WOW, Now I understand it all! Why I am a "observer" and "observing" myself - there is only ME!

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by SuspendedBelief

 

So because some Satanists may understand this knowledge, that means it isn't true? I'm sure Satanists believe in gravity as well...

I am curious as to why anyone who understands this I AM would be worshiping ANY beings... oh well...

There is no more to reality than me, since I AM reality, and I AM the formless. The formless pretends to be "others" in form - to see its own beauty from different perspectives. This body typing this message is just one form.

Believe there is still misunderstanding... there is no pretense it is what occurs and I Am not reality. I Am a property within existence that is responsible for observing, but I Am in it's purest form is within all forms but it is not the form. In order that those who can not separate the form from the observer may reach that understanding there is a language developed that will take you there. However knowing the words and receiving their many levels of meaning takes time. There are many facets of understanding embedded within this language. There is no 'I got IT' because there is no IT to get and no me or I to get it. All I can do is observe it.

One way to think about it might be to have experience you need awareness, once aware to filter experience you need observation, in order to file observation you need separation, in order to have separation you need duality, ( is and is not), In order to measure duality you need judgement, in order to pass judgement you need ego, in order to have ego you need mind, in order to have mind you need body, in order to have body you need matter in order to have matter you need energy, in order to have energy you need movement, in order to have movement you need objects, in order to have objects you need space in order to have space you need dimensions, in order to have dimensions you need perspective in order to have perspective you need awareness....

Just thoughts much love

Originally posted by IAmD1
I Am just part of the story, the observer part.... I Am observing is what divides what is so that it can be observed. I Am love the recognition of what is being observed as it is. I Am everything the miss understanding that observing is anything other than a property of be. I Am nothing in the context of all.


Much love

I think your understanding is an important step ahead of the OP, one hopefully he (she?) will make for themselves.

The 'I am' is a temporary 'bunching of the field' (if you can picture what I mean) so observing can take place, that is bound to dissolve. Or an impermanent whirlpool or eddie in the river of all things.

'Love', I think, is simply the space that allows all things to occur in, and it is our sense of the numinous when we percieve creation beyond any personal or temporal discrimination.
When we observe from there, it feels like love, awe, appreciation for the fact that matter and energy exists and has a space in which to be, forms its appearance of separate objects with specific properties, dances its dance, dies its death, forms new bodies out of the old.

As for Descartes' cogito ergo sum, (other poster), that statement created what came to be known as the Cartesian gap, the idea that there is a little man inside your head observing you. It's mostly been found to be an incorrect assertion by modern philosophy and neuroscience, as well as something buddhism discovered, through the scientific approach of meditation, to be wrong. It's the foolish 'putting an extra head on top of your own' of zen.

Douglas Harding went one further and took away even that head, to create the headless way (though that was zen's original state anyway.)
It's basic purpose is to subtract the virtual false self that we project onto our experience all the time, which actually gets in the way of the original childlike/natural experience of life, which happens without a self.
All else is neurosis.

reply to post by IAmD1



I believe that just saying "The universe created us to observe itself" or "We are the observer" is not the full picture...

The question of "Who am I" can go even further... by answering these three questions:

Observing is an action, "WHAT" observes? WHAT is the essence of that which observes? And is there a REASON for observing if so, what?

Obviously it has to be something because there is only existence, non existence does not exist.

The only answer is - "The Formless". While non-existence can not exists, that doesn't mean that all things are form -

and since "This" which has OBSERVATION, THOUGHT, EMOTION, DESIRE, FORM, ACTION
is not a "form" since there is no THING behind this observation (I would know because I am it)...

It must be "formless". We are all the formless observing...

Then LIGHT energy such as SPIRIT, THOUGHT, DESIRE, EMOTION... comes to exist
even light (or spirit) is a TYPE of form/appearance

Then of course MATTER the physical world and body...

reply to post by arpgme


just be careful not to get caught in the web, brother.

reply to post by arpgme


it is funny...this morning when i was finishing my shower while watching the water going down the drain, with a rotation similar to our galaxy or an huge black hole (spiral rotation).... i thought that the universe where we all live, it's only my universe, where only i live in various forms and states... such as you...so you are me....

actually i hasn't aware of this thread ... and at end of this afternoon i wrote this :

When you die... the universe as you know...ceases to exist... because you stop observing it. So in theory (mine...made up know ^^.)... everything that surrounds you now, it only exists because i'm observing it.. interacting with it... so in a kind of ridiculous way, i'm just talking to me.... sorry if it sounds crazy... because it's crazy... I have to explore more the words and thoughts of Einstein, in the continuum of space and time, that we wave to manage to get out ...our try to see what relies beyond that... hum..

here

funny funny

Originally posted by voyger2
reply to post by arpgme

 

it is funny...this morning when i was finishing my shower while watching the water going down the drain, with a rotation similar to our galaxy or an huge black hole (spiral rotation).... i thought that the universe where we all live, it's only my universe, where only i live in various forms and states... such as you...so you are me....

actually i hasn't aware of this thread ... and at end of this afternoon i wrote this :

When you die... the universe as you know...ceases to exist... because you stop observing it. So in theory (mine...made up know ^^.)... everything that surrounds you now, it only exists because i'm observing it.. interacting with it... so in a kind of ridiculous way, i'm just talking to me.... sorry if it sounds crazy... because it's crazy... I have to explore more the words and thoughts of Einstein, in the continuum of space and time, that we wave to manage to get out ...our try to see what relies beyond that... hum..

here

funny funny

edit on 27-9-2012 by voyger2 because: (no reason given)

with that said... i say there is no boundaries....the universe is a continuum .... where the end is the start ... when we die we reborn....so when i look to the universe i'm looking inside of me (maybe consciousness .. just guessing)... space and time could only be measures of flow of consciousness or stages of matter or consciousness....

sound ridiculous... i agree

I'm surprised no one has posted this video yet. Seems like many of us have had very similar experiences.

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by IAmD1

 

I believe that just saying "The universe created us to observe itself" or "We are the observer" is not the full picture...

The question of "Who am I" can go even further... by answering these three questions:

Observing is an action, "WHAT" observes? WHAT is the essence of that which observes? And is there a REASON for observing if so, what?

Obviously it has to be something because there is only existence, non existence does not exist.

The only answer is - "The Formless". While non-existence can not exists, that doesn't mean that all things are form -

and since "This" which has OBSERVATION, THOUGHT, EMOTION, DESIRE, FORM, ACTION
is not a "form" since there is no THING behind this observation (I would know because I am it)...

It must be "formless". We are all the formless observing...

Then LIGHT energy such as SPIRIT, THOUGHT, DESIRE, EMOTION... comes to exist
even light (or spirit) is a TYPE of form/appearance

Then of course MATTER the physical world and body...

edit on 27-9-2012 by arpgme because: (no reason given)

Hmm, I get a bit more clarity from this as to your thinking.
I think you are correct in a certain way.
BUT... you have created duality, by dividing things into formless and matter.
I think there is no such thing as duality.
You seem to be saying, if something is imagined, even if it doesn't exist, it exists, as the formless, as thought.
(So because duality can be imagined, it exists as the formless?)
I would say if something exists, it has substance and matter.
There are things that do not exist. Just because we can imagine something that doesn't exist, doesn't give it existence outside of the electrical activity of our minds- and even that 'existence', is not really existence.

There are things that are true, and things that are not.
Are you are saying the things that are NOT true, still exist, because they have been thought of in the first place, or they would not even be concievable?
I guess the question becomes, what are thoughts and do they exist?

What you might call the formless, I think are just phenomena arising from the interaction of matter, like colour is a physical result of matter interacting with our eyes and brain. At this present moment in time, they are so subtle as to escape detection from our present understanding.
They are actions. They have no existence except in context of other things. Like words have no existence as anything other than sounds or shapes, except in the context of understanding the language. They're purely arbitrary and impermanent.

I don't feel particularly clear in my attempt to communicate this. Others say it better.
To grapple with the feeling of consciousness is of primal importance, although for some it's just a waste of time and they just get on with life.

Originally posted by arpgme


Now I makes sense why some people (also ME) say that "The Universe creates Humans to observe itself" - The universe (I) am doing this to see myself!

So Why observe myself? Because I am beauty! But even if people do not see me at all - that is still beauty...

I have had this thought and read arguments along these lines before. And I think the correct answer to that may also include something like "to experience LOVE." Because what is beautiful without that?

Also, I do hope you mean this in a kind of spiritual, conceptual way, even if you think it literally. In other words, don't go out and rob or shoot "you" because you've finally realized "it's all me!" and there is no way that you will ever throw yourself into prison.

reply to post by iwilliam

Originally posted by iwilliam
I have had this thought and read arguments along these lines before. And I think the correct answer to that may also include something like "to experience LOVE." Because what is beautiful without that?

How can you not love something that you see such beauty in?

Originally posted by iwilliam
Also, I do hope you mean this in a kind of spiritual, conceptual way, even if you think it literally. In other words, don't go out and rob or shoot "you" because you've finally realized "it's all me!"

This is an insane thought - self destruction...

Originally posted by iwilliam
and there is no way that you will ever throw yourself into prison.

I may be all of the crazy people - but I am also all of the sane people that stop them. I hope another me would protect me if a crazy me tried to get me.

so when you are giving you are receiving... when you are helping someone... you are being helped!
so loving its easier to understand... we can love more and receive more love... this amazingly beautiful

I will try to remember this and put it in practice more often... so i know you will to.

let me touch a little in spiritual/divine path/side --- assuming this knowledge is on the right track ... I have to think in Jesus.. He said "He was the path, the truth and the life."
It was a message / mystery that He left us / (me)...

time (or the flow matter/consciousness) will help me (you) think or understand a little more on this topic....

reply to post by arpgme

You seem to have glossed over this question:
...your realization seems to be more intellectual than experiential. Am I wrong?

I agree with D1ss1dent. You seem to be stuck on something that sounds good to you intellectually. You can't even grasp how different things made up of the same stuff are still individual. How things can only be connected if there is space between them through which the connection is established.

reply to post by daskakik


thats pretty much what i was sayin, its a good realization and all but you can trap yourself in your own mind if your not careful, been there done that.

reply to post by arpgme


I could also say that you are me, and I'd be right. I could say all the same things as you, and it would be truth.

Hi all

This is something of great depth of thought, as the Creator, Created the Creation, the Creatures of this Creation, crawled up out of the muck and mire to witness and speak of the Beauty of The Creation.

I am in awe of this whole thing, I get down on my knee's because I seem to weak, to understand not just my own pain, but the pain of those weaker than I. That even in my own pain of existence, I could find the strength to give support to those weaker than I.

We are all so very, very small, the only thing that even starts to make us big is how we can observe Creation.

Death seems easy, living in this horror seems to hard at times, but maybe that's just being selfish.

I know the first thoughts I have are of peace, even in the chance of conflict, I would prefer to be the better. But at what point do you nolonger turn the other cheek. And what of the innocent, at what point do you step in and plunge the blade into the evil's heart, who would feel the most pain you or the evil, not to even speak of the innocent that has yet to even bare friut nor flower. Do you just observe.

So many questions is there enough answers for all the questions.

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by SuspendedBelief

 

So because some Satanists may understand this knowledge, that means it isn't true? I'm sure Satanists believe in gravity as well...

I am curious as to why anyone who understands this I AM would be worshiping ANY beings... oh well...

There is no more to reality than me, since I AM reality, and I AM the formless. The formless pretends to be "others" in form - to see its own beauty from different perspectives. This body typing this message is just one form.

You have a "new age" way of thinking. I don't think any of it is true because it all has one thing in common, to make you not believe in God. Anything related to "all is one and one is all" is garbage philosophy. You are not part of me and you are not part of God and you are not one in all. You are you.

reply to post by spacemanjupiter

Originally posted by spacemanjupiter
reply to post by arpgme

 

I could also say that you are me, and I'd be right. I could say all the same things as you, and it would be truth.

Exactly, we may be expressed as different bodies, but we are the same thing in essence - pure formless beauty expressing itself in physical forms.


reply to post by OOOOOO


Without me trying to think , thoughts happens.
Without me trying to do, action happens.

You are thinking from mind (which is also just another beautiful perspective). You are planning which actions should be done and which actions should not - but what is creating this "should"?

Reality IS.
It is the physical manifestation of beauty.
It is unfolding perfectly.

You don't have to do anything, and action will happen naturally; the natural urge to help those who may be suffering around you and the natural urge to eat when hungry...


If you put your hand on the stove and it burns, even that pain is beautiful.

From my perspective, one way that I see is beauty is this:

Pain is a beautiful feeling that protects the body - it says "stop that or the body will be damaged"

Fear is a beautiful emotion that protects the mind/body - it says "don't do that or it may lead to suffering".

The idea is to see the beauty intrinsic of all things, don't "hold on" to these things, just behold their beauty.

But even if you DO happen to hold on to these things, creating a suffering life since nothing can be held on to forever, even that is beautiful.

How can I see the beauty in even that situation? It is a learning experience...

All of Reality (physical expression of BEAUTY) must have beauty in it;
although it is our choice to see through IT'S perspective or make up our own as we go along...

reply to post by arpgme


Everything is just happening and there is no 'me' that can do anything. The 'me' is an illusion, the 'me' is thought form that appears and disappears continually.
All is seen and known appearing and disappearing in that which never appears or disappears.

reply to post by arpgme


Congratulations my friend

You have seen your identity with the Lord of Love

but your journey is not over, you must experience full consciousness as this Lord of Love, you must meditate endlessly until you reach samadhi,

your journey up to now has been to find the journey, and now that you have reached the bottom of the mountain you must climb it

and you will have completed life, this is the ultimate goal of reality, and it is what all the religions try to tell us, although we stupid egoic people drastically misunderstand the scriptures.

REMEMBER THIS!!: Although you are correct in saying that everything is you, you are also everything,this is mine and everyone elses as much as it is yours, and it is not the worldly idea of you that is god (your name and all the things you think you are) but the inner idea of you, the only thing that remains when you take away everything, which is: I AM, that is what you are, you are that I AM, but there is a higher and a lower I AM, the lower is the ego (satan) and the upper is the true self (God), The ego will always say ''go on, no ones looking, just steal it'' and the true self will always say ''No, but instead work for the sake of others, so you can earn it, and then give it back to others''

If you are everything and everything is you, then by giving say, a tenner to a homeless person, you are really giving it to yourself (or god) but if you keep it for yourself then you are giving it to satan, this is what the scriptures mean by saying ''give your life to God'' It doesnt mean become a nun, and its not just things you should give toyour real self, but all your actions (for actions are the fruit of the forbidden tree, meant only for god)

Although you are right in saying that your body is also God, this is dangerous thinking when you are climbing the mountain, what you should be thinking is ''I am not my body, I am not my name, I am not my mind, but I AM'' when you remove all the layers you see the true self at the core, and then you see that:

''by knowing one piece of gold, you know all gold, although one is a gold ornament and one is a gold latch or panel, the thing from which both are made is gold though they differ in name and form''

and you see that God is everything that can possibly be conceived of and then you realise that the body is also that same pure consciousness.

When the journey is over you will essentially be in the same place as when you started but there will be a difference, for example:

where you are right now, in your home or something, you could travel the world trying to find the perfect place and go full circle and end up back in that room, but you would be +1 world and you would know through experience why that room is the best place, so you would essentially be the same, but twice as much.

and dont forget! i love you!