Getting to the Bottom of Evolution

reply to post by littleewok

You are mixed up or misinformed, but happily this is curable.
Your link is typical of most creationist sites that just regurgitate false information.
This "proof" you have has nothing to do with evolution, but it has everything to do with creationist falsehoods and lies.
You can learn what evolution theory and biological science really says about the diversity of life on earth, but your not going to get from creationist propaganda.

reply to post by littleewok

You are mixed up or misinformed, but happily this is curable.
Your link is typical of most creationist sites that just regurgitate false information.
This "proof" you have has nothing to do with evolution, but it has everything to do with creationist falsehoods and lies.
You can learn what evolution theory and biological science really says about the diversity of life on earth, but your not going to get from creationist propaganda.

Thats the type of smug attituide you can expect from evolutionists on ATS. They will promise you the world and deliver only assumptions.

No one has ever proven that anything has evolved into another species. No one has ever witnessed this, but they have witnessed suddle small changes. This gave evolutionists free range to assume that more changes could happen resulting in macroevolution which obviously expalins how we are related to apes.

LOL, I don't buy the assumption. There is NOTHING that our prior species brings to the table, there is no language shared, no inventions shared, and no life histoy shared, obviously because it never happened the way they are assuming it did.

If evolution were real as explained here through sites and through ATS, the world we live in would appear a lot different than it does right now. For example, we would see a plethora of intermediate species with almost every species. Instead what we find is a vast array of species that just have a few things in common.

I even came up with a theory that totally debunks evolution, called Target food.
Target food is the observation on how species eat, and determine what to eat. As with all animals anytime you see a species eating just about anything from a food group, they are out of Target food and in phase one of hunger. After that they pick up a new food group when phase one and target food are no longer available, just like wiki lists about the squirrel for example. Phase three is starvation, eating rocks and dirt, dying. The idea that target food exists can be seen in a few species, and it would appear to be that there is only one to three foods in the ideal enviroment. When those ideal foods are off the menu for what ever reason, the phases of hunger starts, providing they are smart enough to move on to other food.

The bible indicates that earth is not our home, it also claims that while we were provided with plants, herbs and animals from everywhere, none of these things are from our home. What this means is that non of the food we eat was actually intended for us, so we appear to be in phase two of hunger. There is additional work that has to be done to make this food available, and additional work to process the food like cooking and packaging, simply because it's not our food. This offers whats called a reduction in the quality of life, and this is the price we have to pay if we want to survive.

reply to post by fastbob72

Hey fella,I've read everyt post and repy in this thread and i have utter respect and admiration for you.

You've fought you're corner tooth and nail against all comers with real determination yet it's such a shame !!

I admire you for the fight you've put up but your position is so inherently flawed that it"s just pure nonsense.

Either you're living proof that a little knowledge is dangerous or you're desire to believe is blinding you to what you're reading.

If you've genuinelly arrived at your conclusions through objective research as you claim then I suggest you take up knitting or something as you haven't got the faculties for critical thinking ;-(


Target foods for example,you could look at the way animals eat and develop a complex theory to describe it,encompassing intelligent design and direction which determined that each planet has the exact requirements to meet the needs of each species.Until god,martians,greys maybe decided to gather them all from their home planets and dumped them on Earth.

No reason for or evidence of this act to show by whom or to what end but you know it's imaginative i'll give you that.

Of course,you could look at animal feeding habits and suggest that species will favour foods most suited to their nutritional needs,dietry system and metabolism.

They'll favour what most easily available to them and abundant in their enviroment.

Only when target food is no longer available. Thats part of the weird mystery about this, is that it's always the first choice. It's when its no longer available that there are problems or odditys in other food.

This isn't chosen for them,no outside intelligence is directing them rather it's it's part learnt behaviour,part instinctive that's all.

You don't need any complex theory to explain that an animal will feed from the most suitable,accesible food in it's enviroment.If that goes it'll find the next most suitable and easy söurce.

Target food is obviously chosen. The reason this is obvious is because we never see species randomly trying out rocks and dirt, to at least discover they don't like them. This tells you its not a "personal choice". Something else that tells you it's not personal choice is how all members of a species eat the exact same food, provided they all live where that food is avaialable. One again their "personal choice" has been pre determined.

If that's threatened they'll adapt if they can which can lead to specilising.

An example,my mother feeds the birds wi hanging up peanuts in bags,bits of lard on string,breadcrumbs etc.

Domesticated pets don't count as we determin what they eat. Aside from that, hungry animals will step outside the box for food, its another clue that the target food is no present.

Of course the reasons why this has happened is because someone went around to other planets and collected all species and dumped a few of them off here on planet earth. Along with plants and herbs. The problem is you can't do that. It causes an inbalance in the system and only the apex preditors will survive. This is why scientsts are confused right now. They are make the first wrong assumption that all life that is here, originated from here and belongs here. It doesn't.

In winter they'll take advantage but in accordance with the law of target foods why arent they eating worms like they've been directed in good weather yet they eat the food she leaves out just as much in summer.Don't tell me sparrows,robins,finchs,blackbirds etc target food is breadcrumbs and lardcakes.

They are either supposed to live in an areas where worms are available all year round, or worms are not a target food.

How do urban foxes feeding from rubbish bins or that seagulls are more common in towns and citys than on the coasts now fit in with target foods ?

When you see animals acting this way, its because the target food is missing. So the question now becomes why and how. It is possible that the food is now extinct, just like why we are now headed into the 6th largest extinction right now. This is caused from all of these things being brought here to earth, and they don't belong together, only the apex preditors will survive, and its going on right now. We are looking at a 99% loss of all life as we know it.

The answer is simple it doesnt because it's nonsense.Open your eyes and use some commön sense.Animals always have,always will exploit and adapt to any ready available source of food and that's instinct and need driving that plain and simple.

Yes I agree that most of what you have realized is animals without target food.

If target foods was real seagulls wouldnt thrive ön our waste food they'd be eating fish as programmed ye

reply to post by fastbob72

If target foods was real seagulls wouldnt thrive ön our waste food they'd be eating fish as programmed yet seagulls are as plentiful as rats in every city.

Your assuming that is their target food, and your also assuming it is available in supply the way it was meant to be.

Parading target foods,pure psuedo science of the worst kind,as a major part of the case agaisnt evolution is a joke,along with the bible and the starchild.

Target food is not psuedo science, its fully observed, unlike evolution.

Star child has already been proven to be an alien skull, as proven in his links backing up the DNA findings.

Star child

reply to post by itsthetooth


After reading through this thread I have to say that you have to be the most willfully ignorant person I have ever seen on these threads. You ignore real science and substitute real knowledge for the craziest mojo you can find. It is fine if you want to be deluded but you are trying to spread it to others. You offer nothing in the way of proof and not even a workable theory.

IF you are going to push creation theory you should find better arguments because the ones you are using are the worst I have heard so far. Perhaps you should take up psychology you may be able to help yourself. It is amazing how you simply ignore the provable foundations of evolution but hey believe what you want I just think it is a shame that you do not apply yourself to seeking the truth instead or tying to justify some old book.

reply to post by Grimpachi

After reading through this thread I have to say that you have to be the most willfully ignorant person I have ever seen on these threads. You ignore real science and substitute real knowledge for the craziest mojo you can find.

And what science are you talking about? Biology? I have never seen a biology book that proved we share a common ancestor with apes. Of course there is always speculation but I stay away from those types of things.
What crazy mojo are you talking about, everything I have presented is backed up by documentation, and its all posted.

It is fine if you want to be deluded but you are trying to spread it to others. You offer nothing in the way of proof and not even a workable theory.

There is nothing deluded about understanding our history.

IF you are going to push creation theory you should find better arguments because the ones you are using are the worst I have heard so far.

Ding! Ding! Ding! now we have a winner, uhm, that would be because I'm not pushing creation.

Perhaps you should take up psychology you may be able to help yourself. It is amazing how you simply ignore the provable foundations of evolution but hey believe what you want I just think it is a shame that you do not apply yourself to seeking the truth instead or tying to justify some old book.

Ya who needs an old book. I don't like the old biology books either. There are no provable foundations of evolution, just that there are changes. Thats it. It goes no further as the cause of those changes haven't been identified yet. So it doesn't make it open season for assumptions just because there are changes, heck I allready proved that ADHD can do that. You need to put the biology book down and pick up a common sense book.

My arguments are the best on here. Not a single person has been able to debunk Target food.
The only two attempts I have heard is that a species only selects food by personal choice, which was proven wrong because they are ALL making the same choice as a species, and the other is that they just eat what ever is available. That was also proven wrong based on the fact that they do actually know what they want to eat BEFORE they try it out, which is why we never seen a species trying rocks and dirt.

I'm shocked you were silent for such a long time, you should stick to that, you were good at it.

reply to post by itsthetooth


You have not made good case or proven anything so there isn’t much to say to you. I am afraid that if I speak to you to long you would drag me down to your level. You can keep ranting though I am just letting you know that every time you do it shows everyone just how ignorant you are. I have never seen anyone destroy their own credibility as much as you have.

Carry on.

reply to post by itsthetooth


Why is it that when you see a simple behaviour in animals,instead of accepting a mundane,straight forward,common sense explantion you prefer a bizarre and unlikely one that isn't so self explanatory it clearly obvious.

I'll come back and lay our two viewpoints out side by side and show the differences though it's clearly pointless as the crux öf this whole business,you're clinging to the most flimsy of argumemnts in the face of sense,logic,proof cited over and over
is clear to me.

You will not accept evoluthon at all.You've accepted adaption early on which is a major part of the process.You've äccepted micro evolution aswell but still with real conviction evolution is a completely flawed so wrong.

Look,I appologise for my sarcasm and mocking your intelligence in my previous post.You've clearly göt intelligence because you clearly are able to debate but you're actual claims are proven bogus but you dismiss it.

You will not accept evolution,you accepted adaption and micro evolution with barely a fight but nothing will make you even consider it.Signed statements from god and Dr Pye awouldnt even make you take a
2nd look.It's not you're theory is far superior.You have target foods,the bible and refuseal to accept it.That's you're counter over 14 pages.Again it isnt you have a better theory,it's you won't accept animals that evolve over millenia into a retated,evolvded species.Yes they can adapt,pöllutants can be a factor.They can change in all kinds öf ways but not any change that you feel might be seen as animal to a related but superior thu evolution,point blank impossible you say.

Why,why,why??

Actually it's blatantly obvious why though you'll deny it.Why do you haue this blind hatred of evolution,what's behind it ??

Apes !!!


Thats why you cant accept evolution,nothing else explains it as easily.
There we have it man evolved from a form of ape.If that idea had never been expressed you wouldnt think to query it !!!

100+ years after Darwin voiced this idea people can't go there.

It suggest mankind is related to an animal and to some thats abhorent.

Mankind is special,set apart and above.The bible,ancient aliens,we're were genetically engineered,anything but a simple product of this earth and just not a monkey that got smart.

That's why any unfounded idea is ok yet evolution is crazy.

If mankind is set apart,then we're special and so are you !!!

Poor bloody apes,it's not their fault.

One question ~ dö you accept humans are primates ??

you say i'm mad,,but being dumped here E.T is better than ape~man argument ??

Actually it's easily solved ~


I evolved from apes,you came down on a sunbeam.

Happy ??

One last point then feel free to respond in anyway.

Was feeling a little bit guilty suggesting you cant accept evolution for a reason l
that wasnt of the highest scientific ideal.

Thats what I think,probably shouldnt have said it (-;

Decided to research your target foods properly rather than respond to what you''ve explained it to be.

Target Food,Target Foods,Target Food Theory -

Googled all three,wikipedia too and find a single Reference to it.

So where do I find independant referance material for it,the theory,a history of it,who's theory,who endorses.

You said it was science fact yet it's not mentoned on google or wickepidia ??

^He made the term "target food" up. There isn't a single study or reference to it anywhere besides in his head. I've given up arguing with him. The entertainment value kind of wore off.

Originally posted by fastbob72
Actually it's easily solved ~


I evolved from apes,you came down on a sunbeam.

Happy ??

"I was created by intelligent design,
You are merely a descendent of the unmodified"

Love that song.

Can someone tell me why creationists are so fixated on food? Believe it or not the guy in this video is being completely serious. I thought this was a joke at first but this is one of their arguments that they thought was convincing enough to make a video about. I ran across this video because I was honestly looking to see if they had any decent theories. My conclusion is that most of them are little nuts.

The video is pretty hilarious. Enjoy.


After watching this I ate a PB&J.

reply to post by Grimpachi


"Evolution teaches that energy such as lightning or heat plus matter can occasionally create new life"

Hilarious! Yeah, these guys seem trustworthy There are reasons I avoid religion. Anybody using blatant lies like that to draw people in to their religion, is going against the very cause they are claiming to support.

reply to post by Grimpachi

You have not made good case or proven anything so there isn’t much to say to you. I am afraid that if I speak to you to long you would drag me down to your level. You can keep ranting though I am just letting you know that every time you do it shows everyone just how ignorant you are. I have never seen anyone destroy their own credibility as much as you have.

Well I have proven that evolution failed to properly decipher how a species determines what it eats.

It's obvious that species know what they are suppose to be eating. They don't have tools or labs to tell them what they are suppose to eat, they just know, and they all know as species as a whole. All that evolution claims is that the food evolves right along side the consumer, but if that were true we wouldn't see species dying from lack of food, and we do.
Evolution claims that the species decides what its suppose to eat, or at least thats what I'm told here on ATS, but if that were true, why and how could the food possibly evolve along with the species?

Intelligence is clearly involved in the eating choices of a species.
Intelligence is clearly involved with our DNA and it's construction and changes.
Even if you want to believe that everything happens because of evolution, you still need intelligence to program it all. Evolution failed to explain how intelligence is involved in all of these sectors, just face it, evolution failed and failed.

My observation of these elements is not ignorance, it's brilliance. You only see it as ignorance because your brainwashed into believing evolution.

reply to post by fastbob72

Why is it that when you see a simple behaviour in animals,instead of accepting a mundane,straight forward,common sense explantion you prefer a bizarre and unlikely one that isn't so self explanatory it clearly obvious.

I'll come back and lay our two viewpoints out side by side and show the differences though it's clearly pointless as the crux öf this whole business,you're clinging to the most flimsy of argumemnts in the face of sense,logic,proof cited over and over
is clear to me.

You will not accept evoluthon at all.You've accepted adaption early on which is a major part of the process.You've äccepted micro evolution aswell but still with real conviction evolution is a completely flawed so wrong.

Look,I appologise for my sarcasm and mocking your intelligence in my previous post.You've clearly göt intelligence because you clearly are able to debate but you're actual claims are proven bogus but you dismiss it.

You will not accept evolution,you accepted adaption and micro evolution with barely a fight but nothing will make you even consider it.Signed statements from god and Dr Pye awouldnt even make you take a
2nd look.It's not you're theory is far superior.You have target foods,the bible and refuseal to accept it.That's you're counter over 14 pages.Again it isnt you have a better theory,it's you won't accept animals that evolve over millenia into a retated,evolvded species.Yes they can adapt,pöllutants can be a factor.They can change in all kinds öf ways but not any change that you feel might be seen as animal to a related but superior thu evolution,point blank impossible you say.

Why,why,why??

Actually it's blatantly obvious why though you'll deny it.Why do you haue this blind hatred of evolution,what's behind it ??

Apes !!!


Thats why you cant accept evolution,nothing else explains it as easily.
There we have it man evolved from a form of ape.If that idea had never been expressed you wouldnt think to query it !!!

100+ years after Darwin voiced this idea people can't go there.

It suggest mankind is related to an animal and to some thats abhorent.

Mankind is special,set apart and above.The bible,ancient aliens,we're were genetically engineered,anything but a simple product of this earth and just not a monkey that got smart.

That's why any unfounded idea is ok yet evolution is crazy.

If mankind is set apart,then we're special and so are you !!!

Poor bloody apes,it's not their fault.

One question ~ dö you accept humans are primates ??

you say i'm mad,,but being dumped here E.T is better than ape~man argument ??

The reason why I don't accept these things is they are missing the needed proof. There is no proof we are related to apes, it's just speculation. Hell you could say that airplanes and bicycles are related as they both are vehicles and have round tires, but clearly they aren't. Making assumptions in science is a big NO NO. Anyone with any credibility knows this and stays away from it. Everything I have ever presented on this is backed up by something, and none of it is weak. Target food as an example can be observed by looking up the diet of any number of species.

They never talk about an experimenal stage of eating which proves food is not a choice.
They never talk about various parts of a species eating things that the rest of them don't, provided the choices are the same, and location can play in this as well.

It's common sense that a species is only going to be able to eat based on whats available to him. The unanswered questions are why do they all seem to have an order that appears to match the species? And why do they go back to the original food when ever its available, even after they have stepped over to a new food? This order of choice is consistant through out a species, it's as though they have the perfect food on their mind.

Humans are considered to be primates, so I don't know how to answer your question.

Oh do I accept us as such, in some ways I do, and in some I don't. I think its a scientific mistake. We also share 70% of our DNA with rats but we are not even close in appearance to them.

I don't see that any of my ideas are unfounded. We have historical documentation that is telling us that earth is not our home, and filled with UFO visits. We have tampering in our DNA, as best described by Pye, and some of that tampering can only be done in a lab, explain that one. Is it possible that god was not our real creator, but a DNA scientist? It's looking very possible especially when the bible is talking about him paying us a visit with a four headed creature of lion ox eagle and man.
Man is not related to apes, there is no astounding proof of this, there is only speculation.

reply to post by fastbob72

One last point then feel free to respond in anyway.

Was feeling a little bit guilty suggesting you cant accept evolution for a reason l
that wasnt of the highest scientific ideal.

Thats what I think,probably shouldnt have said it (-;

Decided to research your target foods properly rather than respond to what you''ve explained it to be.

Target Food,Target Foods,Target Food Theory -

Googled all three,wikipedia too and find a single Reference to it.

So where do I find independant referance material for it,the theory,a history of it,who's theory,who endorses.

You said it was science fact yet it's not mentoned on google or wickepidia ??

The observation is a fact. There is target food followed by three phases, at least thats what I'm seeing, there could be more, of hunger. Your not going to find anything about target food on google, I created it. And just because I created it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Everything we deal with on a daily basis was created by someone, and its all real.

So give me the diet of any species and I can tell you if its target food or a phase of hunger.

reply to post by Grimpachi


He has a valid point. If life can be made from non life, we SHOULD be able to find it say in a jar of peanut butter. But the fact is we never do. So evolution is wrong, you can't expect life from non life, at least I'm sure there will be an excuse why peanut butter is exempt from this clause.

We have never witnessed a species changing into another species, but evolutionists believe it's happening right under our noses. We have never witnessed anything that ties us to apes, aside from simular DNA, but evolutonists believe we are related to them.

reply to post by Barcs


I can understand that the primordial soup idea is open to speculation and just accepting an idea that isn't proven yet but there is the experiment in the 50's or 60's that shöwed the main chemicals and water subjected to electric spiking over a week or so which produced 5 aminos acid the building blocks of proteins,,using modern equipment and testing produced 23 aminos.

It's not life but it proves that the building blocks for life could be created in early earth conditions.

It may sound i'm argueing against what i've been championing butd evolution doesnt need to explain how life started,it describes the process life goes through over millions of years.It begins with living organisms.Life technically has to have began already for evolution to take ahold

Did life start on Earth or was it brought here by meteors,comets from that to earth.They believe the planets entire watetr system came from millions of comet stike

So it's entirely plausible that instead of creating life by something occuring in the organic rich oceans it simply came hear hitchng a ride on comet

reply to post by itsthetooth


Exactly,target foods is your own theory and it continually stating it over and over doesnt turn bull# nonsense into inspired thinking.

look you win,i'm not wasting anymore of my time argueing this crap cos you are convinced you are right and repeating your same nonsense makes it true.

you have proved that if you keep saying the same thing over and over and over people the whole thing up as pointless cos it is.
I know you'll consider it a moral victory and vindication of target foods.

You've created a whole complex phenomena fröm behaviour based on evironment,availabiliy and adaption and instinct.

It really is the most chlldlike,pathetic,drivel i've ever heard,,your arguement goes its true because i say it,i say it because its true ad infinitum !!!

reply to post by fastbob72

Exactly,target foods is your own theory and it continually stating it over and over doesnt turn bull# nonsense into inspired thinking.

Thats easy to say, but doesn't explain why no one has been able to debunk it.

So far the odd things that I have heard from people that they were unable to prove are...
"A species just eats what ever."
"The food evolves right along side with the consumer." But still doesn't explain how the choice is made.
"Experimentation is done by all species untill they arrive at a food they like." This was debunked as all species are choosing the same food within a species, and we never find them experimenting.

So as you can see, Target food is valid, and proves that intelligent programing is somehow involved into every living species that eats for food.

look you win,i'm not wasting anymore of my time argueing this crap cos you are convinced you are right and repeating your same nonsense makes it true.

Of course if I were wrong, you would have no problem proving that, instead you just claim you don't want to dispute it, as I'm sold on it. LOL. Could it be that you can't prove me wrong because I'm not wrong?

you have proved that if you keep saying the same thing over and over and over people the whole thing up as pointless cos it is.
I know you'll consider it a moral victory and vindication of target foods.

And with each time that I repeat it, you have the golden opportunity to prove me wrong, and out of all these chances, you haven't.

You've created a whole complex phenomena fröm behaviour based on evironment,availabiliy and adaption and instinct.

The more there is involved, the easier it should be for you to prove me wrong. Instead, you insist that I'm just wrong. Aside from it obviously not agreeing with evolution, can you name one part that can be proven wrong?
You can't even suggest that species choose their diet through choice because they are all making the same decision as a species. There is obviously a lot more to it than just that, and evolution failed in this catagory.

It really is the most chlldlike,pathetic,drivel i've ever heard,,your arguement goes its true because i say it,i say it because its true ad infinitum !

No it's true because not a single person has proven it wrong.

And if its really so childish why did one person here on ATS claim he didn't believe that I made up this theory, that someone else did and I stole it from them? He coulden't prove it wrong either. Nor could he find a claimed author.

Nope Target food was observed by me, however, I'm not the first to realize that it's true...

How do animals have it all figured out

An even better question is how do animals know what not to eat...
ragwort

How can animals detect poisioness things...
poisioness

So as you can see, your wrong. Other people have identified that there is a hell of a lot more to animals choosing food, then choice, more than selection, more than food groups. The observation goes beyond those limitations down to programing.
But please don't take my word for it, look up as many diets about animals as you want and see for yourself.
You will see that they always eat the same things as a species.
You will see that there never is an experimental stage to eating, unless of course the animal is being starved.
You will see that there never is the eating of rocks and dirt to find out that isn't food, they are pre programmed to know what food they are to look for.

Evolution failed in explaining all of this down to the detail, just a brazen assumption was made that food also evolves just like the species. With no merit of course.