What is the difference between thinking and knowing?

reply to post by followtheevidence


Yeah actually when we go to sleep in we're in deep dreamless sleep -- this sense of bliss that we logically infer occurred during deep dreamless sleep when we wake up and say : "Ah I had a good night's sleep." -- this deep bliss is actually our true sense of being.

It also happens when babies breastfeed and so it is the oxytocin as heart love bliss energy and it's from the vagus nerve. Science discovered only in 2004 that the right side vagus nerve connects to the reproductive organs and the left side vagus nerve connects to the heart.

So this life force energy from the reproductive organs can then through mind focus on the heart get redirected to the heart via the brain and this increases the electromagnetic energy of the heart from the love energy.

Essentially we have huge amounts of serotonin in our lower body and it connects to our vagus nerve via the endothelial nerves in our gut and then the cerebrospinal fluid has serotonin in it but when the vagus nerve is activated through deep breathing -- then the vagus nerve increases serotonin in our brains which then also increases oxytocin as love bliss energy to the heart.

So then the serotonin and melatonin and oxytocin increase -- melatonin is increased the most around 1 a.m. at night -- and so this is the deep dreamless sleep and then the REM visions occur more frequently near the morning before waking up -- and this is how the brain is thinking to organize long term memories with the new information from the previous day. So it's all the subconscious perceptions people have during the day.

It's like -- literally our brain is holographic as our mind and this is stored in our heart -- and also all our organs - and it's just like taking an old photo with chemical processing - so that our organs are the emotional chemical storage of the photo taken by our heart that is expressed out of our eyes during the day.

The modern world does not realize that people express light out of them as spirit energy and this then records information stored in our organs. So at night our heart spirit energy goes to our liver and so this processes all the blood with the oxygen and impurities -- and so if we eat lots of green this increases our wisdom energy as solar energy since green is stored sun energy as chlorophyll -- which is the exact same as red blood only it has magnesium instead of oxygen. So eating greens then cleans the blood which then increases our wisdom energy along with the deep breathing - using the abdomen below the navel you breath in with the abdomen below the navel and this brings oxygen into your lower lobes of the lungs which then really increases the internal oxygen. Normal chest breathing does not do this -- because the reverse breathing of the abdomen activates the vagus nerve.

As Ramana Maharshi says the mind goes with the breath -- so as the real mind takes over as knowing this is electromagnetic as the real source of thinking and so the whole body fills with electromagnetic heart love energy and so the hands and feet pulsate at their centers with electromagnetic energy and the top of the head gets soft like a baby and pulsates with electromagnetic energy and the body is filled with love bliss energy.

Originally posted by followtheevidence
So many thought provoking replies! Sadly I don't have time to reply to them specifically just yet.

One thing tho ...

I don't think we can "know" anything absolutely ... at least not according to formal empirical thought and logic. We just can't. We can't prove that the external world outside of the mind is real, that other minds other than our own are real, etc.

So since we can't actually "know" anything in the formal sense yet the phenomena of "knowing" (or at the very least "feeling" like we know something) is so visceral and fundamentally ubiquitous in the human ethos - what is this experience we call knowing?

I'm not expressing myself very well. I'll be back later with a more cogent reply.

Dear followtheevidence,

But you do know that there is consciousness in the universe, there is self awareness. If you wish to prove that nothings exists, you will require extraordinary evidence and you will still be wrong. If we can at least think or feel then something exists.

reply to post by AQuestion


I don't believe that nothing exists ...

Not sure how I gave that impression

I will apologize ahead of myself here- I did not read the other responses yet, I am on my way out and just have a huge urge to express myself on the question in the op. So my answer may be repeating others, or be out of sync.
Promise to read the rest when I get back from my run!

All that I can claim to know is experience- I know an experience I have had.
Thinking comes in to interpret it, to frame it, to give it meaning and explanation.

To give an example, I had a period of abduction type of experiences.
I know I saw, felt, heard, certain forms, colors, smells, sounds, textures, and biological changes.

But I do not know what the exact nature or source outside these came from. I cannot know.
I can have many hypotheses, and some can be shared by other people, giving me the impression that I "know" because agreed with. But all I reall know in this world is that I have experiences, and those memories are captured by me, either to be left as is, or interpreted in whatever way my mind prefers.

Originally posted by followtheevidence
reply to post by AQuestion

 

I don't believe that nothing exists ...

Not sure how I gave that impression

edit on 16-9-2012 by followtheevidence because: (no reason given)

Dear followtheevidence,

Than at least one thing can be known. We know we are, the next question is what are we and are we alone. The answers to that question are limited. Either I am all that is all there is or I have gone to the trouble of making believe that there are others. As I constantly learn new things that do not come from me, I should assume there are other sentient beings. If I assume I am all there is then I must accept that I am insane and am fooling myself that there are other sentient beings. Which answer do you like?

If you assume that you are all that you can know then why deny the "illusion" that you have created for yourself?

reply to post by followtheevidence


When you are thinking you are aware of the thinking - the thinking is known.
Knowing is the background on which everything appears.
You are the knowing space - aware presence.

All seeing, all knowing and ever present.

Thinking is actually a form of REM

Knowing is your ROM

I think that knowing involves a feeling of confidence whereas thinking does not. The feeling of confidence comes from having had an experience that has taught you something rather than just reading something in a book or having someone else inform you. I think that knowing has to engage the intuition whereas thinking does not.

Without reading all the answers posted already my inclination is to make this destinction.

Knowing is something your mind has stored as a definite concluded answer to a question.
Thinking (something is one way or another) is something you are still considering as changeable if evidence is presented that will give you a different understanding.

Neither are exempt from actual thinking i.e brain processing. But one is archived the other still more or less an open case.

Perhaps?

Originally posted by followtheevidence
reply to post by AQuestion

 

I don't believe that nothing exists ...

Not sure how I gave that impression

edit on 16-9-2012 by followtheevidence because: (no reason given)

Nothing exists as do something. What does not exist will remain unsaid, undone, unthought (not a word but still),unimagined, unexpressed,unfelt etc etc.

By saying you do not believe nothing exists you are saying it does.

Just a take on the question but I know nothing.

much love

Some amazing thoughts on this in this forum, I'm just wondering what sort of replys you would have got elsewhere.

In the science and conspiracey forums for instance, I think the replys would be less to do with an inner knowing as knowing, and more lean towards documented proof of facts, lol.

I use the term, " I think" as to not try to sound like I know, because I don't. And to try not to impose on anothers thoughts, and give them the assumption that what i am stating is absolute fact, because i dont know. But I know what I think. If that makes sense.

Wifi.

Originally posted by Wifibrains

I use the term, " I think" as to not try to sound like I know, because I don't. And to try not to impose on anothers thoughts, and give them the assumption that what i am stating is absolute fact, because i dont know. But I know what I think. If that makes sense.

Wifi.

You say you don't know - isn't this known though? You know you don't know!

reply to post by followtheevidence


Thinking is having a hunch, while knowing is fact...

Originally posted by Bluesma
I will apologize ahead of myself here- I did not read the other responses yet, I am on my way out and just have a huge urge to express myself on the question in the op. So my answer may be repeating others, or be out of sync.
Promise to read the rest when I get back from my run!

All that I can claim to know is experience- I know an experience I have had.
Thinking comes in to interpret it, to frame it, to give it meaning and explanation.

To give an example, I had a period of abduction type of experiences.
I know I saw, felt, heard, certain forms, colors, smells, sounds, textures, and biological changes.

But I do not know what the exact nature or source outside these came from. I cannot know.
I can have many hypotheses, and some can be shared by other people, giving me the impression that I "know" because agreed with. But all I reall know in this world is that I have experiences, and those memories are captured by me, either to be left as is, or interpreted in whatever way my mind prefers.

^^This, from Bluesma, if my understanding as well. Knowledge is experiencing, based upon perceptions. Thought is not a contrary idea to knowledge, instead it's just more general, including imagination, analysis, etc.

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Originally posted by Wifibrains

I use the term, " I think" as to not try to sound like I know, because I don't. And to try not to impose on anothers thoughts, and give them the assumption that what i am stating is absolute fact, because i dont know. But I know what I think. If that makes sense.

Wifi.

You say you don't know - isn't this known though? You know you don't know!

edit on 16-9-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)

Yep, so in a sence everyone knows, but not everyone knows what everyone else knows, so we can safely say that we all know.
I should have said, I know what I know, but I say it's what I think, also using the term think, instead of know, depending on what the conversation is can make you sound a little less crazy.

No one can know, considering at any given moment, your mind could be influenced without your knowledge.

Scary, isn't it?

I see the answers other posters have offered as being like minded.

Their answers resonate within me.

The knowing comes from within of which the knowledge speaks.

NOUS as Enoch offered is the knowing within the order of nature itself. It's evident. It's an understanding.

en.wikipedia.org...

I believe our goal is not think of god anymore but think with him. This, in my opinion was had in the beginning. Time catches up with us, whereas I see us back in time or time catching up whereas we find we are back in the garden knowing and thinking with God and not just thinking of him and pondering the possibilites in matter.

Consciousness is all there is or that's my understanding as the expressions in the nature of all things tell me so.

People in the West talk "knowing" to be left-brain dominance analysis as so-called "facts."

As the above lecture demonstates these "facts" are just logarithmic-based technology that is destroying Earth's ecology and the 12,000 nonwestern tribes that lived sustainable with earth's ecology for tens of thousands of years.

So now we have some 5,000 tribes left -- many facing extinction -- cultural genocide -- and these "facts" are suppressed.

The U.S. is an empire and modern humanity is killing the planet -- depleted uranium, land mines, -- watch the above video -- it's all based on logarithmic math as Western "knowing."

Knowing is what is here NOW.

I know that the computer screen is in front of me, I can believe or trust that when I push a button, a letter will show up on the screen allowing me to type words and sentences, but that is just belief or trust. For all I know, my computer can shut off right now...

Thinking is putting your judgments/emotions on reality, and also imagining an event that you believe happened before or will happen.

reply to post by followtheevidence


Experience.