What is the difference between thinking and knowing?

reply to post by followtheevidence


Good question! I propose that knowing comes from already having the information stored in the brain, and it is this knowing that allows us to think new thoughts.

We cannot think about answering what 9 X 8 equals unless we already know something about numbers and math. So, 'knowing' is the foundation upon which we can think of new things.

Originally posted by r2d246
Thinking is actually a form of REM

Knowing is your ROM

Care to elaborate?

I'm interested in hearing more ...

reply to post by jiggerj

I propose that knowing comes from already having the information stored in the brain,

Not necessarily. Everything that is stored in our brains is a mixture of what we are told, and the conclusions we have formed on our own. Sometimes, what we are told contributes to our conclusions, but whose opinion/verdict - on any matter - is most important to us?

Our own. Therefore, we will often hold our own opinion to be "fact", or to have the same value. And if knowing is based on facts, doesn't that mean that all knowing is, first and foremost, based on our own ideas?

Knowing is thinking at a deeper level. Like I said before, in this world, knowing means so much less than what it used to...because freedom of speech leads to freedom of thought, and freedom of thought leads to preference of thought. As in, preference of what we ourselves think. And that becomes knowing.

Some people think they know.
Few people know they think.
Most people shoot their mouth off without knowing or thinking.

reply to post by Nite_wing


In my opinion, that's the most succinct and accurate answer in this thread. Starred.

Another take on it....

I think that I know and know that I think.

Originally posted by followtheevidence
I really don't even know how to frame this question or elaborate without sounding like an idiot. I suppose the title says it all.

The only thing that sort of helps distinguish the two (for me) is the notion that knowing doesn't require thought. We can interpret knowing through thought but cannot know any given thing through thought alone. Or something like that. But then how can I know that I cannot know through thought alone if thought lead me to that very conclusion? Pondering this question has been a maze, traversing through one hall of mirrors after another.

But really, there is a difference - a behemoth of a difference. It's not like we're splitting hairs here. What say you ATS? What is the difference between thinking and knowing?

I'm eager to hear your answers, reflections, "thoughts", etc.


Post Script: Sorry this is such a short post. I realize one-liner threads are becoming an unwelcome trend here on ATS; but really this is about what my ATS family has to say on the matter - not what I have to say. Because ... I don't know what to say.

Depends on what difference you're trying to distinguish. Both knowing and thinking are actually the same thing, which is information shooting around your neurons through light. Knowing and thinking in the true and false lens of perception is just that so.e thoughs can be made real, some may never come to be real. That simple

I don't know the difference, but I do know that a lot of people think they know something when it isn't true at all.

reply to post by followtheevidence


Well, knowing comes from past experience while thinking usually involves future ideas.

reply to post by jiggerj


JiggerJ you were thinking along the same lines I was!

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by jiggerj

 

I propose that knowing comes from already having the information stored in the brain,

Not necessarily. Everything that is stored in our brains is a mixture of what we are told, and the conclusions we have formed on our own. Sometimes, what we are told contributes to our conclusions, but whose opinion/verdict - on any matter - is most important to us?

Our own. Therefore, we will often hold our own opinion to be "fact", or to have the same value. And if knowing is based on facts, doesn't that mean that all knowing is, first and foremost, based on our own ideas?

Knowing is thinking at a deeper level. Like I said before, in this world, knowing means so much less than what it used to...because freedom of speech leads to freedom of thought, and freedom of thought leads to preference of thought. As in, preference of what we ourselves think. And that becomes knowing.

Like I said before, in this world, knowing means so much less than what it used to...because freedom of speech leads to freedom of thought, and freedom of thought leads to preference of thought.

Preference of thought. I LIKE it!

Our own. Therefore, we will often hold our own opinion to be "fact", or to have the same value. And if knowing is based on facts, doesn't that mean that all knowing is, first and foremost, based on our own ideas?

Sure, but where do we get our ideas? We start at birth with no ideas, so the ideas have to come from somewhere other than our own minds. Once these seeds of information are planted in our head, only then can we use them to formulate our own opinions and perform problem-resolutions. Sadly, many people are given false information at a young age, thus contributing to wrong thinking until each person receives the right information.

Originally posted by darkbake
reply to post by jiggerj

 

JiggerJ you were thinking along the same lines I was!

I just hope your brain didn't hurt the way mine does with this topic.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by jiggerj

 

I propose that knowing comes from already having the information stored in the brain,

Not necessarily. Everything that is stored in our brains is a mixture of what we are told, and the conclusions we have formed on our own. Sometimes, what we are told contributes to our conclusions, but whose opinion/verdict - on any matter - is most important to us?

Our own. Therefore, we will often hold our own opinion to be "fact", or to have the same value. And if knowing is based on facts, doesn't that mean that all knowing is, first and foremost, based on our own ideas?

Knowing is thinking at a deeper level. Like I said before, in this world, knowing means so much less than what it used to...because freedom of speech leads to freedom of thought, and freedom of thought leads to preference of thought. As in, preference of what we ourselves think. And that becomes knowing.

I think someone knows! Lol. en.wikipedia.org...

The subconscious mind is a composite of everything one sees, hears and any information the mind collects that it cannot otherwise consciously process to make meaningful sense. The conscious mind cannot always absorb disconnected information, as it would be an information overload, so the subconscious mind stores this information where it can be retrieved by the conscious mind when it needs to defend itself for survival (and for other reasons, such as solving puzzles).

The mind can be studied to a degree. It reminds me of the Universe itself.

Knowing is faster than thinking, experience in life will prove this.
Intuitive uses that same adherence where information is induced for a moment in time.
You react to the information before the situation occurs without thinking pondering realizing without facts or being factual. That is knowing, knowing without study without teachings.

Most times your ignorances are your worst enemy, your born natural ignorant and innocent. as you become educated in a ignorant concept of life or living,
you will nationally lose innocence. The innocence is polluted
The more educated into conceptual life patterns the more lost you become at finding real, defining real unless you rinse and repeat others who define for you. you live a an inherit society, world, your born into it without knowledge, who gives you your knowledge? All the other ignorances who are rise and repeating the same patterns.


Realization, frustration are keys in finding unlocking self patterns that are real.
The answer WHY is ignorance ----->you can lead a horse to water yet does not drink, the grass over the side is greener? first observed human traits of "of" [of] (of) yes ignorance
ignorance is the meaning of life and will always be no exceptions.

The one thing that's not part of this is infinity, infinite knowledge that is stored in Tachyons or fields of Halcyons
Were also attached to this field by quantum of chaos, know as fractal chaos

The thing that hinders us is ignorance, our intelligence is measured in accumulative stored information and the ability to overcome learning frustration through dendrites growth.

A world wide collapse on a 99% scale factor without stored accumulative information or knowledge the next generation looses intelligence or gaps to a lesser society to the point of 0 and the world restarts all over again.

There are individuals that knew answers to the question "knowing" without reason, later and after trying to establish the connection building the bridge to the question from the answer.
not magical or mysterious but a higher complex science involving infinity.

Without the stored information you would be dumb as #!! sorry for slang even slang has a purpose.
Self realization is the biggest key. Realization using thinking thoughts is a rise and repeat of ignorances

Ignorance teaching ignorance is still ignorance! only the self in a free state can realize realizations

Op, ya know, I was thinking......

While thinking I came across a knowing........

Someone who I think is in the know in regards to the philosophy of mankind is that of Manly P. Hall.

He has lectures on YouTube......

I connect with him on a deep level, sometimes my breath is taken away.

His creditials will speak for them self and it shows through his words and the way he conveys them as a speaker of wisdom and knowledge.

I suppose this is my question, simplified:

Since "knowing" any given thing cannot be proven formally through logic ...

How is it that people accept that they "know" anything? WHAT is the experience of knowing vs the experience of thinking?

"Don't mistake the map for the territory"

That is to say, don't get so caught up in abstraction and formalized thought that you confuse it for the actual experience of reality.

We clearly experience knowingness. We clearly believe there to be a difference between knowing and thought.

Even if we can't prove what we know or even that we know at all - there is the experience itself, common to all of us, "telling" us otherwise.

Is it possible that knowingness transcends the mind itself? I think knowingness doesn't have a material origin. I think knowingness is much deeper, much more internal, and takes up residence in our being - not in our existence.

reply to post by followtheevidence


Thinking requires effort.
Knowing is effortless.

Truth can't be taught. It's known.

Knowing is the electromagnetic bliss in the center of the brain.

Sitting in full lotus yoga position activates this knowing.

If you can't sit in full lotus then the magnetic bliss isn't real knowing.

Originally posted by AQuestion
reply to post by rwfresh

 

Dear rwfresh,

I have to point out that I am in no manner, shape or form an expert at translations. People who did study these things brought it out. There was a preacher named Gene Scott, he was an expert in these translations and knew the languages, he was the first one to explain it the best. Now, may people, myself included, had problems with Dr. Scott; however, he new his languages and received his degree from Stanford. You might be able to find his sermons about faith. This is not a blanket endorsement of the man.

I have a semantic problem with saying that faith and belief are the same thing because they are not. We cannot have absolute knowledge because we do not possess the ability to know everything. That means the most we can "know" is limited to our ability to understand. Knowledge cannot therefore be a question of whether or not our belief is correct, we have no control over what is correct, that is the scientific method. The true test of belief is faith, it is when we act in a way consistent with what we proclaim to believe. We only know what we truly believe when we are tested, faith is the actions that prove what our beliefs are. Words alone do not do it. Peace.

I'm no expert either.. but that fact that many came to the same conclusions simply by reading the actual translated texts.. the bible itself, is testament to the intent and meaning behind the information itself. 20 years ago i had the realization that faith was 'knowing in action' as opposed to 'blind belief' as we are constantly told. I was not a Christian.. I was reading the Nag and the bible and it seemed apparent. With this understanding the use of the word in the texts made a lot more sense and lead to deeper understanding of what it all meant. Thanks for your insight and i will look up Dr Scott! Thanks.

There is no such thing as knowing. For example, sometimes I dream I am flying. While in the dream "I know im flying" Then I wake up and know that I wasn't. I guess knowing is just what you perceive to be accurate at the time.