What drives some to make the assumption that the U.S. is NOT as Militarily Advanced as it truly is?

reply to post by SplitInfinity


SplitInfinity

Be a man, don't post on the internet, I want to see you join mercenaries and go to
Iraq or go kill Scientists in Iran

Go do something worthwhile in your mind, talk is cheap, go risk your own neck

And then report back to ATS and tell us how it went. And if you die with arms in another country.

Well.........then we will say we hope you didn't leave a small child at home.

reply to post by Jay-morris

This topic is not about debating Right or Wrong or even what the U.S. has done is moral or not. This topic asks a question. Split Infinity

reply to post by Uberdavo

If that is what you believe so be it.
Split Infinity

reply to post by Uberdavo

Silly is thinking the planes out of Logan were remote controlled. Split Infinity

Originally posted by LostPassword
reply to post by SplitInfinity

 

SplitInfinity

Be a man, don't post on the internet, I want to see you join mercenaries and go to
Iraq or go kill Scientists in Iran

Go do something worthwhile in your mind, talk is cheap, go risk your own neck

And then report back to ATS and tell us how it went. And if you die with arms in another country.

Well.........then we will say we hope you didn't leave a small child at home.

edit on 3-11-2012 by LostPassword because: (no reason given)

Being a MAN is knowing that you are Vastly Uninformed. I have risked my neck. I still have it.
Split Infinity

reply to post by SplitInfinity


SplitInfinity, job well done for keeping the conversation polite and civil for 10 pages so far.

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by milominderbinder

 

Your reply is correct in it's History but in the cases of issue that involve the U.S. Military and I have a unique perspective of that war as well as the U.S. Air Force's lack of a close support aircraft such as the A-10 or such POLITICAL BLUNDERS as not building the F-4 with a GUN as well as JOHNSON'S total and complete Micromanaging of the U.S. Military.

The current U.S. Military has developed several Direct Energy Weapons along with Targeting and Acquisition Satellites that are of such Power as well as their ability to be used with precision as well as use both in Offensive and Defensive ways that it will force a complete and total restructuring of U.S. Forces.

This is a case where our level of Tech. in Weaponry and Computers has created such a level of disparity that lessons in History do not apply as there has never been such a condition in World History where such a level of Disparity between Countries Military Capabilities have existed. Split Infinity

LOL...Ummm...no you are incorrect. And I think I'm pretty good on the history stuff...I have a Master's degree in it.

Laser beams are fine and great...but it doesn't matter. You know why? BECAUSE NOBODY IS INSANE ENOUGH TO ATTACK A COUNTRY W/ SPACE-BASED LASER CANNONS HEAD ON!!!

The result will only be...CAN ONLY BE...more terrorism and less symmetrical warfare. That's what you aren't understanding. We are ALREADY the most militarily dominant force that the world has ever seen. That's not the part of warfare that we are incompetent at. There is not a country on planet earth that we cannot militarily disable w/ stunning ease. But guess what?

YOU STILL HAVEN'T WON THE WAR!!! Not anymore...not in this day and age. All you did was create lots and lots of people that hate you. The more lopsided the "victory"...the more they hate you. "winning" = "losing". The weapons are fine and great...but the United States is tactically and strategically incompetent in warfare starting the moment we have the opposition bombed back into the stone age...which usually takes about 1-2 weeks these days.

So...we spend two weeks "winning" the war and the next decade (or longer) losing it and going bankrupt. It's a zero-sum game and a complete exercise in futility.

Originally posted by SoulVisions
I've seen an order, regarding that area over in the middle east and Iran. Well, "heard" one is more accurate, for a warplane to drop a line of carpet bombs off in the water there. It was to be between the ships out there on the water and where landfall is.

I have no singular idea why this would we be done, or the reasoning behind it, but it was discussed for the minute I walked in. I have never mentioned it here on ATS or anywhere, because it was just one of those things where you walked into the room mid-conversation between officers. Anyone have thoughts on this? What stage or reasoning there might be behind why this tactic/scenario would occur? It was not a stealth mission, I didn't believe, because they spoke about daylight hours and using just a typical jet..

S.V....I believe I know the reason that they were discussing a Carpet Bombing of the Water just off shore. Iran has built close to a Thousand Mini Speed Boats in a Tactical Effort to harass U.S. Navy Warships at High Speed and while any specific ship is being Harassed and Shot at by this Mini Speed Boats...Iran hopes they will allow for other Iranian Ships or Cruise Missiles to penetrate a Carrier Groups antimissile system as the Iranians believe that as the U.S. Ships must contend with these PESTS...it might be possible for a Ship Killing Missile to slip in and sink a U.S. Ship.

Now a Nuclear U.S. Carrier Group has a Very Advanced integrated Super Computer Networked System that ties in all U.S. Ships, Aircraft, Satellites and the carrier groups Aegis Cruisers ABM and AAA systems as well as it has the ability to prioritize Targets with many Protective Missiles being tied in to the system and not requiring the necessity of Human Commands to allow a LAUNCH OF A DEFENSIVE MISSILE. This is what the Iranian Leadership does not understand but the Iranian Military Leadership does...still...the U.S. Military PLANS FOR EVERYTHING. If B-52H's came in a High Altitude they could drop bombs from 50 to over 100 miles away and let them Glide to the target with the help of GPS Guidance. Thus we could wipe out all these Small Speed Boats which we can see in REAL TIME where they are located by Satellite. It is important to note that even CARPET BOMBING Targets the U.S. Air Force use SMART BOMBS specific for this use as some Carpet Bombing Bombs burst over target and have sub-munitions within that are rendered inert if they do not detonate thus are allowed under the Cluster Bomb Ban Treaty which the U.S. HAS NOT SIGNED. Split Infinity

reply to post by milominderbinder

The FEL is not SPACE BASED but it does and will in the very near future have an entire Satellite System which is used for over the horizon targeting. This TECH is VERY REAL and VERY POWERFUL. It is at such a Power and Precision level that there will be a Massive Fight in the U.S. House and Senate as many programs that this system will render OBSOLETE will be targeted for cancel.

Anytime a Major Weapon System is cancelled...any Representative or Senator who's State is the home of the Company that makes these now obsolete systems will Scream Bloody Murder and try to prevent the closure of this companies plant or plants in an effort to save jobs in their home state.

I would appreciate it if you did not direct your obviously emotional feelings in this matter at me as I am not advocating WAR...I am simply asking a Question. I KNOW what it is like to be a target that someone wants to KILL and I have also been shot multiple times in the field. I HATE violence and my hope is that these Ultra-High Tech. U.S. Weapons will make even the idea of an attack or war so distasteful and be at such a high level of possible risk for any country to start a war would allow that risk to become to terrible a possibility to gamble at all. The people who fight or have fought are the people who hate war the most. This IS NOT A PRO WAR TOPIC! Split Infinity

Originally posted by Drunkenparrot
reply to post by SplitInfinity

 

SplitInfinity, job well done for keeping the conversation polite and civil for 10 pages so far.

Thanks DP....I try my best. This topic may create great emotions based on all peoples forms of opinion...but I ask for all to please remember this Topic is just a question for debate. This topic is not advocating WAR.
Split Infinity

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by captaintyinknots

 

Not as disastrous as it would be for China! We do not import anything from China that is VITAL. The Chinese economy however is completely dependent upon U.S. Purchases. Split Infinity

On the contrary as of right now China controls something like 98 percent of all rare earth metals being mined. These are needed for the advanced technological applications. Now once the california mines go online over the next 5 years or so that is going to change dramatically, but the rare earth market is what holds the US hostage from an import standpoint.

reply to post by SplitInfinity

After reading the follow-on pages and more of your thinking and logic, I can say we have no disagreement I can see at all. You're assuming the U.S. fights with all it has to fight with and by the plan the Military would build to follow. If or when that occurs and without ever talking nukes or that stuff...I agree. We wouldn't have a debate about victory or outcome.

In fact...If some (likely) capabilities were simply demonstrated without lethal use...?....we aren't to the days of Trinity yet where that point is entirely moot to make, IMO.

Having said that, I couldn't help but perk up to this post you made about the carpet bombing. I would note another purpose or I'd sure hope it's another purpose, very much planned for and intended. Mines..... The Iranians LOVE mines. Thousands...10's of thousands...of mines. All for a stretch of water just a few miles wide. Then, look at those speed boats....and their, ahem, mass and construction.

We tend to over think things in the West, IMO. Where they just set up a way to dump thousands of mines to literally pollute the place with them.....and have a little coastal patrol force able to freely move among them all, fully armed. That's not something OUR side can do with a few exceptions. So I hope the carpet bombing is to clear mines from altitude instead of being swarmed by those little bug boats where nothing can safely move to match them.

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by milominderbinder

 

The FEL is not SPACE BASED but it does and will in the very near future have an entire Satellite System which is used for over the horizon targeting. This TECH is VERY REAL and VERY POWERFUL. It is at such a Power and Precision level that there will be a Massive Fight in the U.S. House and Senate as many programs that this system will render OBSOLETE will be targeted for cancel.

Anytime a Major Weapon System is cancelled...any Representative or Senator who's State is the home of the Company that makes these now obsolete systems will Scream Bloody Murder and try to prevent the closure of this companies plant or plants in an effort to save jobs in their home state.

I would appreciate it if you did not direct your obviously emotional feelings in this matter at me as I am not advocating WAR...I am simply asking a Question. I KNOW what it is like to be a target that someone wants to KILL and I have also been shot multiple times in the field. I HATE violence and my hope is that these Ultra-High Tech. U.S. Weapons will make even the idea of an attack or war so distasteful and be at such a high level of possible risk for any country to start a war would allow that risk to become to terrible a possibility to gamble at all. The people who fight or have fought are the people who hate war the most. This IS NOT A PRO WAR TOPIC! Split Infinity

I don't think that will ever happen, the military makes a lot of money making sure the wars go on for as long as possible, their intention is not to win or lose, but to keep it in a perpetual motion.

If people one day would stop fighting because the technology would be so advanced, then they will create an enemy using that same technology, to continue fighting fire with fire.

On the topic, there is no race between countries for more advanced weapons, who is got the bigger gun and what not, they are all working together, that's why it has been so successful, and just for a scenario, if a country wanted to invade U.S they would have done it a long long time ago, and still can... with information.

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by milominderbinder

 

The FEL is not SPACE BASED but it does and will in the very near future have an entire Satellite System which is used for over the horizon targeting. This TECH is VERY REAL and VERY POWERFUL. It is at such a Power and Precision level that there will be a Massive Fight in the U.S. House and Senate as many programs that this system will render OBSOLETE will be targeted for cancel.

Anytime a Major Weapon System is cancelled...any Representative or Senator who's State is the home of the Company that makes these now obsolete systems will Scream Bloody Murder and try to prevent the closure of this companies plant or plants in an effort to save jobs in their home state.

I would appreciate it if you did not direct your obviously emotional feelings in this matter at me as I am not advocating WAR...I am simply asking a Question. I KNOW what it is like to be a target that someone wants to KILL and I have also been shot multiple times in the field. I HATE violence and my hope is that these Ultra-High Tech. U.S. Weapons will make even the idea of an attack or war so distasteful and be at such a high level of possible risk for any country to start a war would allow that risk to become to terrible a possibility to gamble at all. The people who fight or have fought are the people who hate war the most. This IS NOT A PRO WAR TOPIC! Split Infinity

I never said it was pro-war. I'm just explaining that massive military dominance and incredible technological advantage is paradoxically a DISADVANTAGE rather than an ADVANTAGE.

The better and more high-tech the weapons...the more battles we win and the more wars we lose.

reply to post by SplitInfinity


My guess is that such assumptions stem from ignorance. That said I'm reluctant to question the assumers of such assumptions. I mean ignorance can be bliss, so long as you are not the target of a U.S. military objective.

reply to post by Kovenov

Exactly. I think anyone would be hard pressed to find any other Countries Military Leader that would doubt the possibility that they could become the Target of Highly Advanced U.S. Military Weapon. For them to dismiss this possibility would be HIGHLY IRRESPONSIBLE. Split Infinity

I live outside and once worked on one of the navy,s top weapons research bases (China Lake)and i know of many research projects that lead to weapons systems that most of the public has never heard about.

The ban on exploding cluster bombs has lead to the navy going back to older pre exploding cluster bomb area weapons like the Lazy Dog "bombs"
en.wikipedia.org...

One reason the US military troops are getting a lot better is the military is allowing troops to do things that were unheard of 20 years ago.

Little things like allowing the troops to mount scopes on there weapons.
night vision equipment
squad level tactical radios,

All these are force multipliers.

Even the 2th amendment in the US is a force multiplier as many troops already know how to shoot before joining the military.

reply to post by Cypress

The U.S. has many sources to purchase Exotic Metals and is developing several supply chains from Africa. I do not see an issue as far as Exotic Metals. Split Infinity

I have read about 6 pages of the thread. I am going to reply and go back and read the rest. I keep losing signal and getting kicked off the net.

It seems that a major portion of the replies do not understand what you are saying.

I keep reading posts like, look at how you did in Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan.

It seems that everyone posting this missed the part where you stated that the military will only use this super tech in a last "effort" .

We all know that the current politics of war only lets the soldier half as$ fight a war.

Why would we bust out the ray gun just because the other Guy has an RPG?

I believe that the us uses the "loser"(or not so powerful) perception to decieve the public into thinking that we are not that advanced. After all the public opinion would be, if we have the tech then we should use it. Which might able us to win but, there isn't"t prolonged money in winning wars. There is no way in hell that the mother of a soldier who lost his life in battle would tolerate it(become a media sensation) if the military made it known that they had the tech to win already and didn't use it.

This is why it will stay top secret until the nation is a severe risk of being over run.

Yeah it sucks that soldiers die. But that is what a military industrial complex does, keep fighting, keep dieing, keep buying.

I was stating similar things on another thread about ufo's. Isn't it funny that aviation propulsion has gone stagnant over the past 50 to 60 years?

They want us to think the turbine is the best thing we got. It works and why should they roll out the other propulsion methods in the lime light. The complex is making g as much as it can of of current methods, aka oil.

I love your threads OP.

Keep up the great work.

To think we do not have anything developed and tested, is just to be naive. The amount of money spent on r&d is staggering and I refuse to believe otherwise. Or we have the worst r&d ever in the history of the planet and I do not think that is it.

I am typing on a cell phone. I will try to fix some typos.

Thanks for letting me display my two cents worth.