck resided in the Pentagon, where Rumsfeld was no where to be found, and Rumsfeld was the one that three months earlier had changed the 2 protocols that had to be followed simultaneously all those years in case of a hijacking into 1 : the slow protocol. He had to be asked for his fiat, before jet fighters were sent up to intercept. And then they had to sneak up behind the hijacked plane, so the hijackers would not know they were there, that was the new protocol. Slow but save.
But even that one was not followed on 9/11, says Robin Hordon. The calls from the FAA were not put through directly to the fighter squadrons. They were held up at the Pentagon....

And please, view the statements of Robert McIlvaine at 1:25:00 to 1:36:34.
A proud, very sad father of a son that died on 9/11 in the Towers.
If you are a truly empathic reader you will have difficulty to hold back your tears...

Mind his last sentences around 1:39:00, and take his last words to your heart :

AND THE PEOPLE SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF THEMSELVES, FOR NOT SEEKING THE TRUTH......

It's for him and the other fathers and mothers, brothers and sisters, wifes and children of the victims of 9/11 and the subsequently following dishonest wars; the victims on all sides, the soldiers and civilians alike, that's the reason I am so tenaciously fighting against oppression, resistance, burying of evidence, to show my readers that 9/11 was a setup, a black operation, a false flag operation and planned by totally evil persons. And seek and find the justice for the 9/11 planners, they deserve.

reply to post by plube


The reason why there is so little rebuttals lately, is that there is nothing new at all being presented by the truth movement. Nadda. Zip. What has been said has been said. What has been debunked, it has been debunked. NO matter how many times you repackage garbage, its till garbage, irregardless of the new box, new shiny wrapping paper, or but new bow. It is like a giant whack-a-mole game. Once its been bopped down, it pops up again. Bringing up old junk about angled cuts, seismograph data, thermites, silent explosives, and such, The truth only needs to be said once. Facts do not change. They do not to be repackaged with shiny new bells and whistles. There has been NOTHING new added. Even LaBTop's long posts are pretty much the same old debunked junk from years ago. Just because its repackaged, does not mean its new.

Originally posted by GenRadek
reply to post by plube

 

The reason why there is so little rebuttals lately, is that there is nothing new at all being presented by the truth movement. Nadda. Zip. What has been said has been said. What has been debunked, it has been debunked. NO matter how many times you repackage garbage, its till garbage, irregardless of the new box, new shiny wrapping paper, or but new bow. It is like a giant whack-a-mole game. Once its been bopped down, it pops up again. Bringing up old junk about angled cuts, seismograph data, thermites, silent explosives, and such, The truth only needs to be said once. Facts do not change. They do not to be repackaged with shiny new bells and whistles. There has been NOTHING new added. Even LaBTop's long posts are pretty much the same old debunked junk from years ago. Just because its repackaged, does not mean its new.

Labtob's posts are, at least, full of information. Yours, on the other hand, are just full of derision.

Originally posted by Flatcoat
Labtob's posts are, at least, full of information. Yours, on the other hand, are just full of derision.

No, labtops posts are full of disinformation that has been shown to be bunk many times before. Only a few people still go on about it, everyone else has moved on.

reply to post by Flatcoat


I have posted more than my fair share of information and facts that have helped put this bunk to bed. Just because someone repackages garbage as sells it as "new and improved" and I point out that it is still garbage does not mean I am deriding the poster. Just merrily pointing out garbage. ATS has a wonderful search engine where you can see my responses to these posts from years back.

Come on then, you two last uncivil posters, I challenge you to debunk all of the numbered evidence in my huge post on page 4, full of irrefutable facts.

Show your true intelligence, not your simplistic words.

This is the result of the evil propaganda you admire so much and still believe in :

GRIEF :

reply to post by LaBTop


Sorry to burst your bubble but all of that has been refuted. Seismic data has been done to death and debunked. David Chandler has been debunked. Dust ejections have been debunked. Sounds have been debunked. Barry Jennings has been debunked.

Originally posted by GenRadek
reply to post by LaBTop

 

Sorry to burst your bubble but all of that has been refuted. Seismic data has been done to death and debunked. David Chandler has been debunked. Dust ejections have been debunked. Sounds have been debunked. Barry Jennings has been debunked.

You begin to sound extremely desperate.
Do you even realize that ?

PROVE YOUR BIG WORDS.
Refute my EVIDENCE, or shut up.


In the mean time, readers could pay attention to all the admitted liars and lies in the US Administration, exposed in this film about the journalists who were compliant in all the lies fed to us on and after 9/11, who now express their regrets about their cowardly behavior and their misplaced patriotic feelings in those times :

The War You Don't See, a film by John Pilger.
Viewable at Vimeo, a HD video site with valuable films :

vimeo.com...

All other high quality films by John Pilger, from the Vietnam War to today :
vimeo.com...

WTC SMOKING GUN PROOF OF EXPLOSIVE DEMOLITION CHARGES
www.youtube.com...




Compiled Footage of Building 7 !! 2:31 min.
www.youtube.com...



View 3 times in the beginning of this video, those white clouds suddenly appearing up to 15 stories high, then the building collapses, and then the debris clouds start to rush into all surrounding streets.
At 1:07 in the video, you see white dust / steam, billowing up in front of WTC 7 at its Northeast side, where all fire had died down slowly earlier.
After that cloud appeared on the Northeast corner side, which was the only visible side where a small part of its eastern corner ground level could be observed from 9 blocks away by that cameraman; WTC 7 collapsed.
From 1:50 on it's even more obviously to see, those white clouds in front of the basis of WTC 7's North side.


New footage of building 7 newly released via freedom of information act :
www.youtube.com...



The reporter in the first minute of this video stands in front of the Northeast corner of the WTC 7, and later explains that he was lucky, because about 30 minutes later, that building came down.
Did you see what footage his camera man took from that North side? There was no fire of importance. The normal office fires that proceeded in two floors from west to east and then died down because all flammables were burned. The flames coming out of the East facade were from localized office fires. Which also died down, as you can see in my other above video, shot from 9 blocks more Northernly. They viewed at the Northeast corner from that point, and no raging flames anymore on that East nor North facade. Then the huge white steam cloud rises up at that NORTH and EAST side and corner, and then the building collapsed.....

U.S Camera man has Proof 9/11 was a HOAX !! 2:34 min.
www.youtube.com...

4 Sept 2012

An American FEMA cameraman who says September 11 was a lie is facing extradition from Argentina to the United States on alleged murder charges.
Kurt Sonnenfeld, a man who was provided provisory refugee status seven years ago in Argentine, is now wanted by the US government on murder charges. He is the only cameraman that filmed crucial images of Ground Zero in New York after the Twin Towers collapsed.

Kurt Sonnenfeld, who lives in Buenos Aires with his Argentine family, says the footage proves that 9/11 was a lie. He still has the 22-hour footage that US authorities want.

"I have promised to give my footage to the big investigators that are credible and widely known - investigators who will be able to detect anomalies that I or other people without scientific education might miss. With that in mind, I hope that there are many things they can discover that disprove the current official story of what happened," Sonnenfeld told a Press TV correspondent.

He says he fears for his life if he is sent back to the United States to face trial. The Denver police have claimed they have evidence that show he killed his first wife in the US.

Social activists who are campaigning for Sonnenfeld to be given refugee status in Argentina say the Denver police are lying. The Sonnenfelds say they have been under police surveillance and that their phone has been tapped.

Sonnenfeld claims that his footage proves top US government officials were aware of the 2001 terrorist attacks before they occurred says he is a victim of a US plot to silence him.

Kurt Sonnenfeld: The Man Behind the Camera / 9-11 Witness. 13:18 min.
www.youtube.com...

11 Sept 2012

Mirrored from www.youtube.com...

Eleven years after 9/11 we present a short film with undisclosed images, footage and documents about Kurt Sonnenfeld and his work at Ground Zero.

arg911truth.blogspot.com...

conspiracyscope.blogspot.com...

www.youtube.com...

9/11 - Kurt Sonnenfeld FEMA Slideshow Steel Dimensions, Corrosion, Deformations, and Cuts. 7:06 minutes
www.youtube.com...

Originally posted by GenRadek
reply to post by Flatcoat

 

I have posted more than my fair share of information and facts that have helped put this bunk to bed. Just because someone repackages garbage as sells it as "new and improved" and I point out that it is still garbage does not mean I am deriding the poster. Just merrily pointing out garbage. ATS has a wonderful search engine where you can see my responses to these posts from years back.

Yes , I remember my last encounter with you. You called me a "typical ignorant truther, acting like a troll, with zero reading comprehension". Now if that's not derision, I don't know what is.

reply to post by LaBTop


It is called "ATS search". Use it.

Just because you regurgitate the same old crap and demand it be answered, does not mean it has not been answered and debunked before.

I am tired, absolutely tired of retyping the same answers for people who refuse to even listen or read it, and then turn around and claim it has not been answered. It has. Multiple times by myself and others. I suggest you learn to use ATS search.

reply to post by Flatcoat


I believe I said:

Now will you stop acting like a troll or are you going to contribute something useful? Besides being a typical ignorant "Truther"?

because that is exactly how you were behaving. Sorry for calling a spade a spade. Maybe if you had responded differently I would not have had to call you out on it.

Originally posted by GenRadek
reply to post by LaBTop

 

It is called "ATS search". Use it.

Just because you regurgitate the same old crap and demand it be answered, does not mean it has not been answered and debunked before.

I offer a huge heap of links, evidence and explanations, and the only thing you all can do is hide behind ATS Search ?
I assure you that I will drive any so called rebut of you into the ground, as I have done already many times, every time you left the scene when you were out of sane arguments.

I am tired, absolutely tired of retyping the same answers for people who refuse to even listen or read it, and then turn around and claim it has not been answered. It has. Multiple times by myself and others. I suggest you learn to use ATS search.

However, you're not so damn tired that you can't take the time to repeat yourself multiple times in typing the exact same crap.
I have quickly counted your identical posts on just this single page : 4 times you just repeat the same old song, without even ONE TINY LITTLE LINK TO YOUR FAMOUS DEBUNKS !
And your co-pilot hellobruce parroted you 1 time. He probably went to bed early after that, otherwise he would have equaled you for sure.

What a damn cowardly behavior, keyboard heroes worthy, indeed.

I challenge you again, come up or shut up.

The VIMEO link to that beauty of a film is also deleted.

Here's another one, let's see how long this one stands against the infringing-reporting of the real traitors.

Link 1.

Link 2.

If you are a true American, right-click in the video window and choose Download (379 MB ! ), then show this film at every possible opportunity to all your friends, neighbors and family.


INFO : All these people admit that they were fooled during the early days after 9/11 by these LIES, offered by the real traitors of the American heritage of true freedom for all.

It becomes clear in this film, that all these seemingly patriotic journalists, CIA and various government personnel quite well knew that it was all a pack of lies brought by compulsive LIARS, shortly after hearing them already.
Why did they not turn against these lies that time. Why did they wait so long to tell in front of this camera, that they went with the flow, while they knew already that they were used?

One thing becomes very clear, the bulk of American, British and European journalists is a bunch of cowards, not worth holding a microphone at all. And the real courageous ones are possibly shot dead by friendly fire while reporting in war zones, fired from their jobs, or arrested on various charges.

What also becomes clear is the sheer magnitude of the lies, and the abnormal neutral reaction by the greater public after they know that they were lied to, at such immoral scales.

reply to post by GenRadek


Let's put that in context shall we?
I said

It's an odd situation when, in order to believe the OS, one also has to believe that absolutely anything can cause explosions........except, of course, explosives.

To which you replied

Im sorry my friend, but you have just stepped into a huge steaming pile of ignorance. It's an odd situation that in order to believe in the "Truther" fantasy version of events, one has to believe that only an explosive can make an exploding sound. Hearing something go "boom" and saying it sounded like an explosion, does NOT mean it was an explosive. To be this ignorant, to believe that nothing else can make a "BOOM" sound except for a bomb, is well, the epitomey of ignorance. I guess when people describe a car crash like an explosion, or the sound of a train derailment like an explosion, it must really mean, a BOMB exploded! Right? Right?

My reply

Right...of course. People hear booms, watch a building fall down and naturally assume it was a car crash. Definitely a steaming pile of something.

Your reply

It is no wonder the "Truth" Movement hasnt gone anywhere in all these years. The ignorance is really putting a drag. Also I see your reading comprehension skills are right where they should be.......... nonexistent. Thank you for being the model "Truther". Now will you stop acting like a troll or are you going to contribute something useful? Besides being a typical ignorant "Truther"?

You honestly believe your attitude was warranted?

reply to post by LaBTop

I offer a huge heap of links, evidence and explanations, and the only thing you all can do is hide behind ATS Search ?

None of which can you prove the accuracy of.
Once again any first year law student could shoot down.

I assure you that I will drive any so called rebut of you into the ground, as I have done already many times, every time you left the scene when you were out of sane arguments.

And just what college degree do you hold?
How many years of expertice do you have in said field?
Once again any first year law student could shoot down.


The government had hundreds of experts who examined the evidence first hand.
And then there's you. Not an expert. Posting Youtube vids and links to other conspiracy sites.
If you believe everything on the web, Nibiru would have destroyed us last month.

Until you cough up impeccable credentials and prove your web links your claims are no different than Nibiru.

The smoking gun for thermate usage is in the microstructures of the failed A36 steel I-Beams analyzed in WTC 1&2 report. The MIT metallurgists conveniently avoided their careers ending or death by stating that the microstructural changes were inconclusive. The microstructure clearly shows a surface layer near the fracture that contains iron oxide and iron sulfide in a ferritic matrix. Typical signature of thermate (thermite with sulfur) used to cut steel. Don't need nan-super, whatever thermate. This stuff has been used for welding since the early 1900's. And many debunkers thought you can't cut steel with it????

If you don't believe me:
1) Get the Report
2) Find a Metallurgist
3) Cut A36 Steel with Thermate (have an expert does this)
4) Compare: Voila, the same microstructure

reply to post by GenRadek


What I just posted has never been debunked.

reply to post by ibiubu

The smoking gun for thermate usage is in the microstructures of the failed A36 steel I-Beams analyzed in WTC 1&2 report. The MIT metallurgists conveniently avoided their careers ending or death by stating that the microstructural changes were inconclusive.

And you can PROVE that the results on ONE BEAM are CONCLUSIVE?
What degree do you hold that would allow us to believe you over someone who ACTUALLY EXAMINED THE EVIDENCE FIRST HAND?